ND vs Duke (last Mon.)

[JordyG]

Well we're in conference play now, and there is a bit of a difference between playing Duke and playing Tulsa. Duke may not be coached very well, but they do have talent on the team that can at least put up a fight. The ACC may not be a league full of spectacular teams, but again teams that aren't great still have enough talent recruited based on name brand alone that can make for a tough(er) night every now and again. Outside of USF, who in our conference can remotely challenge us? Of course we look much better when we're blowing teams out by 50 and 60 week in week out.

No, I'm talking about improved play. While watching UCONN I've been watching for improvement in certain areas. Specifically covering the perimeter shots, not getting beat off the dribble, jumping into the passing lanes smartly, 3 pt shooting, ball movement, talking to each other, as well as progress in specific players. Specifically the freshmen and Butler. Things like that. I've seen improvement in all of those areas. To me the scores of the games don't matter if I don't see improvement in certain areas. By the way, there is a reason Duke refuses to play UCONN anymore. And USF beats Duke handily.

 

[JordyG]

Defense is where they've improved significantly. Also, Ogunbowale has improved significantly.

ND has played some decent defenses lately and regressed to the mean a little in terms of 3 point shooting, so the decreased offensive production has offset the improved defense and the overall impression is similar.

You seem to have the right of it. This team seems to live by the 3. In the big show however one off night at the 3 line and it's a sad flight home.

 

[JordyG]

In the UCONN vs ND game Turner out & ND Guards went 3 crazy! With Turner back in future UCONN matchups a 3 point Guard sits more, UCONN wins by bigger margin! I've said for the last 3 years the best way to beat ND is with your bigs!
Even when Achonwa was there, she was the ONLY good big for ND! Now with Turner she's the only good big! ND cannot handle Stewie, Tuck (if healthy), Collier, Gabby, KLS, & Butler! Turner can only guard 1 of those 6, other ND bigs cannot cover or score vs UCONN bigs!
Tonight DUKE came back in 2nd 1/2 when their bigs became dominate! They have 4 or 5 bigs 6'2" or bigger, they could/should have killed ND inside! Then JPM became brain-dead and guards forced the issue and they had miss after miss after miss layups and charging fouls and the DUKE lead evaporated!
Tonight was perfect example of why JPM sucks as a HC!
Tuck is the key big-time to the rest of UCONN season! She is the missing link that forces opponents into unfavorable mismatches with Stewie, and the gang of 6! If Tuck is out for any length of time or plays at 1/2 speed UCONN becomes a less awesome team! More easy to match-up with! Collier, KLS, Gabby, & Butler have to be really on the top of their games!
Possible but a lot to ask of young players!

!

 

[CocoHusky]

I don't know. I know some people on The Boneyard don't like the phrase "The eye test", butI've been watching ND games throughout the year and I don't see where this team has improved since they've played UCONN. To me they seem virtually at the same level. Whereas UCONN has visibly improved with the continued maturation of KLS, Butler, Gabby and Chong. Maybe my eyes are deceiving me.

Matchups and lineup. Not equal to compare ND of last night with ND team that played UCONN. ND team that played UCONN was missing both Turner & Reimer. This forced ND to go with 4 guards which was a slight matchup problem for UCONN. Duke started 6'4", 6'5", 6'4" last night and that matchup (at least for a while) worked in Duke favor. That big Duke front line won the rebound battle by 7 and blocked 8 shots, which should have been enough to win the game if Duke had not shot so poorly ~33%.

 

[CamrnCrz1974]

Any history to account for same other than ND arrives and Duke heads a bit south?

After ND's beatdown of Duke in Cameron, Coach P referred to Notre Dame's players by numbers in the press conference. She clearly knew who McBride, Achonwa, and Allen were, but she intentionally referred to them by their numbers (and the people transcribing the press conference inserted their names).

After the game, Muffet McGraw, who rarely tweets, put this out:
Darn, knew we forgot something on our trip this past weekend..note to self: remember to pack "Hello, my name is...stickers for #21,11 &15

 

[TheGOAT23]

Duke has no court awareness. Can somone make a layup? Geez !

Zero awareness on defense as well! Duke's defense was all discombobulated that it gave N.D. problems. This was not by design, folks. Even Muffet was perplexed - couldn't figure out "what defense Duke was playing. I watched Duke's defense during one ND possession that had me SMH! Mabrey1 (or Cable) was on the wing with the ball and the defender in her face. She swung the ball beyond the top of the key to Turner. And what did the Duke guard do? She sprinted to Turner leaving Mabrey1 (or Cable) open on the wing. [Maybe Turner (for a second) looked like Steph Curry] Fortunately, Turner never looked back to the wing, which there was no Duke player in sight for miles. Duke's post would have never made it out there to defend the 3-ball let alone the guard. I see this happening frequently in high school and college basketball these days. What did Geno say recently about basketball IQ? How can Turner hurt you at the top of the key beyond the 3pt line? Would you sprint to Natalie, if she recieved the ball in the same area of the court? Little details like this can cost your team games.

Veteran teams like N.D. that are coached on the fundamentals of the game know how to win and rarely make mistakes when the game is on the line.

 

[Orangutan]

After ND's beatdown of Duke in Cameron, Coach P referred to Notre Dame's players by numbers in the press conference. She clearly knew who McBride, Achonwa, and Allen were, but she intentionally referred to them by their numbers (and the people transcribing the press conference inserted their names).

After the game, Muffet McGraw, who rarely tweets, put this out:
Darn, knew we forgot something on our trip this past weekend..note to self: remember to pack "Hello, my name is...stickers for #21,11 &15

Same thing last night. Sample quote:

"I’ll tell you, 22 won the game for them. You look at 22, 22 is a fifth year senior and she played like one. Without her on the floor, the outcome would have been totally different."

Nice compliment but c'mon JPM, you know her name. It's right on the back of her jersey.

 

[CamrnCrz1974]

Same thing last night. Sample quote:

"I’ll tell you, 22 won the game for them. You look at 22, 22 is a fifth year senior and she played like one. Without her on the floor, the outcome would have been totally different."

Nice compliment but c'mon JPM, you know her name. It's right on the back of her jersey.

And McCallie *always* has the box scores at her press conferences, as she reads right off of them. The box scores clearly have the players names on them.

Frankly, it comes across as disrespectful (at least to me). It does nothing to grow a sport that needs as much media attention as it can garner in a saturated sports market (and making sure players are household names is one way to do that). It also shows a lack of respect for the opposition, especially because Coach P recruited some of those players. Just not a very good display of sportsmanship, in my opinion.

 

[CocoHusky]

And McCallie *always* has the box scores at her press conferences, as she reads right off of them. The box scores clearly have the players names on them.
Frankly, it comes across as disrespectful (at least to me). It does nothing to grow a sport that needs as much media attention as it can garner in a saturated sports market (and making sure players are household names is one way to do that). It also shows a lack of respect for the opposition, especially because Coach P recruited some of those players. Just not a very good display of sportsmanship, in my opinion.

I must have fallen asleep on this one. Can someone enlighten me on the genesis of the animas between JPM & MM. Was there a specific incident? The old numbers things is old news -no?

 

[pvdoggy]

I must have fallen asleep on this one. Can someone enlighten me on the genesis of the animas between JPM & MM. Was there a specific incident? The old numbers things is old news -no?

I have seen postgame presser earlier this year by coach JPM where she referred to opposing players by name, even after Duke was beaten, so it is not like she always does the number thing. I think it is a psychological thing.

 

[RockyMTblue2]

Interesting game - my impression was Duke was playing free and loose and fast through about 13 minutes of the second half and outscored ND by 15. Then with that five point lead, it seemed they went into a stalling, very deliberate offense for the next five minutes and lost the game. This reminds me of what Geno said about men's coaches trying to manage every minute of a game and killing the sport - not sure it was actually JPM, but they seemed to look to her for direction while bouncing the ball just over half court on each of those slow and futile offensive sets.

Gosh, I hope you're wrong, however my expectations of Coach P are very low, so....

 

[CocoHusky]

I have seen postgame presser earlier this year by coach JPM where she referred to opposing players by name, even after Duke was beaten, so it is not like she always does the number thing. I think it is a psychological thing.

I have heard her use both names and numbers and just numbers. I don't have the same take as Cam and others (disrespectful) but this is old news at least to me. What started the hate between her and MM is what I'm interested in.

 

[Orangutan]

I have heard her use both names and numbers and just numbers. I don't have the same take as Cam and others (disrespectful) but this is old news at least to me. What started the hate between her and MM is what I'm interested in.

Two things: 1) I don't know that there's any "hate". They just don't like each other. 2) The only grievance I've seen McGraw publicly raise regarding McCallie is the issue about referring to players by number. So near as I can tell that is what started it.

Maybe it seems like a small thing but I would necessarily expect them to be best friends in the first place.

Time to quote Geno: "Sometimes we act like girls, like we're supposed to go to dinner every night. We're supposed to play each other, try to beat each other's brains in, try to win a national championship and compete like hell...And then we're supposed to get together afterwards and go have a bottle of wine? That s--- is just not going to happen."

 

[JordyG]

Matchups and lineup. Not equal to compare ND of last night with ND team that played UCONN. ND team that played UCONN was missing both Turner & Reimer. This forced ND to go with 4 guards which was a slight matchup problem for UCONN. Duke started 6'4", 6'5", 6'4" last night and that matchup (at least for a while) worked in Duke favor. That big Duke front line won the rebound battle by 7 and blocked 8 shots, which should have been enough to win the game if Duke had not shot so poorly ~33%.

Yes during the first game their big guns weren't there. So now that they are where is the improvement? Orangutan referred to their decrease in 3 point shooting numbers hurting their offensive, but also pointed to their (expected) better defensive capabilities. 1 step forward two steps back is not improvement. Don't get me wrong. I'm one of those that LOVES to see teams at their best before UCONN thrashes them. Then there are NO excuses. I am rooting for ND to improve and maintain their undefeated record. But they seem to be plateauing. This is worrisome. They play too many tight games for my liking. Duke is a good and very young team. But that BC game, Pittsburgh, Tennessee, twice against Georgia Tech, these games had me puzzled. Are these teams playing better than most AAC teams?

 

[CocoHusky]

Two things: 1) I don't know that there's any "hate". They just don't like each other. 2) The only grievance I've seen McGraw publicly raise regarding McCallie is the issue about referring to players by number. So near as I can tell that is what started it.

Maybe it seems like a small thing but I would necessarily expect them to be best friends in the first place.

Time to quote Geno: "Sometimes we act like girls, like we're supposed to go to dinner every night. We're supposed to play each other, try to beat each other's brains in, try to win a national championship and compete like hell...And then we're supposed to get together afterwards and go have a bottle of wine? That s--- is just not going to happen."

Thanks. That was kind of reason/point in asking about a specific incident. Just as there is no reason to expect them to be friends there is no reason to expect them to be uncivil towards each other either. That MM tweet and the post game handshake was maybe not hate but definitely frosty. The played out JPM players by numbers is old.

 

[CocoHusky]

Yes during the first game their big guns weren't there. So now that they are where is the improvement? Orangutan referred to their decrease in 3 point shooting numbers hurting their offensive, but also pointed to their (expected) better defensive capabilities. 1 step forward two steps back is not improvement. Don't get me wrong. I'm one of those that LOVES to see teams at their best before UCONN thrashes them. Then there are NO excuses. I am rooting for ND to improve and maintain their undefeated record. But they seem to be plateauing. This is worrisome. They play too many tight games for my liking. Duke is a good and very young team. But that BC game, Pittsburgh, Tennessee, twice against Georgia Tech, these games had me puzzled. Are these teams playing better than most AAC teams?

Consider yourself (like me) another spoiled UCONN fan. Across the rest of WCBB landscape tight games are the norm and improvement in one area almost always guarantee a let down/up in another area. The #2 team in the country (although still undefeated) has 6 wins by single digits this year-Plenty of room on their bandwagon.

 

[JordyG]

Consider yourself (like me) another spoiled UCONN fan. Across the rest of WCBB landscape tight games are the norm and improvement in one area almost always guarantee a let down/up in another area. The #2 team in the country (although still undefeated) has 6 wins by single digits this year-Plenty of room on their bandwagon.

Note taken. And perhaps the slight chastisement understood.

 

[UcMiami]

The theory behind using numbers in practice against a specific team is to remove the mystique around a 'Maya Moore' or a 'Breanna Stewart' - don't worry about a thing, you're just going up against #23 or #30, you got this, easy! Continuing that practice after a game doesn't really do anything except put down your own players - some 'no name' wearing jersey #23 absolutely torched my players, I can't believe that she went off for 30!
And if in fact she does sometimes use names (presumably when playing against West Podunk) then the psychology is sort of reversed when at the first practice for the next team up, instead of referring to player assignments by name she starts using numbers. Her players will learn pretty quickly that when the numbers get used they are in for yet another butt whipping, even if she doesn't mention the team name but refers to it as a little school from New England.

 

[CocoHusky]

I have changed my mind on this: Flipflop: Cam had a very salient point which I missed in the first reading. Coach P recruited many of these players she is referring to by numbers, sat in their homes, and ate with many of them. Very disrespectful to refer to them by numbers because they had the audacity to go elsewhere and whip your team's butt.

 

[Kibitzer]

After ND's beatdown of Duke in Cameron, Coach P referred to Notre Dame's players by numbers in the press conference.

Coach P was just behaving like an old poop.

 

[FairView]

Coach P was just behaving like an old poop.

Soon she'll have plenty of free time to spend on the Thayer IV looking for Walter.

 

[CamrnCrz1974]

I have changed my mind on this: Flipflop: Cam had a very salient point which I missed in the first reading. Coach P recruited many of these players she is referring to by numbers, sat in their homes, and ate with many of them. Very disrespectful to refer to them by numbers because they had the audacity to go elsewhere and whip your team's butt.

What started the hate between her and MM is what I'm interested in.

Coco, I cannot point to a single incident, nor can I confirm that there is hate between them (I honestly do not know).

But McCallie became the fastest coach in ACC history to reach 100 conference wins (counting only regular season games, not ACC Tournament), doing so in her 122nd game. Muffet McGraw is now 40-1 in her first 41 ACC games. It looks like that record will be shattered.

In the four years before Notre Dame joined the ACC, Coach P went 57-6 (90.48 percent) in the ACC (again, regular season games). In the 2.5 years since Notre Dame became a conference opponent, Coach P's record slipped to 28-13 (68.29 percent).

 

[Gus Mahler]

I have changed my mind on this: Flipflop: Cam had a very salient point which I missed in the first reading. Coach P recruited many of these players she is referring to by numbers, sat in their homes, and ate with many of them. Very disrespectful to refer to them by numbers because they had the audacity to go elsewhere and whip your team's butt.

Plus, a person would think she would know of some of these (top) players from their national team experience. I don't know how she does her game planning (or if she does), but to the extent you speak of opposing players, it seems to me it would be easier to remember names than numbers. Plus, the Duke players would know or know of a lot of opposing players. So in walk-throughs and such it makes sense to me to refer to players by name.

Hey! Maybe I've hit on something she's doing wrong in game planning. I should write her.

 

[RegisteredUconn]

SOUTH Jersey girl reflex I'm OK with but Cable undercutting Greenwell with 2:42 left in the 2 quarter is NOT! Cable does that a couple times per game she going to get someone seriously hurt.

Not from South Jersey I gather.

 

[CocoHusky]

Not from South Jersey I gather.

No actually from Philly. Depending on the person and the circumstances Philly people will claim SOUTH Jersey people-Never North or Central though. As far as the Mabrey's go I warming up the Mabrey 2. 0. The 1.0 version has too much flop in her game.