Hoopgurlz 2013 Class Revisited

[rugbymate]

If Hoopgurlz rankings were a proxy for a draft, i thought it would be interesting to see where the bargains were and ,of course, the relative busts. The Hoopgurlz final ranking is after the players name'

FIRST TEAM BARGAIN
Alexis Peterson- 92
Brionna Jones-55
Chantel Oshafor-71
Kelsey Plum-26
Sydney Wiese-80

SECOND TEAM BARGAIN
Nina Davis-52
Lindsay Allen- 25
Karlie Samuelson-77
Alaina Coates- 28
Shatori Walker-Kimbrough-43

ALL BELOW EXPECTATIONS TEAM( in no particular order)
Mercedes Russell-1
Kaela Davis-2
Diamond DeShields-3
Taya Reimer-4
Allisha Gray-7


Would be interested if there are other views.

 

[Kaizen]

I will add Saniya Chong in somewhere but definitely not below expectation.

2013 HoopGurlz Recruiting Rankings - espnW 100 - ESPN

 

[Tufkas]

Based on this year alone, and recent games in particular that #75 ranked recruit most definitely falls into one of the bargain categories!

 

[nwhoopfan]

Interesting. Looks like the Pac 12 got more than their fair share of seriously undervalued recruits that year. Looking thru the full top 100, #67 Chrishae Rowe I believe led all freshmen in scoring that year at Oregon before transferring to Kentucky and then getting booted from the team and disappearing.

 

[nwhoopfan]

I'd say #26 was the best in the class by a mile.

 

[B BLOCK]

hoopgurlz is biased and slanted. Their rankings have no cred with me.

 

[SCspur]

Allisha Gray was never below expectations. She has always been solid even at NC and scored over 1,000 points and 500 rebounds in just two seasons. Kaela has been below her expectations but now she's more disciplined and is foucusing on all aspects of her game, if she stays for next year and continues to play at the rate in which she is playing right now she could very well be a AA.
I guess most of them on that list would kill to make the FF even if they over achieved.

 

[pacific 44]

If this year was redone,Epps at #37 would be many places higher as well.

 

[Fairfield Fan]

I will add Saniya Chong in somewhere but definitely not below expectation.

2013 HoopGurlz Recruiting Rankings - espnW 100 - ESPN

#75.

 

[Fairfield Fan]

hoopgurlz is biased and slanted. Their rankings have no cred with me.

This sure casts doubt on that ranking, doesn't it?

At least they got the right names ranked. Though the ranks don't make sense.

Does ProspectNation do a better job?

 

[MilfordHusky]

This shows how imprecise the ratings are. I trust Geno's evaluations over HG, BS, ASGR, PN, etc.

Some kids don't have enough exposure, so they are under-ranked. Others are early bloomers who don't improve much after age 16. Some are late bloomers.

A couple of players who were seriously under-rated in high school were Alana Beard and Angel McCoughtry.

The 2013 class was unique is one way: I think the transfer rate among top players was much higher than in other years. This is just an odd group.

 

[UcMiami]

I don't actually think this shows much at all. We post countless threads about the qualities of the Uconn coaching and the deficiencies of other coaching staffs. 'I would love to see how she would have done if she chose Uconn' is a frequently stated thought. And it isn't just coaching but includes system and so much more.
The OP list of disappointments all transferred schools except Russell who had operations on both feet and missed a year. And she had the disadvantage as did DD of playing for the completely incompetent coaching staff at TN if you take the Vol Nation posters word for it.

And we are talking about evaluation 14-17 year old athletes who are only scratching the surface of coordination and adulthood biologically based on occasional sighting in HS games with questionable coaching and competition and AAU games with no coaching trying to determine potential at the next level with questionable coaching. Some players get seen only once or twice by someone with a list of 500 names to evaluate over a weekend.

Generally the ones that make it to the top have better skills than those further down the list but what happens to them at the college of their choice makes a significant difference. Having made it to the next level and secured their college education, what is their motivational level as they mature and need to devote so much more time to the work of moving from athletically gifted to actually having to work to succeed? Being a star can be intoxicating and for most good athletes it comes pretty easily against the level of HS competition, having to work hours in the gym and hours in the weight room and hours in conditioning drills to be a substitute on a good team - not quite so easy or immediately rewarding. ( I was a natural at math and never had to study to get straight As and I loved it, until I got to calculus and actually had to work at it - then I decided I preferred theater! )

The list is and has always been meant as an evaluation of basketball skill, not of heart or personality. No coach looks at the list and decides to recruit all of the top twenty, but they do look at the list and make sure they actually put their own eyeballs on the top 50 to see if some of them might fit into their own program and then talk to the ones that might and further reduce the players they have interest in. We fans for the most part don't see any of them until 'our coach' is interested or offers and then we look at the ranking and a few highlight clips and get excited or confused - why did coach offer Dolson she isn't even in the top 25! There is no video on line, but I saw a picture and she doesn't much look like a basketball body!.

It is like a top 100 movies list - usually I hate half of them if I have seen them.

 

[meyers7]

This sure casts doubt on that ranking, doesn't it?

At least they got the right names ranked. Though the ranks don't make sense.

Does ProspectNation do a better job?

This is why it's best to combine all the rankings. (ASGR's are hard to find though.) Gives you a better perspective. But still things can change in 4 years. Better/worse coaching, desire by player to improve, early/late bloomers.

 

[CocoHusky]

I would add # 35 Shayla Cooper & #37 Makayla Epps to the list of 2nd team bargains to replace # 28 Coates & #25 Allen.

To the below expectation I would add: This entire 2013 class, # 5 Linnae Harper, # 8 Jannah Tucker with an asterisk, and the Duke Trio of (#6 Greenwell, #10 Chidom, #12 Cooper).

*I have probably told this story way too many times but I was privy to some of the Philly Belles practices and games featuring Belles team with Stewie, Jannah Tucker, & Brittney Sykes. On many (maybe most) days Tucker was the best player on that team. That idiot who hurt her so viciously really robbed us all.

 

[SCspur]

I would add # 35 Shayla Cooper & #37 Makayla Epps to the list of 2nd team bargains to replace # 28 Coates & #25 Allen.

To the below expectation I would add: This entire 2013 class, # 5 Linnae Harper, # 8 Jannah Tucker with an asterisk, and the Duke Trio of (#6 Greenwell, #10 Chidom, #12 Cooper).

*I have probably told this story way too many times but I was privy to some of the Philly Belles practices and games featuring Belles team with Stewie, Jannah Tucker, & Brittney Sykes. On many (maybe most) days Tucker was the best player on that team. That idiot who hurt her so viciously really robbed us all.

I wouldn't add either. There's no way Shayla Cooper is better then Coates and Allen, and Makayla Epps was a McDAA so it's not like she underachieved.

 

[CocoHusky]

I wouldn't add either. There's no way Shayla Cooper is better then Coates and Allen, and Makayla Epps was a McDAA so it's not like she underachieved.

So not what I was trying to say. It is a relative comparison based on where they were ranked in HoopGurlz only. It's not saying Cooper is better than Coates- that is a separate argument we can get back to after the WNBA draft. It's saying compared to where they were ranked Cooper exceeded expectations. Coates also may have met expectations or may have exceed expectations just not by as much as Cooper.

 

[Fairfield Fan]

This shows how imprecise the ratings are. I trust Geno's evaluations over HG, BS, ASGR, PN, etc.

Some kids don't have enough exposure, so they are under-ranked. Others are early bloomers who don't improve much after age 16. Some are late bloomers.

A couple of players who were seriously under-rated in high school were Alana Beard and Angel McCoughtry.

The 2013 class was unique is one way: I think the transfer rate among top players was much higher than in other years. This is just an odd group.

Angel McCaughtry is the one player whom Auriemma mentioned in an interview a couple of years ago as being a player he wished he could have coached in college. Not sure why she was invisible in high school....

 

[CocoHusky]

Does ProspectNation do a better job?

No one ranking services is more accurate than another and it is best to do what @Meyers is suggesting and come up with a "composite" ranking which will be far more accurate. It is best to understand the affiliations to AAU teams specifically and the ranking criteria that each service uses. Prospectsnation for example will not rank a player unless they have seen the player in live action.

This shows how imprecise the ratings are. I trust Geno's evaluations over HG, BS, ASGR, PN, etc.

Geno physical talent evaluation differs very little from the evaluation services. The "intangibles" like team fit, and drive to get better, is not the business of the evaluation services but essential to Geno's success.
As much as some might not like to hear it, the vast majority of UCONN current players are playing pretty much at the level where the rankings predicted they would.

 

[triaddukefan]

I would add # 35 Shayla Cooper & #37 Makayla Epps to the list of 2nd team bargains to replace # 28 Coates & #25 Allen.

To the below expectation I would add: This entire 2013 class, # 5 Linnae Harper, # 8 Jannah Tucker with an asterisk, and the Duke Trio of (#6 Greenwell, #10 Chidom, #12 Cooper).

*I have probably told this story way too many times but I was privy to some of the Philly Belles practices and games featuring Belles team with Stewie, Jannah Tucker, & Brittney Sykes. On many (maybe most) days Tucker was the best player on that team. That idiot who hurt her so viciously really robbed us all.

You said in another thread that Greenwell has a subpar career in college. Now that Im back on my laptop... I'll have to find an appropriate pic in response. A player who is on pace for 2,000 points, 700 rebounds, 300 assists, 200 steals AND 300 career 3pt FG's......

Subpar ???

 

[CocoHusky]

You said in another thread that Greenwell has a subpar career in college. Now that Im back on my laptop... I'll have to find an appropriate pic in response. A player who is on pace for 2,000 points, 700 rebounds, 300 assists, 200 steals AND 300 career 3pt FG's.

Subpar ???

This stated was challenged and retracted hours ago. You probably missed it while you were out to dinner. What did you have anyway?

I'll give you Cooper and Chidom but I would in no way classify Greenwell's Duke career as "sub-par".

She was ranked 6th in the class and was hurt as a Freshmen in Sophmore so you maybe be right. But that the last concession I'm making today.

 

[HuskyNan]

Rankings are subjective. It's easy to look back and say they were wrong but don't forget that they're based on high school kids, not college players. Coaching varies widely as does exposure. And they're just very young.

Ratings services also tend to be stronger in certain geographic areas. Blue Star is in the Northeast, Peach State is in the Southeast, and Hoopgurlz is, or was, based in the Northwest. If a scout only sees a kid 3-4 times, and they were off games, the the service will rank her lower. Saniya, for example, is from New York State so Blue Star will have seen her much more than HoopGurlz.

And, rankings have different criteria. Some rank on relative ability as they are now, some rank on potential. I've always maintained it's dumb to rank a center on the same list as a point guard, too, since they have such different skills.

Rankings are fun, I guess, but in the end, they don't mean all that much.

 

[triaddukefan]

This stated was challenged and retracted hours ago. You probably missed it while you were out to dinner. What did you have anyway?

Popeye's Chicken tenders with the Blackened ranch dipping sauce... side of red beans and rice... and a biscuit with sweet tea. Never had them before... and they were tasty. Had a coupon... so they gave me a free chicken tenders snack as well. I had the regular tenders with the meal... but chose the blackened version for the snack. They smelled wonderful..... but saved them for lunch tomorrow..