Malina Howard Makes Commitment ........

[DaddyChoc]

Reports, rumors, hearsay!

So, we lost Harper and Langhorn, did we not gain more than we lost? Yet, there is still all this residual bellyaching.

Why is it necessary to hate on other coaches? Yet, still manage to mentally exonerate one of our own whose program just got slapped with two years probation.

Hypothetically, why shouldn't another coach target UConn recruits given UConn's success? Do we not often find Lowe's and Home Depot closely located? Burger King and McDonald's?

If not for UConn's tradition of success, what would sell a recruit on going to Storrs as opposed to College Park? Especially one from an urban area?

well said... I love the way you see things! (they just cant let things go, geesh)

 

[Outside Shot]

well said... I love the way you see things! (they just cant let things go, geesh)

Not to mention that if you're going to believe any stuff about MD (i.e. rumors and innuendo) than by the same standards, you'd have to believe the allegations Tennessee put out about UConn. Which we know was a bunch of BS. It just comes down to sour grapes when things don't go your way and wanting to console yourself by thinking bad things about the other side.

 

[Kibitzer]

Thinking back on that NC that Maryland won, and steering clear of this Walz/Frese/Harper/Langhorne discussion, my recollection is that a key player for Maryland was Shay Doron.

Allow for my fallible memory, please, but my long-held opinion has been that the failure or inability of UConn to successfully recruit this player was extremely unfortunate.

Shay came to the USA from Israel and I seem to recall that she had UConn on her very short list very early. She attended and played for Christ the King. I have no idea whether or how well she studied her Cathecism.

She was widly considered a strong UConn "lean," but surprisingly showed up at Maryland. I do not know the "inside story" of why she didn't come to Storrs or why she went to College Park. But it was clearly our loss, so to speak, and certainly an important gain for the Terps.

 

[Kibitzer]

widely.

 

[Icebear]

Not to mention that if you're going to believe any stuff about MD (i.e. rumors and innuendo) than by the same standards, you'd have to believe the allegations Tennessee put out about UConn. Which we know was a bunch of BS. It just comes down to sour grapes when things don't go your way and wanting to console yourself by thinking bad things about the other side.

The material about recruiting issues with Harper were not rumor and came from people involved in the situation and media reports. I, also, sat directly behind the Maryland bench for the two games in State College the year they won the championship. Where I sat was, also, directly in front of the Maryland fans.

Jeff Walz was the coach who was busy with the Xs and Os during the game. He left following that season for Louisville. I believe he was, also, their lead recruiter at that time over seeing those responsibilties. Much of what was conveyed to the team in breaks came directly from Jeff.

The cheers from the Terrapin fans were the most noxious cheers I have ever heard at a men's or women's college basketball games. For the games against both Sacred Heart and St. John's they included cheers about abortion, they relentlessly hounded a particular player that had a child using the rudest terms, and more. I, finally, had had enough and stood up wearing my clerics and stared directly at the ringleader of these cheers and he finally shut up at the behest of those sitting around him and the situation was resolved for the rest of the game.

So my experience of that Maryland team was largely first hand knowledge and experience. Maryland was lucky to escape with a win over St. John's who only trailed by one at the half and the score was tied at 72 with 3 minutes to go.

 

[Outside Shot]

I simply don't believe you. I've been around the Maryland program when I lived there. I was fortunate enough to be befriended by some of their supporters and we had fun going back and forth in a good-natured way. And you have your facts wrong- Walz did not leave right after the national championship. He was around the next season at Maryland when they played up here in Hartford and got upset by Mississippi. We'll just disagree. I don't have a problem with them. If I'm not rooting for UConn, I can easily be happy for Maryland doing well.

The material about recruiting issues with Harper were not rumor and came from people involved in the situation and media reports. I, also, sat directly behind the Maryland bench for the two games in State College the year they won the championship. Where I sat was, also, directly in front of the Maryland fans.

Jeff Walz was the coach who was busy with the Xs and Os during the game. He left following that season for Louisville. I believe he was, also, their lead recruiter at that time over seeing those responsibilties. Much of what was conveyed to the team in breaks came directly from Jeff.

The cheers from the Terrapin fans were the most noxious cheers I have ever heard at a men's or women's college basketball games. For the games against both Sacred Heart and St. John's they included cheers about abortion, they relentlessly hounded a particular player that had a child using the rudest terms, and more. I, finally, had had enough and stood up wearing my clerics and stared directly at the ringleader of these cheers and he finally shut up at the behest of those sitting around him and the situation was resolved for the rest of the game.

So my experience of that Maryland team was largely first hand knowledge and experience. Maryland was lucky to escape with a win over St. John's who only trailed by one at the half and the score was tied at 72 with 3 minutes to go.

 

[Icebear]

Well, you are misinformed then because here are the roster pages with coaching staff for the championship season and the one following.

Walz is on the championship staff and is gone the following year and even if that is not right it was no more than one year after that because he was at WVU.

http://www.umterps.com/sports/w-baskbl/stats/2005-2006/roster.html

http://www.umterps.com/sports/w-baskbl/archive/06-07-wbb-roster.html

So yes, Walz was gone

Here is the roster from Louisville for the 2006-7 season.

http://www.uoflsports.com/sports/w-baskbl/archive/06-07-wbb-roster.html

So believe me or not those are the facts. There are many wonderful people around every program so I have no doubt you know many but there are probably others here who might confirm what I said since that was the year UConn played its first two rounds at the PSU Jordan Center although they were on the other end of the court.

If you doubt that I was there Biff has a picture of me that has been posted on the Boneyard prviously directly behind Brenda Frese exactly where I said I was sitting.

 

[Icebear]

Thinking back on that NC that Maryland won, and steering clear of this Walz/Frese/Harper/Langhorne discussion, my recollection is that a key player for Maryland was Shay Doron.

Allow for my fallible memory, please, but my long-held opinion has been that the failure or inability of UConn to successfully recruit this player was extremely unfortunate.

Shay came to the USA from Israel and I seem to recall that she had UConn on her very short list very early. She attended and played for Christ the King. I have no idea whether or how well she studied her Cathecism.

She was widly considered a strong UConn "lean," but surprisingly showed up at Maryland. I do not know the "inside story" of why she didn't come to Storrs or why she went to College Park. But it was clearly our loss, so to speak, and certainly an important gain for the Terps.

You are correct, Kib, Doron was a junior the year of the title. She was a kid who always played with heart.

 

[xxx001]

According to the bio provided by Louisville Jeff Walz was officially hired on March 27th, 2007.

 

[connboy77]

You are correct, Kib, Doron was a junior the year of the title. She was a kid who always played with heart.

She would have made a great Huskie!

 

[Vowelguy]

The material about recruiting issues with Harper were not rumor and came from people involved in the situation and media reports.

What issues? Even if MD did approach her after her verbal, if she really was set on UConn, she would not have been swayed, or she would not have listened.
Clearly it was a weak verbal and I have no doubt that both teams ended up better off.

I, also, sat directly behind the Maryland bench for the two games in State College the year they won the championship. Where I sat was, also, directly in front of the Maryland fans.

So what's your point? I don't know what the behavior of fans at one game has to do with the coach.

So my experience of that Maryland team was largely first hand knowledge and experience.

First hand knowledge of ONE set of fans. One data point is weak to draw any conclusions.

I'm no fan of MD, but it amazes me the way in which certain dogmatic items get repeated without much proof.

 

[Icebear]

According to the bio provided by Louisville Jeff Walz was officially hired on March 27th, 2007.

It is likely that is true and that WVU has conflict within their own information but that does not account for Maryland not having him on the coaching roster for 2006-7 as per the link above.

 

[EricSD]

Reports, rumors, hearsay!

So, we lost Harper and Langhorn, did we not gain more than we lost? Yet, there is still all this residual bellyaching.

Why is it necessary to hate on other coaches? Yet, still manage to mentally exonerate one of our own whose program just got slapped with two years probation.

Hypothetically, why shouldn't another coach target UConn recruits given UConn's success? Do we not often find Lowe's and Home Depot closely located? Burger King and McDonald's?

If not for UConn's tradition of success, what would sell a recruit on going to Storrs as opposed to College Park? Especially one from an urban area?

not sure i get your point. so by your logic, the whole 30+ page report filed against UCONN by Pat and Tennessee was a long time ago. Along with Pat's snide comments about Geno and cheating, etc. UCONN certainly went on to win 2 NC's 3 and 2 years ago so no one should dislike Tennessee?

Syracuse's thugball smackfest of several (3 or so?) years ago wasn't recent so UCONN fans should like and root for Hillsman and his program?

i don't see anyone "bellyaching". several people posted that they wished Howard had gone to ND because there is some serious dislike for Maryland. for some, it's fans. for others it's things the coach did regarding recruiting. so what? fans dislike programs for many reasons.

as for exonerating Calhoun, as i assume it's him you are referring to, the men's team is paying the price right now with the punishment from the NCAA. now if you mean exonerate him referring to still rooting for the men's team to win and be successful, then i guess 95% of the UCONN women's fans are guilty as charged.

 

[Vowelguy]

Well, you are misinformed then because here are the roster pages with coaching staff for the championship season and the one following.

Walz was hired @ Lou in March 2007, so he indeed was at MD for the 2006-07 season.

http://www.cstv.com/sports/w-baskbl/stories/032707aaq.html

He was at Neb until 2001, with Frese in MN 01-02, then 02-07 at MD - which matches the 5 seasons cited in the article.

Also note that the reason Frese was hired at MN was her strong performance at Toledo -- something she did sans Walz. Walz may indeed have been a huge help, but to say that she has no ability as a coach is just silly.

 

[Icebear]

What issues? Even if MD did approach her after her verbal, if she really was set on UConn, she would not have been swayed, or she would not have listened.
Clearly it was a weak verbal and I have no doubt that both teams ended up better off.

The issue of being recruited over after a verbal had been made.Simply mean what was reported at the time concerning the events. I do not disagree with your observation of the strength of the commitment nor regret the final outcome. It seemed good for everyone. Nor is it possible to say that it wasn't Jeff Walz who continued contact for MD.

So what's your point? I don't know what the behavior of fans at one game has to do with the coach.

Two games. Both the Sacred Heart and the St. John's game. These were the fans that traveled to follow the team in the NCAA tournament. They were the fans sitting in the University ticket area. You would feel differently if you had heard the cheers.

First hand knowledge of ONE set of fans. One data point is weak to draw any conclusions.

I'm no fan of MD, but it amazes me the way in which certain dogmatic items get repeated without much proof.

The proof is as I offered my first hand experience and the available roster from the two schools and Biff's picture that I was exactly where I said. I, also, spent time during the UConn games with Philster, and several others including meeting both Ann Strother's mother and Mary Thomas. I, also, acknowledged that it is very possible to have had met many nice Terrapin fans. I have met very nice Tennessee fans but that does mean all are or aren't either way.

 

[Icebear]

Walz was hired @ Lou in March 2007, so he indeed was at MD for the 2006-07 season.

http://www.cstv.com/sports/w-baskbl/stories/032707aaq.html

He was at Neb until 2001, with Frese in MN 01-02, then 02-07 at MD - which matches the 5 seasons cited in the article.

Also note that the reason Frese was hired at MN was her strong performance at Toledo -- something she did sans Walz. Walz may indeed have been a huge help, but to say that she has no ability as a coach is just silly.

Yes, I see that, as well, but it, also means that both the MD and Louisville sites have the same error which is very odd. In my original post I did note that it was either 2005-6 or 2006-7 that he left. The Louisville has conflicting information within its own site. Either way it was very shortly after the National Championship, at most one season.

 

[Vowelguy]

Yes, I see that, as well, but it, also means that both the MD and Louisville sites have the same error. In my original post I did note that it was either 2005-6 or 2006-7 that he left. The Louisville has conflicting information within its own site. Either way it was very shortly after the National Championship, at most one season.

First of all, you blew the original poster out of the water for having the wrong facts. I'm sure he/she awaits your apology now that you falsely criticized him.

Two, a large chunk of your argument was that MD fell apart the moment Walz left. But he in fact WAS around for the disappointing 06-07 season. You were so eager to blame that all on Frese, but clearly Walz shares some of that responsibility. In fact, if he was already running everything (as you allege), I wonder if he should get all of the blame as well.

 

[HuskyNan]

People are blaming Frese for actions taking by a third party, namely Mike Flynn. Let's not rewrite history.

As for Frese, Geno helped her by endorsing her to the Maryland AD when that school was hiring its head coach. But pretty much the first thing she did after getting the job was to lure Shay Doron away from UConn by telling her what a basketball factory UConn is; Geno loses one player then just plugs another one in, etc. This was reported in the Baltimore Sun which quoted Doron when she committed to Maryland. While it is negative recruiting, it's not all that bad but it was the timing and the emphatic representation of UConn and Geno as rather uncaring and impersonal that Geno took to heart, especially as it was right after his generous act for her.

Having said that, I don't know if Geno has long forgotten the perceived (by those with Husky colored glasses) insult but I do know I haven't seen the Terrapins on UConn's schedule.

 

[CamrnCrz1974]

Have to say, this was a huge surprise for me as well. I thought she was a lock for Notre Dame.

 

[CamrnCrz1974]

People are blaming Frese for actions taking by a third party, namely Mike Flynn. Let's not rewrite history.

As for Frese, Geno helped her by endorsing her to the Maryland AD when that school was hiring its head coach. But pretty much the first thing she did after getting the job was to lure Shay Doron away from UConn by telling her what a basketball factory UConn is; Geno loses one player then just plugs another one in, etc. This was reported in the Baltimore Sun which quoted Doron when she committed to Maryland. While it is negative recruiting, it's not all that bad but it was the timing and the emphatic representation of UConn and Geno as rather uncaring and impersonal that Geno took to heart, especially as it was right after his generous act for her.

There was more to it than just what Frese purportedly said about UConn. Let's just say Lamont Jordan and Yuda Doron were involved quite heavily with recruiting "to" Maryland in ways that Geno probably would not have permitted. They were legal, but shady.

 

[HuskyNan]

There was more to it than just what Frese purportedly said about UConn. Let's just say Lamont Jordan and Yuda Doron were involved quite heavily with recruiting "to" Maryland in ways that Geno probably would not have permitted. They were legal, but shady.

I have heard several versions of what went on there but my point is that Geno felt that Frese repaid his good act with one of bad faith. I understand trying hard to recruit the best players, and am sure Geno does too, but the way the events unfolded were, let's say, unfortunate.

 

[Icebear]

There was more to it than just what Frese purportedly said about UConn. Let's just say Lamont Jordan and Yuda Doron were involved quite heavily with recruiting "to" Maryland in ways that Geno probably would not have permitted. They were legal, but shady.

That is largely how I remember it, too, from the time, basically, as you and Nan suggest.

 

[Icebear]

Vowelguy, I have no problem with holding Walz accountable for a share of the 2006-7 season but there has been nothing even approaching the NC year since he has been gone. MD has played very good basketball but nothing stellar while Walz did bring Louisville the the finals against us during Angel's senior year.

As I said regarding the departure of Walz earlier I have no problem apologizing to Outside as far as him/her being wrong which he/she was not but provided material from the University of Maryland itself and the University of Louisville that indicated he/she was wrong and I allowed for that possiblity that it was one year later. If you can't trust a school to have its own records right it is pretty tough.

 

[Vowelguy]

Vowelguy, I have no problem with holding Walz accountable for a share of the 2006-7 season but there has been nothing even approaching the NC year since he has been gone. MD has played very good basketball but nothing stellar while Walz did bring Louisville the the finals against us during Angel's senior year.

As I said regarding the departure of Walz earlier I have no problem apologizing to Outside as far as him/her being wrong which he/she was not but provided material from the University of Maryland itself and the University of Louisville that indicated he/she was wrong and I allowed for that possiblity that it was one year later. If you can't trust a school to have its own records right it is pretty tough.

You constantly keep changing your argument; as each of your "facts" is proved wrong you just morph it into something else.

You said she had "no talent as a coach."

It is this over-the-top statements that I object to, and which all available evidence disproves.
I'm done with this.

 

[VAUConnFan]

not sure i get your point. so by your logic, the whole 30+ page report filed against UCONN by Pat and Tennessee was a long time ago. Along with Pat's snide comments about Geno and cheating, etc. UCONN certainly went on to win 2 NC's 3 and 2 years ago so no one should dislike Tennessee?

Syracuse's thugball smackfest of several (3 or so?) years ago wasn't recent so UCONN fans should like and root for Hillsman and his program?

i don't see anyone "bellyaching". several people posted that they wished Howard had gone to ND because there is some serious dislike for Maryland. for some, it's fans. for others it's things the coach did regarding recruiting. so what? fans dislike programs for many reasons.

as for exonerating Calhoun, as i assume it's him you are referring to, the men's team is paying the price right now with the punishment from the NCAA. now if you mean exonerate him referring to still rooting for the men's team to win and be successful, then i guess 95% of the UCONN women's fans are guilty as charged.

A total misunderstanding from top to bottom. This discussion was/is peripherally about Brenda Frese, her "alleged" tampering, and her abilities as a coach.

The coach to whom I was referring was Jamelle Elliott, her program incurring the most recent two year sanction.

 

[turtlespeed]

People are blaming Frese for actions taking by a third party, namely Mike Flynn. Let's not rewrite history.

As for Frese, Geno helped her by endorsing her to the Maryland AD when that school was hiring its head coach. But pretty much the first thing she did after getting the job was to lure Shay Doron away from UConn by telling her what a basketball factory UConn is; Geno loses one player then just plugs another one in, etc. This was reported in the Baltimore Sun which quoted Doron when she committed to Maryland. While it is negative recruiting, it's not all that bad but it was the timing and the emphatic representation of UConn and Geno as rather uncaring and impersonal that Geno took to heart, especially as it was right after his generous act for her.

Having said that, I don't know if Geno has long forgotten the perceived (by those with Husky colored glasses) insult but I do know I haven't seen the Terrapins on UConn's schedule.

The reason that the Terps have not been on UConn's schedule is not because Geno holds a grudge, instead it is because Frese has not wanted to play them most likely because she didn't want to get a bashing like Duke and UNC were constantly getting. I specifically recall a few years ago Geno stating that he couldn't get MD to agree to play his team.

 

[turtlespeed]

You constantly keep changing your argument; as each of your "facts" is proved wrong you just morph it into something else.

You said she had "no talent as a coach."

It is this over-the-top statements that I object to, and which all available evidence disproves.
I'm done with this.

Vowelguy you made some excellent arguments and provided some great facts and I would like to add a few more to support your case. It is correct that Walz left after the 2006-07 season after MD could not get past the sweet 16. Everybody seems to give him the credit for the NC but blame Brenda for the collapse the next year even though Walz was still there. Amazing isn't it. After Walz left with the defeat in the sweet 16, Brenda brought the team back to the elite 8 for two more years. Seems like she was able to improve after Walz left. What has really been missed here is that MD was always noted as a great offensive team but no defense. Yet for all those years that Walz was with the team, they never got any better on defense. Don't get me wrong I do think Walz is a great coach, definitely better than Brenda, but Walz also has to take the blame for their lack of defense. Even after Walz left, Brenda has continued to field teams that are very good offensively. While no one has probably even noticed, during the last two years MD has actually been respectable on defense which shows that Brenda can coach and improve things that she was deficient in. I have been following MD for a few years before their NC and Brenda has always provided guidance in the hudles whether they were standing on the court or siting in the chairs, the same way with or without Walz as the assistant. What gets me is how some people just post things from left field and act like they know the facts but are completely wrong. Love to see someone like Vowelguy stand up and challenge these posters.

 

[doggydaddy]

You constantly keep changing your argument; as each of your "facts" is proved wrong you just morph it into something else.

You said she had "no talent as a coach."

It is this over-the-top statements that I object to, and which all available evidence disproves.
I'm done with this.

And I get asked to "knock it off"???

Wow.

 

[Kibitzer]

And I get asked to "knock it off"???

Wow.

Yeah, knock it off!

 

[Icebear]

You constantly keep changing your argument; as each of your "facts" is proved wrong you just morph it into something else.

You said she had "no talent as a coach."

It is this over-the-top statements that I object to, and which all available evidence disproves.
I'm done with this.

Yes, in my opinion she has no talent as a coach. That is clearly a statement that is relative to the market in which she holds her position, not Jr High coaches in PA. You have provided no evidence to refute anything. At least I gave evidence as to where my "facts" came from and they were from the University itself and should be presumably accurate.

Sweet 16 and Elite Eight results with much of the same personal that was among the starters and players on a NC team is far from being successful. Folks here were far from satisfied with the results when we making those rounds even after losing the best player in the country in Diana and having an incredibly young team.