Honestly, what happened?

[IndyLives]

UConn had the perfect blend of inside and outside play to dominate the last 2 years. When done through a movement and passing scheme, it is very tough to defend. Before the chips, there was a lot of perimeter passing with no purpose, and eventually iso ball with the clock running out. There was a noticeable change 2 years ago. So, I would say it's the mix of both Luke's new scheme and recruiting the right talent to fit this scheme.

I would argue last year's team was one of best, if not the best, in the modern era. They won't get recognized as such because they lost a few games, mainly due to key players injured. But, when healthy, they would beat even the Duke teams of the early 90s.

 

[Tenspro2002]

And for better or worse, he stayed loyal to some holdover and his early recruits which simply were not at the level needed. In retrospect, I think it was a good thing as it helped cement the kind of culture he wants here.

I'm sure he knew he was sacrificing something on the court to encourage guys like Polley and Whaley to stay as long as they wanted, to hold onto Brendan Adams (his first recruit) as long as he did, but it was a calculated move to build culture, which has paid off in the long run.

In fact, I'm not sure there has ever been a "short term pain, long term gain" intentional choice that has paid off as much as this one in the recent history of the sport.

 

[ec33]

I may be off on this (like entirely) - but it is my casual understanding that in broad terms Geno runs his own version of the Princeton offense and it has evolved even more over the years. Meanwhile, Europeans also evolved their own version of the Princeton offense and the men's side runs their version of the European-based evolved "Princeton offense" complete with analytics.

So they would look similar as they have the same root.

 

[husky429]

I may be off on this (like entirely) - but it is my casual understanding that in broad terms Geno runs his own version of the Princeton offense and it has evolved even more over the years. Meanwhile, Europeans also evolved their own version of the Princeton offense and the men's side runs their version of the European-based evolved "Princeton offense" complete with analytics.

So they would look similar as they have the same root.

The whole Chin series we run is adapted from the Princeton offense. It's kind of old school in a way. But the actual product really doesn't look like Princeton any more.

 

[FfldCntyFan]

I've never believed in 'a good loss', but I think the New Mexico St loss is in retrospect the clearest example that 'a good loss' is a true concept. I always viewed the concept as a loss that removes player complacency, but in this case it completely revamped a coaching style and the desired talent being recruited. The pain of that loss is gone, and replaced by a 'thankyou'.

Fully agree but I have to add the most important part of the equation is the response to the loss is what makes the good loss possible.

As a NY Giants fan from the late 1960's I've said for decades that the best thing that happened to them in my lifetime was the fumble as that led them to hiring a football guy (George Young) to run the franchise and the clown show ended (until a bit more than a decade ago).

DH recognizing that other methodologies could be incorporated into what he was doing and being willing to change his approach has paid dividends far beyond what most of us could have imagined.

 

[FfldCntyFan]

Did members of our staff sudy Geno's offense while devising the offense we currently run? I will state without question, with what I know of our staff, they spent countless hours studying film, including Geno, including Pete Carrill, including European league play, including the Warriors from the past decade, the Knicks from the early 1970's and likely anything else the could have gotten their hands on.

What Geno runs (has run forever basically) is a slight variation of Bobby Knight's motion offense. What we currently run compares with that only in that it can also be categorized as a motion offense. The player movement, the screens, the pin downs, the ball movement all are different from anything I've seen in my lifetime (I've been watching this sport since the late 1960's). A massive part of what makes this offense so special is the off ball screens (pin downs) that most fans aren't aware of as prior to this there would be no reason to ever look for them. I cannot count how many times over the past two seasons where one of our players came open seemingly out of nowhere solely because od something away from the ball that nobody (including the opponent) would ever consider. This may be the most beautiful offense I've ever seen and I saw the Knicks when they had group of unselfish, future hall of fame players who could all handle the ball, pass, move, score as well as anyone in the game.

 

[WhereistheDove?]

So Geno ball to an extreme works very well in the men's game. I agree.

You’re going to have to define what “geno ball” means to you. Best I can tell, what you’re pinning this on is the offense uses off-ball screens. Is that it?

 

[brihman]

Without reading through the rest of the comments, this is it.

And recruiting the players with the IQ and desire to share the ball.

It amazes me that he didn’t just improve but he draws comparisons to the Warriors and guys like LeBron compliment us. His substitutions are always spot on, makes incredible adjustments at half time, and has mostly not let the refs get his goat to the point where it impacts the game.

 

[AZHuskiePop]

I’m not an X and O guy like many of you, but I remember in the early Hurley days, a lot of complaints about our offense and how we just ran a weave and high hedge endlessly. Now, anlmost overnight, we run the best offense in CBB.

Is it the players, is Hurley evolving, is Murray a mad offensive scientist, is it the cultural buy-in? Am I answering my own question by saying it’s all of the above?

Its 75% player and 25% coaching evolution
Even last years team always had one player who had trouble fitting into an offensive set
This years team had a an almost perfect mix to make any offense look good .
However in addition it had 5 players with size and high basketball IQ’s enabing us to put things in coaches only dream of running . A 7’2” generational player in the middle who touched the ball in almost every set is a nice a huge bonus.
From a team perspective that was the best offensive team in our history. They may not have been individually but as a team they resembled 2014 with a more versatile 5 and greater size.

 

[gsmooth]

Fully agree but I have to add the most important part of the equation is the response to the loss is what makes the good loss possible.

As a NY Giants fan from the late 1960's I've said for decades that the best thing that happened to them in my lifetime was the fumble as that led them to hiring a football guy (George Young) to run the franchise and the clown show ended (until a bit more than a decade ago).

DH recognizing that other methodologies could be incorporated into what he was doing and being willing to change his approach has paid dividends far beyond what most of us could have imagined.

Being a UConn is great. It cleanses my palette of being a NY Giants fan and watching their front office ineptitude since the 2nd SB win over the Patriots (really it started before that SB.

 

[SubbaBub]

Early on, Hurley expressed a desire to run a 4 out offense of shooters around a stud low post player.

He also famously decided that he wouldn't run off the players/recruits that he inherited.

It simply took time to assemble the roster and with the portal he was able to select proven college talent over undeveloped HS talent that was predicted to go to places like Duke, Kansas etc.

He beat the recruiting system by not relying on developing a never ending stream of 5 star recruits and hoping they all mesh together or pan out at all.

He also got a bit lucky in players like Sanogo, Hawkins, Jackson, Newton, Spencer, developing into NBA caliber players, but he gets credit for selecting them over others with more hype.

The euro offense thing was also an advantage vs. Older guys and system proteges stuck doing what they've always done, see Boeheim, Jim.

Cat is out of the bag on both concepts. Hungry coaches nationwide are studying the blueprint. The first to market advantage is closing. To sustain, Hurley needs to execute better and add a few wrinkles. He'll benefit by attracting more talented players but getting them to play his style will be more difficult.

To be the man, he had to beat the man, now he is the man.

 

[ec33]

Did members of our staff sudy Geno's offense while devising the offense we currently run? I will state without question, with what I know of our staff, they spent countless hours studying film, including Geno, including Pete Carrill, including European league play, including the Warriors from the past decade, the Knicks from the early 1970's and likely anything else the could have gotten their hands on.

What Geno runs (has run forever basically) is a slight variation of Bobby Knight's motion offense. What we currently run compares with that only in that it can also be categorized as a motion offense. The player movement, the screens, the pin downs, the ball movement all are different from anything I've seen in my lifetime (I've been watching this sport since the late 1960's). A massive part of what makes this offense so special is the off ball screens (pin downs) that most fans aren't aware of as prior to this there would be no reason to ever look for them. I cannot count how many times over the past two seasons where one of our players came open seemingly out of nowhere solely because od something away from the ball that nobody (including the opponent) would ever consider. This may be the most beautiful offense I've ever seen and I saw the Knicks when they had group of unselfish, future hall of fame players who could all handle the ball, pass, move, score as well as anyone in the game.

Much better (and more accurate) description, thank you.

A piece that I picked up in some of the post-championship breakdowns was that the offense was "just" a set of interconnected plays. So play 1 into play 2 into play 3 (each part having reads) and then if there is any time "freelance." It would look like a "motion offense" during the operation of those plays, but only because the shot clock ran out.

And as noted, these incorporated elements of different offensive systems.

 

[Doctor Hoop]

Ball screens work when you have a guy who can beat the switch man one-on-one (i.e., Kemba and to a certain degree Tristen), and enough perimeter shooting to keep the D spread and distracted. Off-ball screens work when you have perimeter shooting but nobody really needs to be a major one-on-one threat. It's tough on the defense because they have to switch and/or scramble to stay connected even though they often can't see the ball. If they do look for it they lose sight of their man.

The key in both cases is having several perimeter threats. Just think back to Tyler Polley. Even though he had other deficiencies he was a good perimeter shooter, but on those teams almost the only one that had to be guarded at all times. Everyone else could be sloughed to help. He wasn't able to get his own shot, and wasn't good enough with the ball to be the handler working off a ball screen.

Hurley had to accomplish two things. Bring in better shooters (he did), and work the offense with multiple options, including ball screens, off-ball screens, back cuts, high-low, etc. That second part requires smart players who can read the D on the fly, and both the player with the ball and those off have to make the same reads. It's that part that stood out in watching the offense this year.

 

[McLovin]

The problem was we had so few shooters on the floor at a time that if we tried running plays for shooters, it was so obvious what we were doing that the best we got was contested Polley spot-up 3s, which were incredibly demoralizing when he missed.

If I recall we did a lot of 2 bigs that year. So yes, it definitely limited our offensive capabilities. Although Whaley did hit like 3 threes in one game lol

 

[HooperScooper]

Teddy Allen

The Boneyard needs to buy that guy a few drinks. Without that game we might not have back to back championships.

 

[Umami Zen]

My two cents. Dan had to rebuild the culture and talent level initially. He is a student of successful people/self-improvement/a voracious reader. After the New Mexico St loss- I believe he knew things had to change re: how he managed his staff and Program. He became a CEO of the "organization"- He delegated to the strengths of his staff and let them self-actualize their talents for the good of the "organization". Gave the keys of the car to Luke for the Offense. Kimani the Defense. Tom the rebounding and GM responsibilities while all of them still being involved in recruiting and player development and scouting of future opponents.

The rosters of the last two years have been magnificently pieced together to optimize this new approach. Players with athletic talent and excellent BBIQ that can function and process the offense and its optionality has been epic. Our starting five this year were exceptional processors of this offensive scheme developed by Luke and Dan.

The system now is about finding the right players for the "organization" and its culture. Not always about who is the highest rated recruit with some skill set that can play hero ball.

 

[uconnfan68]

Unfortunately I was at this game in 1995. It was the first week every UConn got ranked #1 in the country and it was such a big deal. Then Kittles lit up Ray Allen and the Huskies for 37 while Ray only had 11. Nova beat UConn 96-73.

This, or the game in Kansas, were the worst. Still not over them.

 

[Tenspro2002]

The Boneyard needs to buy that guy a few drinks. Without that game we might not have back to back championships.

He's actually a pretty s____y guy from what I understand, which is part of what made losing to him so galling.

I'll pass.

 

[FfldCntyFan]

The Boneyard needs to buy that guy a few drinks. Without that game we might not have back to back championships.

We have quite a few attorneys on the Boneyard. From what I know of Teddy Allen he would be far better served with legal representation than a few drinks.

 

[DogMania]

Maybe I'm misremembering, but it seems our offense this past season was much more intricate than the prior.

There seemed to be a lot more movement, multiple screening and back cuts than the 23 season.

I remember at one point late in the 23 season, maybe even the tournament time, Hurley made an adjustment where he started to run the offense through AJ. So not standing pat and looking to evolve on both ends of the floor seemed start, or at least click, near the end of the 23 season.

I agree with those who said that it's a combination of the coaches evolving the offense and recruiting players who have the skill and BBIQ to execute it.

 

[Chin Diesel]

No doubt but that team that lost to New Mexico State had Hawkins, Cole, Martin and Polley who were all above average or better shooters. We just didn’t utilize them properly (Martin was actually a very very good 3 point shooter his senior year - 43% on over 3 attempts per game - and we ran nothing to get him open looks).

Cole dies in this offense. Polley probably thrives. Martin intrigues me. Quick cuts and quick decisions with the ball make this offense go.

Telling Polley to run around for 20 seconds and he gets a clean look would motivate him. I do have doubts he'd be a willing screener away from the ball, but he'd score. I think Martin could do well with catch and shoot and I am definitely confident he'd knock some bodies around away from the ball and rebound.
Nothing about Cole moved at championship level D1 speed. He busted his ass for the program and I don't wish him any ill but he was limited in speed, length and quickness.

 

[brihman]

Imagine Nadav Henefeld in this offense?!?

​

 

[willie99]

I’m genuinely a bit curious/confused at what you think the similarities are.

Constant motion, cutting, and multiple picks, screens.... creating wide open looks and layups

I'm not sure how anyone can miss the similarities

 

[StllH8L8ner]

He finally visited the Boneyard. And he listened. Congrats all!

 

[uh-no]

Constant motion, cutting, and multiple picks, screens.... creating wide open looks and layups

I'm not sure how anyone can miss the similarities

is it the same offense? No. not close. Based on what he said to Katz the other day, have they seen tape of the offense and found some part of it they may utilize at times? Almost surely. He pretty much said the coaching staff will watch anything they can get their hands on for ideas they can play around with.