FS1

[woomba]

The fox deal with the Big East is worth more than $4MM per school, not $4mm in total. And with Louisville and ND hoops, the ACC is likely over $20MM per school. UNC and FSU didn't stick around to make $5mm year less than they would have got in the Big 12 or Big 10.

ESPN already had any CUSA game they wanted.

Ah - you're right The $4.16M figure is per school. Messed up my columns on the spreadsheet.

Everything else should be correct though - the number with ND's addition was $260M annually, up from $238.4M. People keep talking about the $20M per school number but the signed contract says otherwise - there are certain conditions that will push the value of the ACC deal higher but I believe it's contingent on the ACC Network being launched.

UNC and FSU are being paid less they would be otherwise - they just decided to stick around regardless.

 

[billybud]

Ah - you're right The $4.16M figure is per school. Messed up my columns on the spreadsheet.

Everything else should be correct though - the number with ND's addition was $260M annually, up from $238.4M. People keep talking about the $20M per school number but the signed contract says otherwise - there are certain conditions that will push the value of the ACC deal higher but I believe it's contingent on the ACC Network being launched.

UNC and FSU are being paid less they would be otherwise - they just decided to stick around regardless.

When you get down to it, an extra $4-5 million in TV revenue is fairly meaningless to FSU compared to alumni footprint.

In a near $80 million athletic budget, having an extra $5 million in TV revenue is not any decider. It does not really make up for losses of tradition, chances to host pregame alumni events, to play in front of out of state FSU fans, and collect booster contributions. When folks were talking up FSU and the Big 12, they did not listen to FSU's President who stated that FSU did not have many alumni in Kansas, Iowa, Oklahoma, or west Texas (alumni are in Houston, Dallas and San Antonio). That FSU's out of state alumni were primarily
up the eastern seaboard.

Some folks will crow that FSU will never be able to compete with Florida if they do not join the Big 12, or Ten (pick a conference). If FSU got an additional $25 million per year in TV money to make it $45 million, FSU would still be pulling in tens of millions of dollars less than the Gators.

Florida is an older institution with wealthy contributors (they had a law school and med school when FSU had neither) and FSU has always had access to fewer athletic dollars. That will continue through my lifetime.

 

[upstater]

When you get down to it, an extra $4-5 million in TV revenue is fairly meaningless to FSU compared to alumni footprint.

In a near $80 million athletic budget, having an extra $5 million in TV revenue is not any decider. It does not really make up for losses of tradition, chances to host pregame alumni events, to play in front of out of state FSU fans, and collect booster contributions. When folks were talking up FSU and the Big 12, they did not listen to FSU's President who stated that FSU did not have many alumni in Kansas, Iowa, Oklahoma, or west Texas (alumni are in Houston, Dallas and San Antonio). That FSU's out of state alumni were primarily
up the eastern seaboard.

Some folks will crow that FSU will never be able to compete with Florida if they do not join the Big 12, or Ten (pick a conference). If FSU got an additional $25 million per year in TV money to make it $45 million, FSU would still be pulling in tens of millions of dollars less than the Gators.

Florida is an older institution with wealthy contributors (they had a law school and med school when FSU had neither) and FSU has always had access to fewer athletic dollars. That will continue through my lifetime.

It's kind of a surprise, isn't it, that FSU hasn't broken $80 million? I mean, UConn is at $65 million and it doesn't have a big conference TV contract paying it.

This probably says more about UConn and how it gouges ticket holders than anything else. Maybe UConn could have West Virginia fervor if it charged West Virginia prices.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

Ah - you're right The $4.16M figure is per school. Messed up my columns on the spreadsheet.

Everything else should be correct though - the number with ND's addition was $260M annually, up from $238.4M. People keep talking about the $20M per school number but the signed contract says otherwise - there are certain conditions that will push the value of the ACC deal higher but I believe it's contingent on the ACC Network being launched.

UNC and FSU are being paid less they would be otherwise - they just decided to stick around regardless.

The ACC held a gun to their own head and told ESPN to pay up, and ESPN did. The ACC will get paid for the ACC network no matter what form it takes. I don't need to show it in writing, we all know it is going to happen.

ESPN added 3 all sports programs, Pitt, Syracuse and Louisville, and one hoops only program, ND, to the ACC and lost one all sports program, Maryland. Maryland is obviously more valuable than the three teams that were added, otherwise the Big 10 would have added one of those other schools. In return for a net 2.5 schools with lower value per school than the one they lost, ESPN doubled the ACC TV contract. It will be awful hard for the ACC to prove damages in its case against Maryland.

At the same time, ESPN lost most of WVU, TCU and Rutgers, and all of the C7. The part of WVU, TCU and Rutgers they got, a few games a year, will cost them about the same as they would have paid those schools for their entire schedule if they had stayed in the Big East. Don't underestimate the loss of the C7+3. Those are big city programs that draw well and get good ratings in the part of the country where basketball is king. Losing those schools was a HUGE hit to ESPN's winter lineup.

For $175MM a year, ESPN could have signed the Big East to a long term deal and held the league together and gotten all of its TV content. Instead, ESPN declared war, will still end up paying an incremental $200+ million a year to the Big 10, Big 12 and ACC, and lose a ton of content to a direct competitor while destroying the athletic programs at three of the former Big East schools.

ESPN really screwed the pooch here, and unfortunately for us, with all the money that was getting sprayed around, UConn ended up as one of only three schools that was worse off after than before.

 

[woomba]

I don't think it's so clear cut - they may legitimately feel that they have enough NE exposure now that they have they have Syracuse, BC, Pitt, and UConn in their stable. The part that took them by surprise is that ACC took Louisville instead of UConn.

From ESPN's perspective UConn would've been preferable by far since Louisville doubles up on markets they already own and would've improved the BB product in the NE to the point that the loss of the C7 would've been irrelevant.

As for the ACC Network and the extra money related to it - Ill believe it when I see it. The ACC may be pointing a gun to ESPNs head but they know that it's holding blanks. ESPN already owns all of ACC inventory so there's no need to pay them more for it.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

ESPN has already paid up. The ACC had a 12 year contract and they got ESPN to reopen it and double the per team take. The ACC would not have signed the GOR unless the revenue from the ACC Network was in the bag.

ESPN thought they could pluck a few teams into the ACC and get the rest of the Big East to lock into a long term, low ball deal. It didn't quite work out the way ESPN hoped. ESPN lost a ton of content, and will be losing more to Fox over time. ESPN is the SEC, ACC, some Big 12 and Pac 12 games, and the Big 10 for a few more years. They have damaged the AAC so badly that UConn, Cincinnati and the others will be worthless by the time they are needed to fill in for the lost Big 10 and Pac 12 programming.

 

[woomba]

ESPN has already paid up. The ACC had a 12 year contract and they got ESPN to reopen it and double the per team take. The ACC would not have signed the GOR unless the revenue from the ACC Network was in the bag.

ESPN thought they could pluck a few teams into the ACC and get the rest of the Big East to lock into a long term, low ball deal. It didn't quite work out the way ESPN hoped. ESPN lost a ton of content, and will be losing more to Fox over time. ESPN is the SEC, ACC, some Big 12 and Pac 12 games, and the Big 10 for a few more years. They have damaged the AAC so badly that UConn, Cincinnati and the others will be worthless by the time they are needed to fill in for the lost Big 10 and Pac 12 programming.

The renegotiated ACC contract is worth a bit over $17M a year. The only thing ESPN promised was that they will look into the feasibility of the ACC Network.

They will potentially up the annual payment to each member school if they decide that the ACC Network isn't worth the hassle but no one knows the exact numbers - the most common number I've seen thrown around is $1.5M annually per school

 

[billybud]

The renegotiated ACC contract is worth a bit over $17M a year. The only thing ESPN promised was that they will look into the feasibility of the ACC Network.

They will potentially up the annual payment to each member school if they decide that the ACC Network isn't worth the hassle but no one knows the exact numbers - the most common number I've seen thrown around is $1.5M annually per school

I think that the 2013 renegotiation put the ACC payout up to $20 million per...

"Notre Dame signed the agreement, but its football television contract with NBC will remain in place.
As part of the agreement, ESPN has reportedly agreed to bump each team’s annual payout from $17 million to $20 million, as well as extending its contract with the league through 2027."

 

[woomba]

I think that the 2013 renegotiation put the ACC payout up to $20 million per...

"Notre Dame signed the agreement, but its football television contract with NBC will remain in place.
As part of the agreement, ESPN has reportedly agreed to bump each team’s annual payout from $17 million to $20 million, as well as extending its contract with the league through 2027."

I think I figured it out - the source I'm using(http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Journal/Issues/2013/05/06/Media/ACC-network.aspx), which is post GoR and ND additions, puts the average annual payment at $260M while mentioning that it can go up if certain conditions are met.

Originally I just divided that by 15 to arrive at the ~$17M number...however, that $17M is incorrect because ND has a separate FB contract with NBC so they won't take the full payout. At the same time ND will still take a small cut so it's not correct to divide that $260M by 14 either (which results in $18.5M coincidentally...probably how that $1.5M was derived from).

A reasonable estimate would be ND taking $14M less than a full member, which means that all full ACC members will average a bit over $18M + additional conditions that can push that higher.

Overall point still stands that the FSU and UNC kept money on the table - they just valued the ACC more than trying to pull a few more million by switching conferences.

 

[whaler11]

ESPN only up double digits since FS1 debuted. It's amazing how quickly the EPL chatter died once Gameday started.

 

[upstater]

ESPN only up double digits since FS1 debuted. It's amazing how quickly the EPL chatter died once Gameday started.

Uh, EPL is on NBC SN, not FS1. The EPL has been having great ratings still. The big game this week was on Saturday afternoon, not during Gameday..

 

[whaler11]

Uh, EPL is on NBC SN, not FS1. The EPL has been having great ratings still. The big game this week was on Saturday afternoon, not during Gameday..

Guy - I know what networks the games are on.

The ratings are up since FS1 debuted.

The EPL chatter has been much lower since Gameday kicked off. I haven't seen their ratings just commenting on the buzz from what I see on Twitter.

Those are two separate points.

 

[upstater]

Those are two separate points.

D'Oh? If you say so.

"ESPN only up double digits since FS1 debuted. It's amazing how quickly the EPL chatter died once Gameday started."

 

[whaler11]

D'Oh? If you say so.

"ESPN only up double digits since FS1 debuted. It's amazing how quickly the EPL chatter died once Gameday started."

Note the punctuation between the two sentences. Sorry I didn't add 'also' to spoonfeed it to you.

I've got posts in this thread giving high praise to NBC for the EPL coverage. I'm pretty sure I know what networks games are on.

 

[upstater]

Next time I'll just assume from the start that every succeeding sentence is a non sequitir.

 

[itgoeslike]

The above back and forth was the most entertainment I've gleaned from this site in days. . .

A victory over Michigan should turn things around.

 

[whaler11]

Next time I'll just assume from the start that every succeeding sentence is a non sequitir.

You should go read the Deadspin post today on aTm. Then come back and talk about how much money schools lose playing sports.