Collier in Minnesota

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It'll be a tough choice for the league voters to choose ROY. The award typically goes to #1 picks that lead the league in scoring. So the voter will have to choose whether they want to give the award to the player that scores a lot of points for a bad team, whose point totals will drop drastically once that team has acquired better players, becomes a contender and the offense doesn't revolve around her. A player who plays questionable defense, doesn't really make other players better around her, and needs a lot of shots in order to get her point totals. Or the voters could choose a great team player that makes everyone around her better, that doesn't need the ball in order to help her team win, who has done something in her rookie year that only 3 other players have ever done, makes life difficult on offense for the opposing team, and has the potential to be the face of the new WNBA for years to come. A forward that is also more likely to make the Olympic team. The ball is in your court voters.
 
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Pam Ward (who was the ESPN2 pbp for the last Lynx broadcast and who also gets a vote), was vehement about Collier being the ROY. Her partner in the broadcast LaChina Robinson was leaning toward Ogunbowale with all her scoring accolades. They were squabbling about it on the broadcast for a couple of minutes.
 
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Pam Ward (who was the ESPN2 pbp for the last Lynx broadcast and who also gets a vote), was vehement about Collier being the ROY. Her partner in the broadcast LaChina Robinson was leaning toward Ogunbowale with all her scoring accolades. They were squabbling about it on the broadcast for a couple of minutes.
Not too surprising. LaChina has a bit of the Debbie Antonelli fetish for high scorers.
 
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Pam Ward (who was the ESPN2 pbp for the last Lynx broadcast and who also gets a vote), was vehement about Collier being the ROY. Her partner in the broadcast LaChina Robinson was leaning toward Ogunbowale with all her scoring accolades. They were squabbling about it on the broadcast for a couple of minutes.
It was funny. LaChina was saying if she scores 30 the last night, she would have some record and then you have to give it to her. She finished with 25 so I suppose, no award. Nah, I know LaChina will (more than) lean to Arike.

Although I agree that Pheesa should win for her overall brillance on both sides and her year round consistency and efficiency, I do not agree that the team record should be a big factor. It is too much to ask for a rookie alone to affect the team record to that extent.

In an award Most Valuable Player where Value is part of the title, then team records are clearly important but not ROY in my opinion.

That said, I am glad some are using it since that will help Pheesa in the race. :oops:
 
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It'll be a touch choice for the league voters to choose ROY. The award typically goes to #1 picks that lead the league in scoring. So the voter will have to choose whether they want to give the award to the player that scores a lot of points for a bad team, whose point totals will drop drastically once that team has acquired better players, becomes a contender and the offense doesn't revolve around her. A player who plays questionable defense, doesn't really make other players better around her, and needs a lot of shots in order to get her point totals. Or the voters could choose a great team player that makes everyone around her better, that doesn't need the ball in order to help her team win, who has done something in her rookie year that only 3 other players have ever done, makes life difficult on offense for the opposing team, and has the potential to be the face of the new WNBA for years to come. A forward that is also more likely to make the Olympic team. The ball is in your court voters.
Thanks JordyG for being a voice of reason on this topic. An excellent post. I agree 100% with your observations. There's more to being the ROY than just scoring more points than the other rookies. I would submit that Napheesa Collier would have scored as many points as Arike Ogunbawole if she had taken as many shots.

When Collier scored 27 in the Lynx first game of the season, she only took 10 shots (8/10). I looked at the box scores of the Wings last few games. Ogunbowole took twice as many shots as any of her other teammates, never hitting the 50% FG% mark. She took 28 shots in a recent game against the Sky. Collier usually takes somewhere in the neighborhood of 10-13 shots a game. I wonder how many times the voters saw each one of the candidates play IN PERSON?

Hopefully the voters will take a moment to consider everything you mentioned here into consideration before casting their vote. If they do, Collier should be recognized as the 2019 WNBA Rookie of the Year. I also nominate THIS post as today's POD (Post of the Day). :)
 
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Which carries more weight, scoring more points than any other rookie, or doing something that only 3 other players have done in league history? "With Collier’s help, the Lynx earned their ninth-straight playoff appearance and will face the Seattle Storm in a single-elimination game in Seattle on Wednesday evening.
Collier’s season totals put her performance into better context: The only other rookie in WNBA history with Collier’s totals of 444 points, 223 rebounds, 87 assists, 65 steals and 32 blocks is Tamika Catchings, who reached 594 points, 275 rebounds, 118 assists, 94 steals and 43 blocks in 2002.

Such stats are impressive for any player, let alone a rookie: Collier is also one of only six WNBA players to ever record 400-plus points, 200-plus rebounds, 80-plus assists and 60-plus steals in a single season, joining Sheryl Swoopes, Lisa Leslie, Catchings, Maya Moore and Sancho Lyttle." Collier started and played in all 34 games for the Lynx. The best ability is AVAILABILITY.

The answer to this question is simple. Which dynamic will the voters value and respect more, quantity or quality? :rolleyes:
 
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MilfordHusky

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Pam Ward (who was the ESPN2 pbp for the last Lynx broadcast and who also gets a vote), was vehement about Collier being the ROY. Her partner in the broadcast LaChina Robinson was leaning toward Ogunbowale with all her scoring accolades. They were squabbling about it on the broadcast for a couple of minutes.
Then there was a sequence when Phee made a bucket inside, got a steal, and drained a three. I think that convinced LaChina.
 
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Ben Dull analysis of ROY
Stellar article. Required reading for not only the Pheesa-Arike debate, but for basketball junkies in general. An objectively written, video-enriched analysis of why each is so good and what they do for their respective teams. Props to (the inappropriately named) Mr. Dull.

All the conversation and chatter sparked by the race between the two has been truly exciting to witness. If you really strip the debate down to its core, it centers on this: Collier has been a well-rounded two-way contributor for a playoff team from game 1 to game 34. Ogunbowale found a groove in the second half of the season to finish as one of the league’s top scorers for the banged-up, lottery-bound Wings.​
This is not a 2019 redraft. Both will be extremely valuable WNBA players for a long time. While there’s value in the fact that we each see the game a little differently, you’re kidding yourself if we can’t agree on that much.​
 
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Lynx @ Storm - 9/11/19
WNBA Playoffs - First Round
Everett, WA - 10:00 PM ET
TV: ESPN2

ESPN stream:

Game page:

ESPN Gamecast:
 
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Tribune article recounting the game. A lot of praise for Naphessa

Lynx bounced from WNBA playoffs with 84-74 loss at Seattle

The loss didn't dim the future of Collier, who was named the AP rookie of the year earlier Wednesday.

"That's something only a couple other rookies [Candace Parker and Tamika Catchings] have ever done in their debut, getting a double-double," Reeve said of Collier. "Napheesa just competes. We needed her to do so many things for us today. … I'm really excited about her future."
 

UConnCat

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Fantastic season and first playoff game for Pheesa.

Another off-season of questions for the Lynx. First and foremost: Will #23 return? The other is the point guard spot. I think DRob's contract is up. She isn't the answer but what other options will the Lynx have?
 
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Fantastic season and first playoff game for Pheesa.

Another off-season of questions for the Lynx. First and foremost: Will #23 return? The other is the point guard spot. I think DRob's contract is up. She isn't the answer but what other options will the Lynx have?
 
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No guarantee Moore is coming back. Will be interesting. Time for Augustus to hang it up. Fowles is definitely dropping fast too. This could have been Sylvia’s last good year before she can’t deliver anymore. Collier had some big plays throughout the game. What a player. Dantas was a great get and an underutilized asset in Atlanta. Sims disappeared at the the most inopportune time. Has to make Reeves question her current backcourt even though both Sims and Robinson played over their heads for the season. Robinson is not a legit starter for a contender.
 
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Does anyone know what happened with the guards in the game? Robinson and Sims only had one point between them.
They were zombie eyed by the end of the game. Sims eyes were as big as an owls. Canada, Loyd and Clark owned them on defense. Very aggressive offense to complete the domination. I didn’t expect Loyd or Canada to score like that or Sims to be neutered and have her confidence drained on offense.
 
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