Is "Too Laid Back" Curable?

[RockyMTblue2]

The Courant article repeats what we have been hearing in various iterations for a while now. Perhaps grown more strident as the NCAA Tournament and Baylor, Texas and Miss St potentially loom on the horizon. What is being talked about?

“We need to get [her] into spots where [she] can dominate,” Auriemma said. “But then you have to understand that that’s what you want to do. ‘Coach, I want the ball here. You give it to me here, I’ll score.’ As opposed to, ‘Z, please go there so we can throw you the ball.’ It’s a mentality. We never have to say to Napheesa [Collier], ‘You’ve got to want the ball.’ That’s all she ever wants. And Z doesn’t have that mentality. She’s too laid back. So we’ve spent a lot of time on that.”

I don't know if you can teach what Geno is looking for. Z is shooting over 60%, maybe could get a couple more rebounds. But she is never going to "bang with the truly big girls", though she could make them pretty tired and goofy footed I'm thinking. What does Geno want? Maybe that Z be unstoppable inside and be there for the pass much more often than she is?

Z on Z: “Just not over-complicating things, kind of just really buying into my role and doing the things I’ve been working on,” Stevens said. “I've worked on things outside of practice, and then I get into a game and kind of speed up and let that all go out the window. It’s just [important to] kind of calm down. I really want to work on just owning the paint, especially defensively, but even offensively, just helping my team get high percentage shots and sort of taking over down in the paint area.”

Let's argue?

Azura Stevens' Development Invaluable To Top-Ranked UConn Women

 

[JoePgh]

I don't think Geno wants or expects her to be a "banger". She need not, and is not going to, play in the paint the way Batouly plays. Napheesa isn't really a banger either, but when she sees a spot, she goes to it and gestures emphatically to "just give me the d___ ball" (to quote Keyshawn Johnson of NY Jets fame). I think that is all that Geno wants to see in Azura: an mouth-watering appetite to get to the sweet spot, get the ball, and score.

 

[Sonny44]

Tina did it, finally.

 

[eebmg]

A couple of observations

1) In my view, she is more than willing to mix it up inside but sometimes is caught off balance / out of position of the defensive side
2) Motion offense / high low action and giving Pheesa room to operate means she has to spend time on the outside
3) She is very emotional on court so I think laid back is the wrong term

It is confidence confidence confidence.

I do agree that you can't completely "teach" it. She reminds me of Kiah Stokes as a mirror image. (Just flip offense with defense)

 

[Jim R]

A couple of observations

1) In my view, she is more than willing to mix it up inside but sometimes is caught off balance / out of position of the defensive side
2) Motion offense / high low action and giving Pheesa room to operate means she has to spend time on the outside
3) She is very emotional on court so I think laid back is the wrong term

It is confidence confidence confidence.

I do agree that you can't completely "teach" it. She reminds me of Kiah Stokes as a mirror image. (Just flip offense with defense)

You are exactly right..."It is confidence confidence confidence". Think many forget, it's Z's first year playing under Geno!

 

[HoopsFan21]

She had a nice shot 5-10 feet from the basket earlier in the season, but now can't put the ball in the hoop unless it's a layup.

 

[oldude]

Similar criticisms of being "too laid back" were directed at Lou when she showed up at Storrs from CA. Lou has become a fierce competitor, and I have no doubt that Z will as well.

 

[Jim R]

She had a nice shot 5-10 feet from the basket earlier in the season, but now can't put the ball in the hoop unless it's a layup.

Hmmm, believe it or not, she is a jump shooter, to include the three. Don't believe its something they want her using yet. Why? As we've seen over and over again, coaches want her down low taking advantage of her height. If he we didn't have shooters on this team, I believe we'd see a lot more of her away from the basket offensively. As with many shooters, her low three point percentage is more mental than anything else. If you've read her history, she grew up with an outside game. How many BIGs do you see, with free throw form as good as hers? Not many.
Again, believe we'll see more of it on display next year, when its needed.

 

[LesMis89]

Tina did it, finally.

That was my first thought as well.

 

[HoopsFan21]

Hmmm, believe it or not, she is a jump shooter, to include the three. Don't believe its something they want her using yet. Why? As we've seen over and over again, coaches want her down low taking advantage of her height. If he we didn't have shooters on this team, I believe we'd see a lot more of her away from the basket offensively. As with many shooters, her low three point percentage is more mental than anything else. If you've read her history, she grew up with an outside game. How many BIGs do you see, with free throw form as good as hers? Not many.
Again, believe we'll see more of it on display next year, when its needed.

It makes life easier for Collier if Z doesn't have to occupy the space around the basket exclusively. If she can keep making those short jumpers it helps the spacing.

 

[Los24]

A couple of observations

1) In my view, she is more than willing to mix it up inside but sometimes is caught off balance / out of position of the defensive side
2) Motion offense / high low action and giving Pheesa room to operate means she has to spend time on the outside
3) She is very emotional on court so I think laid back is the wrong term

It is confidence confidence confidence.

I do agree that you can't completely "teach" it. She reminds me of Kiah Stokes as a mirror image. (Just flip offense with defense)

I commented before on Z in that its confidence and comfort. May have been easier at Duke because you did not have 4 potential AA you were sharing with and "needed" to be as dominating. My favorite part of the Temple game regarding Z was how she skied (jumped very high) to snag some rebounds. I dare say that even Gabby would have been challenged to take those away from her.

 

[PhillyCoach]

As usual, lots of good posts that make sense. We all agree that Z is not there yet. No one on the team is "there yet." Some are closer than others and some --like Lou - have come a long way. All I know is that Geno will be banging the drum all say and every day until the season is over. Geno and CD will be reminding, teaching, cajoling, and pushing Z to do more. I did so more aggressiveness last game. I know it was Temple, but you have to start somewhere. IMHO Z will continue to improve (like the rest of the team) and will be a major factor in the big games.
As an aside, I watched UCLA and Oregon last night and they have improved immensely. Along with Miss St., Baylor, Louisville, maybe a super hot ND, those two teams are dangerous. Throw in Texas too.
IMO no one has a full, complete team like UConn. Some teams are up to 4 really good starters. No one has 5 starters and a top 6th man like UConn. But that is just my humble opinion.

 

[Jim R]

I commented before on Z in that its confidence and comfort. May have been easier at Duke because you did not have 4 potential AA you were sharing with and "needed" to be as dominating. My favorite part of the Temple game regarding Z was how she skied (jumped very high) to snag some rebounds. I dare say that even Gabby would have been challenged to take those away from her.

Agreed. For those who've watched, Z is doing a very good job of matching up and boxing out. What she doesn't do so well yet, is, pursue the ball when it goes up. Great rebounders follow the shot and pursue it. Rodman was a perfect example. Am hoping that's the next step in her "owning the paint" progression!

 

[Bigpetunia]

Tina did it, finally.

Yes, she did...and she is probably the ultimate example of a UConn player who was transformed from an on-court sweetheart into a basketball beast! But Tina had the physique and the strength to adapt to that role. True, Z is 6’6”, but she’s not constitutionally built to be a banger. Still a force underneath, but I doubt we’ll see her develop a lot more physicality.

 

[JoePgh]

I don't think Geno's comment related to her rebounding. I think it related to her appetite for the ball as the offense is run. He is saying that she needs to present herself as an obvious and even urgent target for passes, so that teammates find her and opponents get concerned about her and bend their defense to deal with her. Stef Dolson had to learn that, and got quite good at it by her senior year. Morgan Tuck was pretty good at it, and Napheesa has been good at it since Day One of her UConn career, or so it seems.

 

[bags27]

She's being asked to play the 5, whereas she thinks of herself as a 3/4. With a team that had a true center (like, say, South Carolina with Coates last year), Z would be protected from having to get caught up underneath, especially on defense. This problem isn't going to get fixed, but if Batouly can give some competitive minutes it might change the dynamics.

 

[EricSD]

There's a difference IMHO between "too laid back" and "too nice". This team is not "nasty" like some teams in the past have been. Kia is the closest we have on the team to a player with an "edge", and Batouly might be like that too, but with not much PT, it's hard to tell.

However, there's no reason the coaches can't "teach" the kids to go where they need to go. Geno has spent pretty much the whole season working with Z to get her to play in the post. She's improving. So yeah, it's possible to get a laid back kid to play in the position you want them to. But it's not possible IMHO to suddenly get them to play edgier.

 

[BroadwayVa]

The Courant article repeats what we have been hearing in various iterations for a while now. Perhaps grown more strident as the NCAA Tournament and Baylor, Texas and Miss St potentially loom on the horizon. What is being talked about?

“We need to get [her] into spots where [she] can dominate,” Auriemma said. “But then you have to understand that that’s what you want to do. ‘Coach, I want the ball here. You give it to me here, I’ll score.’ As opposed to, ‘Z, please go there so we can throw you the ball.’ It’s a mentality. We never have to say to Napheesa [Collier], ‘You’ve got to want the ball.’ That’s all she ever wants. And Z doesn’t have that mentality. She’s too laid back. So we’ve spent a lot of time on that.”

I don't know if you can teach what Geno is looking for. Z is shooting over 60%, maybe could get a couple more rebounds. But she is never going to "bang with the truly big girls", though she could make them pretty tired and goofy footed I'm thinking. What does Geno want? Maybe that Z be unstoppable inside and be there for the pass much more often than she is?

Z on Z: “Just not over-complicating things, kind of just really buying into my role and doing the things I’ve been working on,” Stevens said. “I've worked on things outside of practice, and then I get into a game and kind of speed up and let that all go out the window. It’s just [important to] kind of calm down. I really want to work on just owning the paint, especially defensively, but even offensively, just helping my team get high percentage shots and sort of taking over down in the paint area.”

Let's argue?

Azura Stevens' Development Invaluable To Top-Ranked UConn Women

No arguing with Azura's or Geno's thoughts on this, they are both right! Until Azura settles into her new position her brain will see everything moving at a fast speed. That's a human condition. If she stops using the Geno "movement" offense and hangs around the basket Geno may get exactly what he wants; catch and shoot. Few in the world of Basketball has her "eye", her height is a huge asset, her attitude is one every coach desires, believe it or don't Azura Steven's can shoot the three accurately and often--but apparently not in games. I'm still very high on Azura, I believe with her desires all things we and Geno want from her will come. This year, we still have 9 games (I hope) left. I remember the super hero of 4 National Championships did not fully blossom until the NCAA games, this may be Azura, Batouly, Irwins, Walkers coming out parties. We can hope!!

 

[BroadwayVa]

There's a difference IMHO between "too laid back" and "too nice". This team is not "nasty" like some teams in the past have been. Kia is the closest we have on the team to a player with an "edge", and Batouly might be like that too, but with not much PT, it's hard to tell.

However, there's no reason the coaches can't "teach" the kids to go where they need to go. Geno has spent pretty much the whole season working with Z to get her to play in the post. She's improving. So yeah, it's possible to get a laid back kid to play in the position you want them to. But it's not possible IMHO to suddenly get them to play edgier.

In the recent past games including Central Fla if you watch Z being mugged she throws her arms and body into them with a much less than nice attitude, it may not be the edge you/we want but it certainly is the edge of the edge. I can see Batouly and Azura side by side tossing in baskets and tossing defenders into the viewing stands

 

[Woof 101]

Tina did it, finally.

AGREE we have seen that a lot with the bigs over the years. When the light in the head goes on....It's lights out on the floor.

 

[BobbyJ]

I don't think Geno's comment related to her rebounding. I think it related to her appetite for the ball as the offense is run. He is saying that she needs to present herself as an obvious and even urgent target for passes, so that teammates find her and opponents get concerned about her and bend their defense to deal with her. Stef Dolson had to learn that, and got quite good at it by her senior year. Morgan Tuck was pretty good at it, and Napheesa has been good at it since Day One of her UConn career, or so it seems.

Exactly. In UConn's offense with the passers they have, at 6-6 she should be backing posts in and screaming for the ball. Would be an automatic 20 a game.

 

[cabbie191]

It's funny but the way some have described the hope that Z settles into the paint to grab all those rebounds: doesn't that sound a bit like Pat's and now Holly's offensive prescription for Tennessee? Throw it up and expect the big comes down with the rebound and puts it in the net.

One thing concerns me a bit regarding Z's place in the UConn constellation. She's at the far end of her first year playing, and her second year being with the team. It's disappointing that she still feels that she's trying to find her place. I can more understand that from a freshman and even a sophomore, but she's been playing varsity ball for a long time.

To clarify, I'm not usually disappointed in her play itself. I get really excited when she enters the game because she does some really great stuff. Just wish she had the confidence to do it more consistently from more spots on the floor.

 

[EricSD]

In the recent past games including Central Fla if you watch Z being mugged she throws her arms and body into them with a much less than nice attitude, it may not be the edge you/we want but it certainly is the edge of the edge. I can see Batouly and Azura side by side tossing in baskets and tossing defenders into the viewing stands

Great point. When she floated around the perimeter at Duke, she wasn't exactly getting mugged, so it's possible she's realizing she does not like it one bit and is happy to give it right back. Good for her.

Normally I'm not one to advocate playing overly rough, but when a team like UCF approaches us that way, the team IMHO needs to be ready to give it right back to them, while still maintaining the flow that we want to have to make us successful on the offensive end...

In other words, don't knock them on their a$$e$ if it's going to throw us off our ability to score...

 

[RockyMTblue2]

In other words, don't knock them on their a$$e$ if it's going to throw us off our ability to score...

Typical fan wanting it all ...

 

[EricSD]

It's funny but the way some have described the hope that Z settles into the paint to grab all those rebounds: doesn't that sound a bit like Pat's and now Holly's offensive prescription for Tennessee? Throw it up and expect the big comes down with the rebound and puts it in the net.

One thing concerns me a bit regarding Z's place in the UConn constellation. She's at the far end of her first year playing, and her second year being with the team. It's disappointing that she still feels that she's trying to find her place. I can more understand that from a freshman and even a sophomore, but she's been playing varsity ball for a long time.

To clarify, I'm not usually disappointed in her play itself. I get really excited when she enters the game because she does some really great stuff. Just wish she had the confidence to do it more consistently from more spots on the floor.

This was discussed somewhat in other threads, but of course it's worth mentioning again...

One thing most of us fans did not know is that when a kid redshirts, even tho she "practices" with the team, she gets very little time on the court with the "starters", nor does she get a lot of focus from the coaches since she is going to contribute zero during her redshirt season. This does not mean the player does not participate, but the coaches only have so much time every day to devote to the 10-12 players who will be in games all season, so they don't have as much time to devote to developing the kid who's not going to contribute...

This does not mean the player is ignored, but in Z's case, I'm not sure the coaches realized she was so tentative in the post till this season started... I think we all thought when a kid reshirts it's a free year and they get to develop at the same pace as kids who are NOT redshirting. But it appears that's not the case...

 

[RockyMTblue2]

This was discussed somewhat in other threads, but of course it's worth mentioning again...

One thing most of us fans did not know is that when a kid redshirts, even tho she "practices" with the team, she gets very little time on the court with the "starters", nor does she get a lot of focus from the coaches since she is going to contribute zero during her redshirt season. This does not mean the player does not participate, but the coaches only have so much time every day to devote to the 10-12 players who will be in games all season, so they don't have as much time to devote to developing the kid who's not going to contribute...

This does not mean the player is ignored, but in Z's case, I'm not sure the coaches realized she was so tentative in the post till this season started... I think we all thought when a kid reshirts it's a free year and they get to develop at the same pace as kids who are NOT redshirting. But it appears that's not the case...

I hear it, I process it, I understand the words ... but I'll never understand the it of it.

 

[DriveLH]

Has Z improved? I compared her sophomore year at Duke to her Year at UCONN on a per minute basis, because she sees much less game time.
The results: points per min .60 at Duke .66 at UCONN
rebs per min .31 .34
blks per min .06 .08
Her fg% was 52% at Duke and is now 60%, free throws up from 75% to 80.8%, a/to ratio from 0.61 to 1.86. I'd say she's done a marvelous job!

 

[Centerstream]

Has Z improved? I compared her sophomore year at Duke to her Year at UCONN on a per minute basis, because she sees much less game time.
The results: points per min .60 at Duke .66 at UCONN
rebs per min .31 .34
blks per min .06 .08
Her fg% was 52% at Duke and is now 60%, free throws up from 75% to 80.8%, a/to ratio from 0.61 to 1.86. I'd say she's done a marvelous job!

What about her personal fouls per minute? She has had a few games that ended up with her having committed 3 or 4, in limited minutes. Heck, recently she had 3 in less than her first 3 minutes on the court.

 

[bags27]

Most important comparison: Z was unhappy at Duke and really happy at UConn.

 

[cabbie191]

This was discussed somewhat in other threads, but of course it's worth mentioning again...

One thing most of us fans did not know is that when a kid redshirts, even tho she "practices" with the team, she gets very little time on the court with the "starters", nor does she get a lot of focus from the coaches since she is going to contribute zero during her redshirt season. This does not mean the player does not participate, but the coaches only have so much time every day to devote to the 10-12 players who will be in games all season, so they don't have as much time to devote to developing the kid who's not going to contribute...

This does not mean the player is ignored, but in Z's case, I'm not sure the coaches realized she was so tentative in the post till this season started... I think we all thought when a kid reshirts it's a free year and they get to develop at the same pace as kids who are NOT redshirting. But it appears that's not the case...

This is a good point and I'm glad you brought it up. I've never been to a UConn practice so perhaps I'm naive, but I would have thought that the coaching staff would have the same approach (in terms of their demands for hard work and pursing excellence) to redshirt players as anyone else. If you're right and they never worked that hard with Z in as close a simulation to real games as practices can produce, then perhaps her tentativeness is something new the coaching staff is having to pay attention to