How bad this season has been

[yukonyc212]

I could honestly care what our regular season record is as long as we make deep runs / win the NCAA tournament. I mean the ultimate goal is to win right? To think some people here complain that we aren't top 10 every year. We've won 2 of the past 6 titles. As someone here mentioned, Kentucky had an NIT season a few years back. It happens to everyone.

 

[Tenspro2002]

I could honestly care what our regular season record is as long as we make deep runs / win the NCAA tournament. I mean the ultimate goal is to win right? To think some people here complain that we aren't top 10 every year. We've won 2 of the past 6 titles.

Quiz: Winning a national championship is more likely after:
a) a dominant regular season
b) a mediocre regular season

Nobody is poo-pooing what we did in 2011 and 2014. That said, those were highly unlikely runs. Going forward, we're not going to be able to count on winning championships from a #7 seed. Moreover, in those seasons we don't win it all, we're still able to stay relevant if we're a #1-2 seed going into the Tournament, vs. largely irrelevant as a lower seed.

 

[UConnDad]

Quiz: Winning a national championship is more likely after:
a) a dominant regular season
b) a mediocre regular season

Nobody is poo-pooing what we did in 2011 and 2014. That said, those were highly unlikely runs. Going forward, we're not going to be able to count on winning championships from a #7 seed. Moreover, in those seasons we don't win it all, we're still able to stay relevant if we're a #1-2 seed going into the Tournament, vs. largely irrelevant as a lower seed.

I think we play to peak in March. I too would prefer a dominant regular season. In 2014 there were so many games where Shabaz wouldn't score in the first half only to score 20 in the second. Get the team working together, facing some difficulties, working things out etc. Some of these games we won and some were only learning experiences. I think 2014 was similar. The conference season was used that way. Kemba turned it up on occasion. We probably don't have the horses this year but who knows we're still growing. Some hot shooting and here we come. Next!

 

[UConnTrumbull]

Within the last 5 years Xavier has missed the NIT and been a 12 seed, hardly a perennial top 25 let alone top 10 team.

Butler missed the NIT twice in the last 5 years.

So it is pretty easy to explain, it is fantasy world.

I'll take your word on those examples. Maybe it's a recency effect that it seems like those schools always outkick their coverage. That being said, our program has still gone 8 years without having a dominant regular season team. Of course, we all love the deep march runs but there's no reason a program of our caliber should go a near decade without a dominant team from November to March. Yes, we've dealt with sanctions and CR issues but eventually those excuses need to stop being used.

 

[huskiemaniac]

What a bunch of whiners. We were bound to have a challenge year. Ollie chose to bring FR in & forego Grad plugs. Then .. 2 of our top 3 talents went down before our 5th game.

Learn in College Sports that sometimes you have development years. We aren't a Blueblood like UNC or UK that just spins top 10 recruit one after another; we win with Team play and development. This is a joyful year watching our final year of development of Purvis & Brimah .. and particularly Facey. And cheer the great improvement of Jackson & Vital & Adams. Look forward to next years 3 recruits.

We will have a solid incredible March again.

Even KY missed the tourney and winning a championship

 

[Pudge]

How do you explain the likes of Gonzaga, Butler, Xavier, etc. These teams are nowhere close to our level of success historically yet are perennial top 25 if not top 10 teams, at least in the past 5 years. I don't think it's crazy to expect a program like UConn to be dominating conference play and fringing upon the top 10.

I think the answer is obvious ... and has been right in your face on this boneyard postings. We were hurt by the sanctions and recruiting handcuffs as Calhoun exited. We plugged with Grad Transfers and, frankly, we had a Coach that figured out Roles extraordinary well. ONLY NOW ... as we entered 2016-2017, did we have a three class true recruiting harvest. I think WE (fans that read and think this ... instead of just attending games as entertainment) should have seen the difficulty of this year. UConn does get placed as a Blueblood in Preseason rankings. And, that top 20 is hard for us to accept if we aren't placed there ... and I guess we should expect not to be there in Oct. 2017. But, with a comeback from injuries, we should be far better. (just need a rim protector defender type)


And I love this "dominant" regular season chant. WE WON National Championships. Ok ... let's throw them back. They were not after playing well in our regular season.

 

[Matrim55]

And I love this "dominant" regular season chant. WE WON National Championships. Ok .. let's throw them back. They were not after playing well in our regular season.

In 2 years when we go 35-4 but lose in the Elite 8 these posters will complain that Ollie can't get us over the hump in March.

They're miserable and clueless. Just enjoy watching a bunch of kids who clearly love the team improve over the course of games, months and years.

 

[Tenspro2002]

In 2 years when we go 35-4 but lose in the Elite 8 these posters will complain that Ollie can't get us over the hump in March.

Not true in the slightest.

I will be firmly on the KO bandwagon if he delivers us a 35-4, #2 seed, Elite 8 type of season in 2 years, and you can quote me on that if and when it comes to pass.

 

[Travelman6]

Not true in the slightest.

I will be firmly on the KO bandwagon if he delivers us a 35-4, #2 seed, Elite 8 type of season in 2 years, and you can quote me on that if and when it comes to pass.

I would be thrilled with that, even for the next decade...35-4 and 32-6 type seasons going to the elite 8 and sweet 16 often are A-ok with me, and if he does get over the hump after many years of that, no worries for me as long as he can deliver at least one championship in the next 15 years after those types of seasons.

Well, let us see. In two years I want to see a Huge difference from this year.

 

[Tenspro2002]

I would be thrilled with that, even for the next decade..35-4 and 32-6 type seasons going to the elite 8 and sweet 16 often are A-ok with me, and if he does get over the hump after many years of that, no worries for me as long as he can deliver at least one championship in the next 15 years after those types of seasons.

Well, let us see. In two years I want to see a Huge difference from this year.

Exactly. KO already has the "can win the big one" credibility. What he hasn't demonstrated yet is the ability to have the team in contention on a regular basis.

If we're routinely grabbing top 5 seeds, the deep runs and championship possibilities will follow naturally. If not, we will be relying on flukes.

 

[Matrim55]

If we're routinely grabbing top 5 seeds, the deep runs and championship possibilities will follow naturally. If not, we will be relying on flukes.

2014 was not a fluke.

 

[UConnNick]

Yes, blue bloods have down years. But when was the last time we had a great regular season, 2009? We've had legendary runs in the tournament which mar the fact that we haven't had any real dominant teams. If that guy for Arizona hits that 3 in '11 and Brimah doesn't get that and-1, our program would be considered to be in a slump for a near decade.

This has to go down as one of the greatest glass is half empty posts in history. I'm an incurable pessimist by nature, and even I'm blown away by this one.

 

[Matrim55]

Not true in the slightest.

I will be firmly on the KO bandwagon if he delivers us a 35-4, #2 seed, Elite 8 type of season in 2 years, and you can quote me on that if and when it comes to pass.

BTW the fact that you felt compelled to respond to my post is your tacit acknowledgement of the fact that you identify as miserable and clueless.

 

[Tenspro2002]

BTW the fact that you felt compelled to respond to my post is your tacit acknowledgement of the fact that you identify as miserable and clueless.

Ha, well, I intentionally omitted that part when I quoted your post.

I have been a fairly outspoken critic of KO, and believe strongly that this program needs to get back to the point where we're routinely ranked, earning high seeds, and relevant throughout the year. KO has 2-3 years to demonstrate he can do that.

I thought it only fair to go on record with those expectations and acknowledge that I would consider the type of dominant regular season you described sufficient to assuage my concerns.

 

[Matrim55]

I have been a fairly outspoken critic of KO, and believe strongly that this program needs to get back to the point where we're routinely ranked, earning high seeds, and relevant throughout the year. KO has 2-3 years to demonstrate he can do that.

One-word answer: Do you expect him to?

 

[uconnell]

Truthfully I would rather have the Nationships Championships. Where is it written in historyThat UConn went 35 -2 and lost in the first round of the tourney. Izzo went to how many tournament games year after year but didn't win the Ch. game. The only time that is mentioned is during tournament time, other that it is never mentioned how many reg. Season games they won.

It is mentioned that UConn won 4 NC in the last 17 years, not how many reg season games we we won

 

[uconnell]

Truthfully I would rather have the Nationships Championships. Where is it written in historyThat UConn went 35 -2 and lost in the first round of the tourney. Izzo went to how many tournament games year after year but didn't win the Ch. game. The only time that is mentioned is during tournament time, other that it is never mentioned how many reg. Season games they won.

It is mentioned that UConn won 4 NC in the last 17 years, not how many reg season games we we won

I really didn't describe what I wanted to say very clearly but I think you guys can figure it out. Reg season games are practice for the Tourney.

 

[UConnNick]

Truthfully I would rather have the Nationships Championships. Where is it written in historyThat UConn went 35 -2 and lost in the first round of the tourney. Izzo went to how many tournament games year after year but didn't win the Ch. game. The only time that is mentioned is during tournament time, other that it is never mentioned how many reg. Season games they won.

It is mentioned that UConn won 4 NC in the last 17 years, not how many reg season games we we won

Exactly right. Who cares about winning regular season conference championships? It's all about March and winning your conference tourney and then the grand prize.

 

[Tenspro2002]

One-word answer: Do you expect him to?

Maybe. (Cop out I know.)

There's a few different ways to think about this.

Q: What should a program of our history and caliber demand?
A: Ranked and top 5 seed 7 years out of 10; top 10 and legitimate contender 4 years out of 10 (note that even these are below our historical performance in the 90's and 00's)

Q: What is KO capable of?
A: Who knows. We've emerged from the sanctions era and he's shown an ability to land 1 great recruit per year, but still hasn't gotten a stud big man and his player development record is spotty. In-game coaching has shown some flashes of brilliance, but also periods of stale and ineffective offense. Next year he will have a full team of "his guys".

The 2014 team was hot in March, but underperformed in the middle of the year. 2015 was just bad throughout, no talent. Last year the team generally underperformed, got hot for about 4 games. This year the team wasn't ready to play in November, period, but has gotten better under difficult circumstances.

My concern is that KO will continue to struggle to have the team firing on all cylinders in November through February. Even if we come on in March, we're still looking at low seeds (6 and below), and hoping for matchups to break the right way.

The next 2-3 years will be very telling.

In principle, all of KO's pieces will be there and we'll be able to evaluate whether he can uphold the expectations that this program has become accustomed to.

 

[Tenspro2002]

Truthfully I would rather have the Nationships Championships. Where is it written in historyThat UConn went 35 -2 and lost in the first round of the tourney. Izzo went to how many tournament games year after year but didn't win the Ch. game. The only time that is mentioned is during tournament time, other that it is never mentioned how many reg. Season games they won.

It is mentioned that UConn won 4 NC in the last 17 years, not how many reg season games we we won

Exactly right. Who cares about winning regular season conference championships? It's all about March and winning your conference tourney and then the grand prize.

I think we're talking past each other here.

Nobody is saying "I would rather have gone 35-4 and lost in the Elite 8 than gone 32-9 and won the championship."

What I am saying is: in the future, going 35-3 heading into the Tournament is more likely to produce deep runs and championships than going 26-9 heading into the Tournament.

This really should not be that controversial.

 

[Matrim55]

I think we're talking past each other here.

Nobody is saying "I would rather have gone 35-4 and lost in the Elite 8 than gone 32-9 and won the championship."

What I am saying is: in the future, going 35-3 heading into the Tournament is more likely to produce deep runs and championships than going 26-9 heading into the Tournament.

This really should not be that controversial.

Nobody's disagreeing with that. Sane people are disagreeing with you downplaying our two most recent titles by calling them flukes, or @UConnTrumbull pretending that Butler or Xavier have been more successful teams than us recently despite pretty easily uncovered evidence to the contrary.

You guys are so obsessed with over-inflating the accomplishments of other schools and minimizing our own accomplishments that you come off as trolls more often than not.

 

[uconnell]

I think we're talking past each other here.

Nobody is saying "I would rather have gone 35-4 and lost in the Elite 8 than gone 32-9 and won the championship."

What I am saying is: in the future, going 35-3 heading into the Tournament is more likely to produce deep runs and championships than going 26-9 heading into the Tournament.

This really should not be that controversial.

Don't get me wrong, I would love UConn to have a wining season and go onto win the NC. I would hope it's not either/or with this team. It makes the long winter more enjoyable and something to look forward to in the spring, along with spring football.
I love basketball and I want the best for our teams.

 

[Jaker]

Exactly right. Who cares about winning regular season conference championships? It's all about March and winning your conference tourney and then the grand prize.

Yup, especially after winning so many great Big East titles, I could care less about winning an American conference regular season title. We play for NC's in March!

 

[UConnTrumbull]

Nobody's disagreeing with that. Sane people are disagreeing with you downplaying our two most recent titles by calling them flukes, or @UConnTrumbull pretending that Butler or Xavier have been more successful teams than us recently despite pretty easily uncovered evidence to the contrary.

You guys are so obsessed with over-inflating the accomplishments of other schools and minimizing our own accomplishments that you come off as trolls more often than not.

My point is that this program should not go a near decade without a well-rounded regular season and postseason. Obviously I would love to continue our deep runs in March. But great regular seasons and deep runs in the tourney should not have to be mutually exclusive. It's not like we need to have 9-10 losses going into March every year.

 

[jibsey]

Everyone has to get a grip here. If we had Larrier it would have been a game changer for our season I'm convinced. We had enough to overcome Gilbert though it's been difficult with Vital's emergence but a 6'8' scoring and rebounding forward was the back breaker. Losing 12-15 points, 5 rebounds changed everything. As it is we are middle of the AAC this year.

 

[ctchamps]

Exactly right. Who cares about winning regular season conference championships? It's all about March and winning your conference tourney and then the grand prize.

If you have a veteran laden and talented team you go for regular season and conference championships as well as post season championships. But if you have consistent turnover from graduation or transfer and have to integrate new players into your system then you use the season to get better for the NCAA. And this has been the situation for UConn for quite some time.

 

[superjohn]

In 2 years when we go 35-4 but lose in the Elite 8 these posters will complain that Ollie can't get us over the hump in March.

They're miserable and clueless. Just enjoy watching a bunch of kids who clearly love the team improve over the course of games, months and years.

A 35-4 season would be wondeful, so would winning this s--tty conference.

 

[champs99and04]

I think we're talking past each other here.

Nobody is saying "I would rather have gone 35-4 and lost in the Elite 8 than gone 32-9 and won the championship."

What I am saying is: in the future, going 35-3 heading into the Tournament is more likely to produce deep runs and championships than going 26-9 heading into the Tournament.

This really should not be that controversial.

Isn't that a correlation and not causation type thing? If you have a great team you have a great team. The '14 team was no more likely to have won the tournament if they had won an additional three games.

The goal in college basketball should be to get better throughout the season. When you do that, wins naturally follow. It seems to me that you're doing the opposite.

 

[Tenspro2002]

Isn't that a correlation and not causation type thing? If you have a great team you have a great team. The '14 team was no more likely to have won the tournament if they had won an additional three games.

The goal in college basketball should be to get better throughout the season. When you do that, wins naturally follow. It seems to me that you're doing the opposite.

Well, there's another way to look at it.

There are a lot of people arguing that we shouldn't be alarmed by repeatedly mediocre regular seasons, asserting that we always perform well in March.

My assertion is: yes, we should be concerned, because more often than not, those teams are simply mediocre, and are not actually great teams waiting to perform at their potential.

Getting better throughout the season is nice, but sneaking into the Tournament, whatever momentum you may have, doesn't help when you end up paired with the #1 overall seed.

 

[champs99and04]

Well, there's another way to look at it.

There are a lot of people arguing that we shouldn't be alarmed by repeatedly mediocre regular seasons, asserting that we always perform well in March.

My assertion is: yes, we should be concerned, because more often than not, those teams are simply mediocre, and are not actually great teams waiting to perform at their potential.

Getting better throughout the season is nice, but sneaking into the Tournament, whatever momentum you may have, doesn't help when you end up paired with the #1 overall seed.

I agree with this to a point. Seeding is important, especially when it dictates location. I'm not sure we beat Michigan State in 2014 without MSG behind us (it's worth mentioning that we were under-seeded as a seven, which actually worked to our benefit that season but also blinds people to the fact that we were in the top 25 pretty much all year).

It's not really about momentum for me, though. It's about being better in March than you are in January. That means grasping schemes that are sometimes complex, tightening your game in subtle ways so that you're accentuating your value as a player, and condensing/optimizing your rotations to align with whatever a season worth of data is telling you.

I'll take being a six seed and losing by one point to a national powerhouse over being a three seed and not having a chance. Last years team wasn't good enough and so they more or less got blown out by Kansas. If we'd lost a 50/50 game, though, then it'd be tough for me to sit here and criticize the overall arch of progress - you'd bemoan the losses that put you in the position of having to play the #1 overall seed opening weekend, but you wouldn't ask for a different team.

For example, even this year, there are teams that can win the title and teams that cannot. Cincinnati is not winning the title. Neither is Baylor. Everybody knows this. Kentucky and Duke might, even though they'll likely be seeded anywhere from 2-6 on selection Sunday. I'll take being Kentucky or Duke in a year where we have some young players (obviously our talent isn't on that level, but in the AAC, we can win the conference tournament) over being say, Butler.