Dog days of August..., so why not discuss KML height controversy...

[doggydaddy]

However, DD, as to your stated belief that KML is taller than Doty and Faris, in your eyes, I gather the bunny-gate photo must have been distressing to you for reasons other than that which provoked lots of hand wringing and teeth gnashing around here. I'm afraid there's a confounding height variable in that photo seen 'round the world that can only be set aside by assuming a difference in heels versus flats:

View attachment 3459

I know for a fact that KML wore flats and Doty wore heels. Big ones.

The only distress here is your theory that KML is 5'10".

You have helped fill the dog ads of August, but you certainly have no proved your point.

 

[doggydaddy]

I know for a fact that KML wore flats and Doty wore heels. Big ones.

The only distress here is your theory that KML is 5'10".

You have helped fill the dog ads of August, but you certainly have no proved your point.

There are some here that just like to take contrary points of view. Similar to your thoughts on the AAC being a good place to be, the KML height theory is a minority stance. Not that there is anything wrong with that.

I believe she is 5'11" and 1/2 inches tall. Unlike Hartley, who I believe is listed three inches shorter (now two since they changed it to 5'8") we are basically arguing about 1 1/2 inches.

Can't wait for the games to start.

 

[Icebear]

I think there are a lot of games being played right here.

 

[doggydaddy]

Oh joy! DD, now I get to illustrate for you the difference between being obvious on one hand (your ditty in prior post) and a true, honest to goodness nitpick on the other (what I will here illustrate):

You have stated, without hesitation that you believe Hartley is 5-10. The only thing that remains unclear is whether you base your belief on your "eyes" or on some other way of belief formation.

But, you have consistently listed Hartley as 5-9 in all of your usually, but not always accurate game analyses. I do not recall any instance where you listed Hartley at other than 5-9.

Yet, you here claim adherence to the belief she is 5-10. You could have posted your analyses with 5-10, but you did not. Who knows, perhaps if you had done so, UCONN wouldn't have list to ND 3 times, resulting in real grief around here.

I'll here do what I can to help you out. Here's a nice piece of 5-10 proof for you that relies solely on Baylor having correctly listed Sims as 5-8 (somewhat doubtful) and UCONN having correctly listed KML at 6-0 (also doubtful):

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Let me help you out. That is Massengale from Tennessee, not Sims. And she is listed at 5'7".

Base send on this picture, it's pretty clear to me that Hartley is 3 inches taller than her and KML is 1 1/2 to 2 inches taller than Hartley.

And your shot on my game analysis? Cheap shot. Really cheap. The post of someone losing an argument.

 

[jplotinus]

Let me help you out. That is Massengale from Tennessee, not Sims. And she is listed at 5'7".

Base send on this picture, it's pretty clear to me that Hartley is 3 inches taller than her and KML is 1 1/2 to 2 inches taller than Hartley.

And your shot on my game analysis? Cheap shot. Really cheap. The post of someone losing an argument.

No, DD, calling attention to you not posting what you "believe" is not a cheap shot. Rather, it was an invitation to think a little more deeply about the issue of height as it relates to basketball.

Height is usually an advantage in basketball. Generally speaking, taller is better. Thus, it may be said that to the extent height errors may occur, they will be on the side of over, rather than under-stating height.

Let me know if you agree or disagree.

In any event, it can be assumed, since you refused to address the issue other than to claim victim status resulting from crying "cheap shot", that your reason for listing Hartley at 5-9 instead of 5-10, which you said you believe her to be, is that a 3 inch departure from her UCONN listed height was simply too great a deviation. It may well be that height list antics are a part of the game.

That, at least, is my claim. I'm sticking with it.

Thanks for the Massengale correction. I appreciate it.

However, for as much as that may have helped me, I think it hurt you.

By virtue of that photo, if Massengale is 5-7, then KML is, indeed, 5-10.

 

[calpedaler]

msf22b and jplotinus ...posters separated at birth.

 

[jplotinus]

More help for DD:

So, KML wore flats in the White House. I do not have photo confirmation of the claim Doty wore very big heels (I.e. high enough to turn a 2" height deficit into a 3" height advantage) could not be independently confirmed via photo.

 

[calpedaler]

More help for DD:

View attachment 3460

So, KML wore flats in the White House. I do not have photo confirmation of the claim Doty wore very big heels (I.e. high enough to turn a 2" height deficit into a 3" height advantage) could not be independently confirmed via photo.

Nice picture, but how does it help your premise?

 

[RadyLady]

Well, DD, nitpicks are a good way to have fun; hyper-accuracy in the way something is expressed is cool, but I'm not sure your comment is either nit or hyper. It rather looks more like an attempt to complicate the obvious. Less fun is had when someone does that, don't you think? :-o

It rather looks as though you are baiting...and this tactic just makes these dog days much longer.
Bad form, bad dog - needs a time out in his crate

 

[jplotinus]

It rather looks as though you are baiting...and this tactic just makes these dog days much longer.
Bad form, bad dog - needs a time out in his crate

I am not a bad dog

 

[RadyLady]

I am not a bad dog
View attachment 3461

we will have to agree to disagree

 

[doggydaddy]

Well, DD, nitpicks are a good way to have fun; hyper-accuracy in the way something is expressed is cool, but I'm not sure your comment is either nit or hyper. It rather looks more like an attempt to complicate the obvious. Less fun is had when someone does that, don't you think? :-o

Nope. Just pointing out what you said. You think KML is under 6' tall, so you left her off on purpose.

Nice try though.

 

[doggydaddy]

More help for DD:

View attachment 3460

So, KML wore flats in the White House. I do not have photo confirmation of the claim Doty wore very big heels (I.e. high enough to turn a 2" height deficit into a 3" height advantage) could not be independently confirmed via photo.

Looks to me that if Stewart is 6'4" KML looks around 6'. Thanks.

 

[meyers7]

In any event, it can be assumed, since you refused to address the issue other than to claim victim status resulting from crying "cheap shot", that your reason for listing Hartley at 5-9 instead of 5-10, which you said you believe her to be, is that a 3 inch departure from her UCONN listed height was simply too great a deviation. It may well be that height list antics are a part of the game.

IIRC, and I usually do, I believe DD in one of his game previews said he put Hartley at 5-9 because he believed her to be 5-10 and he had seen her listed at 5-8 (now) and he was just going to split the difference. So really your whole Hartley argument is mute.

And your other argument (KML not 6-0) is pretty mute based on all the pictures you have posted.

 

[doggydaddy]

No, DD, calling attention to you not posting what you "believe" is not a cheap shot. Rather, it was an invitation to think a little more deeply about the issue of height as it relates to basketball.

Height is usually an advantage in basketball. Generally speaking, taller is better. Thus, it may be said that to the extent height errors may occur, they will be on the side of over, rather than under-stating height.

Let me know if you agree or disagree.

In any event, it can be assumed, since you refused to address the issue other than to claim victim status resulting from crying "cheap shot", that your reason for listing Hartley at 5-9 instead of 5-10, which you said you believe her to be, is that a 3 inch departure from her UCONN listed height was simply too great a deviation. It may well be that height list antics are a part of the game.

That, at least, is my claim. I'm sticking with it.

Thanks for the Massengale correction. I appreciate it.

However, for as much as that may have helped me, I think it hurt you.

By virtue of that photo, if Massengale is 5-7, then KML is, indeed, 5-10.

Pictures don't always tell the story, but this does a nice job of it. Hartley towers over Massengale. Clearly a good 3 inches. And KML towers over the 5'7" Ellenburg. Clearly a good 5 inches.

All the team photos show clearly their height. Much clearer than the two lineup photos taken from bad angles with the supposition that they are in height order.

It's clear this has become more about you than KML and Hartley's height. For some reason you decided to make it personal. The cheap shot was clear - "not always accurate game analyses". I put myself out there every big game. Sometimes I'm right, sometimes not. And I deal with all that point it out. But your comment was not appreciate or necessary. Feel free to not read them or comment on them in the future.

 

[doggydaddy]

IIRC, and I usually do, I believe DD in one of his game previews said he put Hartley at 5-9 because he believed her to be 5-10 and he had seen her listed at 5-8 (now) and he was just going to split the difference. So really your whole Hartley argument is mute.

And your other argument (KML not 6-0) is pretty mute based on all the pictures you have posted.

You have pretty much nailed it.

 

[jplotinus]

Pictures don't always tell the story, but this does a nice job of it. Hartley towers over Massengale. Clearly a good 3 inches. And KML towers over the 5'7" Ellenburg. Clearly a good 5 inches.

All the team photos show clearly their height. Much clearer than the two lineup photos taken from bad angles with the supposition that they are in height order.

It's clear this has become more about you than KML and Hartley's height. For some reason you decided to make it personal. The cheap shot was clear - "not always accurate game analyses". I put myself out there every big game. Sometimes I'm right, sometimes not. And I deal with all that point it out. But your comment was not appreciate or necessary. Feel free to not read them or comment on them in the future.

DD, I need here to double check for accuracy of understanding. Are you claiming victim status based on my comment about your game analyses? If so, your claim is strained well beyond what reason will allow. I complimented your game analyses with a phrase that you have either taken out of context or misapprehended. Permit me to suggest you re-read it.

Striving for deeper meaning, searching out nuance and so on are fine. However, if you want to exchange on the basis of deepeming the inquiry, the better way to do so is to double check for accuracy of understanding, rather than put forth an assumption, and then argue with your own assumption, that in so doing, misses the point entirely.

I've said more than once, basketball is a game where height confers an advantage. Interest in the height of basketball players has been interesting for me over the years as average heights for women and men basketball players appears to me to have increased. I've mentioned this.

So, on a personal level, yes, I find some enjoyment in discussing player height. Beyond that, when I attend games I engage in height comparison. When I review roster stats, I pay attention to the height factor.

That is how I like to roll.

In your last photo, who, if you know, is standing to the left, as you look at the photo, of KML?

Thanks in advance.

 

[VAMike23]

 

[jplotinus]

Looks to me that if Stewart is 6'4" KML looks around 6'. Thanks.

Some might say 5-10 is around 6-0. In fact, in a context other than basketball, I'd say a 5-10 female is around 6-0. I would also consider a 5-10 female as being unusually tall. I've seen it claimed the average height of an American woman at present is 5-4 (5-10 ave. man). So, yes, in that sense, I agree, KML is a tall person, around 6-0. But in basketball terms, she is 5-10.

 

[trisailin]

I've said more than once, basketball is a game where height confers an advantage.

And I would argue that height without other skills is useless.
It's quite telling to me that Muggsy Bogues, Spud Web and several others have successfully played the game at the highest level. Height alone does NOT confer an advantage.

 

[jplotinus]

And I would argue that height without other skills is useless.
It's quite telling to me that Muggsy Bogues, Spud Web and several others have successfully played the game at the highest level. Height alone does NOT confer an advantage.

Ok, so far as it goes. However, your reference to exceptions may serve more as proof of the rule.

I can give you what I think is an equally intriguing NBA example and one that I think comes closer to matching KML's circumstances; namely:

CHARLES BARKLEY

Throughout college (Auburn, I think), he played the 5 and was listed at 6-6. In the NBA he played a lot at the 4. I recall seeing his correct height listed as 6-4-7/8. Or, an under 6-5 power forward where NBA 4s average a good 6-8, with many being taller and with most being at least 6-7.

What Barkley lacked in height, he made up in weight and in strength. He could hold his own and out rebound taller ayers based on what DD refers to as posterior positioning. I agree that is a suitable phrase for BY etiquette purposes. I'm guesding that the men's board, or on the playground in the hood, a different phrase or two might be more suitable. But I digress.

It might be that KML who was listed at 185lbs in the wug roster can play the 4 with the best of them despite being under 6-0.

Peace in the valley?

 

[meyers7]

You have pretty much nailed it.

Hammer time.

 

[trisailin]

It might be that KML who was listed at 185lbs in the wug roster can play the 4 with the best of them despite being under 6-0.

Since you don't believe the 6', why on earth would you believe the 185?

 

[doggydaddy]

Since you don't believe the 6', why on earth would you believe the 185?

Plotsie, when a poster like trisailin questions you, you should think twice about your position. Trisailin has more likes than posts.

That's like a 5-1 assist/to ration. Amazing.

 

[ChicagoGG]

I am not a bad dog
View attachment 3461

Maybe not, but you sure are gnawing at this bone you two are picking....