J. Adams under Ollie & Hurley

[mauconnfan]

Ok but they got better under KO. Bazz has a better freshman year than sophomore under JC. Do not deny he became the leader we needed under KO as did Boat who didn’t have a very good freshman year under JC.

This by no means questions their coaching but just proves Jalen is his own enemy.

 

[InKembaITrust]

Jalen simply can't pull up for threes off the dribble like Bazz could. His game would DRASTICALLY improve if he polished his hideous looking three point shot.

I remember Kemba's three point shot improved significantly from soph - junior year. Why can't Jalen improve his half way through his senior year? Easy to assume his and Kemba's work ethics are night and day.

I can't remember a star UConn player with a three point shot as ugly as Jalens...

 

[CTBasketball]

Jalen simply can't pull up for threes off the dribble like Bazz could. His game would DRASTICALLY improve if he polished his hideous looking three point shot.

I remember Kemba's three point shot improved significantly from soph - junior year. Why can't Jalen improve his half way through his senior year? Easy to assume his and Kemba's work ethics are night and day.

I can't remember a star UConn player with a three point shot as ugly as Jalens...

Kemba, Bazz, and Boat all lived in the gym.

 

[CL82]

Ok but they got better under KO. Bazz has a better freshman year than sophomore under JC. Do not deny he became the leader we needed under KO as did Boat who didn’t have a very good freshman year under JC.

Bazz struggled to figure out how to lead in his Soph season. That process, including JC's coaching bore fruit his junior and senior seasons.

I've said this before Mau, and it is speculation on my part though there is anecdotal evidence to support it, I think KO's biggest weakness is that he expected his players to act like pro's and do things they needed to do to develop. I think he was frustrated that they didn't. No one held KO's hand as he went from contract to contract, he just got it done.

Again speculation on my part as I try to figure out what went so wrong after such a great start.

 

[jibsey]

Jalen simply can't pull up for threes off the dribble like Bazz could. His game would DRASTICALLY improve if he polished his hideous looking three point shot.

I remember Kemba's three point shot improved significantly from soph - junior year. Why can't Jalen improve his half way through his senior year? Easy to assume his and Kemba's work ethics are night and day.

I can't remember a star UConn player with a three point shot as ugly as Jalens...

This has been it in a nutshell. I question the work he put into it but you could also ask what the coaching staff did to help him. The other possibility is that both he and the staff worked on his shooting and it just didn’t happen. I mean I could be instructed and practice painting portraits from now till eternity and I will never be good at it. Jalen might not possess that shot no matter what.

 

[CL82]

This has been it in a nutshell. I question the work he put into it but you could also ask what the coaching staff did to help him. The other possibility is that both he and the staff worked on his shooting and it just didn’t happen. I mean I could be instructed and practice painting portraits from now till eternity and I will never be good at it. Jalen might not possess that shot no matter what.

File this under almost sort of barely related:

My father-in-law decided in his late 60's to take up painting, and not landscapes but portraits. He never had a lesson or any experience. He just buys some canvas, brushes and oil paints goes down into the basement and paints a stunning portrait of mother-in-law without a sitting or using a picture. Just a really lovingly beautiful portrayal of her. If I had tried to do that it have would out come more like this:

And the thing is his version is perfectly accurate, but enhanced, like the dream version of her. You know that is just how he sees her. He's painted other portraits since then and they are very good, but none quite as nice as his portrait of her.

 

[casual-yardin]

Bazz struggled to figure out how to lead in his Soph season. That process, including JC's coaching bore fruit his junior and senior seasons.

I've said this before Mau, and it is speculation on my part though there is anecdotal evidence to support it, I think KO's biggest weakness is that he expected his players to act like pro's and do things they needed to do to develop. I think he was frustrated that they didn't. No one held KO's hand as he went from contract to contract, he just got it done.

Again speculation on my part as I try to figure out what went so wrong after such a great start.

I'm not sure if it was you but someone else mentioned this same type of thing in a thread several months ago. It's something that I also believe was an issue with his mindset. / approach.

 

[Waquoit]

I've said this before Mau, and it is speculation on my part though there is anecdotal evidence to support it, I think KO's biggest weakness is that he expected his players to act like pro's and do things they needed to do to develop. I think he was frustrated that they didn't. No one held KO's hand as he went from contract to contract, he just got it done.

That's quite an indictment. Ollie was frustrated because he actually needed to coach his players? As if he was fully formed when he came to Storrs. JC didn't need to coach him at all and his staff never gave him guidance to aid his improvement?

 

[jayteeman]

Let's pull back and take a look at the difference the past few years vs this year
JA was the person who had the ball in his hands 70% of the time in past few years - he was essentially the PG
This year he is not the PG, he is the 2
If you haven't played either position you can't understand the difference
To say KO tainted his development, IMHO, is crap. KO developed him as the 1, not the 2
JA had some absolutely amazing games the past 2 years and if memory serves me correctly, he was 1st team AAC and 2nd team AAC the past two years - if tainted then I'll take that everyday
Yes, JA is not the JA we have seen in the past BUT that is due, to a large percentage, he is adjusting his role and position. JA has always been a PG, in HS, AAU, international comp and in his UConn career prior to this year
I know many will disagree but I think he is most effective when he is running the show.
He could have been more assertive today and in a few other games this year but I don't think he deserves all the comments saying he sucks, etc.
Can he be better? yes

100% agree with this.

You also need to throw in the defensive intensity that has been turned up a few notches which has it's own side effects, and at times playing with 3 other guards on the court which can really effect your traditional positioning on the court and shot/pass selection. It is night and day transition from his previous years and he is really the only one who's career has spanned it as "the man".

Just have to hope the adjustments work out and he gets back to being comfortable with his role, whatever it is.

 

[ctchamps]

Lets not deceive ourselves, Jalen has obvious holes that separate him from the Kemba's & Shabazz' of the world.. The inconsistent shooting is clear, as are his turnovers. Year to year there has not been a progressive improvement. It isn't a shame or anything like that, he will still have a career in basketball, but coming out as a 5 star player we expected so much more... That is on us, not him. We believed the hype and highlight reel to be truth and set expectations based off of those things. When you actually watch him play you can clearly see that there is a difference between his highlight reel and his game through 48 minutes. He is a freak athlete, has an insane ability to drive right, plays great transition Defense with 'Top10 plays' blocks regularly, but he isn't Kemba Walker or Shabazz Napier. We need to stop wishing he were.

For the most part I agree with this. I don't agree he plays great transition defense. It's good with some high lights.

The major issue is your accusation that posters in The Boneyard can be wrong. It's why you haven't received likes for an otherwise sensible post. We are a bunch of opinionated morons that can find fault in others but never in ourselves.

 

[mauconnfan]

Bazz struggled to figure out how to lead in his Soph season. That process, including JC's coaching bore fruit his junior and senior seasons.

I've said this before Mau, and it is speculation on my part though there is anecdotal evidence to support it, I think KO's biggest weakness is that he expected his players to act like pro's and do things they needed to do to develop. I think he was frustrated that they didn't. No one held KO's hand as he went from contract to contract, he just got it done.

Again speculation on my part as I try to figure out what went so wrong after such a great start.

CL82 I have no doubt in my mind now he didn’t live up to what the job required I’m well over his failures now. But people like to believe he was never a good coach and never coached his last few years. In this case we see a kid who’s been the same kid for 3 1/2 years so we need to realize the frustrations a coach like Hurley is having trying to change his mental weaknesses. By all accounts a good kid and intelligent he should have been a better player easily by now if he wanted to. This is not about how good KO coached him it’s about a kid we need to be better and his coach is asking him to drink the KoolAid but he’s not even sipping it.

I still hold out hope I really do but it’s all on him no one else. Hears hoping.

 

[casual-yardin]

That's quite an indictment. Ollie was frustrated because he actually needed to coach his players? As if he was fully formed when he came to Storrs. JC didn't need to coach him at all and his staff never gave him guidance to aid his improvement?

No. He coached the players. To use a football analogy you are given a playbook or otherwise have a laptop or whatever with you plays on it. You practice the plays in practice but you are expected to know the plays and learn them on your own. If someone wasn't studying the plays on their own Ollie got frustrated as most coaches would. Ollie the player would always know the plays so he wouldn't understand why everyone wouldn't. Ollie the player was probably always in the gym getting better. Ollie the player was probably always early for practice. etc.

 

[ctchamps]

That's quite an indictment. Ollie was frustrated because he actually needed to coach his players? As if he was fully formed when he came to Storrs. JC didn't need to coach him at all and his staff never gave him guidance to aid his improvement?

Bazz struggled to figure out how to lead in his Soph season. That process, including JC's coaching bore fruit his junior and senior seasons.

I've said this before Mau, and it is speculation on my part though there is anecdotal evidence to support it, I think KO's biggest weakness is that he expected his players to act like pro's and do things they needed to do to develop. I think he was frustrated that they didn't. No one held KO's hand as he went from contract to contract, he just got it done.

Again speculation on my part as I try to figure out what went so wrong after such a great start.

I've felt something similar CL. KO struggled to understand that not every kid playing basketball, especially kids with talent, would do every thing in their power to improve. He failed to understand motivation and drive. He mistakenly believed most kids would pursue their development in the way he and Rickey approached the game. That led to a cycle of frustration and incorrect handling of players.

Two years ago people indicted KO for being overly aggressive with his coaching approach to players. Haven't seen that accusation brought up in quite some time. That narrative changed last year to an accusation he was indifferent. That latter accusation prevails today and seems to have obscured the viewpoint made two years ago. I believe we ignore it because it puts the entire failure on KO and eliminates the players role in any failure (although good coaches should be able to have the ability to understand player psychology).

The various perspectives in this thread concerning Jalen are the first honest efforts by posters to examine a players attributes without the lingering resentment to KO, although that resentment is still evidenced such as by your reluctance to admit KO had anything to do with the development of Bazz, Boat or any of the players on that championship team. KO was more than fine with players who were hungry huskies!

 

[intlzncster]

I remember Kemba's three point shot improved significantly from soph - junior year. Why can't Jalen improve his half way through his senior year? Easy to assume his and Kemba's work ethics are night and day.

It just kinda seemed that way imo because he was such a good player. But Kemba and Jalen are the same 3pt shooter percentage-wise (not looking at how those points come). Kemba went from 27% to 34% to 33% respectively. Jalen went 27% to 35% to 32%. Quite similar.

Kemba just impacted the game in so many ways it didn't matter.

 

[CL82]

That's quite an indictment. Ollie was frustrated because he actually needed to coach his players? As if he was fully formed when he came to Storrs. JC didn't need to coach him at all and his staff never gave him guidance to aid his improvement?

It’s speculation but it seems to fit the known data.

 

[Hoophound]

Jalen’s lack of a great jumper is killing him. He can’t burn you from deep most nights, yet he’s a little undersized, so finishing at the rim or in the paint is more of a challenge. Defenders can back off him outside, making it harder to drive by them in the first place. Jalen is the type of player that needs a jumpshot. If he could shoot like Bazz, he’s be the best player in the country or close to it. The whole floor would open up for him.

 

[Hoophound]

It just kinda seemed that way imo because he was such a good player. But Kemba and Jalen are the same 3pt shooter percentage-wise (not looking at how those points come). Kemba went from 27% to 34% to 33% respectively. Jalen went 27% to 35% to 32%. Quite similar.

Kemba just impacted the game in so many ways it didn't matter.

Kemba had a jumpshot though. His pull up jumper was deadly. Jalen scores at the rim. A nasty crossover with a knockdown jumper from 15-17’ like Kemba had would make a huge difference in Jalen’s game.

 

[Whtdmd]

I've felt something similar CL. KO struggled to understand that not every kid playing basketball, especially kids with talent, would do every thing in their power to improve. He failed to understand motivation and drive. He mistakenly believed most kids would pursue their development in the way he and Rickey approached the game. That led to a cycle of frustration and incorrect handling of players.

Two years ago people indicted KO for being overly aggressive with his coaching approach to players. Haven't seen that accusation brought up in quite some time. That narrative changed last year to an accusation he was indifferent. That latter accusation prevails today and seems to have obscured the viewpoint made two years ago. I believe we ignore it because it puts the entire failure on KO and eliminates the players role in any failure (although good coaches should be able to have the ability to understand player psychology).

The various perspectives in this thread concerning Jalen are the first honest efforts by posters to examine a players attributes without the lingering resentment to KO, although that resentment is still evidenced such as by your reluctance to admit KO had anything to do with the development of Bazz, Boat or any of the players on that championship team. KO was more than fine with players who were hungry huskies!

None of the transfer players are any better with the exception of Durham. Enoch and Jackson are the same players despite being two yrs older. None of the current UCONN players has taken a giant leap under Hurley. KO was dealt a bad hand with injuries to key players. I think he will still be the coach if AG was never injured

 

[Huskybass]

None of the transfer players are any better with the exception of Durham. Enoch and Jackson are the same players despite being two yrs older. None of the current UCONN players has taken a giant leap under Hurley. KO was dealt a bad hand with injuries to key players. I think he will still be the coach if AG was never injured

Last time I checked, Vance Jackson was averaging 11 and 7. We dont have a frontcourt player who averages anywhere near those numbers. Also, Vital is considerably better under Hurley. Is it really that hard to be objective?

 

[mauconnfan]

Last time I checked, Vance Jackson was averaging 11 and 7. We dont have a frontcourt player who averages anywhere near those numbers. Also, Vital is considerably better under Hurley. Is it really that hard to be objective?

Vital has gotten better every year. He was better last year by far than his freshman year when he couldn’t make a lay up or finish. He was our leading rebounder last year and is again. He turned it over and still does but one thing is consistent he works hard to get better and plays hard every play. Simple difference between he and Jalen is he gets up early and spends time in the gym as much as he can. We saw Hurley tell us he beat him to the gym a few times. If Jalen had his passion he’d be better too.

 

[Huskybass]

Vital has gotten better every year. He was better last year by far than his freshman year when he couldn’t make a lay up or finish. He was our leading rebounder last year and is again. He turned it over and still does but one thing is consistent he works hard to get better and plays hard every play. Simple difference between he and Jalen is he gets up early and spends time in the gym as much as he can. We saw Hurley tell us he beat him to the gym a few times. If Jalen had his passion he’d be better too.

I certainly agree with all that, I was just responding to a post that said the transfers and current players hadn't gotten better under Hurley or elsewhere. Vance and Vital were 2 examples that disprove that.

As far as Jalen, he is who he is. He will never have Vital's heart. If he did, he would dominate some games and we would likely be a Tournament team. Hard to say that with certainty though since the frontcourt has been underwhelming for the most part.

 

[pj]

Last time I checked, Vance Jackson was averaging 11 and 7. We dont have a frontcourt player who averages anywhere near those numbers. Also, Vital is considerably better under Hurley. Is it really that hard to be objective?

You're criticizing Ollie's retention. Jackson had 8 and 4 at UConn two years ago against stronger opponents with similar shooting percentages, his extra points are due to greater shooting volume, his extra rebounds are an improvement but you'd expect that from a player 2 years older, and his turnovers are also up. It's fair to call him the same player he was here.

Vital is more selective in his shooting which is good, it's led to him hitting a higher percentage and taking fewer shots for significantly better efficiency. Other stats aren't much different. Turnovers are up, assists and rebounds and fouls are the same.

 

[HHusky]

[QUOTE="Huskybass, post: 2973376, Hard to say that with certainty though since the frontcourt has been underwhelming for the most part.[/QUOTE]

Has anyone ever considered why our frontcourt has underwhelmed the last ~3
yrs or so? Mostly I've heard talent. But, I wonder sometimes whether our guards work hard enough to get the ball to our bigs using the best timing and angles for entry passes. There's passes and then there's "effective passes" that can make or break a frontcourt's success. Anyone else think this element could be at play here?

 

[CL82]

I've felt something similar CL. KO struggled to understand that not every kid playing basketball, especially kids with talent, would do every thing in their power to improve. He failed to understand motivation and drive. He mistakenly believed most kids would pursue their development in the way he and Rickey approached the game. That led to a cycle of frustration and incorrect handling of players.

Two years ago people indicted KO for being overly aggressive with his coaching approach to players. Haven't seen that accusation brought up in quite some time. That narrative changed last year to an accusation he was indifferent. That latter accusation prevails today and seems to have obscured the viewpoint made two years ago. I believe we ignore it because it puts the entire failure on KO and eliminates the players role in any failure (although good coaches should be able to have the ability to understand player psychology).I

The various perspectives in this thread concerning Jalen are the first honest efforts by posters to examine a players attributes without the lingering resentment to KO, although that resentment is still evidenced such as by your reluctance to admit KO had anything to do with the development of Bazz, Boat or any of the players on that championship team. KO was more than fine with players who were hungry huskies!

I think we are saying similar things. We are both struggling to understand how Kevin could be so successful his first two years but then struggle so mightily when things should have been very favorable to him. You believe it was that the kids on the team suddenly weren't motivated. I guess that could be it. Just bad luck. I suspect, but do not know that the difference is simply that our HOF coach may have been better at developing kids. Kevin had the skill set to coach kids who had already developed leadership skills but he hadn't learned how to instill those skills at this point in relatively young coaching careers.

I base that guess on a few things. It seems to me that the post Calhoun kids' development seems to be flat. Think about how Kevin's alleged summer development plan for Vance was "get in the gym." Consider how Purvis was more successful before and after his UConn tenure. I guess it all could be bad luck, but I suspect that it was a skill set that KO hadn't developed yet. Note that you can reach that conclusion without the sophistry of liking/disliking KO. It makes sense of the facts, though I fully admit that are likely other ways to put the pieces together.

But it could be that KO just got all lazy or unmotivated kids too, I guess. That seems less likely to me. That may be my natural bias against 'throwing kids under the bus.' At that age most young men are pretty malleable in the hands of a skilled teacher.

 

[intlzncster]

Kemba had a jumpshot though. His pull up jumper was deadly. Jalen scores at the rim. A nasty crossover with a knockdown jumper from 15-17’ like Kemba had would make a huge difference in Jalen’s game.

Absolutely. Kemba was better at every level, sans 3pt (it's kind of a wash there, though I'd rather have Kemba taking the shot). Kemba's ability to play at all three levels, plus charity stripe, makes it no contest.

I was only speaking 3pt shooting with OP.