LeBron

[dogfan96]

Except when you have three players the caliber of James, Wade, and Bosh, those things don't matter as much. Rose was playing with Noah, Deng, and Boozer. Noah has blossomed since, but none of those guys were of the caliber of 2011 Wade or Bosh.

LeBron averaged 26.7
Wade averaged 25.5
Bosh averaged 18.7

In contrast:

Rose averaged 25
Boozer averaged 17.5
Deng averaged 17.4
Noah averaged 11.7

So...LeBron played with another go to scorer...and Bosh was also one. He averaged 24ppg the year before, whereas the most any of Rose's teammates averaged was 21.1 by Boozer 3 years prior.

In contrast, look at Jordan's team 1993 team. Scottie Pippen was the only one to average more than 20 ppg before. Horace Grant maxed out at 15 with Orlando, BJ Armstrong maxed out at 14.8 the year Jordan retired, and Bill Cartwright had maxed out in the early 1980s. Take a look at his team. I'll say you can say Wade and Pippen are washes (although I'd argue Pippen is better...much better defender but not quite the scorer). Take a look at the rest of the roster...it's kind of terrifying: http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/CHI/1993.html

I don't disagree with any of that. Just saying the Big 3 carried a Herculean load that year. The Bulls weren't as talented offensively but they had a lot of good young players (throw in Taj Gibson) and they were a great defensive team too. Miami was pretty much the Big 3, a green Mario Chalmers (he couldn't even beat out Mike Bibby, who had a huge fork sticking out of his back all year) and a bunch of old, washed up vets. They couldn't really run a lot of "good" offense bc they couldn't really rely on anybody outside of the Big 3. When it came to crunch time, they basically said LeBron go guard the other team's best player (and he proceeded to put the clamps on Derrick Rose.. I've never seen a superstar player so dejected afterwards.. I still remember his quote "It's frustrating when a 6'8 guy can guard you easily") and on offense, they did what OKC is doing now. LeBron and Wade alternated playing hero ball and they were so good that it worked until they went up against Dallas, who had an excellent game plan for them.

 

[champs99and04]

Except when you have three players the caliber of James, Wade, and Bosh, those things don't matter as much. Rose was playing with Noah, Deng, and Boozer. Noah has blossomed since, but none of those guys were of the caliber of 2011 Wade or Bosh.

LeBron averaged 26.7
Wade averaged 25.5
Bosh averaged 18.7

In contrast:

Rose averaged 25
Boozer averaged 17.5
Deng averaged 17.4
Noah averaged 11.7

So...LeBron played with another go to scorer...and Bosh was also one. He averaged 24ppg the year before, whereas the most any of Rose's teammates averaged was 21.1 by Boozer 3 years prior.

In contrast, look at Jordan's team 1993 team. Scottie Pippen was the only one to average more than 20 ppg before. Horace Grant maxed out at 15 with Orlando, BJ Armstrong maxed out at 14.8 the year Jordan retired, and Bill Cartwright had maxed out in the early 1980s. Take a look at his team. I'll say you can say Wade and Pippen are washes (although I'd argue Pippen is better...much better defender but not quite the scorer). Take a look at the rest of the roster...it's kind of terrifying: http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/CHI/1993.html

It's true that Wade and Bosh were better than anybody on the Bulls that year (sans Rose), but 1-12, the Bulls were the much more complete team. In Carlos Arroyo, the Heat were literally starting a D-Leaguer at point guard for a large chunk of the year, and two of their key reserves (Miller and Haslem) were out for basically the entire season as dogfan said.

The Rose MVP is something that made a lot more sense at the time than it does in hindsight. For one, it was the first (or second?) year of the Thibs era, so we weren't quite aware yet of how great a coach he was (even though I'm pretty sure he won COY). Rose was part of the reason that team was great, sure. But three things that win in the regular season more than anything else - depth, coaching, and youth - the Bulls had in spades that year. If you were devising a roster to win in the regular season, I'm easily taking a Rose/Boozer/Noah/Deng core with the best bench in the league over James/Bosh/Wade with D-League players and washouts 4-12.

 

[Matrim55]

If you were devising a roster to win in the regular season, I'm easily taking a Rose/Boozer/Noah/Deng core with the best bench in the league over James/Bosh/Wade with D-League players and washouts 4-12.

Really well put.

Also worth keeping in mind when discussing Jordan's early Bulls teams. A core of Jordan, Pippen and Grant with two floor-spacing guards (Armstrong and Paxson) and two good rebounder/smart defender bigs (Cartwright and Williams).

That is a team built to annihilate all comers in the playoffs. Everybody had a role, everybody knew it.

The Heat are close to the same thing now, though I still think they lack talent outside the Big 3, Ray and - to a lesser extent - Chalmers.

 

[MilliniumPrince]

Durant may eventually lift the game to a new level, but right now Lebron plays a different game than everyone else. The great/bad thing is he makes brilliance look so ho-hum. Easy to take Lebron for granted.