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Cupcakes or Top 25

UConnCat

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You also state that Geno won't play freshmen against top teams. This is simply false. See Bueckers and Edwards and Muhl. See Christyn and ONO. See Kia Nurse. See Lou and Napheesa. Many, many more example can be cited.
Oh, let's see. Here's a few. This idea that Geno hasn't or won't play freshmen against top teams is just crazy. If freshmen were good enough they played.

Bria Hartley
Stef Dolson
Kelly Faris
Kaili McClaren
Tina Charles
Renee Montgomery
Charde Houston
Willnett Crocket
Barb Turner
Ann Strother
Kennitra Johnson
Maya Moore
Kaleena Mosqueda-Lewis
Caroline Doty
Tiff Hayes
Crystal Dangerfield
Breanna Stewert
Morgan Tuck
 

HuskyNan

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Oh, let's see. Here's a few. This idea that Geno hasn't or won't play freshmen against top teams is just crazy. If freshmen were good enough they played.

Bria Hartley
Stef Dolson
Kelly Faris
Kaili McClaren
Tina Charles
Renee Montgomery
Charde Houston
Willnett Crocket
Barb Turner
Ann Strother
Kennitra Johnson
Maya Moore
Kaleena Mosqueda-Lewis
Caroline Doty
Tiff Hayes
Crystal Dangerfield
Breanna Stewert
Morgan Tuck
Caroline Ducharme
Christyn Williams
Diana Taurasi
Katie Lou Samuelson
Swin Cash
Asjha Jones
Jessica Moore
Sue Bird (before ACL tear was starting PG)
Svetlana Abrosimova
Nykesha Sales
Shea Ralph
Ann Strother
 

sun

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The UConn website lists the following number of players on the roster for each season, but doesn't list transfers that occurred.
In general it shows the number the WBB scholarships that have been awarded per year short of the 15 allowed.
One can only guess if recruiting more players would have resulted in even more NC's for UConn.

Year -----> # of Players
2001 - 02---> 11
02 - 03-----> 11
03 - 04-----> 11
04 - 05-----> 13
05 - 06-----> 12
06 - 07-----> 12
07 - 08-----> 14
08 - 09-----> 14
09 - 10-----> 11
10 - 11-----> 10
11 - 12-----> 9
12 - 13-----> 11
13 - 14-----> 11
14 - 15-----> 12
15 - 16-----> 11
16 - 17-----> 11
17 - 18-----> 10
18 - 19-----> 10
19 - 20-----> 10
20 - 21-----> 12
21 - 22-----> 12 (14 originally, 2 transferred out)

For 2022 - 23, UConn will be losing 3 seniors, with 2 incoming commits thus far for an estimated total of 11.
 
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Carnac

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This is not an attack but do understand UConn has 11 National Championships unlike most other Div 1 schools.

Good question are there any available? All players can tryout to be a walk-on. Having said that most prefer to go to a lower level school where they are able to compete for playing time. UConn started the season with 14 scholarship players. Both Mir and Saylor were well ranked players that saw the writing on the wall. Does one think others do not? No attack just fact.

Again no attack just conversation, there may be but they most likely realize where Autumn is now. She fought hard to come to UConn but only managed to get 15 minutes in 8 games. (1.9 per game) The level of play at D1 upper crust is beyond what many, actually most any walk on could handle or be prepared for. The program is simply above what most local talent can provide.
A good example of the difference between the "elite" programs in Division 1 WCBB, and the also rans (mid-majors & low mid-majors) is the difficulty that Natalie Butler had here after transferring from Georgetown. She never realized her potential here. A combination of injuries and an inability to get in sync with Geno's system saw her limited minutes her junior year.

She transferred to George Mason (Atlantic 10 Conference) for her senior year and instantly became the star of the team and became the leading rebounder in WCBB. It was not uncommon for her to post a double double on most nights. The difference is the quality of the competition George Mason played versus what UConn played. George Mason is a mid to low major program.

That year (2017-2018), George Mason played only 1 ranked team (#24 Michigan) to whom they lost 75-61. They finished a very respectable 24-10/11-5 in 4th place behind first place Dayton (15/1). The year before they finished 13-17/6/10 in 10th place in the bottom half of the conference standings. Butler was voted the team captain and was the team's MVP.

2017-2018: Butler was selected 30th overall by Dallas Wings in WNBA Draft becoming first Mason player to be drafted in program history... Earned All-America Honorable Mention honors from Associated Press... Atlantic 10 Player of the Year... Broke NCAA single season rebounding record (563 rebounds)... Broke Mason single season scoring record (653 points)... Led country in rebounding (16.6 rpg) and double-doubles (33)... Tied NCAA Division I record for double-doubles (33) and most consecutive double-doubles (33)... Led conference in scoring (19.2 ppg) and rebounding (16.6 rpg)... Broke school record for most rebounds in a game (28) and tied Atlantic 10 mark...
 
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Several thoughts.
No, Geno will stick with his mantra of sitting freshmen unless injuries force him to play them. I strongly disagree with this approach.
He obtains oodles of elite players.
He should figure out how to integrate them into team play earlier.
Other coaches do.
WBB landscape is changing.
Please don’t tout recent records against the anemic AAC, the slowly improving Big East or recent appearances in the Final Fours.
This year’s freshman class is the reason UCONN Wins the BE and will get a high seeding in the Tourney. The were the difference in several very narrow BE wins.
As far as easing up on out of conference scheduling- negatory.
As I’ve previously suggested ( to a landslide of negativity), I’d rather schedule ooc schedule for maximum difficulty, risk several losses, and expose the newbies to the level of competition in their “new” basketball ri world. Let them see what it takes to compete at this level.
Yes, WBB landscape is changing. This is one of the best posts I've read here. Maybe because I agree so much with what you say. Nothing wrong with risking a few losses, or not winning by 30, but not his style. Geez, you can't play Amari against the likes of Butler and Xavier? Maybe giving her some court time will improve her rumored practice attitude. Again, not his style.
 
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UConnCat

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Caroline Ducharme
Christyn Williams
Diana Taurasi
Katie Lou Samuelson
Swin Cash
Asjha Jones
Jessica Moore
Sue Bird (before ACL tear was starting PG)
Svetlana Abrosimova
Nykesha Sales
Shea Ralph
I'm sure we're missing a few. This freshmen "mantra" thing is uninformed and demonstrably false.
 
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Several thoughts.
No, Geno will stick with his mantra of sitting freshmen unless injuries force him to play them. I strongly disagree with this approach.
He obtains oodles of elite players.
He should figure out how to integrate them into team play earlier.
Other coaches do.
WBB landscape is changing.
Please don’t tout recent records against the anemic AAC, the slowly improving Big East or recent appearances in the Final Fours.
This year’s freshman class is the reason UCONN Wins the BE and will get a high seeding in the Tourney. The were the difference in several very narrow BE wins.
As far as easing up on out of conference scheduling- negatory.
As I’ve previously suggested ( to a landslide of negativity), I’d rather schedule ooc schedule for maximum difficulty, risk several losses, and expose the newbies to the level of competition in their “new” basketball world. Let them see what it takes to compete at this level.
You don’t think UConn tries to schedule tough ooc games?
Kermit The Frog Reaction GIF by Muppet Wiki
 
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The UConn website lists the following number of players on the roster for each season, but doesn't list transfers that occurred.
In general it shows the number the WBB scholarships that have been awarded per year short of the 15 allowed.
One can only guess if recruiting more players would have resulted in even more NC's for UConn.

Y
No. In the context you are speaking I think (of having a deeper bench and play more players rather than rely on your superstars as much?). If that is it - then - No.

Because UCONN gets number 1 recruits more than anyone else and it's not close and other very top ranked recruits. They have held a huge advantage of number 1 recruits. Looking back at nearly all the championships, they have had a number 1 ranked recruit.

Number 1 ranked recruits want to play. There is a reason why number 1 recruits come to UCONN and one is that they get to play a lot of minutes.

If the intent is to not play number 1 ranked recruits many minutes then you would never have ever achieved 11 National Championships.

There is always a flawed thought that the bench is more important – but it isn't. Superstars playing 40 minutes in a big game is what gets you championships. See DT (3), Maya (2), Stewart (4). If Geno didn't play these players big minutes at certain points in there career then "Paige Buckers and Azzi Fudd" ain't coming.

It's not the 11 time National Championship coach that is wrong. -- It's the thought that not playing your superstars big minutes in contrast to what the 11 time National Championship coach that has shown us - that is wrong.
 
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CompSci87

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In the game against Oregon State, Stanford gave 15 players time on the court! Three of them, including Prechtel, had 0 points. Wonder why 2 of 17 did not get on court!
Those two have been out all year with injury.
 

MSGRET

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I never get why one/some feel the need to pit freshman vs veterans on same team to justify a point being made, "UConn Wins the BE and will get a high seeding in the Tourney?" ...really?

Maybe you can shed some light on which BE narrow wins you talking about where the freshman were the difference in? Could the veteran players also have made the difference in those arrow BE wins...otherwise the game would have been lost.

Who do we put the blame on the loss to Villanova...freshman or veterans?
I put the blame on the fact that right before the game there was a line up change with Liv not being able to play. The team had planned their game with Liv being a big part of it and they didn't have the time to adjust to it. Villanova is a team that has drastically improved with the return of Maddy Siegrest to the line up. Currently they are in third place in the Big East standings and is the only other Big East team that has a winning record against Top 25 teams.
 

Plebe

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You don’t think UConn tries to schedule tough ooc games?
Kermit The Frog Reaction GIF by Muppet Wiki
I adore this gif and intend to use it sometime in the future, likely this season.
 

HuskyNan

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I put the blame on the fact that right before the game there was a line up change with Liv not being able to play. The team had planned their game with Liv being a big part of it and they didn't have the time to adjust to it. Villanova is a team that has drastically improved with the return of Maddy Siegrest to the line up. Currently they are in third place in the Big East standings and is the only other Big East team that has a winning record against Top 25 teams.
I appreciate your effort but logic or reasoning isn’t part of the schtick of those complaining.

For all you people who hate the way Geno runs the team, I’m sure Stanford or South Carolina would be happy to have a couple more fans.
 
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I tend to agree with you.
UCONN was flirting with being down to 5 players plus Piath and Deberry- whom I consider players also- but many here do not.
If it takes a freshman 1-1 1/2 Years to learn the system and ‘earn’ playing time, the margin of error is very slim.
1 or 2 don’t get it, 1 or 2 injuries, throw in a transfer (new paradigm) and you find yourself up the creek.
Not sure if Saylor would have made it here- I didn’t see enough.
Mir doing well in VA.
The transfer portal could create real roster problems.
Syracuse last year case in point.
There’s not a single poster on this site/board who thinks Piath and/or DeBerry are not players! When they hardly ever get on court, they are often left out when someone is talking about prospective lineups etc for brevity’s sake. Now you may think that is wrong/insensitive/hurtful but suggesting that other posters don’t consider them players is imo, a bit over the top.

As for Saylor and Mir, I think Saylor would have been a solid contributor by her junior year for sure, but obviously did not want to wait that long and/or was not particularly happy here. She seems to have landed on her feet in Arkansas where I hope she will have a great career. Mir, on the other hand was handicapped by her lack of an outside shot and Imo was more questionable as far as becoming a contributor here at UConn. She also seems to have landed in a better place for her talents.

The transfer portal, while bringing its own issues, is overall Imo probably a good thing, though it obviously has a negative side as well. The Syracuse situation, I believe, will be relatively rare. An exodus like that will only happen when there is serious wrongdoing or complete incompetence! There is a flip side as well, as it allows almost instantaneous improvement for a struggling team. One year you are undersized with no floor general, the next you have a solid, sometimes experienced post and a competent point guard. I guess we’ll see in the coming years whether the overall effect is good or bad.
Yes, WBB landscape is changing. This is one of the best posts I've read here. Maybe because I agree so much with what you say. Nothing wrong with risking a few losses, or not winning by 30, but not his style. Geez, you can't play Amari against the likes of Butler and Xavier? Maybe giving her some court time will improve her rumored practice attitude. Again, not his style.
You keep saying things are changing and Geno must change to keep up, yet we are currently on a streak of 13 straight Final Fours. I too would like to see more and earlier integration of our younger players but I think Geno will continue to win whether he changes or not. I think he has many reasons for what he does beyond whether they make basketball mistakes. For him game minutes are not allocated based simply on the player’s on court performance but rather a combination of performance, attitude, effort, and other intangibles that he sees as essential to becoming a well-rounded player/person. If that is true, and I believe it is, who’s to say if relaxing those requirements/standards might not blow up his whole system and lose what has made UConn the envy of women’s basketball for the past 30 years? I think I’ll just support him til he’s done!
 

sun

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No. In the context you are speaking I think (of having a deeper bench and play more players rather than rely on your superstars as much?). If that is it - then - No.

Because UCONN gets number 1 recruits more than anyone else and it's not close and other very top ranked recruits. They have held a huge advantage of number 1 recruits. Looking back at nearly all the championships, they have had a number 1 ranked recruit.

Number 1 ranked recruits want to play. There is a reason why number 1 recruits come to UCONN and one is that they get to play a lot of minutes.

If the intent is to not play number 1 ranked recruits many minutes then you would never have ever achieved 11 National Championships.

There is always a flawed thought that the bench is more important – but it isn't. Superstars playing 40 minutes in a big game is what gets you championships. See DT (3), Maya (2), Stewart (4). If Geno didn't play these players big minutes at certain points in there career then "Paige Buckers and Azzi Fudd" ain't coming.

It's not the 11 time National Championship coach that is wrong. -- It's the thought that not playing your superstars big minutes in contrast to what the 11 time National Championship coach that has shown us - that is wrong.
I respect your opinion.
It's just there must be reasons why UIConn hasn't won a NC in a number of years, and why other schools have become more successful, and apparently by using a deeper bench.

For instance, many folks may not rate Amari and/or Piath as being elite enoiugh to get the job done. Not good enough to be playing other than the bench for another 1-2 years. Meanwhile, Ice Brady is being touted as someone who could possibly keep not only those 2 but put AE on the bench as well.
And that may be true, that Dorka and Ice can be starters. But that means that 4-5 players were recruited in order to find 2 that are worthy of being real stars.
That's 1/3 of the team to perhaps fill 2 positions.

Folks can't have it both ways, to believe that everyone that UConn recruits is a superstar caliber player while at the same time admitting that there are 100's of more elite players in development than there were in the past.
Either there is more player parity these days or there isn't.
Because I believe that there is more parity and a larger number of potentially elite players, then teams like UConn now need to change their recruiting tactics a little bit and recruit more players to get what they need to win a NC.
Some positions can be filled by committee because 2 fresh players are better than 1 tired " superstar" that may not have enough experience or skill to win a NC as a freshman.
We needed to acquire Dorka through the transfer portal and she may not be able to do it all alone either.

Consistency makes all of the difference between being a good player and a great player.
That's also why sometimes there is safety in numbers, the more recruits/players the more chance that positions can be held down to give UConn a fighting chance of obtaining another NC.
AE is good, but alone is she enough?
Dorka is good but alone is she enough?
That's 2 players possibly for only 1 position, and we have more on the way and some sitting on the bench, and all are essentially untested at the college level.
So how can UConn win a NC with only 10 - 12 players?
It's takes maximum effort unless there we have true superstars which are becoming harder to find enough of them who stand head & shoulders above the rest.
Otherwise it becomes a strategic numbers game and a chess match.
Is 12 enough, is 15 too many?
IMO there's no such as too much talent, there is only not enough talent to win a NC.
Then everything becomes an excuse.
 
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There’s not a single poster on this site/board who thinks Piath and/or DeBerry are not players! When they hardly ever get on court, they are often left out when someone is talking about prospective lineups etc for brevity’s sake. Now you may think that is wrong/insensitive/hurtful but suggesting that other posters don’t consider them players is imo, a bit over the top.

As for Saylor and Mir, I think Saylor would have been a solid contributor by her junior year for sure, but obviously did not want to wait that long and/or was not particularly happy here. She seems to have landed on her feet in Arkansas where I hope she will have a great career. Mir, on the other hand was handicapped by her lack of an outside shot and Imo was more questionable as far as becoming a contributor here at UConn. She also seems to have landed in a better place for her talents.

The transfer portal, while bringing its own issues, is overall Imo probably a good thing, though it obviously has a negative side as well. The Syracuse situation, I believe, will be relatively rare. An exodus like that will only happen when there is serious wrongdoing or complete incompetence! There is a flip side as well, as it allows almost instantaneous improvement for a struggling team. One year you are undersized with no floor general, the next you have a solid, sometimes experienced post and a competent point guard. I guess we’ll see in the coming years whether the overall effect is good or bad.

You keep saying things are changing and Geno must change to keep up, yet we are currently on a streak of 13 straight Final Fours. I too would like to see more and earlier integration of our younger players but I think Geno will continue to win whether he changes or not. I think he has many reasons for what he does beyond whether they make basketball mistakes. For him game minutes are not allocated based simply on the player’s on court performance but rather a combination of performance, attitude, effort, and other intangibles that he sees as essential to becoming a well-rounded player/person. If that is true, and I believe it is, who’s to say if relaxing those requirements/standards might not blow up his whole system and lose what has made UConn the envy of women’s basketball for the past 30 years? I think I’ll just support him til he’s done!
I would kindly disagree with you on one point.
A number of members here were lamenting that we ‘had’ only 6 serviceable players, maybe 7, at the height of the injury epidemic.
Some speculated we were flirting the forfeit zone.
The team persevered and weathered the Injury situation.
It’s a fact that many discounted two team members.
I never have and am anxious to see them flourish.
 
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I respect your opinion.
It's just there must be reasons why UIConn hasn't won a NC in a number of years, and why other schools have become more successful, and apparently by using a deeper bench.
Thanks I appreciate the civil back-and-forth.
And what you refer by other schools being more successful than UCONN- please name all the other schools that have been more successful than UCONN over the past 5 years overall? Are you going to use Stanford as one of them? If we look back from 2017 to present - in 2017 Stanford went to FF, in 2018 S16, in 2019 E8, in 2020 UCONN was ranked higher, and ofc 2021 they own a Nat"l. So UCONN being superior nearly every year doesn't count because Stanford won one year while we are in FF in 4 of 5 and in the other year we were ranked higher?

There’s reasons why every team in America and in any sport hasn’t won a championship or hasn’t gotten to let’s say a FF or every team losing a game has a reason. And any time there is a loss and if it was close anyone can say “would coulda shoulda.” How about though that we recognize one game NCAA Tourney doesn’t always mean the best team wins? Along with other teams have great players and great coaching too? We’ve been to 13 straight FF’s. pretty amazing. No other team can say that in recent memory.

In your 2nd and 3rd paragraphs - What “the folks believe” has nothing to do with what happens on the court. I’m not sure what you are trying to suggest about “folks” vs “player performance?” To further that, I’m not getting your point about 1/3 of team to fill 2 positions. Anyhow regarding Amari and your point about her; if using me as an example – if I say that she needs to get better to earn minutes; are you suggesting that I’m saying that she can’t play for another 2 years?

In regards to parity, sure there is. But UCONN hasn’t recruited as well as they have in the past prior to the “Paige class.” Look at the championships since 2008-2009; 6 of them UCONN had at least two all-Americans. None of his seniors have been A//A. None of his juniors. Dangerfield was never an A/A. Walker was – but couldn’t we say for a 1st team A/A she was among the weakest UCONN had? In 4 years from Dangerfield class to Aubrey Griffin class, UCONN produced just 1 All-American.

So I don’t understand your point about parity and UCONN. UCONN hasn’t been as strong. Unless you are going to hammer UCONN for the 2 buzzer-beater defeats in 16-17 and 17-18?

Sometimes yes there is safety is in numbers. But the UCONN way has shown that other times there is safety in winning with your superstars. And it seems Geno the past 2 years has been recruiting extremely well enough in order to keep this superstar method going. And you can’t guarantee championships. Fans do that. But in terms of relevancy, coaches and players do not.
 

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