committee top 16 | Page 3 | The Boneyard

committee top 16

MSGRET said:
The NCAA put out a couple of weeks ago that teams that don't reach the magic number can have the Conference submit a request for consideration to be eligible for the Tournament. I believe the deadline was the Monday before the selection committee meets.
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At the moment, the dates to apply for a waiver were from Feb. 8 through Feb. 26. After Feb. 26, a team can only apply if it has one or more games postponed after that date.
 
oldude said:
That sounds like what the Big10 did to leapfrog tOSU football, when the Buckeyes didn’t have enough games to qualify for the Big10 championship, and a chance to play for the national championship.
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Slightly different since the rule applying to OSU was only a Big Ten rule, and thus it only required a Big Ten vote to change it. The basketball waiver process relates to an NCAA rule - so it takes an NCAA ruling to change it.
 
Bear11 said:
Just as a general question, how do you fairly rank the Pac-12 teams when none of them played a real non-conference schedule? I don't think the NET and the other ranking systems can really apply to a conference that only played amongst themselves.
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Because the PAC-12 is a tough conference where each team has played a tougher schedule than say...UConn.
 
By my count, just three P5 teams have <13 games: MI (12), RU (11), OreSt (12).
USF & UCF have 12.
And a few small conference leaders are below 13 as well.

I think every at-large NCAA pick will be well over 13 by tourney time.
Maybe a few small conference champs get waivers.
 
Dokey said:
Because the PAC-12 is a tough conference where each team has played a tougher schedule than say...UConn.
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Yes the Pac-12 is tough, but we really have no idea how tough. As far as I can tell no one in the entire conference played a P5 opponent in non-conference. That means the committee is just relying on preseason rankings and the eye test to rank the teams in the absence of any real data. You can rank the Pac-12 teams relative to each other, but there is no basis to compare them with the rest of the country. Has the committee made any comment on how they will do that, or is it a total guess?

Personally I think the Pac-12 should take a slight hit across the board for not playing a non-conference schedule, but that may just because Oregon cancelling the Baylor game cost us a chance to improve our own schedule.
 
browns said:
I definitely would put A@M as a 1 seed instead of L'ville..they could win it all..bigs inside and pretty good shooting guards..good defense and a terrific coach...guess we'll see the last day of the regular season when they play SC
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Oh really? Let's see how they actually fare against SC first given their Top 25 wins are really wins against 13-25 teams and 2 of them are way out of top 25 contention-MSU and Texas. Look at their other wins, all are by paltry scores. I am not sold on this team even as a #2 seed as I think Baylor is better, UCLA, Arizona and probably Oregon and Maryland. The whole 7-0 vs. Top 25 without a top 10 team in the bunch is not a great discussion. I would be very comfortable having them in our side of the bracket.
 
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The shuffling of teams to avoid conference matchups is idiotic. It punishes teams like UConn that are from weaker conferences. We almost always end up with the best 2 seed. And, yes, it matters. It is all about probabilities.

As for the rankings, they are awful. There are only 5 teams that can win it all. UConn, South Carolina, Stanford, Oregon and Baylor. Anyone willing to challenge that in a bet, I will take those 5 and you take the rest of the field.

Of course, with 5 teams, that means at least one bracket will have two of them. Guess whose bracket that is?
 
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DefenseBB said:
Oh really? Let's see how they actually fare against SC first given their Top 25 wins are really wins against 13-25 teams and 2 of them are way out of top 25 contention-MSU and Texas. Look at their other wins, all are by paltry scores. I am not sold on this team even as a #2 seed as I think Baylor is better, UCLA, Arizona and probably Oregon and Maryland. The whole 7-0 vs. Top 25 without a top 10 team in the bunch is not a great discussion. I would be very comfortable having them in our side of the bracket.
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I'm not one to defend A&M (in any sports) very often, but they won at Arkansas, which is something neither Baylor nor UConn could do. And, they beat Arkansas a second time at home.

While that's simply comparing the results of 3 teams against one common opponent, it's a valid comparison. We can dissect different teams' resumes', but I believe A&M's is better than just about all but 5 teams (think that's what was on the screen last night when Carolyn Peck was advocating for A&M). Even though some might "think" other teams are "better" than A&M, that is just based on the subjective eye test; the actual numbers indicate A&M has better collective quality wins than all the schools you listed (other than UCLA beating Stanford).
 
oldude said:
What if you don’t play a tournament game due to Covid? You still need 13 games, and while MI is very likely to get there, they’re not there yet.
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The NCAA is offering waivers to the 13 game rule to teams on a case by case basis.

I'm sure that the NCAA would award waivers in the same impartial basis they waive sitout years for transfers. :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
 
southie said:
I'm not one to defend A&M (in any sports) very often, but they won at Arkansas, which is something neither Baylor nor UConn could do. And, they beat Arkansas a second time at home.

While that's simply comparing the results of 3 teams against one common opponent, it's a valid comparison. We can dissect different teams' resumes', but I believe A&M's is better than just about all but 5 teams (think that's what was on the screen last night when Carolyn Peck was advocating for A&M). Even though some might "think" other teams are "better" than A&M, that is just based on the subjective eye test; the actual numbers indicate A&M has better collective quality wins than all the schools you listed (other than UCLA beating Stanford).
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South Carolina beat Arkansas by 22 points, while A&M won their games by 2 points and 1 point respectively. South Carolina has only lost two games both against Top ten teams, NC State and UConn. While A&M lost to an 8-10 LSU by 4 points. UConn has lost only one game against a Top 25 team on the road by 3 points who had a player, who got away with numerous push offs to get open, have her best game ever with 37 points. UConn also beat the #1 ranked team, who A&M plays at the end of the season. I don't see A&M beating South Carolina, but if they do, then they should be in the discussion of being #1.
 
j66kicker said:
Edit: Here's the article. After re-reading (see last paragraph) I'm not sure the 408 isn't just the Friends and Family policy and not the total attendance limit...

2021 DI Women’s Basketball Championship health and safety protocols announced

Following the recent announcement that San Antonio and the surrounding region would play host to the entire 2021 NCAA Division I Women's Basketball Championship,
www.ncaa.org www.ncaa.org

"The protocols also address game attendance, with up to six guests per Tier 1 participant (up to 408 guests total) allowed in each venue per game. Those admitted will follow the established county and venue guidelines for attendance. The guests will be prohibited from interacting in person with any of the Tier 1 participants during the entire tournament. They will be seated in physically distanced family clusters. The final attendance policy will be announced before the championship."
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408 tickets means you have 68 Tier 1 members? Players, practice players, coaches, trainers don't add up to 68. Even on 15 player squads with 15 practice players. 4 coaches, a couple of grad assistants, 2-3 managers make 39. If there are another 20 or more people having daily contact with players no wonder there have been so many pauses around the country.
 
Have they said how they will choose representatives from conferences where no team could qualify for an at-large bid AND the conference tournament is not held?

I hope Hillmon gets Michigan into the tournament with a 4 seed or better. Maybe they can beat MSU today?

The 16 reveal loves SEC teams as usual: Tennessee, Georgia, and Kentucky really don't belong.

I think Pac12 teams deserve high seedings. They have performed very well in the tournament in recent years. Especially this year, they shouldn't be penalized for lack of non-conference games. Even without Covid, Pac12 teams are disadvantaged because they have to travel much further to play other P5 opponents.
 
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MSGRET said:
South Carolina beat Arkansas by 22 points, while A&M won their games by 2 points and 1 point respectively. South Carolina has only lost two games both against Top ten teams, NC State and UConn. While A&M lost to an 8-10 LSU by 4 points. UConn has lost only one game against a Top 25 team on the road by 3 points who had a player, who got away with numerous push offs to get open, have her best game ever with 37 points. UConn also beat the #1 ranked team, who A&M plays at the end of the season. I don't see A&M beating South Carolina, but if they do, then they should be in the discussion of being #1.
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Those are some good points. But, I doubt the committee will put any stock into your bolded comment above; it's not relevant to the committee's criteria, IMO. A win is a win; a loss is a loss. Maybe the committee considers if a team played without a key player (like NC State against Va Tech), but it didn't appear that they did.

South Carolina did lose at home.

A&M lost at LSU; but, then they beat LSU at home. Like Carolyn Peck stated last night, that should be considered a "wash".

If the margin of victory is being used by the committee (I think it is), then that is a bonus for South Carolina. Still, A&M has 2 wins over Arkansas, while USC has 1 win over Arkansas. Which stat is more "valuable" to the committee?

By no means am I suggesting that A&M should be above SC; just commenting on your statements.

We all have opinions on the reveal; makes for good discussion.
 
stamfordhusky said:
no. The NCAA says you can count one tournament game even if it never gets played. A team definitely only needs 12 regular season games, so Michigan has already qualified.
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WHAT? WHAT? WHATTTTT?
 
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Alydar said:
408 tickets means you have 68 Tier 1 members? Players, practice players, coaches, trainers don't add up to 68. Even on 15 player squads with 15 practice players. 4 coaches, a couple of grad assistants, 2-3 managers make 39. If there are another 20 or more people having daily contact with players no wonder there have been so many pauses around the country.
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408 per event means 204 for each team, no? That would be 6 tix each for 34 players & staff. Suspect that ‘staff’ will include AD and various higher-up Athletic Dept staff, possibly University Pres, etc. Pretty easy to get to 34 - don’t need to count any practice players (they would have to watch from the stands as ‘friends and family’, as NCAA doesn’t allow schools to pay for them to travel to games).
 
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j66kicker said:
408 per event means 204 for each team, no? That would be 6 tix each for 34 players & staff. Suspect that ‘staff’ will include AD and various higher-up Athletic Dept staff, possibly University Pres, etc. Pretty easy to get to 34 - don’t need to count any practice players (they would have to watch from the stands as ‘friends and family’, as NCAA doesn’t allow schools to pay for them to travel to games).
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I think you are right. What caught me was the reference to "Tier 1", which I thought was the COVID Tier 1 list which I doubt included administrators. I wouldn't be surprised if prominent donors got a few tickets.
 
southie said:
A&M lost at LSU
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Georgia can be a solid team when playing well but definitely not a 3 seed.
 
Massey has Stanford, UConn, SC and Baylor as the Top four. My amateur eye test can’t disagree.
 
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southie said:
A&M lost at LSU; but, then they beat LSU at home. Like Carolyn Peck stated last night, that should be considered a "wash".
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So, if NC State avenges it's road loss to UNC by beating the Tar Heels at home in a couple of weeks, and doesn't lose another game, should that be considered a wash? Should NC State, then, remain a 2-seed while two teams it beat (again, on the road) get 1-seeds?
 
Jordy said:
Massey has Stanford, UConn, SC and Baylor as the Top four. My amateur eye test can’t disagree.
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Baylor is good but they are more 2/3 seed. That Iowa St game was a bad loss, even though they were coming off the COVID break. Arkansas isn't necessarily a bad loss even though it was at the beginning of the season but their resume is pretty limited due to lack of BIG opponents in the Big 12. USF is a solid win and WVU is solid but that resume win took a tumble after losing to OU. They are still one of the teams in my group of 8/9 that can contend for a final four or natty. This year is pretty wide open IMO.
 
LETTERL said:
So, if NC State avenges it's road loss to UNC by beating the Tar Heels at home in a couple of weeks, and doesn't lose another game, should that be considered a wash? Should NC State, then, remain a 2-seed while two teams it beat (again, on the road) get 1-seeds?
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Yes. :)

Regardless of NC State losing at Va Tech and at North Carolina, I believe they should have been a #1 seed in last night's reveal. Those two losses in no way should diminish their wins at South Carolina and at Louisville. Someone can correct if I'm wrong, but those have to be the two best wins any one team has under its belt so far this season.
 
SECbbfan24 said:
Baylor is good but they are more 2/3 seed. That Iowa St game was a bad loss, even though they were coming off the COVID break. Arkansas isn't necessarily a bad loss even though it was at the beginning of the season but their resume is pretty limited due to lack of BIG opponents in the Big 12. USF is a solid win and WVU is solid but that resume win took a tumble after losing to OU. They are still one of the teams in my group of 8/9 that can contend for a final four or natty. This year is pretty wide open IMO.
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West Virginia still has to travel to Waco to face Baylor. And, they could meet again in the Big 12 tournament. Not sure if Baylor beating WVU two more times knocks WVU out of the Top 25 or not, but it's worth watching.

I already stated that I'm surprised WVU came in at #14 last night with a home win against Tennessee as their best win, and a dreadful loss at home to Oklahoma on Saturday night. WVU being in the Top 16 was one of the biggest head-scratchers, IMO. Perhaps the committee considered them one of the hottest teams in the country based on their double-digit winning streak, but that ended against OU.
 
visitingcock said:
Yup, unlike last season when we were THE OFFICIAL number one seed at actual seeding time after the season had ended.

I guess we'll make this "temporary seeding banner" a different color. Maybe one square inch smaller.

Do we get another one for the next temporary seeding before the final official seeding?

Hot dawg, three potential seeding banners in one year!
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You guys can cover the arena wall to wall if you get creative enough. ;)
 
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