Future of the XL Center as a Home Site

[Fishy]

I was going under the assumption that UConn Basketball will be played in Hartford no matter what which does have its benefits. I agree the best and most sensible solution is a new arena on campus.

XL is in a death spiral. It’s truly no one’s fault - it’s just that the economic realities of that type of facility do not support major investment in it.

Think about it - anyone who went to concerts at HCC back in the day….check out the concerts that are held there now. They simply cannot book those acts anymore. The economics of the building do not make sense for the promotions so those concerts go elsewhere now.

So if you are a pragmatist and not an idealist, you understand that we need to move past XL in the very near term.

We also have an aging facility on campus that will be difficult to expand. There was one plan to bump out the concourse, but that’s a bandaid in a state that absolutely loves bandaids in place of solutions.

We need a mid-term plan to replace Gampel. We will come to that conclusion probably about a ten years too late.

 

[upstater]

These both are perfectly normal ways of doing business.

There are huge inefficiencies caused by this, namely competition for students. Which is dumb. You have Engineering schools literally creating liberal arts departments inside their schools. It's a howl. But I wont get into it.

 

[August_West]

Gampel has been full so getting people there is not a problem. Plenty of other big east teams evenly split the home games between 2 arenas? Which ones? Off the top of my head nova and St. John’s play in 2 arenas, pretty sure nova only plays a few games in Wells Fargo not sure what St. John’s split is like. How many blue bloods nationally split it down the middle?

Neither more than 3, 4 tops in any given year. You’ve been shizzled. NO one in BigEast does what we do. Really no one in all of college basketball pays to play 1/2 their games and calls it “ home”

 

[CL82]

It’s a 33 year old building that isn’t particularly nice or comfortable. And it was not about adding seats, so while common sense should have killed it, a broke-ass state of Connecticut killed it. (It was never actually on the schedule. It was a color-pencil sketch on a plan ten years ago.)

XL is not going to get better - it will simply get worse raster or slower, depending on what they do. Gampel is not going to get better - it’s just getting older.

We need a modern 12,500-15,000 seat facility. We can pretend we don’t, but do not be surprised when “game day” atmosphere kneecaps us again when realignment comes around again. Eventually, you all will figure it out.

That’s a shame, because it made some sense and seemed relatively cost-effective. My assumption, and that’s all it was since there were never any interior renderings as far as I know, was that if you are installing an exterior concourse, a portion of the interior concourse could be used for seats.

For what it’s worth, Gampel is an iconic structure with the geodesic dome. Not that it ever produced the reported savings that a “modular” ceiling was supposed to produce, but it is unique. It would be a shame to see it taken down, in my opinion.

 

[upstater]

Your comment took me by surprise. I went looking for data and found this which suggests that CT provides one of the highest subsidies per student:

State Support for Higher Education per Full-Time Equivalent Student | State Indicators | National Science Foundation - State Indicators

National Science Board Science and Engineering Indicators. A broad base of quantitative information on the U.S. and international science and engineering enterprise.

ncses.nsf.gov

I'm sure its more complicated than this. How do you arrive at the bottom quintile?

Those are gov't #s so I assume they're right. I will only say that when I looked at this in a similar discussion 2 years ago they were at the bottom. Also, this government listing has them at well above 50% of FTE which is very very good, yet the President in that article is quoted as saying they dropped into the 20s%. Either the article I read on this previously is wrong, and also the president is wrong, or else this chart is wrong. I will maybe have a look in a day when I get a chance

 

[upstater]

As for @upstater comments regarding the budget I have no clue as to what that budget would entail though he seems like he does. I have no claim one way or another regarding the budget and it's outcomes on the school.

I really don't know either when it comes to UConn. I'm just hypothetically imagining it's a place like my school. I only know that when we came up short $10m, we destroyed things. I was on the highest committee overseeing it all. It takes your breath away to see units go from 50 faculty members to 25. And then students complain they can't graduate because we don't offer the courses. And your only response is, they're right!

When a President steps out of line like this, they are on the verge of leaving their job. We had a state senate bill in NY take money away from the one public law school in the state and give it to a rinky dink private law school in Rochester. I was at a private summer party standing right next to the Pres. when he got into it with a local state Senator. President was making $1m a year. He was on fire and indignant that day. He was out of there very very soon after that. Replaced.

In my state, we did a little exercise where we determined EVERYONE in state political leadership had attended private school. The President of my school at the time came out of the Cal. system and had been in the B1G for much of his career. He said to me that this state was bizarre and ass backward when it came to support of public schools. It's a private school mentality; the height of idiocy.

 

[Ha Who]

If the State of Connecticut and the politicians want UConn to play in Hartford then they need find a solution to renovating the XL Center once and for all. Stop kicking the can down the road. It’s only going to get worse which is going to make these conversations even more difficult to have.

Also, to the state politicians and Hartford business leaders - stop thinking eight or so games at the XL Center is going to make Hartford. Find a way to incentive more businesses and corporations to move back Downtown which is the only way to create economic vitality. More jobs, more people will create more demand for other things (housing, retail, nightlife, etc.). It’s not going to happen any other way.

Well put. When I walk around the city during my lunch, It is depressing how empty it is other than the occasional guy who says, sir, sir, sir, and the smell of weed by the bus stops..

Find a way to incentive more businesses and corporations to move back Downtown which is the only way to create economic vitality. More jobs, more people will create more demand for other things (housing, retail, nightlife, etc.). It’s not going to happen any other way.

 

[HuskyHawk]

With you upright and breathing, the state’s ”dumbest person” is way out of her reach.


Bingo.

The governor‘s proposed budget is ruinous to the university. He has a thousand priorities…higher education in the state is not remotely close to being one of them.

The prez is 100% right to threaten Hartford. It’s a crap deal and we should walk from it - have fun operating that pile of garbage on third-rate hockey and PAW Patrol.

For those of us who were around and attended UConn before the big funding push around 2000, this feels like a return to the way it was. The attitude was always that they've got Fairfield, Sacred Heart, Trinity, Yale, Wesleyan etc. so why bother funding UConn.

I don't mind them forcing schools to trim the fat and pet projects, there is too much administrative bloat. But this is extreme. So she's right to threaten something worth a lot more to them than they realize.

 

[XLCenterFan]

"Super suburban" is an accurate description for most of the state, although some are rural. Hartford isn't a draw for most people.

“Super suburban” is also a mindset. All encompassing for the anti-city crowd.

 

[BIIIG]

You’re basing “things to do in Hartford” around one thing to do. Not smart. And something tells me you never venture into Hartford. And your argument is what? UConn shouldn’t play in Hartford because when there’s an away game there is nowhere to watch the game in Hartford?

Sorry I expect somewhere that hosts half of the home games the team plays to be a sort of hub for the team. Its totally excusable to be a capital city and have no downtown bars that are open and have the game on at noon on a weekend because checks notes...Parkville Market and the Bushnell exist, my bad, I was wrong

These Hartford bars and restaurants all rely on UConn basketball coming into town and providing them their busiest days of the year but do absolutely nothing to retain that business, nothing to keep that UConn support a part of Hartford. Host a game watch, have a post UConn Football game party, have one of coaches roadshows in Hartford, 10% of your meal with a ticket stub. If you want UConn to play half the games in Hartford, you have to make Hartford a Home for UConn. The fact that you deem it "Not Smart." to base my opinion on whether or not I think UConn should continue to go out of their way to play in Hartford on that factor, tells me more about your intellect than mine.

I'm fine with games being played at XL, I get it, its not my preference, but I get it. But the notion that Hartford has it going on, and any one who disagrees with you is "a snob who never goes into the city" is ridiculous.

 

[Fishy]

That’s a shame, because it made some sense and seemed relatively cost-effective. My assumption, and that’s all it was since there were never any interior renderings as far as I know, was that if you are installing an exterior concourse, a portion of the interior concourse could be used for seats.

For what it’s worth, Gampel is an iconic structure with the geodesic dome. Not that it ever produced the reported savings that a “modular” ceiling was supposed to produce, but it is unique. It would be a shame to see it taken down, in my opinion.

First, nothing is cost-effective on campus. Nothing. See Tuscano.

I don’t care what the thing looks like - the basketball facility on campus will always be iconic and there are designs that are less problematic than a dome.

But it doesn’t matter. There are no plans for anything past covering our eyes and pretending everything is fine forever.

 

[Kolumbo]

XL is in a death spiral. It’s truly no one’s fault - it’s just that the economic realities of that type of facility do not support major investment in it.

Think about it - anyone who went to concerts at HCC back in the day….check out the concerts that are held there now. They simply cannot book those acts anymore. The economics of the building do not make sense for the promotions so those concerts go elsewhere now.

So if you are a pragmatist and not an idealist, you understand that we need to move past XL in the very near term.

We also have an aging facility on campus that will be difficult to expand. There was one plan to bump out the concourse, but that’s a bandaid in a state that absolutely loves bandaids in place of solutions.

We need a mid-term plan to replace Gampel. We will come to that conclusion probably about a ten years too late.

Allen Fieldhouse 17k
Rupp Arena 20k
Dean Smith Center 22k

UConn would absolutely fill a 16k on campus facility. Think about the students. Sure, we all know that game day was a big party. There are many students though who do squeeze a game in between studying. They can't do that when the game is in Hartford.

You've got me convinced. Storrs or bust.

 

[HuskyHawk]

It’s 10,000 seats. We sold 15,000 the other night.

The concourse project is DOA.

Lord, you people and your “near term” bandaids.

How many of them need to fail before the lightbulb goes off?

It was a mistake the day they opened it. Needed to have higher capacity, fewer expensive frills like the tiles and aluminum dome. The focused too much on impractical things rather than a facility that could last and age and remain useful.

 

[BigTenFan]

How does Hartford Mayor fit into the equation? The University has a branch in the city -Would like to hear from Bronin on this

 

[huskymedic]

How does Hartford Mayor fit into the equation? The University has a branch in the city -Would like to hear from Bronin on this

He’s out… not running for re-election.

 

[Fishy]

It was a mistake the day they opened it. Needed to have higher capacity, fewer expensive frills like the tiles and aluminum dome. The focused too much on impractical things rather than a facility that could last and age and remain useful.

I disagree to an extent - the design was fine. It’s a geodesic dome on a concrete plinth. It’s not exactly exotic. Looks good, though.

The capacity was intentionally limited to protect Hartford. UConn cannot build a facility that threatens Hartford in any sense. See the new hockey facility which is a ludicrous 2,500 seats….it opened at 8,000 seats and we instantly needed to expand it. (It expanded twice…once by 2,000-ish seats and a second time for something like 140 seats.)

So it was not a mistake…it was intentional.

How does Hartford Mayor fit into the equation? The University has a branch in the city -Would like to hear from Bronin on this

Who cares what he thinks about anything? He doesn’t matter.

 

[kemba]

Neither more than 3, 4 tops in any given year. You’ve been shizzled. NO one in BigEast does what we do. Really no one in all of college basketball pays to play 1/2 their games and calls it “ home”

Yea. Except for the St. John’s breakdown I knew all that I just posed them as questions to him to be less rude lol

 

[kemba]

Let’s make the student section one sideline for XL games. We have a rabid student fan base that’s absolutely neutered by their hockey rink seats at XL.

Of course, I know this will never happen. But at least it might inject some life into the building.

I can’t imagine there is a worse student experience in the country than xl center. If you are in the risers you spend the whole game ducking your head around people so you can actually see unless you’re super tall. The risers right behind the band idk how people actually sit there. Then you got the regular seats there that are decent seats but probably equivalent to the front of the upper level at gampel. And the rest sit up in the 200s. If not sideline give them both lower levels behind the basket. I’ll still rip them for not showing up more but there’s lots of issues with it beyond just being off campus

 

[Fishy]

Allen Fieldhouse 17k
Rupp Arena 20k
Dean Smith Center 22k

UConn would absolutely fill a 16k on campus facility. Think about the students. Sure, we all know that game day was a big party. There are many students though who do squeeze a game in between studying. They can't do that when the game is in Hartford.

You've got me convinced. Storrs or bust.

Way back in the day, I actually had a conversation about this with Jeff Hathaway. I think Tim White, (Pudge…rest in peace), was with me and we had asked why UConn never considered a 15,000 seat on campus arena. The answer was something like, we could park 12,500 fans but it got dicey over that - so that number always felt right-size to me.

But this is entirely an unemotional argument. I don’t mind Hartford, but I know what it would cost to replace XL ($700M) or reno it ($250M) and I know those numbers are not doable. The facility will not generate revenue and the deal will just get worse for UConn.

On-campus is the future. Short-term, no problem…we have Gampel. Mid-term, what do we do to plan for the future given that Gampel is 30+ years old? If there is a magic bullet of a plan that gets 12,500 seats without simply shrinking the current seating, great. If there’s not, well, time to start planning.

 

[HuskyHawk]

I disagree to an extent - the design was fine. It’s a geodesic dome on a concrete plinth. It’s not exactly exotic. Looks good, though.

The capacity was intentionally limited to protect Hartford. UConn cannot build a facility that threatens Hartford in any sense. See the new hockey facility which is a ludicrous 2,500 seats….it opened at 8,000 seats and we instantly needed to expand it. (It expanded twice…once by 2,000-ish seats and a second time for something like 140 seats.)

So it was not a mistake…it was intentional.



Who cares what he thinks about anything? He doesn’t matter.

Yes, I know it was intentional, I was a student while it was being built. But it was still a mistake. Meaning an error. Concourse area around it was inadequate as well, not much foresight. UConn wasn't given a choice, just like with the hockey facility (which is also a mistake, and needed to be bigger).

 

[Kolumbo]

Yes, I know it was intentional, I was a student while it was being built. But it was still a mistake. Meaning an error. Concourse area around it was inadequate as well, not much foresight. UConn wasn't given a choice, just like with the hockey facility (which is also a mistake, and needed to be bigger).

The day a crane fell and bent in half over the top of the "plinth" was a sign. Like a "The Man With Two Brains" sign. Can't find a picture of it.

 

[August_West]

I can’t imagine there is a worse student experience in the country than xl center. If you are in the risers you spend the whole game ducking your head around people so you can actually see unless you’re super tall. The risers right behind the band idk how people actually sit there. Then you got the regular seats there that are decent seats but probably equivalent to the front of the upper level at gampel. And the rest sit up in the 200s. If not sideline give them both lower levels behind the basket. I’ll still rip them for not showing up more but there’s lots of issues with it beyond just being off campus

You nailed so much. My parents seats they are in same equivalent row at Gampel as they are at XL. Same relevance in location. But the XL seats have to be like 100 feet further from the court . The more I think about this and the more we all talk about it makes me want to play ZERO games at XL

 

[HuskyHawk]

Allen Fieldhouse 17k
Rupp Arena 20k
Dean Smith Center 22k

UConn would absolutely fill a 16k on campus facility. Think about the students. Sure, we all know that game day was a big party. There are many students though who do squeeze a game in between studying. They can't do that when the game is in Hartford.

You've got me convinced. Storrs or bust.

UConn has some disadvantages to those places. I'd go about 14k. I think 12.5 as @Fishy mentioned is below what we know we can sell for good opponents. 15k? Maybe. I think UConn would need to make other accommodations if they build such an arena. More parking. Improve 195. More restaurants or a major concourse with lots of food options. Maybe run shuttles from a lot at 195 and I-84. They'll need to be creative. It's what should happen though. I'm not convinced it should be where Gampel is either. That's now the densest area of campus.

 

[MrSec224]

Let’s make the student section one sideline for XL games. We have a rabid student fan base that’s absolutely neutered by their hockey rink seats at XL.

Of course, I know this will never happen. But at least it might inject some life into the building.

They dont send enough to warrant that, thats the problem. They fill the baseline section and the sections above it were pretty full for Nova, but not for Butler or Marquette.

 

[ConnHuskBask]

You’re bringing up a number that you have zero idea of its impact. That’s the point. I could speculate that more games at Gampel would create more alumni donations to the University because they’re on campus. It’s an easy enough thing to do, but without any data, it’s meaningless.

None of that changes the fact that unless games at the XL Center are sold out, the school loses money versus playing at Gampel on a per game basis.

A seat donation is part of the season ticket package what are you talking about it has nothing to do with ad hoc donations. As noted the lower bowl around mid court go for $800 a season. The donation goes down as the seats get worse obviously, but it's non zero. That's a big part of this picture that is ignored.

You're now switching the argument and moving goalposts. Nobody is arguing that they take home is less at the civic center than Gampel. My position is that the school isn't public with the full picture and that being in Hartford has other benefits that serve to benefit UConn.