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East Coast Football Alliance

The inclusion of Delaware makes no sense outside of their stadium capacity. There are other, better CAA options north of Philadelphia.
 
Zissou said:
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This is an alliance of convenience for scheduling and TV negotiations. It wouldn't have been possible a few years ago as FCS to FBS moves had to be via a conference invite. Liberty changed that with their challenge to move directly to Independent.

This is 5 games in an Alliance schedule. The remaining 7 games would be open to schedule. It is a compromise to a full independent schedule. Either negotiate the Alliance winner into the PinStripe or create a new bowl for the Alliance winner.

Make a TV agreement with Fox, SNY,or YES.

Keep it at this size unless a desired program wants to join as they aren't happy with their own position. Think Temple, Navy, Cincy, Buffalo.

It's not a conference. It's an alliance of football independents.
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This only makes sense for UConn if it comes with a customary reduction in the FCS payout. Why would we limit our scheduling options further, for essentially no benefit?
 
ZooCougar said:
Stony Brook, UNH.
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I think there is room here for credible debate, but I'd lean UD. I think the have the tradition, spending, and the facilities to make a move.

Stony Brook is a newbie, but they could expand the stadium and they have potential. A SUNY program like Buffalo and Albany.

UNH, not so much imo. They would need to expand the stadium. Do they have a following?
 
A Pennsylvania football alliance would have the opportunity to confuse...

With..all playing current Div II football

Seton Hill
California University (of Pennsylvania)
Indiana University (of Pennsylvania)

Just as an aside, it was traditional for the announcer at home FSU games in the 70s-80s to announce the Slippery Rock score....the crowd cheered when the Rock had won or was ahead.

A funny following and tradition...but it died in the 90's.
 
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Zissou said:
I think the Big East is Basketball-first, and a MAC level independent would not threaten that philosophy.

Nova right now is in FCS purgatory. No one is sure what Nova wants, probably not even Nova.
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MAC is unlikely to re-visit some other school’s previously rejected push to participate as solely a gridiron member.

Inadvertently or otherwise, (mis)perceptions of potential purgatory alone likely bogart your suggested eastern alliance for UConn. More likely unless inexplicably proven absolutely impossible, UConn will laser-lock on some hybrid of a few P5, few AAC/MWC, few fellow Indepenendent, traditional other 1 Yankee/Atlantic 1-AA (+1 other as needed).

Time will tell ...
 
Zissou said:
The goal is to make the best of an independent schedule in a compromise.

An Indy schedule is attractive in that it gives you the freedom to schedule various P5 programs. It is also a burden to fill out 12 games.

This compromise puts 5 regional games on the schedule and leaves open 7 others. I’d think UConn might want to schedule Pitt, Cuse, Navy, WVU, Cincy, BYU, etc., but easier to get 7 a year than 12.

Notre Dame has a similar schedule model with the ACC.

For TV, the Alliance deal would probably be modest, but only a piece of each school’s revenue efforts on a partial schedule.

Northeast content for TV programmers.
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Da_Aisijimo_Gou said:
MAC is unlikely to re-visit some other school’s previously rejected push to participate as solely a gridiron member.

Inadvertently or otherwise, (mis)perceptions of potential purgatory alone likely bogart your suggested eastern alliance for UConn. More likely unless inexplicably proven absolutely impossible, UConn will laser-lock on some hybrid of a few P5, few AAC/MWC, few fellow Indepenendent, traditional other 1 Yankee/Atlantic 1-AA (+1 other as needed).

Time will tell ...
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Don't agree and posted on your main football board but could post it here.
Have different version for different audiences, but basically the same. You would still have the ability to play 3 P% or P6 teams and most likely a FCS team. Believe winning is important, along with access to bowl games and a championship game.

The MAC board is probably the best way to gauge their interest and there is some interest. Will quote the thread started on the csnbbs realignment board and then add a link to the thread on the MAC board.

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Think there is a shot, not sure how much, but will the MAC consider an option of adding UConn and UMass for about 10k-50k per university for additional BB inventory and some extra eyeballs on a canned rivalry. Will copy past something did early as on fumes right now.

Don't have faith that a New East Coast Conference will form and will have a media deal that is better than the current A10 5Mill given that the MAC got 10Mill due to their wiliness to play November mid weeks game on ESPN and CUSA got peanuts. It seems possible and now will give my take and will make a reference back to Bob McGovern's article. McGovern: UMass can't afford to be left behind again

Will support the dame the torpedo's all in push for the AAC with it's high gamble and seems unlikely IMHO. Feel it would be hard to compete in AAC Football and have to make huge capital commitments, which seems to be a stretch. My view is winning matters more than the conference.

Perhaps it's age related as I'm in my 60's now that prefer a more measured, conservative direction of keeping the A10 and make a hard push with UConn as FB only MAC additions that would require a far less than 50% share. It would give us a fairly tight division of:
  • UConn
  • UMass
  • Buffalo
  • Ohio
  • Miami
  • Akron
  • Kent St.
It would give the ability to compete for a conference championship and bowl access. Fits into Ryan Bamford's scheduling philosophy of 9 50-50 games, a P5 and FCS game and is financially responsible.

The MAC pitch in two parts, one is the rationale and second is being financially practical to the MAC and will link the thread so you can see everything in context.

PITCH:
This is not your older brother's, sister's or parent's football only add to get to an even number of teams, with the hope that they might join the MAC as full members, perhaps.

This is adding not one but two football teams, with bb games and taking in the end less than a 50% share. UMass and UConn are old football rivals that dates back to 1897. Two local flagships getting psyched to put one another down, cheer in their demise and want to kick their . You'd be bring in true football rivals that took a break when UConn jumped to FBS a dozen or so years before us.

Our administrations realize fan support starts at home and is added, not harmed by local rivals. We supported UConn's application to Hockey East and will support them now if things go as I hope. Have NO insider knowledge and been out of circulation, just my beliefs. We are a canned rivalry add that logically expands the MAC's markets and footprint, will minimal travel cost of this type of associate membership. This is different in the reduced flight risks. If the MAC lost a team, would think UMass would go all in, but fight tooth and nail to keep UConn football despite the unbalanced schedule. You might not like that, but that is how I'd see it.

We needed to chase the AAC dream and if it's not meant to be then become realistic. Do not think we burnt many bridges leaving, as we did not come along as fast as you'd hope and the pie got so big with CFP cash.

IMHO the AAC has some perils and the big one is that there just be Temple as the closest team, increased travel costs and even greater costs to keep up with the Jones, especially with the stadium's staged improvements. It'd be a better basketball league, but not that much better than the A10 right now and in the medium term. Both UConn and UMass costs has gone up. The A10 is more compact for sports than the AAC and the MAC is the most compact conference for football. It'd be great for us and where can a football only UConn go.

Closing with my opening statement, this is your conference, MAC and what matters to you is the right thing. My point of the canned rivalry is significantly different than ANY football add that you have experimented with. Think in the end of the day, we'd add some value to MACtion.

DOLLARS:
We are just fans posting our thoughts and will agree it will probably be closer to your ideas than mine. Like % and you like carve outs so will play. BruceMcF posted no TV revenue unless it's additive and only that extra amount else give the FB Only the home games and not much out of CFP money as well.

First of all, if we are paying dues, buy-in fees (perhaps ours is reduced since we have bought in once) we need a floor amount. That floor amount could be what independents get from the CFP. Even Indy get a piece. For all universities not named ND, that share is the number of Indy divided into 0.5%.

If TV is for home games, UMass will get the first home game against UConn as we have a lot of games to reschedule and pay for.

We should get the APR cut if our university earns it.

Regarding the performance pool, we should receive a cut if our ranking raises the MAC average.

If there is extra money for making the conference championship game and we make it, we should receive a cut.

Basically saying we need a floor amount, if we help the MAC or earn something, we should get a piece. After all, we are paying conference dues, playing in the league and adding BB inventory.
link: UConn joining Big East. Football...?
 
The idea of a scheduling alliance has appeal to independents and also to certain conference schools who like to play certain teams that fit a criteria on a regular basis. If UConn, Army, Navy, Temple, UMass, BC, Syracuse, Rutgers, etc worked out a scheduling alliance, that would benefit all involved. They do not have to schedule each other every year but this would help all involved.

I am not sure it plays into a TV contract per se, (not sure anyone would want that and if you are in a conference, I am sure you can't set up a new Tier 3 contract with other schools.
 
Real East Coast Alliance:

BC
Uconn
Syracuse
Rutgers
Penn State
Pittsburgh
UMD
West Virginia
VPI
Miami

Its sad to think that there was an outside chance something like this could have potentially come together decades ago. Who knows maybe a 90's FSU and USCe would have come aboard? Maybe ND and Navy would have been intrigued by the teams involved? Perhaps it would have grabbed Cincy and Temple, or UCF and USF? Plenty of reasonable expansion options out there over the years. Definitely a P5 worthy conference and one that would have commanded both eyeballs and dollars from TV. A real shame it's lost to hypothetical fantasy.
 
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billybud said:
A Pennsylvania football alliance would have the opportunity to confuse...

With..all playing current Div II football

Seton Hill
California University (of Pennsylvania)
Indiana University (of Pennsylvania)

Just as an aside, it was traditional for the announcer at home FSU games in the 70s-80s to announce the Slippery Rock score....the crowd cheered when the Rock had won or was ahead.

A funny following and tradition...but it died in the 90's.
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Did you ever see the Slippery Rock Rockets? I was at a CCSU game in the 1970's and the Rockets did a halftime show. Everyone stayed for a post game show.
 
Ldandy said:
Real East Coast Alliance:

BC
Uconn
Syracuse
Rutgers
Penn State
Pittsburgh
UMD
West Virginia
VPI
Miami

Its sad to think that there was an outside chance something like this could have potentially come together decades ago. Who knows maybe a 90's FSU and USCe would have come aboard? Maybe ND and Navy would have been intrigued by the teams involved? Perhaps it would have grabbed Cincy and Temple, or UCF and USF? Plenty of reasonable expansion options out there over the years. Definitely a P5 worthy conference and one that would have commanded both eyeballs and dollars from TV. A real shame it's lost to hypothetical fantasy.
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It almost happened. Penn State wanted in the BE but were not voted in.
 
Ldandy said:
Its sad to think that there was an outside chance something like this could have potentially come together decades ago.
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It would be sad to think about what UConn would have missed without the Big East forming.

In hoops the Big East provided UConn with TV exposure and competition to improve its program. It provided a platform for UConn to build a national brand and win 4 titles. It doesn’t happen without the Big East.

In football UConn doesn’t become FBS, especially with the rules of that era requiring a conference to invite a team up. UConn would not have been included in your dream conference if it was to form in the early 80s. UConn was 1AA.

The task at hand is to look forward. UConn basketball is again positioned to thrive in a top conference. The proposed Alliance can help make the best of an Independent football program.
 
Zissou said:
It would be sad to think about what UConn would have missed without the Big East forming.

In hoops the Big East provided UConn with TV exposure and competition to improve its program. It provided a platform for UConn to build a national brand and win 4 titles. It doesn’t happen without the Big East.

In football UConn doesn’t become FBS, especially with the rules of that era requiring a conference to invite a team up. UConn would not have been included in your dream conference if it was to form in the early 80s. UConn was 1AA.

The task at hand is to look forward. UConn basketball is again positioned to thrive in a top conference. The proposed Alliance can help make the best of an Independent football program.
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We are talking in hypotheticals either way you look at it. There is no way to know for certain how UConn would have fared in basketball or football had they been invited to bump up from 1AA to an all sports conference that was NOT The Big East in the early eighties. They may have won 10 Basketball Championships. There is no way to prove or disprove that. As for the alliance it is mostly nonsense as there is zero benefit for James Madison, Delaware, or Nova for that matter to incur the wildly high additional costs of playing FBS Football through additional scholarship allocation, full cost off attendance and offsetting scholarships on the women's side to satisfy Title 9. These programs are already where they should be. Maybe UConn joins them someday in FCS again, but there is no common sense reason for any of those schools to bump up to chase a media deal that would likely hover around 1-2 mil with potential production costs not even factored in.
 
Ldandy said:
Real East Coast Alliance:

BC
Uconn
Syracuse
Rutgers
Penn State
Pittsburgh
UMD
West Virginia
VPI
Miami

Its sad to think that there was an outside chance something like this could have potentially come together decades ago. Who knows maybe a 90's FSU and USCe would have come aboard? Maybe ND and Navy would have been intrigued by the teams involved? Perhaps it would have grabbed Cincy and Temple, or UCF and USF? Plenty of reasonable expansion options out there over the years. Definitely a P5 worthy conference and one that would have commanded both eyeballs and dollars from TV. A real shame it's lost to hypothetical fantasy.
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Switch out Maryland with Georgia Tech and add FSU; there was a real possibility of this happening back in the day
 
Ldandy said:
There is no way to know for certain how UConn would have fared in basketball or football had they been invited to bump up from 1AA to an all sports conference that was NOT The Big East in the early eighties. They may have won 10 Basketball Championships. There is no way to prove or disprove that.
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If you know the history, that’s a pretty silly take.

Ldandy said:
there is zero benefit for James Madison, Delaware, or Nova for that matter to incur the wildly high additional costs of playing FBS Football through additional scholarship allocation, full cost off attendance and offsetting scholarships on the women's side to satisfy Title 9.
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They already pay G5 level / MAC level expenses. There would not need to be wild increases in costs. They are already set with stadiums that are built and will be maintained regardless of a move. We wouldn’t be building any stadiums. This isn’t a commitment to spend like the P5.
 
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JMU and Delaware both play in stadiums that are sized for FBS. Nova's capacity does not meet minimum threshold for FBS (about 20% too small), so certainly there would be infrastructure costs there.

It's only a matter of time for JMU, IMHO. Maybe Nova, too.
 
Purple Stein said:
JMU and Delaware both play in stadiums that are sized for FBS. Nova's capacity does not meet minimum threshold for FBS (about 20% too small), so certainly there would be infrastructure costs there.

It's only a matter of time for JMU, IMHO. Maybe Nova, too.
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Check out the original post. 18,500 Talen Energy Stadium.

Plus the occasional game at the Linc (NFL Eagles).

It’s all built.
 
You're quoting a soccer capacity for a soccer specific stadium that has hosted football so infrequently that it doesn't even have a football seating chart. But if you want to argue there would be no infrastructure costs for 'Nova going FBS, be my guest.

As for the spirit of your post, if and when Nova or JMU go to FBS (both are possible), I'm sure UConn would attempt to schedule them regularly. It would make sense to be aligned with an FBS Nova in some way. As long as both are FCS, they aren't really any more attractive to schedule than Maine, URI, or any other CAA school.
 
Purple Stein said:
You're quoting a soccer capacity for a soccer specific stadium that has hosted football so infrequently that it doesn't even have a football seating chart. But if you want to argue there would be no infrastructure costs for 'Nova going FBS, be my guest.

As for the spirit of your post, if and when Nova or JMU go to FBS (both are possible), I'm sure UConn would attempt to schedule them regularly. It would make sense to be aligned with an FBS Nova in some way. As long as both are FCS, they aren't really any more attractive to schedule than Maine, URI, or any other CAA school.
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I agree any FCS program is not a schedule partner.

Nova and Delaware have played at Talen. Yes, it’s a stadium owned by the county with the primary tenant being MLS Phila Union, but it’s great for football. It’s not like trying to put a football field in a baseball stadium.

The key benefit is realized if the schools act together & make the moves with a ready made schedule.

Most FCS champs have moved up. JMU, Nova, and UD should align with UConn as independent FBS.
 
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UD, Nova, and JMU would not have to build stadiums.

They would just make better use of existing infrastructure.

They are also already paying MAC level costs so no wild increase is needed. $10M spending for "other than P5" should be the right amount.

(UConn should cut football costs and stay FBS. UConn needs a cost accounting - the spending is really high.)
 
Zissou said:
If you know the history, that’s a pretty silly take.

No it's a hypothetical. It can't really be proven true or false.


They already pay G5 level / MAC level expenses. There would not need to be wild increases in costs. They are already set with stadiums that are built and will be maintained regardless of a move. We wouldn’t be building any stadiums. This isn’t a commitment to spend like the P5.
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Well for starters each school would have to add 20 full scholarships each for both men's and women's athletics. Throw in larger football staffs, increased recruiting budgets, additional travel and it all adds up. The question is for what gain?

Villanova isn't Texas State or Georgia Southern that desperately needs FBS for university branding purposes. Nova has a brand as an urban liberal arts school with a strong basketball program. What material difference is there in playing James Madison or Army as an FBS Pogram as opposed to as an FCS one?

Are non engaged football fans suddenly going to care? At least in FCS Nova or JMU have something tangible that they can compete for. As an FBS Program the best they could ever aspire to is playing a 6-6 Middle Tennessee State in Birmingham, AL in the middle of December.
 
Ldandy said:
Well for starters each school would have to add 20 full scholarships each for both men's and women's athletics. Throw in larger football staffs, increased recruiting budgets, additional travel and it all adds up. The question is for what gain?

Villanova isn't Texas State or Georgia Southern that desperately needs FBS for university branding purposes. Nova has a brand as an urban liberal arts school with a strong basketball program. What material difference is there in playing James Madison or Army as an FBS Pogram as opposed to as an FCS one?

Are non engaged football fans suddenly going to care? At least in FCS Nova or JMU have something tangible that they can compete for. As an FBS Program the best they could ever aspire to is playing a 6-6 Middle Tennessee State in Birmingham, AL in the middle of December.
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As I stated, $10M for MAC level FBS is proven. There are not 'Bama aspirations here.

Temple is a Philly case. In my younger days Temple football took a back seat to Nova. Now it is a tight contest even with the FCS mismatch. Temple has successfully landed series with Notre Dame, Penn State and Maryland in succession. You might remember the Penn State trip to the Linc?!?

Notre Dame not only scheduled Temple, they scheduled UMass.

There is some room to grow.
 
Going to FBS to FCS increases expenses by eight-figures yearly.

Villanova loses over $20M annually on athletics - adding FBS football would mean losing $30-35M a year.

Reality is that everyone outside of the P5 is getting shelled by their football programs. I'm not sure why anyone would sign up for that these days.
 
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