IF there is Big 12 Expansion

[jostar1]

It would be kinda funny, in a karma is a B type of way, if UConn ended up in the B12. Flipper and BC "supposedly" (if you are to believe Flippers direct quote to a reporter) put forward Pitt as a candidate over UConn years ago in order to keep the B12 out of the ACC's back yard, but it ultimately may end up putting the B12 inside the ACC's kitchen.

But of course, as we all get cautiously excited about the possibility of getting that life raft, in the back of our minds is rule #1 of CR.

I agree. We've been left behind by both the ACC and B1G. If we get added to the Big 12, it would be very satisfying to see the Big 12 plant a flag in NYC.

 

[JSM1970]

Agree, just hope that there could be some movement by B1G and/or ACC if they believe B12 will expand.

If thrown a life preserver, you don't throw it back and continue to tread water hoping a better one is going to come.

 

[businesslawyer]

In my opinion, the best case scenario is that strong talk of UConn going to the XII spurs the B1G (option 1, especially as the ACC may not survive over the long term) or the ACC (option 2) to grab UConn now.

But, if UConn does join the XII, where do UConn's Olympic sports go? The non-revenue sports, such as baseball, softball, track, women's soccer, etc. would have a devil of a travel schedule. Field Hockey I assume can stay in the Big E and ditto for both hockey teams in Hockey East. The XII does not sponsor men's soccer (West Virginia is the only XII to play soccer and they play in the MAC), so that team would have to find a new home - MAC, stay in the America, Big East?

In my opinion, the best case scenario is that strong talk of UConn going to the XII spurs the B1G (option 1, especially as the ACC may not survive over the long term) or the ACC (option 2) to grab UConn now.

But, if UConn does join the XII, where do UConn's Olympic sports go? The non-revenue sports, such as baseball, softball, track, women's soccer, etc. would have a devil of a travel schedule. Field Hockey I assume can stay in the Big E and ditto for both hockey teams in Hockey East. The XII does not sponsor men's soccer (West Virginia is the only XII to play soccer and they play in the MAC), so that team would have to find a new home - MAC, stay in the America, Big East?

1. This is not an issue in the big picture.

2. No reason to think the Big East would have an issue with soccer and anything else other than football and hoops, since whatever product we give them would be for free. If they don't want it, the A Ten will (which is a better geographic fit than where we are now).

 

[businesslawyer]

6 months later, here we are. Go time.

The Big 12 wants to expand, and there is some major muscle in the conference behind expansion. The desire for a Big 12 Network is a major driver for expansion, and the last obstacle is Texas' desire to wait for the outcome of the 10 Team Amendment. The Big 12's amendment appears dead on arrival unless Delaney is appeased somehow, which he won't be. There is no way the vote goes against Delaney. He wouldn't have said anything unless he knew he had already blocked it. We don't know if Texas will continue to block expansion regardless of the outcome of the vote.

I agree with others that BYU appears to be out of the picture based on Mendenhall taking a dead-end Virginia job. If he thought there was any realistic chance of BYU getting into a major conference, he would have waited a year. Virginia is where coaches go to finish their careers early.

That leaves us in a face-off with Cincinnati and Houston. Cincinnati seems like a lock, which means Houston vs. UConn, mano y mano. We are not a lock by any means, but I like our odds. It is up to Herbst and Manuel to close the deal.

It also appears that Herbst may be getting a helping hand from the media. There are major sports reporters running with this story, not just basement dwelling, twitter freaks from Appalachia and the northern prairie. Raising UConn's profile with the media helps us out with the Big 12 Presidents, who will feel at least a little pressure to take the best academic school of the options.

More importantly, the open discussion of UConn to the Big 12 must be causing some phones to ring around Tobacco Road. Any hope of an ACC network requires a major NYC presence, and if the Big 12 adds UConn, NYC becomes a 3 conference town. The ACC has a spot for us and we know there is support among many in the league, with our biggest opponents at BCU having retired. The ACC knows it has to add us before the Big 12 does, because the Big 12 offer will most likely be exploding. We will find out real soon if A) there is any real meat behind these rumors and B) whether UConn has enough support in the ACC for an invitation. If either A or B are true, failure is not an option.

Less than 24 hours after agreeing with a Palatine post, I find myself agreeing mostly with Nelson. Strange start to the year. I'd say the following:

1. I have no reason to think any of this chatter is or is not real. So I'm not saying it isn't -- just that I won't have my hopes up until we know more.

2. Fully agree with NM on the ACC -- thinking we're on the table for the XII makes them ask if they can allow that to happen. Is anyone going to pay significant money for a single conference network going forward in NYC if three major conferences are playing in and sharing the market?

3. I still think the Big Ten asks the same question. It's not as simple as saying "if Delaney wanted us we'd have an invite." Delaney certainly could have us in mind but, assuming he has no time deadline, is waiting to see how various things (including the cable market) play out. If he has a deadline, things may be diferent.

I've said all along, our biggest value to both the Ten and the ACC may be in keeping us out of the other's hand. Allowing us in the XII's hands may be even worse as it brings a third player into the marketplace.

We'll see.

 

[Dooley]

There is no question that we fit in better with the B1G or even ACC. But we also fit in well with the B12. Maybe all of this B12 chatter will light a fire under Delany to make a pre-emptive move. Maybe it won't. But it's clear that we are the #1 option currently sitting outside of the G5. I agree that there is significantly more pressure on our leadership to find us a Power conference home in the near future if the Big 12 decides to expand in 2016. If we are passed over for schools that are below us athletically, academically, brand revenue, and TV markets (that would be ALL of the G5 schools), then I think UConn Nation, including me, will go into full meltdown mode.

 

[junglehusky]

There is no question that we fit in better with the B1G or even ACC. But we also fit in well with the B12. Maybe all of this B12 chatter will light a fire under Delany to make a pre-emptive move. Maybe it won't. But it's clear that we are the #1 option currently sitting outside of the G5. I agree that there is significantly more pressure on our leadership to find us a Power conference home in the near future if the Big 12 decides to expand in 2016. If we are passed over for schools that are below us athletically, academically, brand revenue, and TV markets (that would be ALL of the G5 schools), then I think UConn Nation, including me, will go into full meltdown mode.

I'll try not to go into meltdown mode until the ACC or B1G expands and UConn's still outside the P5. The worry of the BXII expanding without UConn - aside obviously from UConn still being G5, is what happens to the AAC TV deal if Cincy leaves. If that does happen we'd have to hope the ACC or B1G decide to accelerate the next round of CR before the mid-2020s. A fanbase meltdown would be understandable but could be the straw that breaks the camel's back if attendance craters.

 

[noeynox]

There is no question that we fit in better with the B1G or even ACC. But we also fit in well with the B12. Maybe all of this B12 chatter will light a fire under Delany to make a pre-emptive move. Maybe it won't. But it's clear that we are the #1 option currently sitting outside of the G5. I agree that there is significantly more pressure on our leadership to find us a Power conference home in the near future if the Big 12 decides to expand in 2016. If we are passed over for schools that are below us athletically, academically, brand revenue, and TV markets (that would be ALL of the G5 schools), then I think UConn Nation, including me, will go into full meltdown mode.

I get @junglehusky s point. I won't "blame or Sue or Warde" if we don't get picked. But please, don't come out with another missive about winners, and big future this and that. Nobody wants to hear that. Hearing that would make me go into meltdown mode. Attendance will likely crater. They won't be to blame, but the fans can't keep getting kicked in the balls and being asked to hang in there, donate more, come to our games against East Podunk State U etc.

If we do get left at the altar again, don't say nothing.

 

[UConnJim]

6 months later, here we are. Go time.

The ACC has a spot for us and we know there is support among many in the league, with our biggest opponents at BCU having retired.

Father Leahy is still President at Boston College and he was part of the Big East lawsuit. Supposedly, Herbst has met with him to smooth over past issues. The fact that UConn and BC are scheduled to playing football again is a good sign that the relationship has warmed, but it is hard to know if Father Leahy still has issues with UConn.

 

[JSM1970]

Has Skiblets chimed in yet? Will we know anything before the next Spring game?

 

[junglehusky]

I get @junglehusky s point. I won't "blame or Sue or Warde" if we don't get picked. But please, don't come out with another missive about winners, and big future this and that. Nobody wants to hear that. Hearing that would make me go into meltdown mode. Attendance will likely crater. They won't be to blame, but the fans can't keep getting kicked in the balls and being asked to hang in there, donate more, come to our games against East Podunk State U etc.

If we do get left at the altar again, don't say nothing.

Well what realistic alternative is there to what the leadership could say at that point? What alternative was there to say after Louisville got in the ACC? Honest question.

 

[Fairfield 1st]

Father Leahy is still President at Boston College and he was part of the Big East lawsuit. Supposedly, Herbst has met with him to smooth over past issues. The fact that UConn and BC are scheduled to playing football again is a good sign that the relationship has warmed, but it is hard to know if Father Leahy still has issues with UConn.

Didn't the Hockey East admission smooth things out for us with them?

 

[Fairfield 1st]

Well what realistic alternative is there to what the leadership could say at that point? What alternative was there to say after Louisville got in the ACC? Honest question.

IF we don' t get in anywhere this go around, I will trust Jeff Jacobs will help us find out who we should be angry with

 

[noeynox]

Well what realistic alternative is there to what the leadership could say at that point? What alternative was there to say after Louisville got in the ACC? Honest question.

I got it then. Made sense. Just don't pull the same stunt again. We all know what time it is. All the school could do is put on its best dress, but they still have to be asked to the prom. Please don't blow smoke up our azzes again.

 

[Waquoit]

Didn't the Hockey East admission smooth things out for us with them?

Yeah, but then we went and beat them.

 

[Point6]

B12 has always been my preference. "Fat side up" on tailgate day!

 

[The Funster]

Well, hey CR fans...how about this scenario: what if Delany has already told Herbst that the B1G is very interested in UConn but can't do anything right now because 1) UConn isnt AAU and b) doesn't have a partner atm. If there is one rule that I believe is hard and fast for the B1G it's that there is no admittance to the conference unless you are AAU. Imagine the outcry if UConn turns down the Big 12 because they already have a semi solid B1G invite in hand but can't say anything?

I also think Swofford has to be crapping his pants about now and trying to rally his troops to start talking to UConn too.

6 months ago a Big 12 invite would have been a stunner but as it gets coser it makes too much sense although I have my doubts that the Big 12 can actually put a network together. I'd laugh my off if they do before the ACC does though...

 

[DarthGrumpy]

6 months ago a Big 12 invite would have been a stunner but as it gets coser it makes too much sense although I have my doubts that the Big 12 can actually put a network together. I'd laugh my off if they do before the ACC does though...

If the XII gets a network in place before the ACC, then UConn needs to get into the XII (assuming that there is no invite from the B1G) because then the ACC would more more likely than the XII to be raided when the P5 become the P4.

 

[noeynox]

@funster

"Semi solid"? There are two things you don't want to be dealing with when it comes to semi solids. One is P5 conference invites, the other is your superjohn.

 

[Sea Goat]

Well, hey CR fans...how about this scenario: what if Delany has already told Herbst that the B1G is very interested in UConn but can't do anything right now because 1) UConn isnt AAU and b) doesn't have a partner atm. If there is one rule that I believe is hard and fast for the B1G it's that there is no admittance to the conference unless you are AAU. Imagine the outcry if UConn turns down the Big 12 because they already have a semi solid B1G invite in hand but can't say anything?

I also think Swofford has to be crapping his pants about now and trying to rally his troops to start talking to UConn too.

6 months ago a Big 12 invite would have been a stunner but as it gets coser it makes too much sense although I have my doubts that the Big 12 can actually put a network together. I'd laugh my off if they do before the ACC does though...

Stating the obvious - we can't be picky about which lifeboat we get in...

Having said that, it is just as obvious, that the B1G would be our dream lifeboat. Doesn't look likely in the short term, however.

As between the ACC and the Big 12, I think a properly structured Big 12 is superior to the ACC for a couple of reasons. While, the ACC provides logistical advantages, I think instability down the road is inevitable. The gulf between the current football powers and the weak sisters (Syracuse, BC, Wake etc.) will only increase. The academic gulf is just as stark. Need I say anything more than Duke and Louisville? Further, the deal with ND will eventually bring divisiveness as the "full time" football powers wonder why they must win a conference championship to possibly qualify for the playoff while ND can cruise in with one less game and an inconsistent conference schedule. Simply put, the ND deal for full inclusion of the olympic sports, doesn't bring enough to the conference to warrant the sweet heart football deal. As posted before, the ND deal is a one-way mess waiting to happen.

In the Big 12, we would provide a connection to NYC and the Big 12 will tout it. Imagine a NYC BB doubleheader with KU, OU, UT and UConn. I think it works. Football wise, provided we can deal with the stadium issues, home games v. OU, Baylor, TCU, UT etc. would be big draws, easily as big or bigger than for an ACC game.

The ACC is going to become the modern day equivalent of the Holy Roman empire - it has shown signs of decay that will eventually doom it. Now, also on the "obviously" front, we would take an offer from the ACC in a heartbeat. But that has as much to do with being in a gulag than anything else. IMHO, the Big 12 has an appeal that the ACC is lacking. As between the two, I'd take the Big 12.

 

[FDNY99]

Stating the obvious - we can't be picky about which lifeboat we get in...

Having said that, it is just as obvious, that the B1G would be our dream lifeboat. Doesn't look likely in the short term, however.

As between the ACC and the Big 12, I think a properly structured Big 12 is superior to the ACC for a couple of reasons. While, the ACC provides logistical advantages, I think instability down the road is inevitable. The gulf between the current football powers and the weak sisters (Syracuse, BC, Wake etc.) will only increase. The academic gulf is just as stark. Need I say anything more than Duke and Louisville? Further, the deal with ND will eventually bring divisiveness as the "full time" football powers wonder why they must win a conference championship to possibly qualify for the playoff while ND can cruise in with one less game and an inconsistent conference schedule. Simply put, the ND deal for full inclusion of the olympic sports, doesn't bring enough to the conference to warrant the sweet heart football deal. As posted before, the ND deal is a one-way mess waiting to happen.

In the Big 12, we would provide a connection to NYC and the Big 12 will tout it. Imagine a NYC BB doubleheader with KU, OU, UT and UConn. I think it works. Football wise, provided we can deal with the stadium issues, home games v. OU, Baylor, TCU, UT etc. would be big draws, easily as big or bigger than for an ACC game.

The ACC is going to become the modern day equivalent of the Holy Roman empire - it has shown signs of decay that will eventually doom it. Now, also on the "obviously" front, we would take an offer from the ACC in a heartbeat. But that has as much to do with being in a gulag than anything else. IMHO, the Big 12 has an appeal that the ACC is lacking. As between the two, I'd take the Big 12.

ACC with ND membership as it is...Big East 2.0...with a similar fate.

 

[junglehusky]

ACC can afford to lose schools if the B1G raids. BXII cannot afford to lose Texas or OU, they instantly become AAC 2.0 once that happens.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

ACC with ND membership as it is...Big East 2.0...with a similar fate.

Except that one can argue that Texas has its own sweetheart power arrangement with the XII that may provide as deadly to the conference as ND was to the old Big E (and possibly current ACC).

 

[FDNY99]

Except that one can argue that Texas has its own sweetheart power arrangement with the XII that may provide as deadly to the conference as ND was to the old Big E (and possibly current ACC).

If the B12 expands by 2 ....I think it's safe to say that OU has Trump carded UT's power.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

If the B12 expands by 2 ....I think it's safe to say that OU has Trump carded UT's power.

Depends, if the XII add Houston and Memphis or maybe Houston and Cincinnati, I would call it a draw as the XII gets what it wants in a playoff while Texas gets to shore-up its domestic political base over the short-term as the XII is still likely dead over the long-term. If Cincinnati and UConn are added, then I agree that OU won.

 

[FDNY99]

Depends, if the XII add Houston and Memphis or maybe Houston and Cincinnati, I would call it a draw as the XII gets what it wants in a playoff while Texas gets to shore-up its domestic political base over the short-term as the XII is still likely dead over the long-term. If Cincinnati and UConn are added, then I agree that OU won.

If UT were worried about shoring up a domestic political base they would't be purchasing land in Houston to build another UT system campus. That link is floating around here somewhere. IMHO if the B-12 expands it's either gonna be BYU and UC or UC and UCONN.

 

[Kolumbo]

There is absolutely no way in he11 UCONN gets invited to the Big 12. That said, I look forward to watching UCONN Football progress against the Horns and Sooners and watching their hoops teams try to keep up with UCONN if it happens.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

There is absolutely no way in he11 UCONN gets invited to the Big 12. That said, I look forward to watching UCONN Football progress against the Horns and Sooners and watching their hoops teams try to keep up with UCONN if it happens.

Playing Oklahoma worries me. Playing a Charlies Strong led U Texas team, not so much as we have already beaten one of his teams (#19 Louisville in 2012), which was arguably more talented than what he has been able to put together to far in Austin, with one of our Coach P teams

 

[uconnphil2016]

If it does come down to a B12 vote between Cincinnati/Houston or Cincinnati/UConn let's think of how things should hash out:
-All Texas teams most likely will prefer UConn over Houston, for obvious reasons. So that gives Texas, Baylor, TCU and Texas Tech in favor of UConn--that's already 4 of 10 teams in the conference, and two away from a majority vote. My guess is that whatever Texas favors, Oklahoma will favor the same thing. Further, it would make way more sense for a school like Kansas to want UConn as a good basketball partner. WVU should prefer UConn's geographical proximity, and Herbst seems to be making moves with K-State's president. Given that we SHOULD have 4 schools close to locked up, the scales seem to be hugely tipped in our favor. Of course, who knows what will happen when push comes to shove, but conventional logic tells us that UConn stands a far greater chance than Houston as long as Texas egos have something to say in the decision.

 

[junglehusky]

If it does come down to a B12 vote between Cincinnati/Houston or Cincinnati/UConn let's think of how things should hash out:
-All Texas teams most likely will prefer UConn over Houston, for obvious reasons. So that gives Texas, Baylor, TCU and Texas Tech in favor of UConn--that's already 4 of 10 teams in the conference, and two away from a majority vote. My guess is that whatever Texas favors, Oklahoma will favor the same thing. Further, it would make way more sense for a school like Kansas to want UConn as a good basketball partner. WVU should prefer UConn's geographical proximity, and Herbst seems to be making moves with K-State's president. Given that we SHOULD have 4 schools close to locked up, the scales seem to be hugely tipped in our favor. Of course, who knows what will happen when push comes to shove, but conventional logic tells us that UConn stands a far greater chance than Houston as long as Texas egos have something to say in the decision.

I suspect the reality is not a simple as that. B12 presidents may want a presence in Houston simply for alumni relations and recruiting (athletes and non-athletes). And we know UT and OU are clashing as far as their vision for the conference down the road.

Recall - we/the media thought UConn in the ACC was almost a done deal because the Tobacco Road contingent thought they had the votes. Then the politics happened and the FSU/Clemson/Miami contingent won out over Tobacco Road. I suspect that OU and maybe Kansas would be supportive of UConn, but beyond that I have no idea. A lot hinges on UT. And I hope the rumors from the last couple weeks are accurate about Directional Florida being on the B-list, we don't want them being a dark horse.

 

[HuskyHawk]

If it does come down to a B12 vote between Cincinnati/Houston or Cincinnati/UConn let's think of how things should hash out:
-All Texas teams most likely will prefer UConn over Houston, for obvious reasons. So that gives Texas, Baylor, TCU and Texas Tech in favor of UConn--that's already 4 of 10 teams in the conference, and two away from a majority vote. My guess is that whatever Texas favors, Oklahoma will favor the same thing. Further, it would make way more sense for a school like Kansas to want UConn as a good basketball partner. WVU should prefer UConn's geographical proximity, and Herbst seems to be making moves with K-State's president. Given that we SHOULD have 4 schools close to locked up, the scales seem to be hugely tipped in our favor. Of course, who knows what will happen when push comes to shove, but conventional logic tells us that UConn stands a far greater chance than Houston as long as Texas egos have something to say in the decision.

I mostly agree. All the Texas schools should want to keep Houston out. Whether they want UConn over a BYU (presumably out) or a Memphis or UCF....not sold on that at all. I think OU and Boren want UConn for Academics. He really wants to boost OU and the conference. I think Kansas would be similar to OU on the academic side and could use a hoops rivalry since OSU has fallen off. WVU would like UConn over Houston...but again, not sold they'd choose us over say, Memphis. They certainly don't want to go to Provo, Utah. Oklahoma State, KSU, ISU? No idea really. Then there is the question of what the Network wants.