ESPN Top 10 Centers all time | The Boneyard

ESPN Top 10 Centers all time

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If blessed with good feet Big Bill would have been much closer to the top.
 
  • Hard to argue with that list of ten. I would rank them a little differently though.
Could Andre crack that list one day?
 
Huskybass said:
  • Hard to argue with that list of ten. I would rank them a little differently though.
Could Andre crack that list one day?
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In theory, as soon as people realize how ridiculous it is to be putting George Mikan on there.
 
It's almost absurd to think about this early in his career... but he has the tools. You'd have to think the bottom two or three (and I'm a huge Ewing fan) are vulnerable depending on the length of Andre's career and if he's on a playoff contender.
 
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IMind said:
It's almost absurd to think about this early in his career... but he has the tools. You'd have to think the bottom two or three (and I'm a huge Ewing fan) are vulnerable depending on the length of Andre's career and if he's on a playoff contender.
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I'll give you a Mikan b/c it's so hard to compare him since his era is so antiquated. But you really think Andre will go down as a better player than Patrick Ewing and Bill Walton? Those are two legendary players (a lot has to do with college) who were both underrated pros. Walton, never was really himself due to injuries. But nobody disagrees that he's one of the most talented all-around centers who have ever lived. Watching him, completely hobbled, on the 86 Celtics is amazing. And Ewing, for all his detractors, was a career 21-10-2.5 guy on some great teams that had the misfortune of going against some other all-time great teams/players (Pistons, Bulls, Hakeem). I really like Andre and I think he has great potential that is just being scratched, but I cannot imagine him ever having the legacy of Walton or Ewing.

Do we consider Boogie Cousins or Anthony Davis to be "centers"? If they are, both of them have the potential (especially if Cousins gets traded to a winner and stops being an idiot) of being guys who could be in a top 10 center positional ranking someday. Cousins was a 24-13 guy last year and is scoring even more this year. He's an idiot and can be a chucker, but he's as talented as anyone. And Davis is already a 20-10 guy at age 22 and is a better shotblocker and passer than AD. AD is the vastly superior rebounder, obviously.
 
boog204 said:
I'll give you a Mikan b/c it's so hard to compare him since his era is so antiquated. But you really think Andre will go down as a better player than Patrick Ewing and Bill Walton? Those are two legendary players (a lot has to do with college) who were both underrated pros. Walton, never was really himself due to injuries. But nobody disagrees that he's one of the most talented all-around centers who have ever lived. Watching him, completely hobbled, on the 86 Celtics is amazing. And Ewing, for all his detractors, was a career 21-10-2.5 guy on some great teams that had the misfortune of going against some other all-time great teams/players (Pistons, Bulls, Hakeem). I really like Andre and I think he has great potential that is just being scratched, but I cannot imagine him ever having the legacy of Walton or Ewing.

Do we consider Boogie Cousins or Anthony Davis to be "centers"? If they are, both of them have the potential (especially if Cousins gets traded to a winner and stops being an idiot) of being guys who could be in a top 10 center positional ranking someday. Cousins was a 24-13 guy last year and is scoring even more this year. He's an idiot and can be a chucker, but he's as talented as anyone. And Davis is already a 20-10 guy at age 22 and is a better shotblocker and passer than AD. AD is the vastly superior rebounder, obviously.
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Saying "he has the tools" and "the bottom two or three are vulnerable" is not the same as saying that Drummond WILL be better than any of those guys. But Mikan and Walton are both stretches on that list in the first place, since one was the only center in the league when he played, and the other barely played at all.
 
CallMeBruce said:
Saying "he has the tools" and "the bottom two or three are vulnerable" is not the same as saying that Drummond WILL be better than any of those guys. But Mikan and Walton are both stretches on that list in the first place, since one was the only center in the league when he played, and the other barely played at all.
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I guess even the "tools" aspect seems a bit far-fetched to me. I'm just not sure what Andre can become. He's as athletic a big man who has ever played, but I'd argue he's still not very "skilled" beyond rebounding; and that in itself has a lot to do with a combination of athleticism and effort. His obvious comp is Dwight Howard, a guy with similar athletic gifts, but petered out after a great start. A lot of that is due to Howard being a , but all that "rawness" and potential is often unrealized.

Walton and Ewing were two of the best offensive centers of all time. Ewing for his jump shooting and Walton for the all-around game. I agree that Walton's body of work (at least in the NBA) is incomplete, but everyone knows he was as talented a big men as any who ever lived. Unfortunately he was only really healthy in his prime for two seasons. In those two years he won a title and MVP and averaged around 18-14-4-3. Pretty sick.
 
boog204 said:
I guess even the "tools" aspect seems a bit far-fetched to me. I'm just not sure what Andre can become. He's as athletic a big man who has ever played, but I'd argue he's still not very "skilled" beyond rebounding; and that in itself has a lot to do with a combination of athleticism and effort. His obvious comp is Dwight Howard, a guy with similar athletic gifts, but petered out after a great start. A lot of that is due to Howard being a , but all that "rawness" and potential is often unrealized.

Walton and Ewing were two of the best offensive centers of all time. Ewing for his jump shooting and Walton for the all-around game. I agree that Walton's body of work (at least in the NBA) is incomplete, but everyone knows he was as talented a big men as any who ever lived. Unfortunately he was only really healthy in his prime for two seasons. In those two years he won a title and MVP and averaged around 18-14-4-3. Pretty sick.
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Andre is averaging about 18-15-2-1.5 as a 22 year old
 
I think I hit the nail on the head when I said, "depending on the length of Andre's career and if he's on a playoff contender." Walton was incredible, but he's vulnerable on longevity. Ewing is probably my all time favorite non-UConn NBA player... but he had the misfortune of being up against Jordan and Hakeem in their primes. So he'll always be unfairly vulnerable on these top 10 lists when it comes to titles. And I'm VERY skeptical that Andre can ever become the offensive player that Ewing became. What's crazy is Ewing at 22 was still at Georgetown.

The bottom three are really the only ones that even have an outside chance of being knocked down a peg. That's all.

I also did say the whole discussion was pretty absurd. :D
 
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UConn990411 said:
Lol at Wilt ahead of Russell.
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Not saying I'd move Russell ahead of Wilt (and not saying I wouldn't), but it's worth pointing out that Russell's "honors" are misleading because both the Finals MVP award and the All-Defense team weren't introduced until his final season in the NBA. He would have won a lot of hardware had those two honors been there for the taking during his career.

Generally, it's a pretty good list.
 
I loved Russell as a player. He redefined the position which gives him a place in history. But if Wilt was on the Celtics instead of Russ, they wouldn't have missed a beat.

As a player, Wilt was simply the most dominant player to ever play in the NBA at any position. And here's the kicker. The NBA protected guys like Michael Jordan and other later stars. In Wilt's day they let opponents try to beat the crap out of Wilt. He was shown absolutely no favoritism by the refs. The league even changed the rules to help the rest of the league deal with the guy.

A 20-year old Wilt Chamberlain would still absolutely destroy the current league.
 
Huskybass said:
  • Hard to argue with that list of ten. I would rank them a little differently though.
Could Andre crack that list one day?
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Either him or Davis, which is why it will become a rivalry between the two. But I would say this list is the hardest to crack of all the lists. Those guys listed are great for a reason. Its better to expect them cracking the top 50.
 
I was kind of surprised that Wilt was not #1. I only saw the twilight years of Kareem, but I always thought he was a pretty fixed #3 behind Wilt and Russell. Seems like Wilt was the absolute most dominant ever to play in pure #'s (he led the league in assists one year, too) and the fact that the rules were changed to try and level the playing field- similar to Kareem at UCLA.
 
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Wilt and Russell would have been my top 2, but maybe that's because they were just before my time and their legend was larger than Kareem's play that I witnessed.
 
Palatine said:
I loved Russell as a player. He redefined the position which gives him a place in history. But if Wilt was on the Celtics instead of Russ, they wouldn't have missed a beat.

As a player, Wilt was simply the most dominant player to ever play in the NBA at any position. And here's the kicker. The NBA protected guys like Michael Jordan and other later stars. In Wilt's day they let opponents try to beat the crap out of Wilt. He was shown absolutely no favoritism by the refs. The league even changed the rules to help the rest of the league deal with the guy.

A 20-year old Wilt Chamberlain would still absolutely destroy the current league.
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Basketball is a team game, chemistry means more in that sport than anywhere else. Wilt was notoriously a "me-first" guy, Russell was one of the best teammates ever. As a kicker, Russell was by far the best player on a team that beat Wilt, Oscar, West, and Baylor every single year.
 
PcketknfNiels said:
Basketball is a team game, chemistry means more in that sport than anywhere else. Wilt was notoriously a "me-first" guy, Russell was one of the best teammates ever. As a kicker, Russell was by far the best player on a team that beat Wilt, Oscar, West, and Baylor every single year.
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Wilt led the league in assists one year. Name me ONE other center who ever did that?
 
No gripes with the list. Russell was amazing but not as good as Wilt, Chamberlain is the most dominant force ever in the game, so dominant they changed the rules because of him. Basketball is a team game and Russell had loaded teams since the time he first stepped foot on the Celtics. Wonder where Sabonis would have been on the list if he came to the league as a young man, also wonder if Yao would have made it if his feet didn't destroy his career like they did Walton's.
 
superjohn said:
No gripes with the list. Russell was amazing but not as good as Wilt, Chamberlain is the most dominant force ever in the game, so dominant they changed the rules because of him. Basketball is a team game and Russell had loaded teams since the time he first stepped foot on the Celtics. Wonder where Sabonis would have been on the list if he came to the league as a young man, also wonder if Yao would have made it if his feet didn't destroy his career like they did Walton's.
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Wish we would have Sabonis in his prime as well, what an immense talent. To change sports, it's amazing in a similar vein what we were able to witness from Ichiro after he played 10 years in Japan. Guy is approaching 3000 hits starting at least 5 years later than most MLB players.
 
CallMeBruce said:
Wilt was a lot better than Russell. You have to play offense in the NBA, too.
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Sorry Bruce but the famed Celtic fast break normally originated with a Russell rebound and precise outlet pass,something Wilt never learned.
The outlet pass is critical to the offense.
The stereotype of Russell as one dimensional is due to ignorance of how the game is actually played.
 
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AZHuskiePop said:
Sorry Bruce but the famed Celtic fast break normally originated with a Russell rebound and precise outlet pass,something Wilt never learned.
The outlet pass is critical to the offense.
The stereotype of Russell as one dimensional is due to ignorance of how the game is actually played.
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He also had a bad field goal percentage for a post player
 
CardiacAndre7 said:
He also had a bad field goal percentage for a post player
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Agreed, 44% fg for a center isnt exactly great. He was a tremendous defender and rebounder and won championships routinely.
 
tentoes4rings said:
Wish we would have Sabonis in his prime as well, what an immense talent. To change sports, it's amazing in a similar vein what we were able to witness from Ichiro after he played 10 years in Japan. Guy is approaching 3000 hits starting at least 5 years later than most MLB players.
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Sabonis was fantastic. There's quite a few clips/games of him playing for the Soviets in the mid 80s and he was basically Walton. Passing, touch, dunking on ppl. Amazing basketball player. Even when he came to the NBA and could barely move, you could tell that he was just a better pure basketball player than most.
 
The three best centers of all time are shaq ,Olajuwon, and KAJ. In no particular order. You have to take into account level of competition pre aba merger... Really can't sit here and say wilt or Russell were better basketball players than dream
 
PcketknfNiels said:
Basketball is a team game, chemistry means more in that sport than anywhere else. Wilt was notoriously a "me-first" guy, Russell was one of the best teammates ever. As a kicker, Russell was by far the best player on a team that beat Wilt, Oscar, West, and Baylor every single year.
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Every time he stepped on the court Wilt was the best option for his team. It wasn't so much "me first" as he just flat out dominated.

Both Wilt and Russ averaged over 4 assists a game and over 20 rebounds a game for their careers. But Wilt scored 30 a game.

Russ had a slightly better high jump going 6'9" while Wilt's best high jump was 6'6". Both were amazing athletes.

Poor Russell had to play with Bob Cousy, Sam Jones, KC Jones, John Havlicek and Tommy Heinsohn. Poor guy.
 
James said:
The three best centers of all time are shaq ,Olajuwon, and KAJ. In no particular order. You have to take into account level of competition pre aba merger... Really can't sit here and say wilt or Russell were better basketball players than dream
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Yup and Babe Ruth, Willie Mays, Hank Aaron, Ted Williams, Lou Gehrig, Mickey Mantle and Joe DiMaggio are nowhere near as good as Ken Griffey Jr, Barry Bonds, Chipper Jones, Derek Jeter, A-Rod, Manny Ramirez and David Ortiz.
 
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