How come Dorka only played 3 minutes?

[hoophuskee]

That could be. The gasoline on the fire part is directed at how do you fix nervousness, a lack of confidence, or rushing things. Is it by showing a lack of confidence in that player with a quick hook?, or by letting them work thru it a little bit? I'm not sure what is best, but what I fear is that this kind of quick hook reinforces whatever lack of confidence a player has, and might make them even more nervous the next time they are called on, because despite how they have performed all season, they know one screw up in the first few minutes and they are gone.

I hope the players respond well to whatever technique Geno applies, and he knows them and I don't, so that is a given too, but if it is basketball or something completely different, I don't understand how potentially destroying confidence with a quick hook helps build confidence if that is the issue affecting play that needs to be improved. We all know Geno's records they speak for themselves, I hope all nine get over their jitters and play with confidence. When the problem is most other things I think the stick probably works great, and has for Geno many times. When it is nerves, or a lack of confidence seems like the carrot might be more appropriate. But people are different and react in different ways so who knows.

The winning is more important than attempting to fix the psyche of any one individual player. Unless it’s an irreplaceable part within the concept of “the team.” What was that line in the move Miracle? The name on the front of the jersey is a lot more important than the name on the back? Isn’t that so for the NCAA Tourney and to every other Husky player on the team with the dream of winning it all? They are to risk that because one of the bench player's is feeling a little off that day? That's not fair to them. The fan might feel bad but it's not fair to the other players that are okay.

The coach has the responsibility to try to do his best to coach to win. And when you have spoken of “earned the right,” every other player on the team that isn’t as nervous has “earned the right” to expect that Geno to play the best players that will help their team win the game. That’s the center where his coach’s decisions rely.

But I’d like to ask, hasn’t he shown you over the years that they have responded well? And didn’t CD respond well? Hasn’t AE if in fact she was benched at any point to any serious degree, hasn't she responded well?

The thing is, in sports, nothing is rarely assured. And you can’t even ensure the best of the best won’t get nervous. You just do your best with the formula you best believe in. Geno’s formula has worked. So why change?

 

[tomcat]

If the missed shots in this game were all there was to see, it might seem premature to pull her. I counted 5 missed layups and very short shots in the UCF game, too. That doesn't mean she can't come back and play meaningful minutes. I just hope she slows herself down and plays the way we've seen previously. If UConn gets another crew of foul-happy refs, the team will need her.

 

[JRRRJ]

I think Geno in a way likes the idea of a 9 player rotation even against top competition, but in the tough games he has a very short hook. If he inserts a player who has a bad first minute or two they may be done for the day. My question that I don't know the answer to, is how do you build confidence in a player?

Dorka, Aaliyah, and at times Caroline have seemed to be nervous and rushed on shots around the basket. I understand the teaching aspect, namely if you do something wrong you sit, and in the long run you will learn and be a better player as a result. But if the issue is more nerves, confidence, and the pressure of the moment what is the best solution?

The hook should not be a teaching moment in the post-season.

Geno should have already told the assembled troops that this is the one-and-done time. That that means they must be focussed and ready to contribute when they are inserted into a game. That failure to perform will mean removal in pretty short order, and that if others are performing well they might not get back in that game.

If he does this, then the players need to listen to and believe those things. (Apparently Geno claims Caroline's the only one who listens.) And act on them: be focussed and ready to play whenever called on.

If they do listen, then being taken out then is not seen as punishment, nor a message, nor a comment on the value of their contributions that got the team here. It's a move that is intended to improve the team's likelihood of surviving this game and advancing.

 

[Gus Mahler]

I haven't read this whole thread so this might have been mentioned already.

But on the layup: I don't think Dorka ever had complete control of the ball. I've watched the play five or six times, and that would explain both the hesitation and the bad overshoot. Under "normal" circumstances, whatever that means, there would be no way you could miss that shot that badly. I think it happens a lot in women's college basketball that the ball slips out on quick shots near the basket. I'm go to go with this explanation and not read anything further into it.

Go Dorka.

 

[Baltic]

Liv and AE were amped up for this game.
They were exhibiting some fast twitch cat-like reflexes on defense and when rebounding.
They were beating out the competition by fractions of a second to make steals, rebounds and shots.
Dorka was having a crises in confidence and Geno probably wanted her to observe how aggressive the players with experience from last year's tournament were performing.

Also, there's another game in 2 days, and by resting her today she will be fresher for the next game.
She just needs to focus & concentrate more on executing the tasks at hand.

You don’t really believe he was resting her for the next game, do you!

 

[mercfan]

Nika’s 3rd foul was right in front of us. On the inbound she basically hit the Indiana player with 2 hands in the chest/shoulders, very much like a football CB playing bump and run. Mind you the girl was running from baseline to outside and had her back to the ball. She was not setting a screen and was in no way going to be an issue at that point in time. It was a head scratcher. And it’s too bad because Nika certainly raises the energy level when she comes in.

I love her. The way she fouls (and then acts like it isn't a foul) is hysterical. I know Geno doesn't think it's funny at the time, but even he seems to get a kick out of it after the game. (Hence his comment)

 

[mercfan]

I thought it was a reference to Caroline. Still only a freshman, Caroline needs some time to settle into a game and find her groove. She’s a great player, though, and will learn. She’s incredibly coachable - Geno says she’s the only one that listens to him.

Caroline had an excellent first/second quarter though. Granted, when she came in the fourth she didn't. But I thought her first/second quarter was part of the reason Dorka didn't play. She was incredibly effective (made some layups - which all of our posts were struggling with). When she came in during the second half, she looked shaky. So when Geno went small, he played Evina at the 4 instead.

 

[Los24]

I think Geno in a way likes the idea of a 9 player rotation even against top competition, but in the tough games he has a very short hook. If he inserts a player who has a bad first minute or two they may be done for the day. My question that I don't know the answer to, is how do you build confidence in a player?

Dorka, Aaliyah, and at times Caroline have seemed to be nervous and rushed on shots around the basket. I understand the teaching aspect, namely if you do something wrong you sit, and in the long run you will learn and be a better player as a result. But if the issue is more nerves, confidence, and the pressure of the moment what is the best solution?

You could give that player a little more rope, and hope they settle down and get into the game, not being paranoid that they are one mistake away from an early hook. Maybe if they don't settle down and make more mistakes, you yank them then, but give them a chance to right the ship themselves, at least for a little longer.

Isn't there a difference between what kind of problem it is. Not hustling? get them out, same thing for not following the game-plan, too many missed assignments on defense etc. But if it is nerves or a lack of confidence couldn't a quick hook be pouring gasoline on the fire? It seems to me very one of the 9 players in a full rotation have earned their place there over the course of the season.

Caroline for example was hardly used in the beginning of the season, then because of injuries Geno had to use her, playing her 40 minutes in at least one game, and for a stretch you could argue she was our best offensive player. Dorka was a starter for much of the year when Aaliyah was struggling and did a good job. Haven't they proven themselves enough to not warrant a quick hook if they make a mistake or look a little nervous in their first couple of minutes?

Many coaches learn how all their players are different, and you push different buttons to motivate different players, and I have no idea what that is for players like Dorka or Caroline, but it seems like Geno publicly touts the merits of a deep rotation, while looking for a quick reason to abandon it. He probably knows better, but i just don't get it.

I think there is over analyzing, not you specifically but everyone. Apply the same logic to Azzi and she sits during most of that game. She has turnovers, number of missed shots, etc... AE, bless her, has offensive fouls which equals turnovers. I can go on with the starters. It seems if your not a starter you have an incredibly short leash, even if you dont play bad.

 

[Los24]

Caroline came out after her turnover in the circle. You could see Geno was upset. Honestly, he played all of the right people for the right amount of time yesterday. This is crunch time.

So her one turnover in two games? She had 2 assists yeatwrday and the higest for any player was 3 for whole game. Plus she was 2 for 3 fg.

Really struggling huh.

 

[hookshot]

I haven't read this whole thread so this might have been mentioned already.

But on the layup: I don't think Dorka ever had complete control of the ball. I've watched the play five or six times, and that would explain both the hesitation and the bad overshoot. Under "normal" circumstances, whatever that means, there would be no way you could miss that shot that badly. I think it happens a lot in women's college basketball that the ball slips out on quick shots near the basket. I'm go to go with this explanation and not read anything further into it.

Go Dorka.

she has frequently demonstrated hard hands, as opposed to soft hands (catcher mitts) like Napheesa C was blessed with

 

[hoophuskee]

I think there is over analyzing, not you specifically but everyone. Apply the same logic to Azzi and she sits during most of that game. She has turnovers, number of missed shots, etc... AE, bless her, has offensive fouls which equals turnovers. I can go on with the starters. It seems if your not a starter you have an incredibly short leash, even if you dont play bad.

That's how it should be. There's a reason why players are starters and those that are deeper on the bench. You trust the starters the more. That's the reason why they start and play the most minutes. It's why you don't apply the same logic to Azzi.

 

[hoophuskee]

So her one turnover in two games? She had 2 assists yeatwrday and the higest for any player was 3 for whole game. Plus she was 2 for 3 fg.

Really struggling huh.

It's why she is 9th on the bench before the NCAA had started rather than 6th for example. So yeah she was.

 

[sun]

You don’t really believe he was resting her for the next game, do you!

No, not primarily.
From hindsight, Dorka hasn't been exhibiting the ability to score from a variety of positions on the floor like she did earlier in the season.
That may be another reason why Geno dismisses her as quickly as he does.
Just as rapidly as AE has improved offensively, Dorka's scoring ability seems to have declined.

 

[freshler40]

This is production time. Players need to be ready. We are at the time of serious play. There is no time off during the remainder of the season. Focus! These are competitive gals with great skills, with their basketball experience they know this is their time to shine. Go Huskies.

 

[microfich]

It’s likely we’ll need Dorka at times tonight to keep the 6’5” Cunane bottled up.
Maybe focusing and getting good run on defense leads to better flow reactions on offense?

 

[ucbart]

I was there yesterday and the place was rocking when they went on that run to start the 3rd quarter. I didn't see the defensive lapses by Dorka but her two outside shots were nervous shots and her lay up was just unfortunate. We will definitely need her size Monday night and if she can make outside shots it will change the game because the middle will open up.

I also wanted to see Caroline more. She is a 100% basketball player. In 8 minutes she had 4 points, a rebound and 2 assists. She can be a major weapon going forward. She has appeared tentative at times though and I don't know if it's the injury, being a freshman in the Big Dance ,not starting, or a combination thereof.

At halftime I turned to my wife and remarked that CW only had 5 points and was going to get going in the second half. She just goes to the basket like no one else and is unstoppable with a head of steam.

I think I just have to get used to the fact that with Aaliyah you are going to get basketball pluses and minuses every game. If she ever gets to that zone of basketball completeness it will be something very special. She just seems to need a better awareness of exactly where she is and others are on the court. In that last play before halftime she lost sight of her man and stayed underneath instead of being on her and she made the 3.

I thought Evina contributed solidly on defense and the two breakaways on steals made the place roar. She had a turnover but it didn't lead to a basket and made some great set up passes that were hockey assists.

Liv was just great all around. She really wants it and I hope she stays out of foul trouble on Monday. Nika was Nika, a crowd favorite with a bomb of a 3, and Paige and Azzi were really good even on a somewhat off night. I hope we get to see the 2 of them both really "on" together on Monday and hopefully beyond. That layup by Paige off the cut hand off was picture perfect form.

That devastating run was defense and going to the basket and being opportunistic. The Hoosiers were shellshocked and their timeout when the lead was 13 was closing the barn doors after the horses had run out. Their season was over because they were not coming back.

I wanted us to play ND because of Paige but NC State is a very good team with a very good offensive inside player. We won't have to be perfect, just 1 point better.

Caroline turns the ball over wayyyyyy too much. Our turnovers have gone down lately because she's not on the floor as much. I also wanted her to play more until her limited minutes the last two games, when turned the ball over. And that one missed shot she had in the second half, was such a bad shot that it should've counted as a turnover. I like her a bunch and she will be a great player, but who do you sit if she plays, Azzi or Christyn?

 

[browns]

Caroline turns the ball over wayyyyyy too much. Our turnovers have gone down lately because she's not on the floor as much. I also wanted her to play more until her limited minutes the last two games, when turned the ball over. And that one missed shot she had in the second half, was such a bad shot that it should've counted as a turnover. I like her a bunch and she will be a great player, but who do you sit if she plays, Azzi or Christyn?

Good point..I think Geno feels the same way regarding turnovers

 

[Huskyfan63]

Good point..I think Geno feels the same way regarding turnovers

I suspect she is still adjusting to the level of play sometimes, at least it looks that way to me. She tries passes that worked against private high school competition, but at this level the windows are smaller and the defense better. She'll keep adjusting, I'm sure. Smart and competitive kid.

 

[browns]

Remember except for Azzi the other 4 starters have final four experience..Caroline and Dorka have no experience ..Geno knows what he's going to get..He knows AE is going to have turnovers but the way her and Liv were playing it's hard for Dorka to get any minutes after missing those bunnies..When Caroline went in to the basket and 3 IU players were there and she just threw and underhanded shot up towards the basket Geno saw enough..I think she'll be OK but I hope this doesn't hurt Dorka's confidence

 

[BBallF]

Caroline turns the ball over wayyyyyy too much. Our turnovers have gone down lately because she's not on the floor as much. I also wanted her to play more until her limited minutes the last two games, when turned the ball over. And that one missed shot she had in the second half, was such a bad shot that it should've counted as a turnover. I like her a bunch and she will be a great player, but who do you sit if she plays, Azzi or Christyn?

I think that is relatively unfair. I don't think that turnovers are the deciding factor at all. AE leads the team in turnovers, with Liv second and Evina third. AE also commits many unnecessary offensive fouls both on moving screens and simply not being aware of where her opponent is. She also has defensive lapses as evidenced by the last play in the first half. Yet she brings intensity and energy and rebounds and defends and does some important counterbalancing things. I think it is more the eye test. A coach can tell if a player is "ready" or " in the moment" but CD was not against Indiana nor was Dorka and I do think the first NCAA tourney is a factor for both of them. The turnover and bad shot was more a symptom of not being there. Caroline can spell CW at times for a rest and can be an important contributor. After Cunane, NC St is not big and CD can post up, cut, drive and shoot the pull up or 3. She can make the difference in the game if she is "on". Unfortunately, she has been a different player since her injury, more tentative, less engaging. I'm hoping tonight she has a good game for us. She is a very complete and smart basketball player.

 

[The deacon]

Caroline turns the ball over wayyyyyy too much. Our turnovers have gone down lately because she's not on the floor as much. I also wanted her to play more until her limited minutes the last two games, when turned the ball over. And that one missed shot she had in the second half, was such a bad shot that it should've counted as a turnover. I like her a bunch and she will be a great player, but who do you sit if she plays, Azzi or Christyn?

The debate goes on and on about Caroline's minutes, as well as Dorka's.

I'll note at the other end of the PT spectrum that Azzi is certainly not earning all the minutes she's playing. Yes, she plays solid D (as does Caroline), and her occasional successful three-pointer fires everyone up. Yet she's shooting 7 for 24 for the past two games, with just three rebounds and not a single assist in 73 minutes of PT.

Just because she's now a starter means she has to be on the court throughout? How do those numbers merit her playing virtually the entirety of both games? Don't you think perhaps she'd shoot/play better if given more frequent breaks?

Vs. Indiana, Caroline made an ill-advised pass intended for a teammate on the other side of the lane that was tipped and that her only TO in her 12 minutes of court time for those two games. And I agree, Ucbart, a pullup 10-footer would have been smarter shot than that ill-fated underhanded effort. But even for those, you continually go to a weary, off-target Azzi to produce sub-30 percent shooting, few rebounds and zero assists in two full games?

There are those who argue starters have earned the plus-30 minutes they get each game, regardless of their performances. I'm amazed so few of us remember that, pre-head injury Caroline was a player virtually everyone here agreed would be a starter throughout season's end. Now she doesn't deserve more than 12 minutes in two games to spell Azzi, or perhaps Christyn?

I love Azzi and what her potential might bring to the Huskies. So far in two tough NCAA games, I'd suggest she and Caroline should be compared for their actual results, not what Azzi's potential might be. If the Huskies are fortunate enough to play three more games, I'll bet there will be plenty of times when Caroline's knack for finding the hoop, as well as open teammates with good passes, would come in mighty handy.

Please remember, Azzi also hasn't experienced this before. Some here love to talk about the moment being too big for Caroline, or Dorka. Is it possible that's the case for Azzi? I hope not, because the Huskies won't win it without her contributions, but isn't that possible?

Good luck to the Huskies tonight, no matter who's on the floor for Geno. Go, Huskies!

 

[cohenzone]

I don’t know why some people need to over analyze. Dorka is rushing her shot like crazy two games in a row Plus AE was having a very good game as was ONO.

 

[warbler1055]

This is the regional final, there is very little time for improving and adjustment. Azzi did look gassed at the end of the Indiana game. It would be great if Caroline can have an impact. Dorka has not been playing well, what with all the missing free throws and bunnies. Dorka needs to seize the moment and hopefully can earn some playing time. To win we need all of them to be at their best.

 

[browns]

The debate goes on and on about Caroline's minutes, as well as Dorka's.

I'll note at the other end of the PT spectrum that Azzi is certainly not earning all the minutes she's playing. Yes, she plays solid D (as does Caroline), and her occasional successful three-pointer fires everyone up. Yet she's shooting 7 for 24 for the past two games, with just three rebounds and not a single assist in 73 minutes of PT.

Just because she's now a starter means she has to be on the court throughout? How do those numbers merit her playing virtually the entirety of both games? Don't you think perhaps she'd shoot/play better if given more frequent breaks?

Vs. Indiana, Caroline made an ill-advised pass intended for a teammate on the other side of the lane that was tipped and that her only TO in her 12 minutes of court time for those two games. And I agree, Ucbart, a pullup 10-footer would have been smarter shot than that ill-fated underhanded effort. But even for those, you continually go to a weary, off-target Azzi to produce sub-30 percent shooting, few rebounds and zero assists in two full games?

There are those who argue starters have earned the plus-30 minutes they get each game, regardless of their performances. I'm amazed so few of us remember that, pre-head injury Caroline was a player virtually everyone here agreed would be a starter throughout season's end. Now she doesn't deserve more than 12 minutes in two games to spell Azzi, or perhaps Christyn?

I love Azzi and what her potential might bring to the Huskies. So far in two tough NCAA games, I'd suggest she and Caroline should be compared for their actual results, not what Azzi's potential might be. If the Huskies are fortunate enough to play three more games, I'll bet there will be plenty of times when Caroline's knack for finding the hoop, as well as open teammates with good passes, would come in mighty handy.

Please remember, Azzi also hasn't experienced this before. Some here love to talk about the moment being too big for Caroline, or Dorka. Is it possible that's the case for Azzi? I hope not, because the Huskies won't win it without her contributions, but isn't that possible?

Good luck to the Huskies tonight, no matter who's on the floor for Geno. Go, Huskies!

You make some valid points but I have to bring up the last 2 games that you brought up Azzi is shooting 7/20 from the 3..35% which is quite a bit lower than her season av. of 43% but still quite higher than Caroline's av of 28%..now we have all seen how proficient a 3 point shooter Azzi can be and I would think Geno is waiting for her to get back to what she's been all year..that being said ...yes it looks like she can use more rest and your right she hasn't experienced this before but I really don't think the moment is too big for her..what I find more baffling is Azzi shooting 0/4 inside the arc..maybe fatigue is a factor

 

[The deacon]

You make some valid points but I have to bring up the last 2 games that you brought up Azzi is shooting 7/20 from the 3..35% which is quite a bit lower than her season av. of 43% but still quite higher than Caroline's av of 28%..now we have all seen how proficient a 3 point shooter Azzi can be and I would think Geno is waiting for her to get back to what she's been all year..that being said ...yes it looks like she can use more rest and your right she hasn't experienced this before but I really don't think the moment is too big for her..what I find more baffling is Azzi shooting 0/4 inside the arc..maybe fatigue is a factor

Agreed, Browns. I wouldn't argue Caroline is a better three-point shooter overall than Azzi. My point, which I believe you caught, was that all the minutes on the court might be part of the cause for her to miss even the shorter shots, hence 7 of 24.

 

[BBallF]

You make some valid points but I have to bring up the last 2 games that you brought up Azzi is shooting 7/20 from the 3..35% which is quite a bit lower than her season av. of 43% but still quite higher than Caroline's av of 28%..now we have all seen how proficient a 3 point shooter Azzi can be and I would think Geno is waiting for her to get back to what she's been all year..that being said ...yes it looks like she can use more rest and your right she hasn't experienced this before but I really don't think the moment is too big for her..what I find more baffling is Azzi shooting 0/4 inside the arc..maybe fatigue is a factor

The inside the arc shot is a pure jump shot with hang time and release at the top of the jump. The 3 point shot is a set/push shot. The jumper takes a lot more legs.

 

[Los24]

That's how it should be. There's a reason why players are starters and those that are deeper on the bench. You trust the starters the more. That's the reason why they start and play the most minutes. It's why you don't apply the same logic to Azzi.

Thats fair but not always the case across the board. There are bench players that get as many mins as starters. I dont care if we win because thats always goal number one, I guess one fear is if we lose and didnt tap the folks available to help and could have made the difference.

 

[dabears17]

Got home from my daughter's HS softball game and my daughter wanted to watch overtimes, not watch the DVR'd game, so we caught the last minute of 1st overtime and 2nd overtime. Feel bad for Dorka. Hope it isn't a serious injury to her wrist.

 

[Dublin]

Got home from my daughter's HS softball game and my daughter wanted to watch overtimes, not watch the DVR'd game, so we caught the last minute of 1st overtime and 2nd overtime. Feel bad for Dorka. Hope it isn't a serious injury to her wrist.

Just heard at the end of Geno's post-game presser that Dorka unfortunately fractured her wrist.

 

[Bajan Best]

I think there is over analyzing, not you specifically but everyone. Apply the same logic to Azzi and she sits during most of that game. She has turnovers, number of missed shots, etc... AE, bless her, has offensive fouls which equals turnovers. I can go on with the starters. It seems if your not a starter you have an incredibly short leash, even if you dont play bad.

Some are here getting down on the young lady for her 3 mins of play
I would like those same people to show me exactly who played well for the first 3 mins of the game..
Our team had what was it again, 3 Turnovers in the first 3 mins by the starters which allowed IU to go up by as many as six early, Should those players all be benched as well? Only One perfect person walked this earth as far as I know...

Our Coach is a very good coach, but he is also Human and therefore can make mistakes like anyone else...
Some of us forget that Put Summit was also a very good coach and successful as well, then along came an upstart named Geno who got the best of her. It does not matter how many titles you have won before, if you sit on those achievements, then you too will be surpassed by some other Coach who has made adjustments or learn what it takes to beat your style of play...

In my opinion, this is not the time of the year to be giving your players doubt in their abilities, at this stage the teams that move on are the ones who are confident and willing to take the next shot, even when they have missed poorly or are having a bad game..
One of our strengths is suppose to be our depth, which may not yield results in the beginning of a game but can certainly wear a team down in the latter stages of a game and cause them to miss shots they would normally make because they are tired..