Lamb near decision...Drummond still unsure

[champs99and04]

Sorry, unless I missed something isn't JC the head coach of the Huskies or is he now a sports agent? Getting guys drafted high is an agent's job, not the coach at a university's job. A coach's job should be to try to get kids to stay in school as long as possible to hopefully get their degrees or come close not to push them into the NBA. If you're correct, that this is what JC is doing, maybe this is how we got into the APR mess we're in? I say a little more focus on the education side and less on the NBA side is overdue.

Dude, you have no idea what you're talking about. First of all, Calhoun convincing Jeremy to go pro has nothing to do with the APR. As long as he finishes up his sophmore year in good standing he will receive full points for his services. Secondly, Calhoun's first responsibility is to look out for the best interest of his kids. I don't know which coach said it, but it was something along the lines of, "You can go make money or you can come back and make me money". Calhoun convincing Lamb to return to school would be in his best interests, not Jeremy's. Do you think that's what a parent wants to hear when a coach is sitting down to recruit his or her son?

Should John Calipari beg Anthony Davis to return to school so he can get closer to his degree? Just ridiculous.

 

[HeGotGame]

Wait no one on this board can be dumb enough to actually believe UK would beat the Bobcats right? Vegas released a line because so many morons were saying this and it was Bobcats -30, that is right 30.

Also, the people bad mouthing the NBA are just ignorant, we played a national championship game in which a total of 94 points were scored. Butler made a total of 6 shots over 20 minuets of play. FG % and the overall college game has been deteriorating at a rapid rate. I still like the college game more because of the intangibles and my love for UConn, but the NBA game is light years ahead right now.

 

[HeGotGame]

Sorry, unless I missed something isn't JC the head coach of the Huskies or is he now a sports agent? Getting guys drafted high is an agent's job, not the coach at a university's job. A coach's job should be to try to get kids to stay in school as long as possible to hopefully get their degrees or come close not to push them into the NBA. If you're correct, that this is what JC is doing, maybe this is how we got into the APR mess we're in? I say a little more focus on the education side and less on the NBA side is overdue.

You sound foolish. These kids are here to play basketball, they are "pre-NBA", like some other students are "pre-law" or "pre-med", JC's job is to make sure they in the best position to succeed at the next level and to go to the NBA when the time is right. Telling someone like Anthony Davis to stay in school and get his degree is doing the player a major injustice.

Also,you really need to educate your self on the APR.

 

[NHUConnfan]

I seriously doubt Andre Drummond would get significantly better in one more year at college than he would in an NBA D-league. He's in the 2-5 draft range. He should go. End of story.

Don't draw parallels to Thabeet. He had 3 years in college and was dominant and it clearly didn't translate over. But I think maybe people saw that coming. Drummond is a freak show and has 100x more potential than Thabeet ever had. Now that the NBA D-league is actually functional now (more so than in the past), he doesn't risk sitting on the bench of a team. And chances are, if he makes an NBA roster, he'll be playing for a pathetically bad team and will get plenty of opportunities to prove himself.

How will Drummond benefit from another year? Averaging 18 points and 11 rebounds a game? Who cares...people already know he has that ability? Show that he's a defensive whiz? The NBA defense is so different that he'll need to relearn it anyway and Drummond possesses the raw skills to get it done.

And this is why I say that anyone saying Drummond should return is just selfish. NBA coaches think the potential is there now and that will not change to anything better in one year. He's already riding the mass hype. One more year of college will in no way guarantee him a better contract in the future, nor can you say that the chance is even better; because for every one you find that was the case, I'm sure you could find one where that wasn't the case. The NBA draft has always and will always be based on potential. When he gets into the NBA, then he can worry about the next step. But not one ounce of what he does next year in college would guarantee him a better contract. This isn't the NFL!

 

[champs99and04]

DM I agree with a lot of what you wrote, but I think your point about him not being a "fourth quarter guy" is way off base. Lamb didn't excel at the end of games this season simply because he's not good at breaking his man down off the dribble. Unfortunately, Jeremy set the bar very high this season by going off for 30 points in his first game. He's a really good player, one of the best in the country, but he's not one of those guys that's going to say "hop on my back, I'm dropping 40 tonight". He's a great pure scorer, but he's also dependent on a good point guard and big men who can set good screens. It also helps when, like last year, he's the second or third option instead of the first. With Kemba drawing ten eyes at the end of games last season, Lamb was able to free himself often and knockdown huge shots. It's not that he isn't an end of game player, it's just that his skill set is not conducive to hitting that shot at the buzzer. The difference between this year and last year is that Lamb was covered better off the ball, it wasn't the disappearing act that many on here make it out to be. JMO

 

[UCweCONN]

Dude, you have no idea what you're talking about. First of all, Calhoun convincing Jeremy to go pro has nothing to do with the APR. As long as he finishes up his sophmore year in good standing he will receive full points for his services. Secondly, Calhoun's first responsibility is to look out for the best interest of his kids. I don't know which coach said it, but it was something along the lines of, "You can go make money or you can come back and make me money". Calhoun convincing Lamb to return to school would be in his best interests, not Jeremy's. Do you think that's what a parent wants to hear when a coach is sitting down to recruit his or her son?

Should John Calipari beg Anthony Davis to return to school so he can get closer to his degree? Just ridiculous.

I can see my point went right over your head so let me put it more simply. If a program continues to send marginal talent to the NBA it runs the risk of creating a culture where academics has no importance. Thus the reason I mention APR. If every Joe thinks he's going pro beginning their freshman year and people don't try to dissuade them, you don't think it erodes kids' focus on working towards graduation and thereby hurts APR?? As for bringing Kentucky into the discussion, is that the type of program you want UCONN to be? First, we'd need to bring in a class of ultra-talented studs every year like they do, and second, as other posters gave written, implement a cupcake course schedule to keep them in good academic standing for their first year to protect our APR. As for your comment about Anthony Davis, there's a big difference between a guy being the consensus top pick and a guy going mid to late first round. I have no problem with the elite players going pro. I do have a problem with the Marcus Williams, Josh Boone's and others of the world doing it. That is my point.

 

[RS9999X]

Lamb runs the risk every year that a Freshmen like Bradley Beals comes out, pulls it together at the right time, has the x quotient and the buzz, and then Jeremy slips to 2nd best SG available and not quite good enough (unique size and physicality) to be a top 10 pick. No surprise there. Top 10 picks are loaded with Centers, PFs, and top flight PGs. Size, ball handling and physical growth potential.

As far as JC talking with Scouts I'm sure they tell him their gut feel and there are usually caveats: who else comes out; international players; trades; workouts.

IIRC Josh Boone 'surprised' JC so no I don't believe something JC blurts out to the press is NBA Draft Gospel 60 days from now.

 

[Huskymaniac]

Why did Sullinger return for another year? If it was the lockout, why did Kemba leave? When a kid from another team returns, we say he had other reasons. When a UConn kid is projected to be a lottery pick only a fool would think he could possibly have any good reason to risk losing his draft spot and the money that goes along with it. Why are UConn fans in such a hurry to kick our players out of the nest? Maybe Jeremy has the same reasons to return as Sullinger did......whatever those reasons may be.......

 

[HuskyHawk]

I guess it depends on how you define bad. I've conceded from the beginning that the players are better, but simply having better players doesn't translate into a better game, or maybe a more entertaining game is a better way of putting it. I find the NBA passionless for the most part except late in the playoffs, and not particularly entertaining. And more or less predictable. In a word, boring. Others disagree, which is fine but overall it is a matter of personal preference. Doesn't mean one side is right and one wrong. Only that we have different ways of looking at it.

I would say that the NBA was better in the Magic-Bird era. It sucked in the Jordan era, and slowly got better. Right now, defense is a much bigger focus, and it's a better game. The rules changes on D have helped.

But I enjoy the college game more because unlike most other sports, like football and soccer, that are just better when the execution is better, NBA athletes have exceeded the limitations of the court and hoop. The game was not designed to be played as it is today. The fans of the women's game enjoy basketball below the rim. I feel the same way about good Ivy teams. It's a more elegant and team oriented sport below the rim. So while I can be awed by the athleticism of the NBA game, it's a bit like watching major league baseball players play in a little league park. Some of the beauty is lost. It's entirely too easy for them.

 

[businesslawyer]

I seriously doubt Andre Drummond would get significantly better in one more year at college than he would in an NBA D-league. He's in the 2-5 draft range. He should go. End of story.

Don't draw parallels to Thabeet. He had 3 years in college and was dominant and it clearly didn't translate over. But I think maybe people saw that coming. Drummond is a freak show and has 100x more potential than Thabeet ever had. Now that the NBA D-league is actually functional now (more so than in the past), he doesn't risk sitting on the bench of a team. And chances are, if he makes an NBA roster, he'll be playing for a pathetically bad team and will get plenty of opportunities to prove himself.

How will Drummond benefit from another year? Averaging 18 points and 11 rebounds a game? Who cares...people already know he has that ability? Show that he's a defensive whiz? The NBA defense is so different that he'll need to relearn it anyway and Drummond possesses the raw skills to get it done.

And this is why I say that anyone saying Drummond should return is just selfish. NBA coaches think the potential is there now and that will not change to anything better in one year. He's already riding the mass hype. One more year of college will in no way guarantee him a better contract in the future, nor can you say that the chance is even better; because for every one you find that was the case, I'm sure you could find one where that wasn't the case. The NBA draft has always and will always be based on potential. When he gets into the NBA, then he can worry about the next step. But not one ounce of what he does next year in college would guarantee him a better contract. This isn't the NFL!

I'm sorry -- you think everyone knows he has the ability to average 18 and 11? I don't know that. I know he has some of the physical tools that would allow one to average 18 and 11, but I have no clue if he has any of the mental tools (desire, basketball sense, concentration) to do so.

 

[NHUConnfan]

I'm sorry -- you think everyone knows he has the ability to average 18 and 11? I don't know that. I know he has some of the physical tools that would allow one to average 18 and 11, but I have no clue if he has any of the mental tools (desire, basketball sense, concentration) to do so.

And you don't think mental tools change considering whether you're in the NCAA or NBA? If you get a pay check, I'd imagine desire and concentration would be at the forefront unless you hate the game...which then, you shouldn't be playing.

 

[NHUConnfan]

I'll phrase it this way:

To UConn fans: Drummond has something to prove.

To NBA scouts: Drummond has (almost) nothing to prove.

And I'll kindly bow out of this conversation here. Commence trolling, trolls.

 

[businesslawyer]

And you don't think mental tools change considering whether you're in the NCAA or NBA? If you get a pay check, I'd imagine desire and concentration would be at the forefront unless you hate the game...which then, you shouldn't be playing.

Not every young man has the ability to focus on a task for two hours. Not every young man can feel or understand what everyone around him is doing on the court. I know coaches think I can teach anything but athleticism, but it's just not true.

You think Drummond didn't try this year because he wasn't being paid? O.K., that's possible I guess, but most athletes in college don't ever get paid to do it and most athletes in college try their butts off. I know I did.

 

[champs99and04]

I can see my point went right over your head so let me put it more simply. If a program continues to send marginal talent to the NBA it runs the risk of creating a culture where academics has no importance. Thus the reason I mention APR. If every Joe thinks he's going pro beginning their freshman year and people don't try to dissuade them, you don't think it erodes kids' focus on working towards graduation and thereby hurts APR?? As for bringing Kentucky into the discussion, is that the type of program you want UCONN to be? First, we'd need to bring in a class of ultra-talented studs every year like they do, and second, as other posters gave written, implement a cupcake course schedule to keep them in good academic standing for their first year to protect our APR. As for your comment about Anthony Davis, there's a big difference between a guy being the consensus top pick and a guy going mid to late first round. I have no problem with the elite players going pro. I do have a problem with the Marcus Williams, Josh Boone's and others of the world doing it. That is my point.

What basis do you have to say Marcus Williams and Josh Boone shouldn't have gone pro? If you're a first round pick, and feel your ready for the NBA, what reason is there to return to school? If either of those guys had returned to school chances are their stocks would have dropped and they'd be a lot worse off financially right now. There are only 30 kids in the country good enough to be selected in the first round, so I think calling them "any joe" is overstating it a bit.

Again, I can kind of see what you're trying to say with the academics issue, but I don't think it applies much, if at all to most situations. Has Calhoun created a culture where academics don't matter or one where players are allowed to chase their dreams if they're good enough to be picked in the first round? Like it or not, most basketball players at major programs like UConn are athletes first, students second, and frankly, I have no problem with it. If a Jeremy Lamb wants to lighten up his coursework during the spring semester so he can prepare himself for the draft, all the power to him. It would be silly to say, "Sorry, Jeremy, you can't get your shots up today because you have to study for that advanced bio test tomorrow".

I'm not saying we should necessarily model our program after Kentucky, but their are certanly a lot more similarities between those two schools than there are between UConn and Princeton. UConn recruits a lot of top 100 kids who are likely to have a career in basketball, whether it be over seas or in the NBA. Obviously it is nice to be working towards a backup plan, but again, if a kid weighs school work over basketball would he really be taking off across the country every week during the Winter semester? I'm not saying school isn't important, it's just that most of these kids are going to be making their money as an athlete and not as a student.

 

[champs99and04]

I'll phrase it this way:

To UConn fans: Drummond has something to prove.

To NBA scouts: Drummond has (almost) nothing to prove.

And I'll kindly bow out of this conversation here. Commence trolling, trolls.

Yeah, he has nothing to prove if he wants to get drafted in the top ten. That doesn't mean it is in his best interests to leave now. Scouts see in Drummond what everybody else can see in him. You're looking at this situation from a very narrow perspective, one in which the only possible correct move to make is to go pro right now. Consider the pros and cons of declaring for the draft right now:

Benefits of going pro:
-Immediate money, set for life
-Chance to get better every day against some of the best basketball players in the world, while collecting a lofty pay check.
-Opportunities to work with some of the best trainers, coaches, and teammates in the world.

Benefits of returning to school:
-He gets another year to grow into a man through Big East competition and Jim Calhoun coaching--a kid who is willing to bang bodies in the Big East will have no problem doing it in the NBA
-He stays at a level closer to where he is as a player right now, eliminating the risk of entering the draft and overwhelming himself.
-Has the opportunity to develop not just his physical skills, but also his intangibles (I.E. the ability to dominate a game)--if you're ever going to dominate in the NBA you better first learn to dominate inferior athletes
-One on one coaching from one of the best teachers at any level in Jim Calhoun
-Better understanding of how to play the game (I.E. how to post up, how to play help side defense, how to screen, back to the basket moves, defensive rotations, passing out of the post, etc. etc.). These are all skills that ideally, a player should know before entering the draft.
-Prepares himself (in my opinion) for a long, successful career rather than a shorter, more limited one.

 

[DogMania]

DM I agree with a lot of what you wrote, but I think your point about him not being a "fourth quarter guy" is way off base. Lamb didn't excel at the end of games this season simply because he's not good at breaking his man down off the dribble. Unfortunately, Jeremy set the bar very high this season by going off for 30 points in his first game. He's a really good player, one of the best in the country, but he's not one of those guys that's going to say "hop on my back, I'm dropping 40 tonight". He's a great pure scorer, but he's also dependent on a good point guard and big men who can set good screens. It also helps when, like last year, he's the second or third option instead of the first. With Kemba drawing ten eyes at the end of games last season, Lamb was able to free himself often and knockdown huge shots. It's not that he isn't an end of game player, it's just that his skill set is not conducive to hitting that shot at the buzzer. The difference between this year and last year is that Lamb was covered better off the ball, it wasn't the disappearing act that many on here make it out to be. JMO

Lamb made some big time shots late in games during that 11 game run last year, but how much of that was helped by teams focusing on stopping Kemba? You do make a good point, which I also alluded to in that he's not good right now at breaking his man off the dribble, but that's what you need to do in the NBA unless you're a complimentary player. That's why I think JL won't get drafted as high as some fans think and would be best suited to be picked by a team that either runs a lot of stuff to free up jump-shooters and/or has a very good PG that is good at breaking down his man. Maybe his value is higher than I'm giving him credit for if a team in the lower half of the lottery has that type of player who can get the ball to JL with a little space and some forward momentum. He always seems at his best when receives that ball while he already has some forward momentum, cutting into the lane from an angle.

Don't get me wrong. I enjoy watching him play and hope he turns out to be an outstanding pro. I'm just simply on the fence as to how much of his game will translate to the next level. If he learn to create more space, I think those other skills pop.