Marquette

[freescooter]

His teammates played tentatively in a frightened way. They didn't have the moxie to take the game. If anything, the buck stops with the coach.

This. They didn’t and NC State did. Marquette thought they were playing Butler. NC State has shown incredible moxie over the last 3 weeks. Give them some credit. I know john won’t. He refuses to believe a NEWBIE team can lose. So he invents excuses even if they are horrible and insulting. The moment was too big for Marquette. They got beat in every single phase of the game. Plus it was a bad matchup. They don’t have the size and strength to play State’s forwards. And they played a silly defense on top of that.

 

[Gutter King]

I agree. They forgot one of the basic rules of comebacks. Get points. They tried to make up an 8 point deficit on one shot. I think you could even say they panicked. That isn’t vaguely the same as they threw the game. John is such a NOOB fanboy he can’t accept that NC State just played better under pressure.

To me accusing a team of throwing a game with zero evidence is a despicable thing to say. No lower seed has ever out hustled and out played a lower one. Jeez.

You are strangely overly offended by this. By him saying "I wouldn't be surprised" is not an accusation, it's grasping for an explanation on why a team we've watched all year play with a plan absolutely no show. Did you even watch the game? It wasn't just shooting. They struggled to make the most basic passes, couldn't dribble, and had horrendous decision making throughout.

It was so out of character for that team, that anything is on the table. It was embarrassing.

This just in: gambling is a mega problem at this level. You can stick your head in the sand all you want, but it's slimy tentacles are on the court.

 

[gsmooth]

Not accusing the team. Just some of their players. They brought it on themselves.

Yeah, maybe the rebound that bounced comically off Oso's head and went OB could be attributed to a hangover and not point shaving. Fair enough.

That rebound that bounced off of Oso's head was because he got fouled by Middlebrooks. Middlebrooks slapped and pulled Oso's right arm when Oso jumped in the air to time the rebound. The officials missed that one.

 

[freescooter]

You are strangely overly offended by this. By him saying "I wouldn't be surprised" is not an accusation, it's grasping for an explanation on why a team we've watched all year play with a plan absolutely no show. Did you even watch the game? It wasn't just shooting. They struggled to make the most basic passes, couldn't dribble, and had horrendous decision making throughout.

It was so out of character for that team, that anything is on the table. It was embarrassing.

This just in: gambling is a mega problem at this level. You can stick your head in the sand all you want, but it's slimy tentacles are on the court.

I am offended by that. It is the worst accusation you can make against an athlete. And the worst thing an athlete can do in a game. It’s why players get lifetime bans. If you compete at any level above little league you’d know that.

As for his accusation, he made it. Trying to hide behind the “people will say, but I never would. I’m just reporting what others say” is not a defense.

 

[Yanksrock615]

Some people are always surprised that it’s a make or miss league. Marquette tried to get penetration to the rim multiple times. In fact it’s how they got a lot of threes. Saying “they should have had a plan b” acting like they didn’t try get to the rim illustrates to me a lack of intelligence. NC States defense was fantastic and Marquette vastly underperformed their shot quality. Its basketball, this happens.

 

[MilliniumPrince]

To an 11 seeded team that didn’t even play all that great it is. If it were to a Kentucky team clicking on all cylinders then ok. To be fair the players should also get a lot of the blame they shot horribly including fts.

Once you get to the Sweet 16, I don't care about seeding.

 

[businesslawyer]

Not accusing the team. Just some of their players. They brought it on themselves.

Yeah, maybe the rebound that bounced comically off Oso's head and went OB could be attributed to a hangover and not point shaving. Fair enough.

Disgusting thread. Nothing more cowardly than publicly and anonymously accusing a human being of a felony with no evidence. I have an idea — why don’t you walk into an FBI office and, telling everyone who you are and that you’re willing to publicly make charges, file a complaint.

Friggin internet tough guys.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

Disgusting thread. Nothing more cowardly than publicly and anonymously accusing human being of a felony with no evidence. I have an idea — why don’t you walk into an FBI office and, telling everyone who you are and that you’re willing to publicly make charges, file a complaint.

Friggin internet tough guys.

Flipping the appearance of misconduct on the person that observes the misconduct is some real mob-lawyer logic. I am surprised you didn't write "it would be a shame if something happened to you" in that post. In my experience, there is a strong correlation between how indignant someone gets at an accusation and the likelihood they did something wrong.

A lot of the decisions by Mitchell and Joplin in particular were weird in that game, and not consistent at all with their previous performance. Talk to anyone that follows betting, and there are many of these examples popping up. The only place "innocent until proven guilty" happens is in a court room. Otherwise, reputations are earned, not given, and none of us have an obligation to assume anyone is innocent. When it linked itself to gambling sites, sports took the risk that the integrity of the games would be questioned. So I am questioning the integrity of the Marquette/NC State game, which is absolutely my right to do.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

Some people are always surprised that it’s a make or miss league. Marquette tried to get penetration to the rim multiple times. In fact it’s how they got a lot of threes. Saying “they should have had a plan b” acting like they didn’t try get to the rim illustrates to me a lack of intelligence. NC States defense was fantastic and Marquette vastly underperformed their shot quality. Its basketball, this happens.

Look at the passes from Joplin and Mitchell in particular. How many were to the chest, and how many required reaches for Igodharo or Kolek to reel them in? A split second is all it takes to turn an open shot into a contested shot.

 

[businesslawyer]

Flipping the appearance of misconduct on the person that observes the misconduct is some real mob-lawyer logic. I am surprised you didn't write "it would be a shame if something happened to you" in that post. In my experience, there is a strong correlation between how indignant someone gets at an accusation and the likelihood they did something wrong.

A lot of the decisions by Mitchell and Joplin in particular were weird in that game, and not consistent at all with their previous performance. Talk to anyone that follows betting, and there are many of these examples popping up. The only place "innocent until proven guilty" happens is in a court room. Otherwise, reputations are earned, not given, and none of us have an obligation to assume anyone is innocent. When it linked itself to gambling sites, sports took the risk that the integrity of the games would be questioned. So I am questioning the integrity of the Marquette/NC State game, which is absolutely my right to do.

There are posts in this thread that would subject the poster to a reasonable risk of losing a libel suit, assuming it was worth it to a plaintiff to trace the posts to an actual human being with a name. Which it almost certainly isn't. But the thought that a poster could convince a jury that they have a reasonable basis for their belief that a felony was committed by watching players play poorly is absurd.

But, since you're an expert in everything, I'm sure you think you know more about libel and slander law than I or anyone else does as well. After all, I'm sure you once stayed at a Holiday Inn Express.

 

[Edward Sargent]

I am sorry I started this thread

 

[nelsonmuntz]

There are posts in this thread that would subject the poster to a reasonable risk of losing a libel suit, assuming it was worth it to a plaintiff to trace the posts to an actual human being with a name. Which it almost certainly isn't. But the thought that a poster could convince a jury that they have a reasonable basis for their belief that a felony was committed by watching players play poorly is absurd.

But, since you're an expert in everything, I'm sure you think you know more about libel and slander law than I or anyone else does as well. After all, I'm sure you once stayed at a Holiday Inn Express.

By your logic, claiming professional wrestling is staged would be slanderous to the wrestlers since likely none of us have first hand proof that professional wrestling is staged. Obviously, that is not the standard, and you know that.

Major conference basketball players that have been on television dozens of times are public figures by any definition, and people are opining on their actions in the arena in which they became public figures. The bar for proving libel or slander is REALLY high in that situation. Someone would have to say "I know Person X fixed a game for money" when they KNEW it was not true, have no evidence to support such an accusation, represented themselves as being a credible source for information, AND did so deliberately with the purpose of hurting the reputation of the person accused, for someone to be liable for libel or slander in that situation. Some fans on a message board saying that a game looks suspicious, and providing over a dozen examples of why the game looks suspicious, is pretty far away from an action that would make someone civilly liable.

On the other hand, any lawyer even threatening a frivolous slander or libel lawsuit with the purpose of intimidating someone into shutting up about misconduct could risk disbarment and potential criminal conspiracy charges if it was later shown that the lawyer knew or should have known that their threatening actions were in furtherance of criminal activity. In other words, the legal standard of behavior for a lawyer is much higher than it is for a regular citizen.

And I didn't stay in a Holiday Inn last night, but I have dealt with bullying lawyers over the years who think throwing around some legal jargon makes them wizards or something.


p.s. Are you one of those lawyers that threatens lawsuits if someone posts a review on TripAdvisor that their chicken was overcooked or the lettuce was soggy? A friend of a friend is a manager at a chain restaurant, and they are ready to go scorched earth on their customers. Should I send them your way?

 

[Fishy]

That was the worst game I've ever seen Marquette play.

They played like they had a burrito lunch with Ex Lax.

Really? That’s the worst game you saw them play? Really?

Because I can think of one that was worse..

 

[Mr. Wonderful]

Really? That’s the worst game you saw them play? Really?

Because I can think of one that was worse..

Yes.

I can think of more lopsided final scores that they've been on the wrong end of, but that's different. This time they did a whole lot of beating themselves.