Chief’s Briefs - USF Edition

[zepfan]

We are a soft team upfront and our players don't shoot well enough to win against bigger, stronger players. Agree that recruiting is the issue. Coaches don't make shots for players or make them taller. Making them stronger and and smarter takes time. Moxie is also difficult to instill in a player... I think Vital came with his moxie and tenacity. Also, Jalen continues to be one dimensional, his outside shooting is not there consistently. Polley and Wilson are also not better than most teams small forwards/power forwards. Both Polley ad Wilson have to be able to bring more offense. This game was a big let down... great start then wtf.

 

[SwingDog]

Cobb and Carlton need to take the ball to the basket with authority. It's a matter of effort and intestinal fortitude.

 

[Psolo12]

I think there's plenty of effort. But hey, believe it or not one time my fat blob self played one on one with Charles Barkley. I tried really hard. But.

Fair, but it can't be that USF's big men are that more talented than ours. Maybe it is the case, but it's scary to think our talent level has fallen that far.

 

[AdamaNation]

On top of all that it seems like there's no fire and pride to rebound and play good defense albeit Yakwe from time to time. Severely disappointing.

And Christian

 

[Towney007]

I mean there's a lot of talk about pride and effort - and I'm not trying to come off as condescending, but I've worked with some pretty amazing athletes in my day and when you're just facing players who are better or you lack talent, it's really easy for the team on the receiving end to look like they don't care. When it doesn't take effort on the other team's part to do what they want to, our eyes tend to skew to the higher talent level and wonder why the other team can't hack.

That doesn't explain tonight away, but we've been seeing the same issue for three years at this point. Sometimes it just is what it is.

 

[Psolo12]

And Christian

Without a doubt, I was referring to the big men alone, Vital is a grinder and a dog who will always have my respect.

 

[Rewster]

Any team that plays appreciable harder than us will likely beat us.
Our talent and skill level is not at the level that will compensate for that at this point.

 

[Chief00]

Fair, but it can't be that USF's big men are that more talented than ours. Maybe it is the case, but it's scary to think our talent level has fallen that far.

Not putting our players down - but as Chief has been saying - we need stronger, better players.

 

[Psolo12]

Not putting our players down - but as Chief has been saying - we need stronger, better players.

That fact can no longer be questioned when we get bodied by the likes of USF.

 

[Dream Jobbed 2.0]

At this point, Jalen Adams is 2010 Jerome Dyson.

The question is: who's Kemba? Frankly, I haven't been all that impressed with Gilbert or Wilson, though there's still plenty of season to go.

Gilbert realized about 10 minutes too late all he had to do was drive and jump into someone and it’s a foul. If he started doing it when Rita and Collins did we would have held the lead. It’s up to Jalen to EITHER STEP THE HELL UP or let Al and CV start taking charge. IMO both have really good leadership qualities and Jalen...does not... there is still a minor chance to turn this year around and this is one of the keys (and rebounding and not fouling)

 

[SwingDog]

Not putting our players down - but as Chief has been saying - we need stronger, better players.

Sad that the basketball and football teams both have the same problem.

 

[Towney007]

Fair, but it can't be that USF's big men are that more talented than ours. Maybe it is the case, but it's scary to think our talent level has fallen that far.

It kind of has/hasn't. There's talent here. Adams has been a flame out and who knows why. But Gilbert is obviously really talented, but he's a first year D1 player for all intents and purposes. Ditto for Wilson. Those guys are legit. Polly can step it up, but he's inexperienced too and not that athletic so he can't do it consistently. Vital is one of those max effort that almost tries too hard sometimes and you just have to take the good with the bad. Those guys can do stuff.

What kills them is depth. There's almost no one off the bench that's good enough to play at a high level. And that depth issue really comes from the patch work job Ollie did two years ago. Then this past year in the transition, we didn't pull in much playable talent, either. So when you basically sit out two years of serious recruiting - when you're acustomed to the talent we've seen - that's going to hurt you - and maybe for longer than you'd like.

So you get this goofy limbo we have right now - where you've got really talented, inexperienced youngsters figuring their life out and under developed role payers who were really lottery tickets to begin with and a bunch of nothing after that. It's frustrating because they're at this place where everything hinges on your youngsters getting better as soon as possible and that's just asking a lot for any program minus a few.

Next year might be more of the same, but you'll have some talent that'll get better and mature and hopefully a lottery ticket that we have now gets a little better. Then the guys who are talented and starting this year, well the guys next year take their place but they're coming off the bench. Then you're in a spot where you can take a step forward. Get another recruiting class after that, well that's when the engine begins to turn over. It's just critical mass.

 

[Marbles90]

Is it too early to blame the coaching?

I agree the team has flaws and I’m not expecting miracles but I think coaching is getting exposed too - there is a lack of toughness, discipline and hustle and no matter your flaws, that should be table stakes for any competitive team. I hope this doesn’t hurt the recruiting that @Chief00 keeps talking about. I keep waiting to hear about the Kofi’s and Achiuwa’s signing elsewhere and that Akok deciding to go pro and/or the others decomitting.

 

[Psolo12]

It kind of has/hasn't. There's talent here. Adams has been a flame out and who knows why. But Gilbert is obviously really talented, but he's a first year D1 player for all intents and purposes. Ditto for Wilson. Those guys are legit. Polly can step it up, but he's inexperienced too and not that athletic so he can't do it consistently. Vital is one of those max effort that almost tries too hard sometimes and you just have to take the good with the bad. Those guys can do stuff.

What kills them is depth. There's almost no one off the bench that's good enough to play at a high level. And that depth issue really comes from the patch work job Ollie did two years ago. Then this past year in the transition, we didn't pull in much playable talent, either. So when you basically sit out two years of serious recruiting - when you're acustomed to the talent we've seen - that's going to hurt you - and maybe for longer than you'd like.

So you get this goofy limbo we have right now - where you've got really talented, inexperienced youngsters figuring their life out and under developed role payers who were really lottery tickets to begin with and a bunch of nothing after that. It's frustrating because they're at this place where everything hinges on your youngsters getting better as soon as possible and that's just asking a lot for any program minus a few.

Next year might be more of the same, but you'll have some talent that'll get better and mature and hopefully a lottery ticket that we have now gets a little better. Then the guys who are talented and starting this year, well the guys next year take their place but they're coming off the bench. Then you're in a spot where you can take a step forward. Get another recruiting class after that, well that's when the engine begins to turn over. It's just critical mass.

Very well put. I trust that Hurley is the one to see us through this process, but it hurts none the less seeing our storied program get out-classed down low by a team like USF.

 

[Towney007]

Very well put. I trust that Hurley is the one to see us through this process, but it hurts none the less seeing our storied program get out-classed down low by a team like USF.

And the other thing is - look.

These are great kids. They all stayed. Imagine what this would be like had we lost anyone really. And it speaks to Hurley's characters that he was so adamant that this be the team he rolled with. They believe in him. They bought in. They're here.

But they know better than anyone that they don't have the ammo. They do. I remember when I played prep hockey at Salisbury when we were an up and coming hockey program and we just weren't as good as say - Cushing was at that time. And we'd go up there - a team that played on a big rink built for speed going to a team on a small rink with guys who were huge, and we knew what was coming. And we went out and got our heads kicked in ruthlessly. And we moped a bit, or skated a little slower when their guys would get an open ice hit and some dude who was 6'2 without skates would scoop up the loose puck on a break away. You know it's coming, you can't do anything about it and you know it's going to keep on hppening.

And that kind of thing on a basketball court has been happening for three years to these kids. And part of Hurley's best hope with that is trying to gradually program that out of them. But that doesn't go away overnight and sometimes it never goes away.

Doesn't matter what his subs are, his system, none of it. And even when the guys buy into that can't quit attitude, i'm not sure the results will be dramatically different. Maybe a little better, but only a little bit.

It just comes down to talent and Hurley having the personnel that can do the things in his system he wants to without that kind of taint caked all over them. And hopefully they start to see results. He's rebuilt two teams and made URI a top 25 team. He can do it. But it doesn't happen overnight.

 

[Sportsfan71]

Is it too early to blame the coaching?

Not the coaching, it’s the groceries

 

[Psolo12]

And the other thing is - look.

These are great kids. They all stayed. Imagine what this would be like had we lost anyone really. And it speaks to Hurley's characters that he was so adamant that this be the team he rolled with. They believe in him. They bought in. They're here.

But they know better than anyone that they don't have the ammo. They do. I remember when I played prep hockey at Salisbury when we were an up and coming hockey program and we just weren't as good as say - Cushing was at that time. And we'd go up there - a team that played on a big rink built for speed going to a team on a small rink with guys who were huge, and we knew what was coming. And we went out and got our heads kicked in ruthlessly. And we moped a bit, or skated a little slower when their guys would get an open ice hit and some dude who was 6'2 without skates would scoop up the loose puck on a break away. You know it's coming, you can't do anything about it and you know it's going to keep on hppening.

And that kind of thing on a basketball court has been happening for three years to these kids. And part of Hurley's best hope with that is trying to gradually program that out of them. But that doesn't go away overnight and sometimes it never goes away.

Doesn't matter what his subs are, his system, none of it. And even when the guys buy into that can't quit attitude, i'm not sure the results will be dramatically different. Maybe a little better, but only a little bit.

It just comes down to talent and Hurley having the personnel that can do the things in his system he wants to without that kind of taint caked all over them. And hopefully they start to see results. He's rebuilt two teams and made URI a top 25 team. He can do it. But it doesn't happen overnight.

Couldn't agree more. His first years changing the culture at a new program have not gone well historically, but to be cliche we're just going to have to trust the process. It may hurt like a son of a b on the way, but in the end hopefully the reward will be worth the suffering.

 

[FlakeyFoont]

Carlton is following the Philip Nolan trajectory - a mediocre freshman eventually blossoms into a mediocre senior. We just have to be patient as he's not quite there yet.

 

[Bonk]

Why is Hurley not getting more blame for this? Just curious

 

[Psolo12]

Why is Hurley not getting more blame for this? Just curious

Is Hurley supposed to make our frontcourt bigger, stronger, better at basketball, be able to play defense, have better footwork, and have a decent basketball IQ?

 

[Towney007]

Why is Hurley not getting more blame for this? Just curious

I think the question should be what the expectation is.

Because these aren't his players. Not really designed to play his system. He subs, he calls timeouts, he yells, he motivates. He gets T'd up.

At a point he just can't do everything for them. He's got what he's got but no one on the team is capable of stringing together good games consecutively never mind in consort. It's like playing whack a mole.

 

[Ts5034]

Why is Hurley not getting more blame for this? Just curious

Because 98% of the roster is made up of Ollie’s recruits.

 

[Edward Sargent]

South Florida killed us on the offensive boards. That was the key to the game. They played their style and tempo. We don’t have strong guys and lost the 50/50 balls.

At some point we realized with the refs calling it close - to take it to the rim. But it was too late and we were down by 11.

Chief’s goal was to finish the first half strong and get in at halftime up by double figures. We failed that test due to some late turnovers and not boxing out. But, give USF credit, they get after it on the boards. Thankfully, they aren’t a good foul shooting team, but they did improve in that area in the second half and it was all downhill from that point.

I still don’t understand the benefit of a 6-10 guy chasing a guard down 25 feet from the basket. Fortunately, USF did not take advantage of the Big on guard mismatch that this creates inside but a good offensive team would.

Both Carlton and Wilson need to go up stronger on their offensive moves. Cobb played tentative but having said that - he needs to play at least 25 minutes a game.

Rideau was the key to the game, he was aggressive and physically stronger than our guards. Over-all USF just outmuscle us and was more aggressive. Jacobs was right about Yetna. He murdered us. They got the crowd in the game, and Chief can remember years there when it was a UConn crowd.

Polley was a huge disappointment tonight. He had a ton of open looks and either turned them down or missed open shots. Your “best shooter” can’t perform like that.

Vital and Adams played good at times but not consistently. Gilbert played good defense.

Get ready to criticize me, but the first priority this year is recruiting. We need stronger, more talented players with good BB IQs.

Couple of added thoughts;
On rebounding we lost at least a half dozen rebounds off their missed free throws! At one point (I was in Section 103 Row B) we had four guys on the free throw line adjusting their shorts and lost the rebound to the one USF guy!
We had no answer to Rideau
Polly and Sid had bad shooting nights.
We missed all our one and ones
They were under 50% for FT in the first half
At one point with USF shooting free throws Eric is standing at half court - again adjusting his shorts when Jalen shoves him a bit and points to the box where he should have been.
Whats with the shorts? Can't we get them unis that fit?

 

[Jimdish255]

Unfortunately Hurley can't give Polley back his shooting confidence, or Carlton the instincts and quick feet he never had. Cobb proved again tonight to be a better option but when guys are missing bunnies and making sloppy passes and not getting enough boards Hurley gets the benefit. He's making some changes but the guys have to win games like tonight. They failed.

 

[Coach J]

I only got to watch the last 15 minutes, but it looked a lot like last year's KO offense. Basically trying to take their man one on one with whoever had the ball. Not a good look, not a way to win conference games.

 

[Edward Sargent]

It kind of has/hasn't. There's talent here. Adams has been a flame out and who knows why. But Gilbert is obviously really talented, but he's a first year D1 player for all intents and purposes. Ditto for Wilson. Those guys are legit. Polly can step it up, but he's inexperienced too and not that athletic so he can't do it consistently. Vital is one of those max effort that almost tries too hard sometimes and you just have to take the good with the bad. Those guys can do stuff.

What kills them is depth. There's almost no one off the bench that's good enough to play at a high level. And that depth issue really comes from the patch work job Ollie did two years ago. Then this past year in the transition, we didn't pull in much playable talent, either. So when you basically sit out two years of serious recruiting - when you're acustomed to the talent we've seen - that's going to hurt you - and maybe for longer than you'd like.

So you get this goofy limbo we have right now - where you've got really talented, inexperienced youngsters figuring their life out and under developed role payers who were really lottery tickets to begin with and a bunch of nothing after that. It's frustrating because they're at this place where everything hinges on your youngsters getting better as soon as possible and that's just asking a lot for any program minus a few.

Next year might be more of the same, but you'll have some talent that'll get better and mature and hopefully a lottery ticket that we have now gets a little better. Then the guys who are talented and starting this year, well the guys next year take their place but they're coming off the bench. Then you're in a spot where you can take a step forward. Get another recruiting class after that, well that's when the engine begins to turn over. It's just critical mass.

Townes we lost to a team of Freshmen and Sophs

 

[uconnbill]

lack of overall hustle bothers me the most

 

[AdamaNation]

Not putting our players down - but as Chief has been saying - we need stronger, better players.

I’ll take one of these 2

 

[ASweet3781]

Why is Hurley not getting more blame for this? Just curious

Because this board always has to complicate everything. Former coach vs current coach vs players. The same tiring blame game with posters picking the side their on.

It's all of their fault.

Ollie for the mess he assembled. The core group of players the last 3 years who sadly will be the first group to leave this program worse off than when they arrived. I cannot believe what they have done to this program. I no longer recognize it. They have infested this program with a DNA of incompetence, humiliating defeats, and bad low basketball IQ basketball. Some of these guys have been playing 2-4 years here and have not fixed their flaws or gotten better at anything. And yes Hurley gets some blame here too. He gets paid a lot of money to win games and he wasn't facing a good or even decent team tonight. They played poor and still had a lead at the half and they came out and played worse. He shouldn't get a pass by any means for bad losses in winnable games just because they aren't his players. Every game matters.

 

[Chief00]

More than a skills deficiency, we don’t have enough guys with strength and physicality. If we could shoot and take care of the ball, we could offset this some. USF just beat the heck out of us - our guys are just not of sufficient physical stature to win this type of game.