Dallas Wings, part 2

[jdote33]

40% closes Chicago 25% Yeah, not odds but best I can do.

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Thanks for posting this. I didn't realize that Dallas was sorta guaranteed a top 3 pick. While it's not 3 To See level, I do like the presumed top 4 picks (Azzi, Lauren betts, Awa Fam, Olivia Miles). I also really like Taniya Latson and kinda think she would also be a good fit next to Paige. I know she's a bit on the small end but she seems to be a really good athlete. If Kelsey Plum can get by at that size perhaps she can too.
I feel like Big Mama Stef would be a great fit in Dallas. But right now they are losing games by 20 plus. I can't lie, I'm a bit concerned. It's ok that it may take time to make the playoffs. I think DT literally missed the playoffs her first 3 years. But they haven't been competitive in a lot of games. Paige has kinda talked in post games about building a foundation, but as noted the team can look 90 percent different. Idk if pros is like college in that sense.

 

[RockyMTblue2]

Thanks for posting this. I didn't realize that Dallas was sorta guaranteed a top 3 pick. While it's not 3 To See level, I do like the presumed top 4 picks (Azzi, Lauren betts, Awa Fam, Olivia Miles). I also really like Taniya Latson and kinda think she would also be a good fit next to Paige. I know she's a bit on the small end but she seems to be a really good athlete. If Kelsey Plum can get by at that size perhaps she can too.
I feel like Big Mama Stef would be a great fit in Dallas. But right now they are losing games by 20 plus. I can't lie, I'm a bit concerned. It's ok that it may take time to make the playoffs. I think DT literally missed the playoffs her first 3 years. But they haven't been competitive in a lot of games. Paige has kinda talked in post games about building a foundation, but as noted the team can look 90 percent different. Idk if pros is like college in that sense.

Don't worry, rest assured can take those odds and blown it. I'm convinced no one in the Dallas organization knows how to fit a team together. On Kelsey, one of my least favorite ball players but she makes it work. She's super tough and gives 100% pretty much all the time.

 

[WFFL]

If "team style of play" is important to you, why would you draft Lauren Betts? She makes Kara Wolters look like Nikola Jokic.

PREACCCH ive been trying to get this point across lol Get rid of McCowan to bring in McCowan Jr ? WTF LOL

 

[jdote33]

If "team style of play" is important to you, why would you draft Lauren Betts? She makes Kara Wolters look like Nikola Jokic.

It's interesting to see this. I get things wrong all the time, but I always think the opposite of Betts. Jana did a great job on her but she had 25 on 11/18 shooting. I've seen her switch out on guards, I've also seen her change ends pretty well from offense to defense. I was genuinely thinking who has been a better big/center in college in the last 10 years?

 

[DEpup]

Thanks for posting this. I didn't realize that Dallas was sorta guaranteed a top 3 pick. While it's not 3 To See level, I do like the presumed top 4 picks (Azzi, Lauren betts, Awa Fam, Olivia Miles). I also really like Taniya Latson and kinda think she would also be a good fit next to Paige. I know she's a bit on the small end but she seems to be a really good athlete. If Kelsey Plum can get by at that size perhaps she can too.
I feel like Big Mama Stef would be a great fit in Dallas. But right now they are losing games by 20 plus. I can't lie, I'm a bit concerned. It's ok that it may take time to make the playoffs. I think DT literally missed the playoffs her first 3 years. But they haven't been competitive in a lot of games. Paige has kinda talked in post games about building a foundation, but as noted the team can look 90 percent different. Idk if pros is like college in that sense.

For Dallas. If all they have is one first round pick with out any other deals and they are stuck with Arike then for them I think the better choice is Betts. They need reliable mobile bigs who can score.

Now, if they deal Arike away (my wish) then you can take Azzi as the 2 guard replacement first and then get a different big later in the draft.

 

[Bald Husky]

Thanks for posting this. I didn't realize that Dallas was sorta guaranteed a top 3 pick. While it's not 3 To See level, I do like the presumed top 4 picks (Azzi, Lauren betts, Awa Fam, Olivia Miles). I also really like Taniya Latson and kinda think she would also be a good fit next to Paige. I know she's a bit on the small end but she seems to be a really good athlete. If Kelsey Plum can get by at that size perhaps she can too.
I feel like Big Mama Stef would be a great fit in Dallas. But right now they are losing games by 20 plus. I can't lie, I'm a bit concerned. It's ok that it may take time to make the playoffs. I think DT literally missed the playoffs her first 3 years. But they haven't been competitive in a lot of games. Paige has kinda talked in post games about building a foundation, but as noted the team can look 90 percent different. Idk if pros is like college in that sense.

Latson is a gunner, and Paige is already playing with more than one of those. Not working out very well.

 

[NycUcWbbFan]

• (2) Is Arike a core-protect-sign-and-trade player? If she is, who should Dallas trade her for?

This was mentioned in Post #25 as something to consider well. I personally think it is very ironic that we read so many negative comments here on the Boneyard about Ogunbowale, … force her to resign a contract with the Wings, and for no other reason than to hopefully trade her for some draft choice?

Here is the thing, EVERY veteran player is a free agent next season (I guess with the exception of those who may be Cored). So, given that there will be so many on the market, why would any other program want to trade for Arike, when they might simply be able to negotiate with one of the eighty or so other free agents? What kind of trade value would she really carry? And what if there are no other teams willing to trade anything, what then?

Who does Dallas draft (c) in the 2026 WNBA draft?

Which comes first - the chicken or the egg?

2026 roster management for Dallas is akin to solving a Tetris puzzle whose rules are dependent on a new CBA &2 — not unlike Trans Warp Beaming. It’s not neatly linear.

• For example, protecting Awak Kuier and possibly Lou LS and letting Golden State draft Carla Leite in 2025, might seem silly for 2025;
• But it may look inspired for 2026 if the WNBA prioritization rule is relaxed, Arike is traded for (cored) protected player(s) &1 (excluding double-cored-need-not-be-protected players such as Britney Griner, Tina Charles or Dewanna Bonner with whom Dallas could directly negotiate with), and Azzi is drafted.

&1 The idea of coring a UFA has always had some unsavory undertones to the unwilling cored player.

• But the rule is there, and unless changed in the new CBA &2, there will perhaps be many newly cored UFAs in 2026 to protect from two expansion drafts and possibly for sign-and-trade;
• Arike is a key Dallas asset in such a market; but being newly cored does not necessarily mean automatic sign-and-trade fodder; Paige, who has vouched for Arike, may be the one player that Arike would be willing to be accountable to, to rein in her ball dominant hero ball that loses games also by being a defensive liability.

&2 It is my gut feeling that WNBA owners already know that jeopardizing or chaotically compromising a 2026 season (and by extension, market valuations and growth momentum in a now societally accepted professional women’s basketball league) will be blamed on them. And over what? A perceived untransparent penny-pinching.

 

[oldude]

2026 roster management for Dallas is akin to solving a Tetris puzzle whose rules are dependent on a new CBA &2 — not unlike Trans Warp Beaming. It’s not neatly linear.

• For example, protecting Awak Kuier and possibly Lou LS and letting Golden State draft Carla Leite in 2025, might seem silly for 2025;
• But it may look inspired for 2026 if the WNBA prioritization rule is relaxed, Arike is traded for (cored) protected player(s) &1 (excluding double-cored-need-not-be-protected players such as Britney Griner, Tina Charles or Dewanna Bonner with whom Dallas could directly negotiate with), and Azzi is drafted.

&1 The idea of coring a UFA has always had some unsavory undertones to the unwilling cored player.

• But the rule is there, and unless changed in the new CBA &2, there will perhaps be many newly cored UFAs in 2026 to protect from two expansion drafts and possibly for sign-and-trade;
• Arike is a key Dallas asset in such a market; but being newly cored does not necessarily mean automatic sign-and-trade fodder; Paige, who has vouched for Arike, may be the one player that Arike would be willing to be accountable to, to rein in her ball dominant hero ball that loses games also by being a defensive liability.

&2 It is my gut feeling that WNBA owners already know that jeopardizing or chaotically compromising a 2026 season (and by extension, market valuations and growth momentum in a now societally accepted professional women’s basketball league) will be blamed on them. And over what? A perceived untransparent penny-pinching.

The idea that Dallas might “core” Arike and then trade her seems unlikely. With so many free agents in the W this coming season, it’s hard to imagine that any team would trade an asset to the Wings for Arike on a one year Supermax contract, only to lose her the following season. It would make far more sense to sign a veteran guard to a long term contract without the need to give up any assets.

Futher to the point of coring, it’s equally unlikely that the Wings would core Arike and keep her, only to lose her to free agency the following season. If the Wings do elect to keep Arike, which is a debatable decision at this point, the only way it would make sense is if the team signs her to a longer term contract, i.e. 3+ years.

 

[NycUcWbbFan]

The idea that Dallas might “core” Arike and then trade her seems unlikely. With so many free agents in the W this coming season, it’s hard to imagine that any team would trade an asset to the Wings for Arike on a one year Supermax contract, only to lose her the following season. It would make far more sense to sign a veteran guard to a long term contract without the need to give up any assets.

Futher to the point of coring, it’s equally unlikely that the Wings would core Arike and keep her, only to lose her to free agency the following season. If the Wings do elect to keep Arike, which is a debatable decision at this point, the only way it would make sense is if the team signs her to a longer term contract, i.e. 3+ years.

Agree, that (and below to complete your thought process) would be the most likely outcome.

• Arike probably need not be protected from the expansion drafts under current rules since the expansion team would need to core her, the one and only UFA.

But if, for argument’s sake, say, Britney Griner doesn’t want to stay in ATL, and ATL wants to get something for her, and they like Arike and the coring rules stay the same. Then both ATL and Dallas probably need to execute mirror core-protect-sign-and-trade actions.

 

[cancontent]

Agree, that (and below to complete your thought process) would be the most likely outcome.

• Arike probably need not be protected from the expansion drafts under current rules since the expansion team would need to core her, the one and only UFA.

But if, for argument’s sake, say, Britney Griner doesn’t want to stay in ATL, and ATL wants to get something for her, and they like Arike and the coring rules stay the same. Then both ATL and Dallas probably need to execute mirror core-protect-sign-and-trade actions.

Atlanta has a fair bit of guard depth with Gray, Canada, Howard, PaoPao and Caldwell. Think Atlanta would look for another post presence if Griner decided to move on before entertaining this trade idea.

 

[NycUcWbbFan]

Atlanta has a fair bit of guard depth with Gray, Canada, Howard, PaoPao and Caldwell. Think Atlanta would look for another post presence if Griner decided to move on before entertaining this trade idea.

And I realized that Griner (as well as Tina Charles) is double-cored and my specific example of mirror trades for a needed Dallas post is not what I thought it was.

 

[WiseWillie]

Agree, that (and below to complete your thought process) would be the most likely outcome.

• Arike probably need not be protected from the expansion drafts under current rules since the expansion team would need to core her, the one and only UFA.

But if, for argument’s sake, say, Britney Griner doesn’t want to stay in ATL, and ATL wants to get something for her, and they like Arike and the coring rules stay the same. Then both ATL and Dallas probably need to execute mirror core-protect-sign-and-trade actions.

You as well as the OldDude seem much more conversant on the all of rules in play here than yours truly so please excuse this neophyte's question: Does not the new CBA introduce penalties restricting ability of teams to make trades and sign players that impact the salary cap and the salary protection of the involved players? How would Dallas and ATL get around this?

 

[oldude]

You as well as the OldDude seem much more conversant on the all of rules in play here than yours truly so please excuse this neophyte's question: Does not the new CBA introduce penalties restricting ability of teams to make trades and sign players that impact the salary cap and the salary protection of the involved players? How would Dallas and ATL get around this?

You raise an interesting and currently unanswerable question. So long as the new CBA is not final, we have no idea how the new salary cap will impact players and player movement.

 

[Cuango]

If "team style of play" is important to you, why would you draft Lauren Betts? She makes Kara Wolters look like Nikola Jokic.

She is the best big in the draft ( not close) and there is a little something called coaching! You should look into it! Who would you like to see them draft? I tend to think that if you have a very good facilitator at the point, the next thing is a good post player. You then try to put as many good players around that core as you can and hope your chemistry is good. Throw in a good coach and you might have something. Dallas has exactly one of those things at present.

 

[oldude]

She is the best big in the draft ( not close) and there is a little something called coaching! You should look into it! Who would you like to see them draft? I tend to think that if you have a very good facilitator at the point, the next thing is a good post player. You then try to put as many good players around that core as you can and hope your chemistry is good. Throw in a good coach and you might have something. Dallas has exactly one of those things at present.

I agree that Betts is the best Big in the draft. What is difficult to determine is whether or not she can be a dominant post in the W, where there’s a bunch of 6’5 - 6’8” posts. Griner, Jonquil Jones, Charles, Wilson, Boston and others are all bigs who are mobile and effective. My view on Betts is that she is “mobility limited” and her ceiling is more like Cardoso. If so, then the Wings could do better by signing a veteran center and using their lottery pick in the draft to sign another big time scorer: Azzi, Miles or another top g/w.

 

[RoadMaster]

 

[oldude]

There were a couple games to start the WNBA season off at the end of May and there will be a couple games to wrap the season up at the beginning of September. In the middle, there were 3 full months of basketball in June, July & August, during which Paige was named the Rookie of the Month for each of the three.

I’m going way out on the limb here by suggesting that Paige will be named the WNBA Rookie of the Year……..😉

 

[RockyMTblue2]

Oh, I don't know @oldude . Never underestimate the Sonia Citron Fan Club. And then there is the power of the WNBA totally screw things up ... viz. Caitlin Clark; referee influenced games; I'll stop there.

 

[Crossover]

She is the best big in the draft ( not close) and there is a little something called coaching! You should look into it! Who would you like to see them draft? I tend to think that if you have a very good facilitator at the point, the next thing is a good post player. You then try to put as many good players around that core as you can and hope your chemistry is good. Throw in a good coach and you might have something. Dallas has exactly one of those things at present.

Thanks so much for schooling me. I had no idea that there was such a thing as coaching. I took your advice and looked into it, and came across someone named Tara VanDerveer. Apparently she was the head coach at a place called Stanford when Lauren Betts was a freshman there. Betts did not play much that year, probably because VanDerveer was too dumb to recognize her talent (or her height), or lacked the ability to develop talent. (Pay no attention to rumors out of Palo Alto that Betts was un-coachable). Thankfully, Lauren had the good sense to transfer. During my research I learned that she landed at UCLA where she played for a coach by the name Cori Close. Did I get that right? Close must be terrible at her job since her team lost to UConn in the Final Four this past Spring. (Geno Auriemma would beg to differ with that evaluation of Close, but what does he know?) So yes, Betts has been victimized by lousy coaching up until now, and will undoubtedly blossom under the superb tutelage of Dallas Wings coach Chris Koclanes. Plus, I bet she can't wait to escape UCLA's heliocentric style of play, and is eager to be in a system that does not revolve around her.

 

[Cuango]

Thanks so much for schooling me. I had no idea that there was such a thing as coaching. I took your advice and looked into it, and came across someone named Tara VanDerveer. Apparently she was the head coach at a place called Stanford when Lauren Betts was a freshman there. Betts did not play much that year, probably because VanDerveer was too dumb to recognize her talent (or her height), or lacked the ability to develop talent. (Pay no attention to rumors out of Palo Alto that Betts was un-coachable). Thankfully, Lauren had the good sense to transfer. During my research I learned that she landed at UCLA where she played for a coach by the name Cori Close. Did I get that right? Close must be terrible at her job since her team lost to UConn in the Final Four this past Spring. (Geno Auriemma would beg to differ with that evaluation of Close, but what does he know?) So yes, Betts has been victimized by lousy coaching up until now, and will undoubtedly blossom under the superb tutelage of Dallas Wings coach Chris Koclanes. Plus, I bet she can't wait to escape UCLA's heliocentric style of play, and is eager to be in a system that does not revolve around her.

Good one, Pengy! Yeah, she hasn’t had much luck with coaches, thats for sure! I forgot that I praised the “superb tutelage” of Koclanes,
Oh wait! Well, maybe Dallas will hire a different coach that can actually coach. There’s a thought.
I don’t have the “in” about Tara’s last year and Close is clearly a genius with one final four (a blowout loss) in 14 seasons in spite of highly ranked recruiting classes including two #1 classes. Clearly you have a different idea about who Dallas should choose with their hoped for #1. I just hope they can get Paige some help.

 

[Crossover]

Good one, Pengy! Yeah, she hasn’t had much luck with coaches, thats for sure! I forgot that I praised the “superb tutelage” of Koclanes,
Oh wait! Well, maybe Dallas will hire a different coach that can actually coach. There’s a thought.
I don’t have the “in” about Tara’s last year and Close is clearly a genius with one final four (a blowout loss) in 14 seasons in spite of highly ranked recruiting classes including two #1 classes. Clearly you have a different idea about who Dallas should choose with their hoped for #1. I just hope they can get Paige some help.

We can definitely agree on your last sentence!

 

[Bald Husky]

I believe that the Wings envision Paige as a shooting guard and not a point guard. If they can get a veteran Big, their priority would be a point guard to help Paige get her looks without having to be guarded the full length of the floor. Ty Harris is one answer, but they need another guard that can be point or off the ball when Paige wants to take over. Grace isn't it; JJ isn't it either. It's going to come down to who Paige can convince to come to Dallas as a free agent, and that will determine which way they lean in the draft. Miles may be the answer as the best pick, but Betts is an option if they cannot secure a veteran Big.

 

[Basingstoke]

I believe that the Wings envision Paige as a shooting guard and not a point guard. If they can get a veteran Big, their priority would be a point guard to help Paige get her looks without having to be guarded the full length of the floor. Ty Harris is one answer, but they need another guard that can be point or off the ball when Paige wants to take over. Grace isn't it; JJ isn't it either. It's going to come down to who Paige can convince to come to Dallas as a free agent, and that will determine which way they lean in the draft. Miles may be the answer as the best pick, but Betts is an option if they cannot secure a veteran Big.

I actually think that it's actually the reverse: I think that they think of her as THE point guard, but, since they need her on the court for virtually the entire game (& don't have other intimidating scoring options), they've played her off the ball to reduce wear-and-tear on her body.
They might also have been curious to see how the team functions with Berger, JJ, et al as point guard while Paige is off the ball (& they're getting their answer - although, if Harris was healthy it might look a lot better).

 

[Bald Husky]

I actually think that it's actually the reverse: I think that they think of her as THE point guard, but, since they need her on the court for virtually the entire game (& don't have other intimidating scoring options), they've played her off the ball to reduce wear-and-tear on her body.
They might also have been curious to see how the team functions with Berger, JJ, et al as point guard while Paige is off the ball (& they're getting their answer - although, if Harris was healthy it might look a lot better).

A lot better with Ty Harris. JJ has the same disease that Moriah had, and Chrystal had. That is running into the paint with no plan, not looking at the floor and running into trouble that they cannot get out of. The UConn guards are learning to control that by their sophomore or junior year. JJ has not learned that, so she is not an advantage for playing with Paige. Paige plays at her own pace, and the Wings have to look at that if Paige is going to be the top dog. I have faith in Curt Miller, but not necessarily Koclanes. Next year will be a new team again with many very young players. The Wings need a no-nonsense coach that knows defense, and a system that knows how to develop young players. Hmmm, Geno and CD come to mind. How about Dawn?

 

[oldude]

Watching the Wings vs the Valkyries on the WNBA League Pass. Every game is broadcast by the respective home team’s broadcast crew. During a break in the action in the first qtr, the following trivia question was asked:

“Who is the winningest coach in the history of women’s college basketball?”

• Dawn Staley
• Tara Vandever
• Kim Mulkey
• Pat Summit

Huh?????????

The answer they gave was Tara, which would have been the correct answer 2 years ago. I realize that Tara coached not far from SF. But I was incredulous that any basketball broadcast team, anywhere in the country could get that question so obviously wrong, particularly after Geno and the Huskies just won their record 12th national championship.

 

[YKCornelius]

Watching the Wings vs the Valkyries on the WNBA League Pass. Every game is broadcast by the respective home team’s broadcast crew. During a break in the action in the first qtr, the following trivia question was asked:

“Who is the winningest coach in the history of women’s college basketball?”

• Dawn Staley
• Tara Vandever
• Kim Mulkey
• Pat Summit

Huh?????????

The answer they gave was Tara, which would have been the correct answer 2 years ago. I realize that Tara coached not far from SF. But I was incredulous that any basketball broadcast team, anywhere in the country could get that question so obviously wrong, particularly after Geno and the Huskies just won their record 12th national championship.

Oldude, since I can't listen to the replay until after the game is over, are you sure they didn't ask: "Who is the winningest woman coach in the history of college basketball?

 

[oldude]

Oldude, since I can't listen to the replay until after the game is over, are you sure they didn't ask: "Who is the winningest woman coach in the history of college basketball?

Well, I guess that’s a possibility. But even if that was the question, why exactly would you ask that question which would clearly imply that Tara is the winningest coach all time, when she’s not?

 

[RoadMaster]

 

[Basingstoke]

Since they noted it in the broadcast but didn't show a replay: did anyone catch how Paige wound up on the floor in pain with around 5:10 left in the 4th quarter?

 

[YKCornelius]

Since they noted it in the broadcast but didn't show a replay: did anyone catch how Paige wound up on the floor in pain with around 5:10 left in the 4th quarter?

She tripped over Carla Leite's lower leg as Carla was defending Grace Berger with her back to Paige. Carla took a step backward, and Paige, trying to get to the top of the key, tripped over Carla's right leg hitting the floor pretty hard. Unfortunate but no doubt inadvertent.