morgan william | The Boneyard

morgan william

S

snlMINAJ

Joined
Dec 11, 2012
Messages
237
Reaction Score
358
this is not a criticism, not a bashing - just me feeling really bad for the current 'generation' of huskies - including saniya, gabby and kia.


boy, did that one shot from morgan william really really effect us and women's college basketball.
i think it totally 'destroyed' that uconn team (as a whole and individually) which carried over to last year and this year.

not only did it end the streak, but it actually showed other teams they can be beat.
not only did it show other teams they can be beat, but i think it showed other teams that uconn is totally vulnerable in close games.
not only did it show that they were vulnerable, but i think it put serious doubt in to members of that team - and that played out the next year against ND.

that carry over i think is/was always in the back of collier, samuelson, dangerfield, etc mind.
that one damn shot totally changed everything, the more i think about the last 3 years the more i think about that 1 shot.
 
No, not correct. I will argue that the 3 straight FF’s by UConn was a greater achievement than the 4 straight championships that preceded because they were accomplished without a single PF or C in the starting lineup. During the championship run, UConn had 2-3 starters who could dominate in the post, not to mention Kiah Stokes coming off the bench.

During the past 3 years UConn has started 2-3 guards and a couple of small/forwards/wings. No other team with that type of lineup made it to the FF. A couple statistics from the FF highlight UConn’s challenge. Against ND and their 2 talented Bigs, UConn was -17 rebounding, and yet somehow hung around to the end. When has UConn ever been -17 rebounding? In the other semifinal, Oregon hit 12x3’s to Baylor’s 0 and still lost.

Team’s with big, talented posts win championships. Liv will be that very soon. Geno needs to get al least one more capable post to play alongside Liv. Add in the incredible talent of Christyn, Paige and hopefully Azzi and order will be restored. Once again UConn will be bad for WBB.
 
snlMINAJ said:
i think it totally 'destroyed' that uconn team (as a whole and individually) which carried over to last year and this year.
Expand ...
I understand the sentiment. But it may come as some comfort that it is all but certain that a shot in a basketball game on March 31, 2017 does not affect shots taken (if any) in a basketball game the next day. The same holds true for all games by all players on all teams thereafter.

It is also important to appreciate that at the highest level of performance, and in competition between the very best teams, the difference between winning and losing quite often comes down to . . . dare I say it . . . arbitrariness. A shot can hang on a rim for what seems an eternity . . . and fall in (CW in Sweet Sixteen game against UCLA) or it can fall out. An innocuous missed FT in the 1st quarter can turn out to be the point that would have tied or won the game with no time on the clock at the end of regulation. A missed call along the baseline, or a dubious call or no call on a foul, or a turned ankle on a misplaced foot . . . all can tip the scales in weighing the difference between victory and defeat. But for a shot here, a shot there, UConn could just as easily have advanced to the final game in 2016-17, 17-18, and 18-19. Whether they would have won in those games is anyone's guess.
 
.-.
oldude said:
No, not correct. I will argue that the 3 straight FF’s by UConn was a greater achievement than the 4 straight championships that preceded because they were accomplished without a single PF or C in the starting lineup. During the championship run, UConn had 2-3 starters who could dominate in the post, not to mention Kiah Stokes coming off the bench.

During the past 3 years UConn has started 2-3 guards and a couple of small/forwards/wings. No other team with that type of lineup made it to the FF. A couple statistics from the FF highlight UConn’s challenge. Against ND and their 2 talented Bigs, UConn was -17 rebounding, and yet somehow hung around to the end. When has UConn ever been -17 rebounding? In the other semifinal, Oregon hit 12x3’s to Baylor’s 0 and still lost.

Team’s with big, talented posts win championships. Liv will be that very soon. Geno needs to get al least one more capable post to play alongside Liv. Add in the incredible talent of Christyn, Paige and hopefully Azzi and order will be restored. Once again UConn will be bad for WBB.
Expand ...

You can't coach size, but if you are lucky you can recruit it.
 
I think in a lot of ways this team's achievements were truly remarkable.
They were basically playing a 4 guard offense with a small forward.
Their talent was evident. There only "weakness" was rebounding because of their size.
The records that Geno and his players are achieving will last longer than any of us will will live to see broken.
 
.-.
my2cents said:
I think in a lot of ways this team's achievements were truly remarkable.
They were basically playing a 4 guard offense with a small forward.
Their talent was evident. There only "weakness" was rebounding because of their size.
The records that Geno and his players are achieving will last longer than any of us will will live to see broken.
Expand ...

I have to add to this. The missed free throws this season were maddening. To be honest, there is no excuse for how poor it was. This can be fixed and hopefully is a priority. Even the worst team in all of NCAA basketball should be able to shoot 80-85% free throws (at least.)
 
snlMINAJ said:
this is not a criticism, not a bashing - just me feeling really bad for the current 'generation' of huskies - including saniya, gabby and kia.


boy, did that one shot from morgan william really really effect us and women's college basketball.
i think it totally 'destroyed' that uconn team (as a whole and individually) which carried over to last year and this year.

not only did it end the streak, but it actually showed other teams they can be beat.
not only did it show other teams they can be beat, but i think it showed other teams that uconn is totally vulnerable in close games.
not only did it show that they were vulnerable, but i think it put serious doubt in to members of that team - and that played out the next year against ND.

that carry over i think is/was always in the back of collier, samuelson, dangerfield, etc mind.
that one damn shot totally changed everything, the more i think about the last 3 years the more i think about that 1 shot.
Expand ...
I have been contemplating your post during my mourning and moping. I had never thought of it from your suggested viewpoint. Wow. a four-times-in-a-row NCAA champion, undefeated and holding the ball with about 15 seconds left in a tied semifinal game with a possible match against a team (SC) that they had already beaten comfortably eventually waiting for them in the final. then, to have it all disappear in an instant. Who knows the lingering effect in 2018 and, for that matter, in 2019?

Pardon my first comparison, but the words work so well. A stand of trees near Cemetery Ridge in Gettysburg, Pennsylvania, is called the "High Water Mark of the Confederacy." It is marked with a plaque.

1554744770283.png


Then I thought about the 1996 Atlanta Braves Baseball team. 1995 World Series Champs, with three eventual HOF pitchers, overwhelm the Yankees in New York in the first two games. After a hiccup in game three, they hold a 6-run lead midway in game four. It seems that they will hold on at 6-3 in the eighth inning, and go up 3 games to 1, with top reliever Mark Wohlers facing backup Yankee catcher Jim Leyritz. The High Water mark of the Atlanta Braves. Leyritz hits a 3-run home run, the Yankees win in extra innings, win the next two games, and the Braves, despite all that talent, never get very close in succeeding years.

I welcome other high-water examples (perhaps the 1992 UNLV MCBB team vs. Duke, though there were some upcoming sanctions, or the 2001 New York Yankees going against the Diamondbacks in ninth inning of in game 7) but I am hoping not to see that last 15 UCONN /MS ST seconds commemorated any time soon.
 
Urshurak said:
I have to add to this. The missed free throws this season were maddening. To be honest, there is no excuse for how poor it was. This can be fixed and hopefully is a priority. Even the worst team in all of NCAA basketball should be able to shoot 80-85% free throws (at least.)
Expand ...
I hate to think of it as a "UCONN Thing,' but many of the top UCONN Men's teams over the past two decades were known as much for poor foul-shooting as for shot-blocking prowess.
 
cohenzone said:
Yeah, but, but, UConn isn’t supposed to be that other team. :rolleyes: If it stretches to 4 years without a UConn NC next year, McGraw might even start to think Geno is irrelevant.
Expand ...
I cringe thinking about all of the comments over the past ten years designating the Tennessee WCBB program as irrelevant. ("We've moved on," etc.) Now do we change our aphorisms now to "what goes around comes around" or "watch how you treat folks on the way up etc." or the dreaded "Karma is a *****????."
 
oldude said:
No, not correct. I will argue that the 3 straight FF’s by UConn was a greater achievement than the 4 straight championships that preceded because they were accomplished without a single PF or C in the starting lineup.
Expand ...

Gabby and Pheesa are both PFs
 
Urshurak said:
I have to add to this. The missed free throws this season were maddening. To be honest, there is no excuse for how poor it was. This can be fixed and hopefully is a priority. Even the worst team in all of NCAA basketball should be able to shoot 80-85% free throws (at least.)
Expand ...
It did occur to me that missed FT could, potentially, be attributable to fatigue. We did pretty much play with 7 players for most of the season, with the starters carrying a heavy load down the homestretch. We also played tighter games than in previous seasons (allowing less rest during games for starters), with smaller players overall. Our style of play seemed to sometimes require an uptempo game to combat the half-court war-in-the-trenches approach some other/bigger teams favored. Presumably, that all affects FTs.

Would be interesting to track FT percentage by team and player, by quarter, to see if FT% dropped over time, in each game, or for that matter FT% by week and month, to see if there are any correlations between playing time and %.
 
Last edited:
.-.
Oldbones said:
I cringe thinking about all of the comments over the past ten years designating the Tennessee WCBB program as irrelevant. ("We've moved on," etc.) Now do we change our aphorisms now to "what goes around comes around" or "watch how you treat folks on the way up etc." or the dreaded "Karma is a *****????."
Expand ...

Only if we hire Holly Warlick to replace Geno.
 
Orangutan said:
Gabby and Pheesa are both PFs
Expand ...
Gabby was a 5’11” pg in HS. As a result of her extraordinary athletic ability she was able to defend opposing post players. In the WNBA, Gabby is a guard once again. Pheesa is 6’1”, and extraordinarily skilled as well. But has a freshman at UConn, playing with Stewie & Tuck, she played the small forward/wing, which is exactly where she will play once she’s in the WNBA.

UConn has been doing a wonderful job with undersized players, playing out of position. But make no mistake, there hasn’t been a true power forward or center as a regular starter in UConn’s lineup since Stewie & Tuck graduated.
 
Last edited:
oldude said:
Gabby was a 5’11” pg in HS. As a result of her extraordinary athletic ability she was able to defend opposing post players. In the WNBA, Gabby is a guard once again. Pheesa is 6’1”, and extraordinarily skilled as well. But has a freshman at UConn, playing with Stewie & Tuck, she played the small forward/wing, which is exactly where she will play once she’s in the WNBA.

UConn has been doing a wonderful job with undersized players, playing out of position. But make no mistake, there hasn’t been a true power forward or center as a regular starter in UConn’s lineup since Stewie & Tuck graduates.
Expand ...
It’s really a shame that Batouly is not physically able. She would’ve fit the bill as a power player.
 
oldude said:
Gabby was a 5’11” pg in HS. As a result of her extraordinary athletic ability she was able to defend opposing post players. In the WNBA, Gabby is a guard once again.
Expand ...
Sorry, that is not correct. I am a Sky fan and season ticket holder. She is a forward. Chicago's most common starting lineup was Sloot (PG), Quigley (SG), DeShields (SF), Williams (PF), Dolson (C).

She did play some SF, but I think she played more PF and that is where she started. Long term, I think her best fit is at SF, but she will need to improve her 3-point shooting and ballhandling.

Collier is a SF/PF tweener as well but my expectation is that she will play PF to start. We'll see.
 
.-.
Orangutan said:
Sorry, that is not correct. I am a Sky fan and season ticket holder. She is a forward. Chicago's most common starting lineup was Sloot (PG), Quigley (SG), DeShields (SF), Williams (PF), Dolson (C).

She did play some SF, but I think she played more PF and that is where she started. Long term, I think her best fit is at SF, but she will need to improve her 3-point shooting and ballhandling.

Collier is a SF/PF tweener as well but my expectation is that she will play PF to start. We'll see.
Expand ...
I stand corrected on Gabby as a pro, but she was in fact a pg in HS.
 
Oldbones said:
I have been contemplating your post during my mourning and moping. I had never thought of it from your suggested viewpoint. Wow. a four-times-in-a-row NCAA champion, undefeated and holding the ball with about 15 seconds left in a tied semifinal game with a possible match against a team (SC) that they had already beaten comfortably eventually waiting for them in the final. then, to have it all disappear in an instant. Who knows the lingering effect in 2018 and, for that matter, in 2019?

Pardon my first comparison, but the words work so well. A stand of trees near Cemetery Ridge in Gettysburg, Pennsylvania, is called the "High Water Mark of the Confederacy." It is marked with a plaque.

View attachment 42036

Then I thought about the 1996 Atlanta Braves Baseball team. 1995 World Series Champs, with three eventual HOF pitchers, overwhelm the Yankees in New York in the first two games. After a hiccup in game three, they hold a 6-run lead midway in game four. It seems that they will hold on at 6-3 in the eighth inning, and go up 3 games to 1, with top reliever Mark Wohlers facing backup Yankee catcher Jim Leyritz. The High Water mark of the Atlanta Braves. Leyritz hits a 3-run home run, the Yankees win in extra innings, win the next two games, and the Braves, despite all that talent, never get very close in succeeding years.

I welcome other high-water examples (perhaps the 1992 UNLV MCBB team vs. Duke, though there were some upcoming sanctions, or the 2001 New York Yankees going against the Diamondbacks in ninth inning of in game 7) but I am hoping not to see that last 15 UCONN /MS ST seconds commemorated any time soon.
Expand ...
I "liked" this post because it is provocative. (And as a high-water example, I give you 1 out in the top of the 9th inning of Game 4 of the 1988 NLCS. The Mets up (I think) 4-2 against the Dodgers, ready to take a commanding 3-1 lead in the series. Mike Soscia goes deep on Gooden for a 2-run HR, and the Dodgers win the game in extra-innings to ties the series. Within a year, the mighty Mets of the mid-80s were no more, with but a single WS to show for it.)

But I caution against what I call "reading history backwards". It may certainly appear in retrospect that Game 3 of the '96 series was a high-water mark for the Braves. But reading history forward, no one at the time could ever have perceived that or thought that. And it is hard to believe that any player's performance in subsequent seasons was somehow affected by what happened in the previous year.

Interestingly, but understandably, we tend not to ask these high-water questions when history produces events that negate the need to ask in the first place. But that does not mean that fortuity was not also at work. Consider the Patriots incredible run. But for the ruling in the "Tuck" rule game, the 2001 Pats probably would not have gone on to win the SB 36. The SB 38 run had the Pats winning the Div. game by 3 points, the SB by another 3 points. In fact, the Patriots' margin of victory in SBs 36, 38 and 39 is a total of 9 points (3 points in each game). The Pats could have and probably should have lost '14 SB. Thus, but for a play here and there in each of these years, it is possible that the Pats could have not won a SB until 2017. In that event, history would be telling a very different story than the one that will be told (justifiably so) years hence. This is not to say that the Patriots are not a great team during these years. It is to say that sometimes fortune smiles on some more so than on others, perhaps disproportionately.
 
HuskyNan said:
Winning 30+ games and getting to the Final Four isn’t what I would call “destroyed”. 300+ other teams would love to have UConn’s problems
Expand ...
.1 final seconds loses is a crapshoot, a fluke. Either team could win those. DESTROYED? I'd like to read THAT definition!. Anyone that thinks 2 loses got into the psyche of the total team doesn't know Geno et al.
You won't like to read this but, my take: for 2 of the last 3 seasons Uconn far exceeded the personnel on the team. Oh, there was talent but no real Post, no Maya, No DT, No Stewies. then no bench. Geno in this past year and the previous one should have won Coach of the year. I've worn the 5 without bench into the ground but it was a fact and factor. Don't damn this team--cheer for the success they had--FF? who truly could have believed??
 
oldude said:
Gabby was a 5’11” pg in HS. As a result of her extraordinary athletic ability she was able to defend opposing post players. In the WNBA, Gabby is a guard once again. Pheesa is 6’1”, and extraordinarily skilled as well. But has a freshman at UConn, playing with Stewie & Tuck, she played the small forward/wing, which is exactly where she will play once she’s in the WNBA.

UConn has been doing a wonderful job with undersized players, playing out of position. But make no mistake, there hasn’t been a true power forward or center as a regular starter in UConn’s lineup since Stewie & Tuck graduated.
Expand ...
Noting that Gabby came to UConn as a guard, Geno once jokingly observed: "Yeah, Gabby's a guard. And ya know, if she could dribble and pass and shoot . . . she'd be a pretty good guard!"
 
Oldbones said:
I cringe thinking about all of the comments over the past ten years designating the Tennessee WCBB program as irrelevant. ("We've moved on," etc.) Now do we change our aphorisms now to "what goes around comes around" or "watch how you treat folks on the way up etc." or the dreaded "Karma is a *****????."
Expand ...
All those trite saying have some truth to them, especially treat folks well on the way up without them on the way down the hit is hard.
Second thought on TN, it ain't done until the very round lady sings. Uconn MAY have a not FF year next year--How can anyone in their right mind think 3 FF's or factually 12 FF's in a row is failure time? Uconn never preps for FAILURE, so they rarely see it. Some fans, hope for that failure, even some Uconn fans SEE 3 ff's as failure. Geno is ultimately right! Uconn fans are spoiled rotten.
The number of Uconn wins, at home wins, away wins, NCAA wins, top 10 wins, etc makes Baylors win this year, ND's last year, Ms St's the year before pale by example. I suggest those that can't see that become life long fans of Baylor, you'll love it (this year).
 
Oldbones said:
I hate to think of it as a "UCONN Thing,' but many of the top UCONN Men's teams over the past two decades were known as much for poor foul-shooting as for shot-blocking prowess.
Expand ...

Absolutely. And the women too. I just watched a fuzzy replay of the 2004 reg season game at Tenn. UConn shot 17-28 ft's (60%) and won by 14. And not to take anything away from this year's refs but that game was one of the worst officiated games I ever saw. Sally Bell was probably the most incompetent ref in the game. There were 45 fouls called in that game and yet they missed Taurasi getting wacked in the throat, TWICE! And 3 of her fouls were for the hem of her shorts brushing an opponent. Things haven't changed much. UConn made dumb mistakes and failed to play defense back then too. What UConn had then and not right now is a player with a powerful presence to lead. Taurasi had 18 pts on 4-13 shooting. Her stats were so-so but her attitude was that the game was UConn's to win or lose. This year's seniors, as highly skilled as they were, didn't have that aura of invincibility. The 2004 team assisted on only half their baskets that day. It was not the well-oiled machine Geno and many others have in their memory banks. It was flawed, just like now.
I've also watched the supposedly "greatest" UConn team, 2002, and they too had many many lapses during games. Bird actually threw some really bad and/or ill-advised passes and turned the ball over. I swear to god it really happened. If they were playing now this board would not be happy with many of their efforts, despite winning.

Me? ........ I trust in Paige. :rolleyes:
 
.-.
You must log in or register to reply here.

Forum statistics

Threads
168,543
Messages
4,581,540
Members
10,491
Latest member
7774Forever


Top Bottom