Darko Muhl tweet
- Thread starter HuskyNan
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HuskyNan
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Sure, MJ the player feels that way but I believe Mr Muhl is talking to the fans. As the father of a player, he sees the criticism and has a different perspective than the fans
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I agree. I hate when fans talk about how Uconn hasn't won since 2016. And that making the final 4 isn't good enough. Giannis brought up MJ which is why I said that
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Every year is its own unique situation so yes you could have won several previous championships and still would be considered a "failure" the way the Bucks lost to the 8th seed Heats and Giannis shooting 10-23 at the FT line has a lot to do with it. Would Uconn's season be considered a success if they were bounced out of the first round by a 16th seed?
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Defining the success or failure of a season by only what happened the last game, IMO is not a valid appraisal. Take the 2016-17 Huskies' season. At the end of 2015-16 we had completed a four-pete and sent the top three draftees off to the WNBA. Yet that next season's squad, while facing and surviving many challenges, miraculously extended the record setting win streak to 111 games before falling to Mississippi State on a buzzer beating prayer to be eliminated in the final four. Is it fair to characterize that season as a failure? No. Is it fair to believe if that shot hadn't fallen Uconn would have (should have) added a fifth title to the string and ended the season with a 113 game winning streak alive. Yes ( SC fans may disagree but Uconn fans and many others would have given Uconn the edge on getting the W had that game happened).
This past season, what would have happened if we had an answer for tOSU press? Would we have fallen in the next game? What would have happened in the championship game if we had a rematch against Iowa with a full roster including a healthy Dorka? Should our season be accessed solely on arguably the worst game we played all year? Was Iowa's season a failure because they lost to LSU? Disappointment and what could have/should have been regrets are legitimate reactions but IMO its not valid to define the success or failure of a season solely by what happened in the last 40 minutes.
This past season, what would have happened if we had an answer for tOSU press? Would we have fallen in the next game? What would have happened in the championship game if we had a rematch against Iowa with a full roster including a healthy Dorka? Should our season be accessed solely on arguably the worst game we played all year? Was Iowa's season a failure because they lost to LSU? Disappointment and what could have/should have been regrets are legitimate reactions but IMO its not valid to define the success or failure of a season solely by what happened in the last 40 minutes.
Yes it was a failure because the bucks were a team that could have won it all. Next year a lot of their pieces can be playing elsewhere. Opportunities at something so hard to accomplish are seldom and may never present itself again for the freak. His life is great so in the big picture it’s no big deal, but from a basketball standpoint from the perspective of his team, it was a failure and if anyone on that team says otherwise, they are not telling the truth.
Fans sometimes describe disappointment as failure. At times the team played as good as anyone and at others they were just a very good team. Their margin of error though was razor thin and no team plays their best game every time out. But for some reason we as fans seem to think that expectation is rational and attempt to explain how we would have been better.
I enjoyed watching UCONN this season and thought they did some extraordinary things along the way. I think next year you will see how those things will translate into a fantastic, hungry team.
I enjoyed watching UCONN this season and thought they did some extraordinary things along the way. I think next year you will see how those things will translate into a fantastic, hungry team.
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As a Yankee fan (take it easy Bostonians) I do get where some people are coming from with the win it all or it isn't a good season talk. You just get used to winning all the time championships all the time and when it does not happen, fans are sometimes angry beyond belief. What people have to realize is the amount of obstacles that a team has to overcome to constantly win championships. This year's UConn wbb team is a prime example of that. Lets all breathe and find joy in the moments that our players had this season. Thats where the success lies.
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Don’t forget Giannis missed (I believe) 2 1/2 games in that series.
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And the Previous season, with Paige's dramatic return from surgery, making the finals was quite a climb. The final score ( vs. South Carolina) smudged most of that good effort into the background.
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Giannis' speech was eloquent and respectful to the reporter, and I appreciate his calm resolve. His statement has tremendous application to Little Leaguers, T-ball, high school and some college athletes. However, what he said about there being no failure in sports for an NBA professional team, an NBA player who makes about $40 million a year is absolutely absurd. He is in a highly competitive business where there is indeed success and failure! Everyone doesn't get a ribbon for competing.
Like any multi-million dollar for profit company, I'm sure the Milwaukee Bucks have annual goals and metrics that they hoped to meet and losing in the first round surely, was not one of them. As a result of this failure to meet a significant metric, people might well lose their jobs, including their head coach.
True, Jordan did not win a championship in all of his 15 seasons, but after he win his first, there was only one season afterwards with the Bulls that he didn't win the championship. As Jordan would say, it wasn't the thrill of victory that motivated him, it was more the agony of defeat... And Jordan definitely saw failure in defeat, particularly if you were the No. 1 seed with the best record and you get knocked in the first round by an 8 seed....
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Huskynan and Darko are right on to endorse Giannis' observations about what constitutes failure. The reality of human existence is persistent disappointment. The crucial issue is not how you characterize such disappointment. Rather it is how you grow as a result of enduring that disappointment. It is so easy to judge the disappointments of others as failures. Respectfully, I suggest that, before making such a harsh judgment, tchalla 1 take a hard look in his or her mirror.
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He was injured and missed a few games. Should he feel extra bad for that?
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Yes, I am being so harsh on poor, poor Giannis who is preparing this offseason to begin renegotiating his $40 million a year, seven-year contract. Coincidentally, Giannis said prior to this year that his goal was to bring back a championship to the Bucks. So if you set a goal and you do not reach it, is that not failure?--or do you have a nicey nice word for this? He failed to reach his goal. Doesn't make him a bad guy, but he failed. Or what do you call not reaching a set goal?
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If I don’t learn from situations, then that is failing. Other than that, failing doesn’t exist. – Kobe Bryant (paraphrased).
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Of course his goal is a championship. In sports, the ring is everybody's goal before the season starts. I don't think anybody would say that FAU not winning the NCAA championship is a failure, but to those guys immeaditely after they lost, I'm sure it felt like failure. A few years back when the expansion Golden Knight made it to the Stanley Cup finals and lost, I'm sure it felt like failure in the locker room after game 5. However, I don't know anyone who would call what they did a failure.
Giannis answered in the moment, with it still raw. But he remained poised and classy throughout. The more I see this man off the court, the more I respect him. He seems incredibly smart, honest and very thoughtful. In the end, failure is an opinion often offered up by people removed by the moment by distance or time or both.
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Even if anyone does consider this season a “failure”, remember what Geno said before the 2016-17 season. Failures can lead to better things in the long run.
Personally, I don’t think this season was a failure. It forced some players to step up and they did so magnificently. Instead, I’d say this season was a testament to being “tough” in the face of adversity. Only 16 teams out of 300+ make it to the sweet 16 and UConn was still one of them despite the grind this season was for them. I’m beyond proud of every UConn player this season!
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I completely agree with all your examples--however, did I not say what Giannis said is viable for amateur sports? And also it is for an expansion pro team, but not for the Bucks who are a veteran NBA team who won the championship two years ago,
The Bucks and Giannis set as their goal this year to win the NBA championship--they set this as their goal, not me--so what do you call not achieving your set goal? If you don't think this is failure, then was their winning the championship a success? You can't have a success without not reaching success being called failure.
i would suggest you that pose this question to the Bucks GM or owner(s) --ask them what they consider this year's #1 seed, 4-1 loss to an 8th seed--something which has happened only 4 times in NBA history--whether this season was a failure...
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This is a lovely, subjective euphemistic definition of "success" and works OK for non-measurable goals and metrics. However since they do keep score in NBA games and wins and losses as well, it is not largely applicable to pro sports.
I know a lot of enthusiastic coaches and players who lose their jobs for not winning.
This is a lovely bromide for Little League and T-ball, but not the NBA...
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I give--you guys are making assessment without reading or perhaps comprehending. I said Giannis's statement on failure perhaps is applicable to amateur sports....
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Not sure why you quoted my post. I did not read, nor was my post in reference to, your post(s). My post was about the use of “failure” as this terrible thing when even Geno has said “failure” has its upsides. The second half of my post was about my personal views of this season and how I didn’t think the term “failure” applied to this season despite UConn’s lofty standards.
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Agree 100%. Like I tell my Academic Teams, "You can learn a lot more from a loss than you can from "accidentally" winning." Our first competition this year was against teams with multiple champions the previous year in a 13 team invitational, and came out with two third place finishes from six teams. Although our teams were experienced with four teams to State Finals the previous year, we lost five of six Captains to graduation. The lesson I believe was, "be humble in winning and losing."
We have State Finals in Academic Super Bowl on Saturday, 5/6/23, and we are bringing four teams: Math, Science, English, and Interdisciplinary (which means Fine Arts and Social Studies are still in "the play.") I believe the lesson was learned from the 1st competition...
Carnac
That venerable sage from the west
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It’s easy for fans of teams that consistently win to become complacent and expect the trend to continue every year without fail. I believe you are correct about the various obstacles that teams have to negotiate successfully to win. It’s interesting to me to read comments from fans that think it’s inconceivable that another team could possibly have better players or a better season than UConn could.
The last 7 years have proven beyond a doubt that parity has arrived in WCBB. Since UConn's unprecedented run of 4 consecutive championships from 2013-2016, only South Carolina has won the national championship more than once. LSU lost more games than SC did this past season, but none of the LSU fans considered it a failure, why? Because this was their year. They got it done. It's not going to be your year every year.
Like it or not. Accept it or not, but UConn had obstacles placed in front of them this past season they just couldn't overcome. Obstacles that other teams didn't have. It doesn't mean their season was a failure. It means it wasn't their year and other teams had more success.
I'm not suggesting for a moment that we should not expect to win a championship every year, but that if we don’t, it may be because other teams have players as good as ours.
There are a lot of very good and highly skilled players in D1 WCBB. All of them are not on the same team. All you can do is recruit the best players you can, coach them up as best you can, then compete as hard and consistently as possible, and hope for the best.
Some days your best will be good enough, some days it won’t. That’s life. It doesn’t mean we throw our team under the bus when they lose. Few teams go undefeated all year. South Carolina came close but stumbled at the end, and came up empty. How many times has Geno said how hard it is to win a championship?