NBA Playoffs

[Mazhude]

Meh. Draymond Green is a winner. The guy is clutch, he plays super hard, doesn't make boneheaded mistakes, he's fiery and injects energy into his teammates, and he's a a perfect big for a high octane offense. Guy's shot isn't what it was a few years ago, but that's not necessarily permanent. He was the guy who kept the Warriors in the game several times by hitting a string of huge 3s when everybody else was tanking.
Not an exaggeration when I say this guy is more important to the Ws than Durant. Durant is redundant, and only added a marginal amount to an already loaded team. Green is critical.
Don't like his cheap shots, but the rest of his game should be used as an example to young players.

Durant is redundant might be the most insipid thing I've heard on the Boneyard... and that's saying something.

 

[tzznandrew]

Durant is redundant might be the most insipid thing I've heard on the Boneyard... and that's saying something.

One year they lose in the Finals in 7 games, the next, against the same team (and almost certainly a better version of that team), they won in 5 (after being up 3-0).

 

[MadDogRevival]

One year they lose in the Finals in 7 games, the next, against the same team (and almost certainly a better version of that team), they won in 5 (after being up 3-0).

Both years they were up 3-1, lol.

 

[tzznandrew]

Both years they were up 3-1, lol.

The 2016 Cavs won the Championship. Sort of important to remember that aspect. Without Durant, the 2017 Warriors would have lost to the Cavs too.

Again, one team won the title and the other team lost the title. And, while it was 3-1 in both, there's a big difference between being down 2-1 and losing Game 4 (Warriors had done the same thing the round before) and losing Games the first three games. Everyone knows the series is over at that point, it's just dressing up a corpse to win Game 4.

Further, statistically the 2017 Cavs were much better than the 2016 Cavs. Their playoff and regular season offensive rating was higher than the Warriors and 6 points higher than the year before.

 

[MadDogRevival]

The 2016 Cavs won the Championship. Sort of important to remember that aspect. Without Durant, the 2017 Warriors would have lost to the Cavs too.

Again, one team won the title and the other team lost the title. And, while it was 3-1 in both, there's a big difference between being down 2-1 and losing Game 4 (Warriors had done the same thing the round before) and losing Games the first three games. Everyone knows the series is over at that point, it's just dressing up a corpse to win Game 4.

Further, statistically the 2017 Cavs were much better than the 2016 Cavs. Their playoff and regular season offensive rating was higher than the Warriors and 6 points higher than the year before.

Ws had a better record w/out Durant. Lol. He was a redundant addition. If you had to remove either Green or Durant from the team, you remove Durant. Definitely don't remove the game 1 refs though, ha.

 

[Rocktheworld]

I apologize if this is stating the obvious, but I would think any possible deal hinges on Kawhi's willingness to sign an immediate extension. Do we have any indication he's willing to do that anywhere other than LA?

Boston can certainly make a deal, but shipping away Brown and future picks for a player who might not re-sign, when you're already putting your chips in the middle with Kyrie, is a big risk. I don't know if Philly has enough unless they include Simmons (which I would consider, assuming everything else falls into place behind that).

Don’t the Spurs have control over where he goes? Do they ship him to the East?

 

[champs99and04]

My first reaction was to think that the "KD is redundant" take is stupid, but I can sort of see what he's getting at, even if they're obviously better with him.

You saw it against Houston more than you did against Cleveland. When Golden State gets lured into going to KD every possession (kind of hard not to do when he's guarded by P.J. Tucker or Chris Paul), they play a completely different style. Playing a different style can be less effective even when you have better players.

Draymond's game is fairly static regardless of whether it's Durant or Barnes at that spot. Steph, on the other hand, takes over two less shots per 36 minutes than he did two years ag0 (I imagine that gap widens when they share the court). Klay takes a little less than two fewer shots per 36 minutes. Iggy's usage has gone down (oddly, Livingston's has gone way up). If you take the additional seven shots per 36 minutes that KD took over Barnes (who is a good player, even if overpaid) and split them between Steph, Klay, and Draymond, you have a team that is worse but not necessarily by the amount that a normal team would get if they lost KD.

That's the shame of it, in my mind. You want to find the happy medium between making great players fully exert themselves but not overworking them like Russ or LeBron. We're never going to be able to fully appreciate the talent if KD is in Golden State.

 

[champs99and04]

Don’t the Spurs have control over where he goes? Do they ship him to the East?

At this point, they don't have a ton of leverage. You can ship him to his preferred destination and maybe get a Brandon Ingram type player or you can play it out and lose him for nothing. I'm not in love with Brandon Ingram (I wouldn't put him on the same level as Tatum or Simmons), but he's not even 21 yet and putting up some nice shooting numbers.

Boston is dealing from a position of strength. Right now they're set up great long-term even if they lose Kyrie next year. They don't have a ton of incentive to break the bank for Kawhi unless he commits to an extension. I mean, it'd be tempting to trot out a Kyrie/Tatum/Hayward/Leonard/Horford starting five, but with two of them free agents, one coming off a major injury, and the other 32, there'd be potential to look back years from now and say "how did this all go wrong?" ala OKC.

Philly is more interesting because of the LeBron factor. If him and Kawhi want to play together long term, you might be able to pry away Simmons, which would be best case scenario. Otherwise, you probably have to settle for something like Saric/Fultz/#10 overall pick. That wouldn't be nothing, but you'd gladly take the known blue chip if you get the chance.

I don't know who else would even be a possibility. Talk is that Sacramento could shop the #2 pick, but there's no clear cut #2 guy this year after Ayton. I don't think Minnesota has the cap space to make it happen and even if they did I don't think a player like Wiggins has enough value any more to center a trade. Houston has cap problems already, Milwaukee doesn't really have the pieces, the Clippers have nothing to offer, etc. It's a bad spot for the Spurs to be in.

 

[tzznandrew]

Ws had a better record w/out Durant. Lol. He was a redundant addition. If you had to remove either Green or Durant from the team, you remove Durant. Definitely don't remove the game 1 refs though, ha.

I forgot that Win Loss in the regular season is what determines the championship...

Nobody cares what anyone did in the regular season if you can't win a championship.

And I like Green a lot, but you absolutely kick him to the curb to keep KD. You know, the guy who just won back to back Finals MVPs.

And, you know, blame the refs all you want rather than JR Smith or George Hill.

You're clowning yourself here.

 

[JaYnYcE]

This is SuperJohn we're talking about here, not that guy with the jerry curl avatar and camel font and JayNyC in his name that used to always try to sell us the Knick's most recent false resurrection.

It’s JaYnYcE.

 

[Purple Stein]

Replying to a comment 50 pages ago on a thread that's 4 years old -- and without being tagged!

That's some dedication to the BY @JaYnYcE

 

[JaYnYcE]

Replying to a comment 50 pages ago on a thread that's 4 years old -- and without being tagged!

That's some dedication to the BY @JaYnYcE

Catching up for lost time!