Isola: Knicks are 129 mil poorer.

[otp85]

Like him or not Carmelo Anthony can play basketball. If you don't think so then you are wrong; plain and simple. Is he the best player in the league, no, can he carry a team by himself, no. He's not LeBron. So what? No one is. But there is a reason virtually every contender in the league wants him. A reason that every GM is willing to give him the max. A reason Kobe wants him in LA. A reason Phil wants him in NY. He can play.

The question is will he ever put it all together? Will he play D, lead, be a team first guy? Sadly, it reminds me alot of AI, I hope with Phil he can figure it out.

 

[Jerry1714]

First, Tony Parker is the best PG in the NBA, forget your PER and everything else, give me him over anyone.

Second, Chalmers has LeBron so he doesn't count. LeBron is the exception to all rules. You have that guy you win games.

Third, you CANNOT compare 80s/90s NBA to today's game. It was not a PGs game back then. In fact, if you doubt me listen to the pros. Watch any episode of "Open Court" on NBAtv and you'll hear it. Isiah Thomas regularly says he "wishes" and "dreams" about playing in this era. Stockon point is irrelevant.

And finally do I need to mention that Kerr and Armstrong had Jordan. And that Kerr himself says he was not a PG, but a small 2 that could play point because he "had Michael and Scottie"

But nice try

I see my whole post went right over your head.

I will try to spell it out for you so you can keep up. If it is a PG league tell me why the best PGs in the league don't win titles? I will give you Tony Parker to build your team around (best PG in the league according to you (which is laughable)) and see how many games you win.

I will build my team around guys like Lebron (my point about Chalmers), Kobe, Duncan, Durant (or Jordan back in the day hence my point about Armstrong and Stockton). You know the guys who win titles and can score and make others around them better. These guys can win titles no matter who plays point for them, and guys like Rose, Paul, ect., cannot do anything in the playoffs.

Is the game full of good PGs and does the rules allow them to be more effective then they were 20 years ago, yes, hence, Isiah's point, but they are not running the league.

 

[otp85]

I see my whole post went right over your head.

I will try to spell it out for you so you can keep up. If it is a PG league tell me why the best PGs in the league don't win titles? I will give you Tony Parker to build your team around (best PG in the league according to you (which is laughable)) and see how many games you win.

I will build my team around guys like Lebron (my point about Chalmers), Kobe, Duncan, Durant (or Jordan back in the day hence my point about Armstrong and Stockton). You know the guys who win titles and can score and make others around them better. These guys can win titles no matter who plays point for them, and guys like Rose, Paul, ect., cannot do anything in the playoffs.

Parker is the perfect PG, he does the one thing a PG is supposed to be able to do more than anything, controls the game. And he does so better than anyone. Paul is a close 2nd.

Yes, you are right, the premier players in the league are LeBron and KD, no they are not PGs. But the style and rule of today's game lend to PG having more influence, free run into lanes to create for themselves and others.

The only good team in the league without a top PG was Miami, and let's face it, offensively Lebron is their PG. And before the Finals people were alot higher on Mario Chalmers until Tony Parker made him look silly. Without a PG to create and MORE importantly defend opposing PGs it doesn't matter what else you have.

Raymond Felton could not guard anyone last season. I mean anyone. Watch any game you want at the opposing PG had his best game of the season. If Jeff Teague only played the Knicks last year he would've won the MVP.

Your can argue it's not a PGs league all you want but I am not alone in my assessment. The rules of the game are made for the PG. If they weren't then Westbrook would be a SG and Lebron would never bring the ball up.

 

[JaYnYcE]

Like him or not Carmelo Anthony can play basketball. If you don't think so then you are wrong; plain and simple. Is he the best player in the league, no, can he carry a team by himself, no. He's not LeBron. So what? No one is. But there is a reason virtually every contender in the league wants him. A reason that every GM is willing to give him the max. A reason Kobe wants him in LA. A reason Phil wants him in NY. He can play.

The question is will he ever put it all together? Will he play D, lead, be a team first guy? Sadly, it reminds me alot of AI, I hope with Phil he can figure it out.

I think most Knicks fans can agree with everything here. No one is saying Melo is the person that you put in the same conversation as Lebron. But he's still a great player in his own right.

 

[UConn990411]

I think one of the biggest issues with Melo is that he's always been the best player on his team. If you have championship aspirations, that can never be the case.

Melo is one of the five or so best offensive players in the NBA, so he can definitely be a go-to guy on a title contender. But he simply can't be "the guy." He'd be much better served playing the the complementary star role on a great team.

 

[JaYnYcE]

I think one of the biggest issues with Melo is that he's always been the best player on his team. If you have championship aspirations, that can never be the case.

Melo is one of the five or so best offensive players in the NBA, so he can definitely be a go-to guy on a title contender. But he simply can't be "the guy." He'd be much better served playing the the complementary star role on a great team.

When he's on he's unstoppable. If you put him in a system and surround him with defensive minded guys that would be a tough to team to beat. Melo on the Bulls is the best team in the east. Put him on the Pacers and that team beats Miami last year imo.

 

[JaYnYcE]

http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2014/7/...new-york-knicks-second-thoughts-chicago-bulls

 

[champs99and04]

I'm not the biggest Bill Simmons fan, but I thought his column on 'Melo today was right on the money: http://grantland.com/features/carmelo-anthony-new-york-knicks-legacy/

 

[HailUConn]

When he's on he's unstoppable. If you put him in a system and surround him with defensive minded guys that would be a tough to team to beat. Melo on the Bulls is the best team in the east. Put him on the Pacers and that team beats Miami last year imo.

Man, seriously, how old are you? I am no expert but I do know what's wrong with your Man Melo's game. I will break down real simple for you:

1. Defense wins the championship. So in the game of basketball, defense first, offense second, ALWAYS. Your man Melo cannot even spell defense, let alone play defense.
2. Basketball game is a team game. Melo is the antithesis of team concept. his style of play (Isolation play) is killing the team chemistry and ball movement. Over his 11 seasons of NBA play, it's safe to say he is a selfish player (not sharing basketball). Here is some food for thoughts:
You wonder why no other super stars have openly expressed interest in playing together with Melo for ships? I mean, James, Wade and Bosh teamed up, Duncan, Parker, and Ginobili teamed up, Kobe and Shaq teamed up... NBA is a player's heaven and you can pretty much go wherever you want, barring in violation of NBA rules.



A word to the wise, you need to stop making these Melo's comments, and they make you look really bad.

"When he is on, he is unstoppable".

but, but , but what if he is off? Other players would be able to offer defense, but

"If you put him in a system and surround him with defensive minded guys that would be a tough to team to beat."

Why do i need Melo with a price tag of 5 years 129Million then if i have a team of 4 defense-minded guys? Rip Hamilton can do that with half that money (See Pistons champ team). Plus Rip plays defense with no extra cost.


"Melo on the Bulls is the best team in the east. Put him on the Pacers and that team beats Miami last year imo. "

While you are fantasizing these, you fail to tell how to make this work? Do you mean Bulls or Pacers can get Melo for free? I thought Melo was the max player.

 

[Fishy]

He's not a great player - he's just not. He's very good

If you assemble the five to seven best players in the game and then take a large step outside that circle..that's where Anthony is. He's in that Dwight Howard/James Harden level where the talent comes with a few question marks.

But the Knicks had to sign him. You need two anchor players these days and with Anthony, they have one. They have cap room next year and a first round draft pick, so they have a fighting chance to pick up a second - and in a weak Eastern, that might be enough.

I'm a little surprised that he didn't end up with the Bulls - I guess the dollars signs outshone the W's.

 

[Adios]

Leaving the Knicks for the Bulls wouldn't be good for him post-basketball in the NYC area. He said he wanted to come to the Knicks, so might as well take the money and be a man of his word.

 

[JaYnYcE]

I'm not the biggest Bill Simmons fan, but I thought his column on 'Melo today was right on the money: http://grantland.com/features/carmelo-anthony-new-york-knicks-legacy/

Its hard to argue most of what he said.

 

[Dooley]

I'm a Knicks fan (pity me) and would sign up for a Melo -Wiggins swap right friggin now. The Knicks need to properly rebuild...not cling to their current state of mediocrity.

 

[Onions]

Putting aside all the subjective evaluations, if you use Player Efficiency Ratings (PER) - a stat which takes pretty much everything into account and is widely used as a statistical tool by NBA clubs, Melo has the third best PER in the league for small forwards - Durant 29.9, Lebron 29.4, Anthony 24.5, Paul George 20.16; and he's ranked 9th amongst all players. In other words, he's not awful.

 

[CallMeBruce]

Man, seriously, how old are you? I am no expert but I do know what's wrong with your Man Melo's game. I will break down real simple for you:

1. Defense wins the championship. So in the game of basketball, defense first, offense second, ALWAYS. Your man Melo cannot even spell defense, let alone play defense.
2. Basketball game is a team game. Melo is the antithesis of team concept. his style of play (Isolation play) is killing the team chemistry and ball movement. Over his 11 seasons of NBA play, it's safe to say he is a selfish player (not sharing basketball). Here is some food for thoughts:
You wonder why no other super stars have openly expressed interest in playing together with Melo for ships? I mean, James, Wade and Bosh teamed up, Duncan, Parker, and Ginobili teamed up, Kobe and Shaq teamed up... NBA is a player's heaven and you can pretty much go wherever you want, barring in violation of NBA rules.



A word to the wise, you need to stop making these Melo's comments, and they make you look really bad.

"When he is on, he is unstoppable".

but, but , but what if he is off? Other players would be able to offer defense, but

"If you put him in a system and surround him with defensive minded guys that would be a tough to team to beat."

Why do i need Melo with a price tag of 5 years 129Million then if i have a team of 4 defense-minded guys? Rip Hamilton can do that with half that money (See Pistons champ team). Plus Rip plays defense with no extra cost.


"Melo on the Bulls is the best team in the east. Put him on the Pacers and that team beats Miami last year imo. "

While you are fantasizing these, you fail to tell how to make this work? Do you mean Bulls or Pacers can get Melo for free? I thought Melo was the max player.

Considering that the Bulls were paying Rose to not play, I'm not sure that swap is all that complicated. In order to win in the NBA, you need a crunch-time scorer. There aren't a lot of those guys, and Carmelo is definitely one of them.

 

[UConnSean]

Putting aside all the subjective evaluations, if you use Player Efficiency Ratings (PER) - a stat which takes pretty much everything into account and is widely used as a statistical tool by NBA clubs, Melo has the third best PER in the league for small forwards - Durant 29.9, Lebron 29.4, Anthony 24.5, Paul George 20.16; and he's ranked 9th amongst all players. In other words, he's not awful.

finally

 

[BankShot]

He might not be awful, but he's not the center piece of a championship team neither. If I was Knicks fan, I would have spent the minimum and started to ramp up a REBUILD, with real young talent, getting ready to make an offer to Durant in 2016. Sorry but Melo isn't taking them anywhere.

The better deal for both parties involved was for him to go to Chicago (for 4 years) and the Knicks to make a killing in 2015-2016 off seasons, but no the same point that keeps him from spreading the ball around, kept him in NY, arrogance.

11 YEARS, don't we know what this guy is yet?

 

[Onions]

He might not be awful, but he's not the center piece of a championship team neither. If I was Knicks fan, I would have spent the minimum and started to ramp up a REBUILD, with real young talent, getting ready to make an offer to Durant in 2016. Sorry but Melo isn't taking them anywhere.

The better deal for both parties involved was for him to go to Chicago (for 4 years) and the Knicks to make a killing in 2015-2016 off seasons, but no the same point that keeps him from spreading the ball around, kept him in NY, arrogance.

11 YEARS, don't we know what this guy is yet?

Yes, absolutely, let's wait for Durant. That was the Knick Strategy 4 years ago, lets wait for LeBron. Ah, the wisdom of basing your franchises future on the movements of a player who has shown absolutely no interest in coming to your club - brilliant. We could also wait for the tooth fairy to bring back Clyde, Willis and DeBusschere. In the meantime let's think about teams who have won a championship without the best player in the league - the Mavericks, the Celtics and this year's Spurs have all done it in the past 10 years. You can argue that Dirk is better than Melo, fair enough, but I don't see how Melo isn't as good as the best player of either the Garnet/Pierce/Ray Celtics or this years Duncan/Ginobili/Parker Spurs. Remember that none of the Celtic trio had ever won anything till they came together on that team. So is Carmelo in the same tier as LeBron - absolutely not. Can he alone carry any team to the playoffs - this year proved he couldn't. But could he be the best player on a championship team - if it was the right team, history says he could.

 

[Jerry1714]

Yes, absolutely, let's wait for Durant. That was the Knick Strategy 4 years ago, lets wait for LeBron. Ah, the wisdom of basing your franchises future on the movements of a player who has shown absolutely no interest in coming to your club - brilliant. We could also wait for the tooth fairy to bring back Clyde, Willis and DeBusschere. In the meantime let's think about teams who have won a championship without the best player in the league - the Mavericks, the Celtics and this year's Spurs have all done it in the past 10 years. You can argue that Dirk is better than Melo, fair enough, but I don't see how Melo isn't as good as the best player of either the Garnet/Pierce/Ray Celtics or this years Duncan/Ginobili/Parker Spurs. Remember that none of the Celtic trio had ever won anything till they came together on that team. So is Carmelo in the same tier as LeBron - absolutely not. Can he alone carry any team to the playoffs - this year proved he couldn't. But could he be the best player on a championship team - if it was the right team, history says he could.

Well history says he cannot, since he has not. He has not come close.

As long as Melo is losing in the first round and leading the league in shots no one will care for him, if he shows he can change his game and be a player people want to play with then things will change.

 

[Onions]

Well history says he cannot, since he has not. He has not come close.

KG played 12 years before winning a title, with a playoff record no better than Melo's . Pierce was in the league for 9 years and never got a sniff of the title game. According to your lack of reason, history says that they could not, until they did.

 

[CallMeBruce]

I'd love for someone to tell me which team that Anthony played on was good enough to win a championship. That 2013 Knicks team gave nearly 3000 minutes to Steve Novak and Pablo Prigioni. Their second-best scorer was JR Smith (who absolutely cratered in the playoffs). And that's the best or second-best roster he's ever played with.

 

[Jerry1714]

KG played 12 years before winning a title, with a playoff record no better than Melo's . Pierce was in the league for 9 years and never got a sniff of the title game. According to your lack of reason, history says that they could not, until they did.

Comparing KG and Melo makes no sense. Might as well throw in Karl Malone while you are at it.

PP is an apt comparison, he had played with a lot less then Melo has, but he always made it clear he wanted to play with better talent and win, Carmelo has not.

 

[Onions]

Comparing KG and Melo makes no sense. Might as well throw in Karl Malone while you are at it.

PP is an apt comparison, he had played with a lot less then Melo has, but he always made it clear he wanted to play with better talent and win, Carmelo has not.

Malone (and Barkley and AI) are not in the conversation because they never did win a ring. Melo still has a chance. And why is KG more apt than PP - we're not talking about position here, we're talking about great players who took years to win a ring. Would Melo have a better chance to win if he took less money - absolutely. Will his salary stop the Knicks from building a championship squad - the jury is still out on that one, especially once the cap number goes up in 3 years. At that point Melo will be 33 and his max salary will seem small compared to what that years free agents will be getting.

 

[intlzncster]

When he's on he's unstoppable. If you put him in a system and surround him with defensive minded guys that would be a tough to team to beat. Melo on the Bulls is the best team in the east. Put him on the Pacers and that team beats Miami last year imo.

Why the hell did he resign with NY then? I still don't get it. If I was him, I'd have gone to the Bulls in a heartbeat.

 

[intlzncster]

He's not a great player - he's just not. He's very good

If you assemble the five to seven best players in the game and then take a large step outside that circle..that's where Anthony is. He's in that Dwight Howard/James Harden level where the talent comes with a few question marks.

But the Knicks had to sign him. You need two anchor players these days and with Anthony, they have one. They have cap room next year and a first round draft pick, so they have a fighting chance to pick up a second - and in a weak Eastern, that might be enough.

I'm a little surprised that he didn't end up with the Bulls - I guess the dollars signs outshone the W's.

I think you need three, rather than two. I guess it depends how you define anchor players. OKC has what I'd call two (Durant/Harden), but I don't see them beating the Spurs any time soon.

When Miami lost (however you want to put it) Wade, they lost that third anchor, and were no where near getting over the hump this year.