MLB to add Negro Leagues to the official record books | The Boneyard

MLB to add Negro Leagues to the official record books

Status
Not open for further replies.
If you guys get a chance look up Cam Perron, he's the reason we got to this point. He was a 14 year old white kid in the Boston Suburbs and he started researching all the forgotten about black ballplayers, digging up any info he could, tracking them down for recognition and their MLB pensions they were owed. He became a part of the families of these old former ballplayers. He has been doing this for the last 10/11 years. It's an amazing story and there will be books and movies made about it.
 
Tried to google it, with no luck... how many HRs did Hank Aaron have playing in the Negro Leagues? Will they include his stats?
 
  • Like
Reactions: VCE
.-.
uconnfan68 said:
Tried to google it, with no luck... how many HRs did Hank Aaron have playing in the Negro Leagues? Will they include his stats?
Expand ...
He hit 9 HRs, but stats will only be counted through 1948 and his came later on so it's still Bonds
 
Deepster said:
So, are Steve Young’s and Herschel Walkers USFL stats included in their NFL totals too?
Expand ...
Not until the NFL decides ita a good idea.
 
.-.
If NFL wanted to merge USFL with NFL numbers that's their perogative. NBA did it was ABA stats even though the leagues had different rules (ABA had a 3-point shot, NBA didn't).

MLB combines AL and NL numbers even though one league has Dan Hurley and other one doesn't.

At the end of the day, it's the leagues' decisions and in 40 years no one will care.
 
HskysNvrSlp said:
Haven’t had a chance to read the article, but didn’t Josh Gibson hit like 830 home runs or something absurd like that?
Expand ...

I saw something that those totals include every game he played in including exhibitions, games against semi-pro teams, barnstorming (note: these might all be the same thing) as that is what they had to do to remain financially viable. It'd be like adding HR's for Ruth that he hit in Japan or during All Star games.

Also, the games weren't tracked as religiously as the AL/NL at that time, so they can only count stats that they can verify.

Of course the first thing I did was check to see if Aaron would overtake Bonds :)
 
Chin Diesel said:
If NFL wanted to merge USFL with NFL numbers that's their perogative. NBA did it was ABA stats even though the leagues had different rules (ABA had a 3-point shot, NBA didn't).

MLB combines AL and NL numbers even though one league has Dan Hurley and other one doesn't.

At the end of the day, it's the leagues' decisions and in 40 years no one will care.
Expand ...

Right. And my point is that anytime a league blurs those lines, it waters down the overall stat pool.
 
.-.
Chin Diesel said:
If NFL wanted to merge USFL with NFL numbers that's their perogative. NBA did it was ABA stats even though the leagues had different rules (ABA had a 3-point shot, NBA didn't).

MLB combines AL and NL numbers even though one league has Dan Hurley and other one doesn't.

At the end of the day, it's the leagues' decisions and in 40 years no one will care.
Expand ...
Much like this pointless virtue signalling from MLB.
 
I'm glad that it calls more attention to the Negro Leagues and it was a league full of pro's, but does this mean Oh's the Major League homerun king.

I'm sorry. Call me cynical, but it just feels kind of 'dirty' to me, like MLB is trying to 'whitewash' it's past. Celebrate the Negro League and it's stars. Educate young players and fans.

Baseball still has a major problem with getting the interest of young black athletes. This is what they should be addressing right now. Don't just say 'Yah, were including them decades way too late. Again, celebrate the league, the players and work on making baseball all of America's pastime. I'm glad if this move does, but I think in the long run, there is a chance it minimizes the struggle that many of the players went through. That can't ever be forgotten.
 
superjohn said:
MLB was watered down until the 1950's. The Negro Leagues were always the Major Leagues, now it's just official.
Expand ...

Well, again. By that logic, the NFL would be watered down until the USFL guys joined in.
 
Deepster said:
Well, again. By that logic, the NFL would be watered down until the USFL guys joined in.
Expand ...
No, the USFL was only around 3 years and was horrible in comparison to the NFL and the Negro Leagues were on equal footing with MLB. The NFL didn't ban all black players and ban all Latino players who had dark skin/looked black. You're trying to make some point here and all it's doing is making you look ignorant.

To answer your question the reason the USFL was destroyed and they aren't any part of the NFL is because of Donald Trump.
 
I doubt many of the records will change too much. The Negro Leagues did a lot of barnstorming tours, which will be counted as exhibition games I would imagine and therefore not count towards professional records. Also the Negro Leagues only played 60+ games a year.
 
.-.
superjohn said:
No, the USFL was only around 3 years and was horrible in comparison to the NFL and the Negro Leagues were on equal footing with MLB. The NFL didn't ban all black players and ban all Latino players who had dark skin/looked black. You're trying to make some point here and all it's doing is making you look ignorant.

To answer your question the reason the USFL was destroyed and they aren't any part of the NFL is because of Donald Trump.
Expand ...

I guess the USFL was horrible. They still had Jim Kelly, Steve Young, Reggie White, Herschel Walker, Mike Rozier and Doug Williams. And the negro league were played in the 1890s to 1930's, where the quality of baseball was really high end. Guys pitching 330 innings on 3 days rest. 2-3 guys in the entire league hitting more than 12-13 hrs a year over fences 480 yds away and all.
 
How will things like best batting averages over a single season be counted, as far as single-season records? You had guys hitting +.450 in the negro leagues but over a much shorter season. Should they belong on single-season all-time best lists> Same with ERA, etc.
 
I like this. Don't care about why, or why now, just like the idea. They were a major league.
In 1959 my little league team had a black manager who was a great guy, was told back then he was a hell of a baseball player in his day, in 59 he was in his 40's. This is for you Mr. Patterson and the opportunities you never had.
 
Deepster said:
I guess the USFL was horrible. They still had Jim Kelly, Steve Young, Reggie White, Herschel Walker, Mike Rozier and Doug Williams. And the negro league were played in the 1890s to 1930's, where the quality of baseball was really high end. Guys pitching 330 innings on 3 days rest. 2-3 guys in the entire league hitting more than 12-13 hrs a year over fences 480 yds away and all.
Expand ...
The National League has been around since 1876 and they didn't start a slow integration of black players until 1947, the Negro Leagues also started in the last 1800's and were pretty much over by the start of the 1950's once baseball had intergrated. The USFL was a little 3 year blip startup in football where black and white players chose to play for them instead of the NFL, nobody was banned from playing in the NFL.

You would've had a better argument bringing up the ABA since it was a closer league to the NBA in how good it was and because the leagues merged they have a better argument in having their totals included in the NBA totals. NBA was still a lot better but it was closer than the USFL was to the NFL. It would still be a terrible example comparing it to MLB and the Negro Leagues because black players weren't banned from the NBA and made a choice to play in the ABA.

If you do have a genuine interest and want to learn about the quality of the play and players of the Negro Leagues I suggest you read The Negro Leagues were the Major Leagues by Todd Peterson or The New Bill James Historical Abstract. You can also get a pretty decent understanding of how good these guys were by reading what Aaron, DiMaggio, Ruth, Feller etc. said about them.
 
superjohn said:
If you do have a genuine interest and want to learn about the quality of the play and players of the Negro Leagues I suggest you read The Negro Leagues were the Major Leagues by Todd Peterson or The New Bill James Historical Abstract. You can also get a pretty decent understanding of how good these guys were by reading what Aaron, DiMaggio, Ruth, Feller etc. said about them.
Expand ...
I heard about it while listening to this piece on NPR last night on my ride home. I didn't know what to think about it at the start because, embarrassingly enough, I was ignorant of the movement and had never thought about it before.

I kind of cringed when Kelly said "They're correcting racism is what they're correcting here," but upon reflection I guess that's the point. There really is no other way to say it. In any event, by the end there was no question in my mind that it's the right move.

 
In the late 1960s, a group decided which non MLB leagues counted as "Major Leagues," and the Negro Leagues were excluded, on the basis of race. They should have been included then. If they didn't do this for players like Cap Anson and others, perhaps there'd be an argument. They did, so there isn't.

It's really not going to change any career records (though Satchel Paige rockets up the charts, as he should have). This is obviously a huge win. These players came into the league and won Cy Youngs and MVPs, and unlike the USFL and ABA were excluded from the AL and NL rather than choosing to play elsewhere.
 
Last edited:
.-.
Status
Not open for further replies.

Forum statistics

Threads
168,532
Messages
4,580,649
Members
10,491
Latest member
7774Forever


Top Bottom