Chances of both Daniels and Boatright returning next year??

[Walker11]

As to the guy saying Boat will not de a first rounder bc Bazz is projected end of the first/early second - you do realize how wildly inaccurate mock drafts are, right? Best to take a wait and see approach. I wouldn't be surprised if he rises to the middle of the first.

 

[Rico444]

Potentially...It's only a bad move if Daniels is a 1st rounder this year. There is no guarantee and it only takes one team, but most people have him going in the latter part of the second round. He does not hurt his value by coming back unless he breaks his coccyx or something.

If DD is actually a late second-rounder, then he's obviously coming back. You're too focused on online mock drafts; those are far from gospel. I don't know that DD is a first-rounder, but if he's projected in the late first by scouts then it's not at all a bad idea to jump, and his stock next year could absolutely drop if he doesn't consistently play great his senior year.

 

[BlueMAB]

I just check 6 separate Mock drafts. Granted that 3 of them were CBS's and haven't been updated in 3 weeks, but Daniels was not to found in any of them, even the ones that predicted both rounds. Daniels has to declare by the 27th, so we will know within 2 weeks. Tomorrow is the deadline to return to school if the player has already declared.

If it's on the internet it must be true.

 

[PcketknfNiels]

Well, there are no practice maximums and what not. A ton of development takes place in the league.

Not during the season, for the reasons I stated. Regardless, how many NBA teams have the track record for development that UConn has

 

[PcketknfNiels]

Popovich is not working out the Spurs' young guys on the mornings of game days. That's why they have a staff of coaches. You're kidding yourself if you think a young kid - a young kid a team has invested in for the future - is not getting a lot more focused instruction in the NBA than he would be in college.

Are you talking about the same franchise that routinely stashes young prospects in Europe specifically because the Spurs themselves think theyll develop more there than by their own staff? Ok, just making sure.

 

[BigErnMcCracken]

Are you talking about the same franchise that routinely stashes young prospects in Europe specifically because the Spurs themselves think theyll develop more there than by their own staff? Ok, just making sure.

Yup, the very same. It sounds like you think you made some sort of point - I'd take another look if I were you. It's always entertaining to hear the uninformed lecture others about how informed they are.

 

[PcketknfNiels]

It's not that I doubt Daniels would make a team. That is irrelevant. Second rounders don't get a guaranteed contract. Big Baby has made a nice little career for himself and has a championship ring.

2nd rounders like him and Arenas are physically ready and pretty much are who they are when they got drafted. Daniels still has some developing to do, and unless you're a very high pick that the team is heavily invested in the player usually doesn't get that opportunity

 

[tzznandrew]

Yup, the very same. It sounds like you think you made some sort of point - I'd take another look if I were you. It's always entertaining to hear the uninformed lecture others about how informed they are.

It feels like a lot of people who disparage the NBA haven't really watched since the 1999-2005 period. When people talk about how little defense is played, or how players don't develop, or things of the sort, it's like they haven't realized how the game has evolved at the pro level.

Thankfully, KO does.

 

[PcketknfNiels]

Yup, the very same. It sounds like you think you made some sort of point - I'd take another look if I were you. It's always entertaining to hear the uninformed lecture others about how informed they are.

Not even sure how you can attempt to refute that. Whatever it takes to argue though, right?

It's cute that you think DD will be a 2nd round pick and get all this massive development time. How'd that ever work put for Price or Adrien?

Sad that people can't discuss things like this without getting chippy about it.

 

[PcketknfNiels]

Wesley Johnson was like 24 and a top 10 pick. Being a 4 year player doesn't matter if you both have good numbers and what scouts/gm's discern to be nba skills.

Just going to bump this back up for anyone who thinks age is a total nonstarter when it comes to being a high pick.

 

[James]

KO is probably the best coach for this kind of consultation. he isn't like damn boeheim throwing his players under the bus. it really depends on how DD works out for individual teams, some gm's might already have an eye on him late first round. Go for it if so. Honestly don't know if DD has the drive to survive being a 2nd round pick and to fight for his life/contract. I hate that belmont shores dude, and the fact that he is connected to dham enrages me.

 

[PcketknfNiels]

It feels like a lot of people who disparage the NBA haven't really watched since the 1999-2005 period. When people talk about how little defense is played, or how players don't develop, or things of the sort, it's like they haven't realized how the game has evolved at the pro level.

Thankfully, KO does.

Perry Jones, Jeremy Lamb, Johnny Flynn, Joe Alexander, etc. Are all guys who never were or having yet been given proper chances in the NBA. If Daniels comes back, he'll improve his draft stock. He was in most cases the number 3 guy this year, next year he'll be 1 or 1a. More shot attempts=more points on a consistent basis. And he'll get guaranteed development on the floor, which is something he won't get for at least a couple of years if he jumps to the nba now.

 

[tzznandrew]

Perry Jones, Jeremy Lamb, Johnny Flynn, Joe Alexander, etc. Are all guys who never were or having yet been given proper chances in the NBA. If Daniels comes back, he'll improve his draft stock. He was in most cases the number 3 guy this year, next year he'll be 1 or 1a. More shot attempts=more points on a consistent basis. And he'll get guaranteed development on the floor, which is something he won't get for at least a couple of years if he jumps to the nba now.

Perry Jones was drafted around 30, to a great team. Who should he consistently play over?

Lamb does very well when he gets minutes. He doesn't get a ton of minutes. That means he's not developing?

Sorry, Johnny Flynn was terrible. He was given all the time in the world to run a team in the league, and was putrid. Next thing you know, you're going to point to Austin Rivers. Flynn, Alexander, Telfair, Rivers, etc. are more examples of bad NBA talent evaluators on certain teams than bad talent developers.

 

[PcketknfNiels]

Perry Jones was drafted around 30, to a great team. Who should he consistently play over?

Lamb does very well when he gets minutes. He doesn't get a ton of minutes. That means he's not developing?

Sorry, Johnny Flynn was terrible. He was given all the time in the world to run a team in the league, and was putrid. Next thing you know, you're going to point to Austin Rivers. Flynn, Alexander, Telfair, Rivers, etc. are more examples of bad NBA talent evaluators on certain teams than bad talent developers.

Both Jones and Lamb are on a team that gives big minutes to a washed up Perk and Fisher. Great team but very little depth. Hard to believe they can't find more than 12mpg for a guy who was in the discussion of being a top pick that year.

My point on Flynn was that he showed absolutely no development. Even if he was never destined to be a star, he didn't show improvement in any area of his game.

And Alexander was a prime example of never being given the opportunity, do you not remember how he destroyed us in 09, and particularly, the scoring versatility he seemed to have?

 

[Walker11]

If you have watched Lamb play for the Thunder and think he hasn't developed you should pick a new sport.

You can pick a guy who hasn't developed and I can pick two who have. How bout Lamb's teammate Reggie Jackson.

 

[Alexander]

Like many have said already, I just don't want to see DD declare if he's not virtually guaranteed a first round selection. With that said, I find it hard to believe that he'd be promised a first round selection by a team given the range of consistent role players already ahead of him in the draft. Shabazz's draft placement will be a mystery to me until workouts and the draft itself. I can see him going as high as the early twenties. Hope he goes late twenties to the likes of the Spurs/Heat.

 

[tzznandrew]

Both Jones and Lamb are on a team that gives big minutes to a washed up Perk and Fisher. Great team but very little depth. Hard to believe they can't find more than 12mpg for a guy who was in the discussion of being a top pick that year.

My point on Flynn was that he showed absolutely no development. Even if he was never destined to be a star, he didn't show improvement in any area of his game.

And Alexander was a prime example of never being given the opportunity, do you not remember how he destroyed us in 09, and particularly, the scoring versatility he seemed to have?

About Alexander, I remember that. But just because you can do something in college but can't do it in the pros, doesn't mean you haven't actually improved. The talent jump is enormous, and most college players can't make the leap. Playing basketball all the time, and against the best, makes you better. Flynn just didn't have a skill-set that translates well to the pro level. Doesn't mean he didn't get better. The opposite happens all the time: think Michael Carter-Williams, or even someone like Rudy Gay. Sure, they got much better, but their skill set hampered them in college, and allowed them to blossom in the NBA.

Scott Brooks is a strange coach. I don't like his substitution patterns. But the fact that Lamb doesn't get minutes doesn't mean he didn't get better. He added a passing ability he never showed in college. He's going to be a good pro...the Thunder are just not giving him minutes because they seem to (in my eyes) over-value the "veteran leadership" of Fisher and Perkins.

 

[Husky25]

I'm not focused on anything in particular. I checked the mocks just to get a feel for where the "experts'" heads are. Bottom line for me is if Daniels or Boatright are not sure fire first rounders, I'd say return to school and entertain me in the process.

 

[tzznandrew]

I'm not focused on anything in particular. I checked the mocks just to get a feel for where the "experts'" heads are. Bottom line for me is if Daniels or Boatright are not sure fire first rounders, I'd say return to school and entertain me in the process.

Yeah. I largely agree. If you're likely to be in the Top 20, you should definitely go. If not, your best bet is to come back. I hate that Coach K got the deadlines pushed forward. It hampers students way too much, and forces them into more difficult draft decisions than there really needed to be.

 

[huskyharry]

There is a lot of truth on both sides of the argument listed above. It is harder to get drafted at a high position when you are older. DD's draft projection is likely bolstered by the team's success and his individual success in some of the games.
However, many here are blinded by prior UCONN players' success in the draft. There are only 30 slots in the first round and only 1st round selections get guaranteed contracts...pick #31 can be cut during training camp and get a minimal payment. Somewhere between 3 and 10 of those first round picks will go to players from overseas.
There are roughly 350 teams in Division 1. Beings selected as a first round pick is very rare.

It is certainly true that the NBA Draft sites can be inaccurate. However, currently, NONE of these sites show DD in the first round. It is widely reported that this year's draft has a higher quality of draftees than the typical draft and also has greater depth. Because of this, DD could play exactly the same next year and end up being drafted higher. In this context, if he improves his handle and plays more consistently, it appears very likely that he should move up.
If he were to receive a guarantee from an NBA team that he will be drafted in the 1st round (as Andrew Bynum did from the Lakers), then he should certainly go. But these types of guarantees are extremely rare for players who are borderline 1st to 2nd rounders (typically given to projected Lottery picks.

If he declares, I will root like heck for him to be selected in the first round and root like heck for him to make a roster if he doesn't. But, just making a roster is a far cry from being a 1st round pick and getting guaranteed $ for three years.

 

[BigErnMcCracken]

Not even sure how you can attempt to refute that. Whatever it takes to argue though, right?

It's cute that you think DD will be a 2nd round pick and get all this massive development time. How'd that ever work put for Price or Adrien?

Sad that people can't discuss things like this without getting chippy about it.

You're not responding to anything that I said. I didn't say a thing about DeAndre or the second round or anything like that. You said that NBA teams are too busy during the season - "3in4s" and whatever else - to spend time on player development. I know that to be 100% untrue so I said as much.

Your response was that the Spurs stash kids in Europe therefore I'm wrong. But you leave out the fact that they stash them in Europe to play professional basketball, not go to college.

 

[champs99and04]

IMO, neither the NBA nor college basketball is an ideal environment for the development of younger players (like Daniels). In college basketball, the drawbacks are obvious - practice time is restricted, facilities generally aren't as good, and on top of that, you have to devote a large portion of your time to maintaining a certain GPA that could otherwise be used to expand your game. Additionally, many of the less endearing qualities of the college game - the packed in zones, the over-coaching, the general lack of fluidity - aren't conducive to player development.

But let's also not act like the NBA is some sort of sanctuary of teaching. If you're Andrew Wiggins or Jabari Parker, you can rest assured that whoever franchise your drafted by is going to squeeze everything out of you. It is just too big an investment not to direct every conceivable resource into the development of that player. But what if you're Jeremy Lamb? Posters above have mentioned that he's developed, and that's true. But did he develop at the rate he would have had he stayed here? I don't think so. And that's precisely the problem a lot of young NBA players have - sometimes, the talent of their teammates is so extraordinary (Durant & Westbrook) that they're rendered specialists by the time they step on an NBA floor. I've watched the Thunder a lot the past couple years, and aside from a brief period in which Westbrook was injured, Lamb's basically been designated to the role of spot-up shooter. More problematic, he doesn't play enough to maximize his potential. If he were here, he'd be the focal point of the offense - and would thus enter the NBA with a more diverse skill set - that would have undoubtedly expanded his game under Ollie the same way he would have under Brooks. Andre Drummond is in a similar boat - with another year or two of college, he likely enters the league with a better post game.

Ideally, a legitimate minor league system would be developed (the D-League isn't it, at least right now) where the development of skills would be prioritized above everything else (including winning, which clearly isn't the case in the NBA or college basketball).

Don't get me wrong, the NBA is as entertaining a product as it has ever been. But when guys like Anthony Bennett #1 in the draft, and like clockwork, every year, somebody with strikingly raw skills enters the draft, it conveys one thing: a broken system. Either start paying college kids (which is probably a long way from happening) or adopt a system like that of the MLB or NHL.

How does this relate to Daniels? Well, if the kid is a first rounder, he should go - all else aside, it's guaranteed money that would set him for life if managed properly. But for the sake of his development, I think he'd be better served here next season than bouncing around the D-League.

 

[PcketknfNiels]

If you have watched Lamb play for the Thunder and think he hasn't developed you should pick a new sport.

You can pick a guy who hasn't developed and I can pick two who have. How bout Lamb's teammate Reggie Jackson.

Look, if you want to disagree with me on Daniels, that's fine. Don't sit here and try to pigeonhole me like I've ever said that nobody ever develops or improves in the NBA ever.

Also, the people arguing that Daniels stock is at it's peak due to winning the title are wrong. Winning the title garners more attention for the team, but it still comes down to the players performance and projectable skills.

Age is not a factor either, there have been plenty of 4 year players or otherwise old for their class players who have been picked highly through the years.

The case for Daniels going this year really boils down to whether you think he's actually a top 20 prospect RIGHT NOW. There isn't a shred of existing evidence that would suggest so. Now, if Ollie or Daniels or anyone else involved get a solid commitment that he will be, then he should go no question. However, if that turns out not to be the case, he needs to come back and put up a more consistent year on a team that will be tailored for him to do so. He also needs to at least TRY to add some muscle, as he doesn't really have an nba body right now.


If anyone wants go continue to argue whether the NBA develops as well as college, go ahead. There are dozens of cases to be made for either side and no definitive point to be made. Futhermore, it's irrelevant to the situation Daniels is in until he makes a decision whether to stay or declare. We can't even project where he'll be picked, how can any of us project how he will or won't develop?

Like I've said, I personally hope he comes back because I think it's the best chance for him to secure himself a long NBA career. If he decides to go I'll wish him the best and hope for the best.

 

[PcketknfNiels]

You're not responding to anything that I said. I didn't say a thing about DeAndre or the second round or anything like that. You said that NBA teams are too busy during the season - "3in4s" and whatever else - to spend time on player development. I know that to be 100% untrue so I said as much.

Your response was that the Spurs stash kids in Europe therefore I'm wrong. But you leave out the fact that they stash them in Europe to play professional basketball, not go to college.

And I brought up the fact that the Spurs keep prospects in Europe specifically because the spurs themselves feel like playera will develop more there than on their roster. Kind of point proven.

Not like you really said anything that needed to be responded to beyond just disagreeing anyways...

 

[Gurleyman]

And I brought up the fact that the Spurs keep prospects in Europe specifically because the spurs themselves feel like playera will develop more there than on their roster. Kind of point proven.

Not like you really said anything that needed to be responded to beyond just disagreeing anyways...

They stash players in Europe so they maintain their rights but don't have to pay them. They don't count against the cap, but if they develop and want to come to the NBA, they aren't free agents.

 

[Walker11]

I think often the guys who can develop the most in college are guys who perhaps lack confidence and need to grow mentally and emotionally. I completey agree that DD could raise his stock next year. I just think its stupid to think college develops players better than the NBA.

As for champs post, I think Lamb developed a ton in the D league. I watched him play there and he was running the point some and always the go to guy. I bet he developed there more than he would have at Uconn.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

If you have watched Lamb play for the Thunder and think he hasn't developed you should pick a new sport.

You can pick a guy who hasn't developed and I can pick two who have. How bout Lamb's teammate Reggie Jackson.

Both first round picks. Teams put a lot of money into first round picks, so they will be more patient and throw some coaching resources against those players. Second round players are on their own to a large extent. There is not a lot of money invested in their development, and if one doesn't make it, there are 20 more that will kill each other for the chance to step in.

 

[PcketknfNiels]

I think often the guys who can develop the most in college are guys who perhaps lack confidence and need to grow mentally and emotionally. I completey agree that DD could raise his stock next year. I just think its stupid to think college develops players better than the NBA.

As for champs post, I think Lamb developed a ton in the D league. I watched him play there and he was running the point some and always the go to guy. I bet he developed there more than he would have at Uconn.

Didn't watch his D league play but did he develop as much there as he did from his Fr-So year at UConn?

 

[johnhuskies95]

Not even sure how you can attempt to refute that. Whatever it takes to argue though, right?

It's cute that you think DD will be a 2nd round pick and get all this massive development time. How'd that ever work put for Price or Adrien?

Sad that people can't discuss things like this without getting chippy about it.

Adrien has been given playing time right now on the Bucks, and he's been playing very well.

Do you honestly think a guy like DeAndre Jordan would've been better off developing at Texas A&M as opposed to the Clippers?

 

[Walker11]

Didn't watch his D league play but did he develop as much there as he did from his Fr-So year at UConn?

From the beginning of Fr year to the end of sophomore year, definitely not. His jump was enormous. That said, I think a lot of that leap was dependent on him gaining the confidence and realizing how good he could be. This was a kid who didn't even start in high school til his sr year. I think him paired w Kemba was his perfect scenario.