Duke in freefall | Page 2 | The Boneyard

Duke in freefall

Status
Not open for further replies.
For me it would be Jeff walz, then Doug bruno and if not them it gets tricky. Lots of young good coaches I've never heard of but I'm also talking to Kara Lawson.

Don't see Walz leaving or Bruno. Not sure Lawson wants to be a coach.

Agreed that for Duke's sake, JPM has to go. But is the administration that concerned over what is happening?
 
From JPM post-game interview:

"It's very disappointing that we've got people with zero assists playing 30 minutes."

"It's amazing to me how easily we've been taken out of things."

"We're not focused....Some people are focused on themselves instead of what they can do for the team."

"It's really disappointing to not do what we're capable of doing. Our leadership has been very poor."

http://www.goduke.com/mediaPortal/player.dbml?&db_oem_id=4200&id=3742244
How about a lack of leadership at the top, starting with the head coach!
 
For me it would be Jeff walz, then Doug bruno and if not them it gets tricky. Lots of young good coaches I've never heard of but I'm also talking to Kara Lawson.
Every team in the world would Walz if they had an opening, but why would he ever leave Louisville? I think Ivey might be a good pick.
 
Niele Ivey would be a great coach for Duke or any high profile program. IMHO its no coincidence that with Ivey's arrival at ND, their recruiting is significantly improved and now the second best program in all of WBB.
 
.-.
I don't think JPM is a very good coach, but their biggest problem can be described in 2 words: Alexis Jones. Duke has very weak guard play. If Alexis were still there, healthy, and motivated to play for JPM, the Dukies would have 3-4 losses, not 9.
That seems to be the problem across the board with them. You can only kick 20 year olds when they are down so many times, before they either give up on you or turn on you...
 
From JPM post-game interview:

"It's very disappointing that we've got people with zero assists playing 30 minutes."

"It's amazing to me how easily we've been taken out of things."

"We're not focused....Some people are focused on themselves instead of what they can do for the team."

"It's really disappointing to not do what we're capable of doing. Our leadership has been very poor."

http://www.goduke.com/mediaPortal/player.dbml?&db_oem_id=4200&id=3742244

Als0 -

Poor leadership - two seniors on bench in foul trouble

Not looking forward to Sunday game vs UNC due to poor effort this game
 
I wonder if the transfer bug will strike again after the season concludes for the Blue Devils? Shame to think that way really but who wants to play in that situation.
 
Im sure this would be devastating for the Duke fans, but I would love to see the kids approach the administration en masse, it is either her or us. I say devastating to the fans because I still am not sure the Administration would make the right decision.
I feel so terrible for these young women (and for the fans of Duke), they deserve so much better.

I saw on the The Devils Den that a meeting was held to talk to, get feedback from, fans who were not renewing their season tickets. I wonder what the outcome of that was. My optimistic, glass half full self, wonders if Duke is gaining documentation for cause of termination, so they do not have to pay out her contract. Again though, given the appearance of lack of interest in the WBB program, I doubt it.
 
Last edited:
.-.
Gosh, its too easy to pick on Coach P these days..........Where is the AD? or the school President?...........Getting boo'd at home is bad...........
 
From JPM post-game interview:

"It's very disappointing that we've got people with zero assists playing 30 minutes."

"It's amazing to me how easily we've been taken out of things."

"We're not focused....Some people are focused on themselves instead of what they can do for the team."

"It's really disappointing to not do what we're capable of doing. Our leadership has been very poor."

http://www.goduke.com/mediaPortal/player.dbml?&db_oem_id=4200&id=3742244
The leadership starts with her; my guess is she probably hasn't thought one bit about that though.
 
Gosh, its too easy to pick on Coach P these days.....Where is the AD? or the school President?......Getting boo'd at home is bad......
High speculation on my part here, but I actually wonder if JPM fate at Duke has not already been decided by the administration and will be announced post season. I just don’t see how this recent relentless attacks on her own players could be ignored by the administration. The current players going to the administration may have very little effect because there is a built in penalty for a current student of having to sit out a year after transferring and let’s face it unless a Duke player transfers to Stanford they are going to be taking a step down in terms of the academic reputation of the school to which they transfer. Duke 2015 incoming class is quite a haul. It includes 5 players. The lowest rankedaccording to ESPN is Haley Gorecki- yes same Haley who had an offer from UCONN. Top of the Duke class is Salavadores. 3 (Lambert, Suggs, Primm) excellent players in between. If the administration makes a change before those players arrive on campus you might see some defections. Duke Administration can still play hardball and refuse to release them from NLI.
 
Look to Oregon State to see what happens when a good coach follows a poor one.
 
In the loss prior to this one to the Wolfpack I saw a demotivated Duke team, which is perfectly understandable. One of the Devil's Den regulars calls McCallie a narcissistic personality and she sure seems to fit the part of the definition about not caring about the feelings of others together with an inflated sense of one's own worth. She's cancerous but there is nothing but pessimism at the DD about her being given the boot.
 
.-.
Personally, I categorically do NOT indulge in any schadenfreude over the Duke situation. Unlike many others, I neither like nor dislike Coach P as a human being. I just think that she has proved herself, again and again, to be manifestly incompetent insofar as the development of talent is concerned. Clearly, she can recruit good players, although I think she is helped disproportionately in that effort by the name, the institution, the campus, etc. But still, pretty impressive talent lands on her doorstep, whatever the reason, and I'm sure she deserves a lot of the credit. Yet, from the time the players arrive until the time they graduate (or transfer out) it's virtually impossible to point to anything about her abilities as a head coach of a major program about which to be very laudatory...and failures in player development constitute only part of the story. She is one of the worst in-game coaches I've ever observed. Her stubborn refusal to make appropriate in-game adjustments, or, maybe more accurately, her inability to do so would frustrate me beyond measure if I were a Duke fan. All this makes her refusal to accept personal responsibility for her multiple failures especially galling. Duke will continue to be one of the "better" programs in WCBB because of its own allure for prospective players, but it ain't ever gettin' to the promised land with this woman as coach!
 
For me it would be Jeff walz, then Doug bruno and if not them it gets tricky. Lots of young good coaches I've never heard of but I'm also talking to Kara Lawson.
Forget Waltz he is not leaving Louisville and will be back in the final 4 in the next 2 years!
 
Personally, I categorically do NOT indulge in any schadenfreude over the Duke situation.
Schadenfreude-had to look that one up, good SAT word there. Luckily I inferred the right meaning from your post.
Schadenfreude: satisfaction or pleasure felt at someone else's misfortune.
 
It's hard to say with Coach P because I don't think she has done a good job of keeping Duke a national powerhouse, but a lot of it can be blamed on bad luck with injuries/transfers.

She took over in 2008 after Duke lost Bales/Harding, they were going to struggle regardless and still earned a #3 seed and made the Sweet 16. Not great by Duke standards, but not awful for first year.

In 2009, they had a solid season earning a #1 seed and lost to Michigan State.

In 2010, another good year with a last minute choke job against Baylor in the Elite 8, the closest they've been to a Final Four. Finished about on par for what most expected.

2011, they get romped by UCONN. I'd say they underachieved this year with Thomas/Thomas as seniors and a great freshman class.

2012 they have a young but talented lineup. They caught a tough break being arguably the 5th best team in the nation, where Baylor/UCONN/Notre Dame/Stanford were clearly 1-4.

2013 they lose Gray and match up in the Elite 8 as a 2 loss team with Notre Dame...still a solid season, can't blame P for that season.

2014 they lose Gray and Jones and fizzle in the 2nd round

2015 they lose Jones to injury and Calhoun to a midseason transfer. Still put together some good wins but are starting to tank.

There have been valid reasons almost every season for Duke's lack of success, but Duke has yet to overachieve under Coach P, and have done nothing to prove they can hang with elite teams, as they are consistently throttled by Connecticut and I don't think have any top 5 wins. They are a perennial Sweet 16 caliber squad but coming from GG who made Duke into a power house and consistent title threat, Duke has definitely taken a step down and with this coaching staff there are no signs that Duke will be a title contender.
 
It's hard to say with Coach P because I don't think she has done a good job of keeping Duke a national powerhouse, but a lot of it can be blamed on bad luck with injuries/transfers.

She took over in 2008 after Duke lost Bales/Harding, they were going to struggle regardless and still earned a #3 seed and made the Sweet 16. Not great by Duke standards, but not awful for first year.

Duke still had eight McDonald's All-Americans with McCallie arrived in Durham (Wanisha Smith, Chante Black, Abby Waner, Carrem Gay, Joy Cheek, Bridgette Mitchell, Krystal Thomas, Jasmine Thomas). Eight.

In 2009, they had a solid season earning a #1 seed and lost to Michigan State.

...in the second round.

In 2010, another good year with a last minute choke job against Baylor in the Elite 8, the closest they've been to a Final Four. Finished about on par for what most expected.

2011, they get romped by UCONN. I'd say they underachieved this year with Thomas/Thomas as seniors and a great freshman class.
2012 they have a young but talented lineup. They caught a tough break being arguably the 5th best team in the nation, where Baylor/UCONN/Notre Dame/Stanford were clearly 1-4.
2013 they lose Gray and match up in the Elite 8 as a 2 loss team with Notre Dame...still a solid season, can't blame P for that season.
2014 they lose Gray and Jones and fizzle in the 2nd round

Even with both Gray and Jones, Duke was getting walloped by UConn.

What you can blame Coach P for is the complete lack of adjustments. In two games against Notre Dame before the Irish joined the ACC, Duke had halftime leads. In one game, Duke was up 36-20 before losing 56-54 (on a neutral court). In the NCAA Tournament game, Duke was up by six at the half, before losing the second half by 17 points.

McCallie's biggest weakness is her failure to make in-game adjustments. Once good teams adapt to her coaching style and understand the schemes she is using, she is utterly helpless to make the necessary moves and counter-moves to lead Duke to victory.


There have been valid reasons almost every season for Duke's lack of success, but Duke has yet to overachieve under Coach P, and have done nothing to prove they can hang with elite teams, as they are consistently throttled by Connecticut and I don't think have any top 5 wins. They are a perennial Sweet 16 caliber squad but coming from GG who made Duke into a power house and consistent title threat, Duke has definitely taken a step down and with this coaching staff there are no signs that Duke will be a title contender.

Agree with this completely. McCallie's record against Top 5 opponents in her eight seasons at Duke is abysmal, especially when Duke has been ranked in the Top 5/Top 10 for most of those games. She is winning less than 22 percent of those games.
 
She's a manager (albeit a poor one at that), not a coach. Typical kiss up and down management style.
She probably won't go away cause this type papers their nest with powerful supporters that will back her till you know what freezes over. It's just hard to see a good program sink into mediocrity and obscurity. Oh yeah, not to mention the players she's impacting so negatively.
On the upside, there's alot of new teams on the up and up. Exciting coaches and players to match wits with going forward.
 
.-.
It's hard to say with Coach P because I don't think she has done a good job of keeping Duke a national powerhouse, but a lot of it can be blamed on bad luck with injuries/transfers.

Jones, Holland, Moore, Calhoun, at what point do you stop saying the transfers are bad luck?
 
New drinking game in Durham, NC….

Watch the presser after a Duke loss and do a shot every time McCallie denigrates her own team.

They're on track for a sixth-place finish in the ACC. No way they should host in the NCAA Tourney. (But you can bet they will!)
 
Jones, Holland, Moore, Calhoun, at what point do you stop saying the transfers are bad luck?
Off the top of my head, this is the only major year where transfers have hurt Duke. Injuries crushed Duke the previous two years where they had some really talented players go down.
 
Off the top of my head, this is the only major year where transfers have hurt Duke. Injuries crushed Duke the previous two years where they had some really talented players go down.
As an outsider, it seems really plausible to me that this is a snowball effect. Geno is very hard on his players sometimes, but constructively, with an important element of quid pro quo. If you are a highschool kid who wants to be an All American and win a National Championship, you know that his methods are proven. As that trust that the coach is doing what is best for you drops, so does your willingness to tough it out.

When McCallie is tough on her players, it doesn't seem constructive or productive and, frankly, at a distance at least it comes off as malicious (not letting players see their families because they lost, the infamous not-so-veiled tweets about players, etc.). As McCallie has now gone several years without meeting up to the expectations of fans, the program, or herself, it seems really easy to imagine that players are less willing to endure that. And, indeed, we're starting to see players who had the opportunity for a ton of playing time transfer away, something which is fairly rare in general.

Now that Duke is under performing even more-so this year, I can see the locker room dynamic getting even worse, and this can turn into a viscous circle which gets out of control really fast. For this reason, I think the (understandable) complaints about McCallie's Xs and Os are secondary to the fact that she doesn't seem to have the loyalty or trust of her players. It will be really telling if more players transfer at the end of this season.
 
Im sure this would be devastating for the Duke fans, but I would love to see the kids approach the administration en masse, it is either her or us. I say devastating to the fans because I still am not sure the Administration would make the right decision.
I feel so terrible for these young women (and for the fans of Duke), they deserve so much better.

I saw on the The Devils Den that a meeting was held to talk to, get feedback from, fans who were not renewing their season tickets. I wonder what the outcome of that was. My optimistic, glass half full self, wonders if Duke is gaining documentation for cause of termination, so they do not have to pay out her contract. Again though, given the appearance of lack of interest in the WBB program, I doubt it.
I have seen an entire team approach administration, demand change and get it. Of course that was a long time ago when the entire team wasn't on full athletic scholarships - which may impact their willingness to do something that drastic.
 
It's hard to say with Coach P because I don't think she has done a good job of keeping Duke a national powerhouse, but a lot of it can be blamed on bad luck with injuries/transfers.

She took over in 2008 after Duke lost Bales/Harding, they were going to struggle regardless and still earned a #3 seed and made the Sweet 16. Not great by Duke standards, but not awful for first year.

In 2009, they had a solid season earning a #1 seed and lost to Michigan State.

In 2010, another good year with a last minute choke job against Baylor in the Elite 8, the closest they've been to a Final Four. Finished about on par for what most expected.

2011, they get romped by UCONN. I'd say they underachieved this year with Thomas/Thomas as seniors and a great freshman class.

2012 they have a young but talented lineup. They caught a tough break being arguably the 5th best team in the nation, where Baylor/UCONN/Notre Dame/Stanford were clearly 1-4.

2013 they lose Gray and match up in the Elite 8 as a 2 loss team with Notre Dame...still a solid season, can't blame P for that season.

2014 they lose Gray and Jones and fizzle in the 2nd round

2015 they lose Jones to injury and Calhoun to a midseason transfer. Still put together some good wins but are starting to tank.

There have been valid reasons almost every season for Duke's lack of success, but Duke has yet to overachieve under Coach P, and have done nothing to prove they can hang with elite teams, as they are consistently throttled by Connecticut and I don't think have any top 5 wins. They are a perennial Sweet 16 caliber squad but coming from GG who made Duke into a power house and consistent title threat, Duke has definitely taken a step down and with this coaching staff there are no signs that Duke will be a title contender.[/Q
As an outsider, it seems really plausible to me that this is a snowball effect. Geno is very hard on his players sometimes, but constructively, with an important element of quid pro quo. If you are a highschool kid who wants to be an All American and win a National Championship, you know that his methods are proven. As that trust that the coach is doing what is best for you drops, so does your willingness to tough it out.

When McCallie is tough on her players, it doesn't seem constructive or productive and, frankly, at a distance at least it comes off as malicious (not letting players see their families because they lost, the infamous not-so-veiled tweets about players, etc.). As McCallie has now gone several years without meeting up to the expectations of fans, the program, or herself, it seems really easy to imagine that players are less willing to endure that. And, indeed, we're starting to see players who had the opportunity for a ton of playing time transfer away, something which is fairly rare in general.

Now that Duke is under performing even more-so this year, I can see the locker room dynamic getting even worse, and this can turn into a viscous circle which gets out of control really fast. For this reason, I think the (understandable) complaints about McCallie's Xs and Os are secondary to the fact that she doesn't seem to have the loyalty or trust of her players. It will be really telling if more players transfer at the end of this season.

which reminds me - while I have not heard the Calhoun transfer rationale, I can say that if I traveled to see my daughter play then was told I couldn't see her because they lost, I'd consider drastic action.
 
.-.
Status
Not open for further replies.

Forum statistics

Threads
168,059
Messages
4,551,417
Members
10,434
Latest member
DukeBlue


Top Bottom