bryce mcneal

[Palatine]

I find it funny that in a week where we see an institution get knocked down because it put football success before doing the right thing, that people want to see football be put ahead of doing things the right way...

Im not saying that letting someone into a Grad program with preferential treatment will get us to where PSU was, but that culture had to start somewhere

That is a very long leap. The two are NOT comparable.

 

[rich1122]

We aren't the Ivy League. If you want this school to be successful in athletics this is something you need to accommodate. It might effect a handful of kids a year. Just make the room.

Wrong

 

[pj]

Grad departments would accept a dog into the program if it got them an extra $1 million in research funding. A great wide receiver might be worth $1m in income to the university. So, if decision-making is solely in the hands of the department and they don't take into account benefits to other parts of the university, the dog would get in ahead of the wide receiver, even though the wide receiver was more valuable to the university and the grad program.

 

[junglehusky]

Having been in grad school, I think it's fair to say grad programs are looking for students who can carry out work (research, publishing) with professors both independently and as part of collaborative teams, competently teach undergrads, compete for fellowships, and have shown a desire to specialize in one field. So it might not be simply a grades issue that's keeping McNeil from being accepted immediately to whichever grad program he applied to.

 

[metsfan2323]

I find it funny that in a week where we see an institution get knocked down because it put football success before doing the right thing, that people want to see football be put ahead of doing things the right way...

Im not saying that letting someone into a Grad program with preferential treatment will get us to where PSU was, but that culture had to start somewhere

Admissions are somewhat arbitrary in nature. What is the downside to admitting someone to the school who might not have otherwise gotten in? To me the biggest downside is he flunks out. That would hardly be a stain on the grad school. I'm sure there are plenty of students who have nothing to do with athletics who flunk out or just drop out of UCONN's grad schools every year.

Please, comparing this to Penn State is just....

 

[Jimmy Serrano]

Having been in grad school, I think it's fair to say grad programs are looking for students who can carry out work (research, publishing) with professors both independently and as part of collaborative teams, competently teach undergrads, compete for fellowships, and have shown a desire to specialize in one field. So it might not be simply a grades issue that's keeping McNeil from being accepted immediately to whichever grad program he applied to.

I hope to God that the admissions area isn't reading his twitter account.......

 

[metsfan2323]

Just a general question for anyone who can answer this. Lets say the Law school normally accepts 50 students to its school per year. Could they in any given year accept 51?

 

[Santini35]

That is a very long leap. The two are NOT comparable.

Not in severity, but the underlying idea of, screw the correct way to act when it comes to how we run academics we just wanna win football games, is at its heart similar

 

[metsfan2323]

Not in severity, but the underlying idea of, screw the correct way to act when it comes to how we run academics we just wanna win football games, is at its heart similar

What does the Sandusky case have to do with academics? That had to do with the correct way to act when there is a major crime on campus.

I don't think anyone is saying UCONN should accept someone into the grad program even if that person is grossly underqualified, but if this is a case of yes he meets the qualifications but we had our heart set on accepting this other kid who we feel is more qualified, then in that case an exception should be made to support athletics. I doubt P would be going to bat for the kid if there were a major academics problem.

 

[Santini35]

When people are making statements like this

"We aren't the Ivy League. If you want this school to be successful in athletics this is something you need to accommodate. It might effect a handful of kids a year. Just make the room."

Where does it stop?

Is fake classes okay too? It'll make us more successful in athletics if our athletes stay "eligible"


Thread after thread people have decried the insular JoePa is a God mentality that exists at PSU, but where do you think this sort of thing started? Win at all cost mentality starts with something small like this. If you dont keep it in check, somewhere down the line that mentality can eventually lead to some very bad things

 

[pj]

Santini, I admire your desire for integrity, but don't think scholarship dominates other considerations. Academics are, as a rule, obsessed with money and status, and will sacrifice scholarly and research integrity for either. I expect "What's in it for us" has a lot more to do with a grad department refusing him admission than "Only scholarship should matter."

 

[metsfan2323]

Let us all remember that UCONN's rise in stature over the last 20 years is largely due to the success of its athletics department.

 

[junglehusky]

Let us all remember that UCONN's rise in stature over the last 20 years is largely due to the success of its athletics department.

I would say UConn's rise in stature is largely coincident with the success of its athletics department. The two are related for sure, but one is not causative of the other. The main factor for both has been funding from the state along with donors.

 

[MilliniumPrince]

Admission processes at reputable programs are not very arbitrary. The graduate admission process is certainly more difficult than the undergrad process. Top rank graduate programs earn those rankings in large part because of the high academic levels of their students.

I hope Bryce ends up here, but not because we lowered standards and cut corners. That is the path to ruin for institutions of higher learning.

 

[Adios]

We are now considered a "public Ivy". Same turf as UNC, UVA, California, UMichigan, etc. Not as well-endowed as them. That's still a rep the school would want to protect. I could imagine Herbst plans on advancing the school through our now prestigious academic standing. Who'd ever have imagined this? UConn was still a tough school before we ever won a national title in basketball. Plenty of people I knew ended up getting booted.

 

[metsfan2323]

I would say UConn's rise in stature is largely coincident with the success of its athletics department. The two are related for sure, but one is not causative of the other. The main factor for both has been funding from the state along with donors.

Just a coincidence. Sorry but you are wrong. I'm sure its a coincidence at these other schools too. Please take a moment to read. Butler's final four appearances were worth 1.2 billion to the school. Amazing.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flutie_Effect

George Mason
Another school alleged to have experienced the "Flutie Effect" was George Mason University, following their 2005–06 basketball team's advancement to the "Final Four" of the 2006 NCAA Men's Division I Basketball Tournament as an 11th seed.[6]
[edit] Appalachian State

ASU had a "Flutie Effect" after winning multiple Division I-AA Championships and upsetting Michigan with Armanti Edwards as their quarterback.
[edit] Boise State

Boise State University experienced an effect similar to the "Flutie Effect" after their 43-42 overtime victory over Oklahoma in the 2007 Fiesta Bowl. The game capped an undefeated season and a top-5 finish by Boise State, a team not considered to be a traditional football power. Online inquiries about the school increased 135 percent, and graduate school application inquiries increased tenfold. Boise State also enrolled over 19,000 students the next fall, an all-time high. [7]
[edit] Northern Iowa

Another school that was reported to have experienced a similar "Flutie Effect" as a result of a basketball accomplishment was the University of Northern Iowa. In the 2010 NCAA Tournament, the Panthers sprung an upset of top-ranked Kansas. The game and the national exposure that went with it led to massive increases in donations, website traffic, and e-commerce for the athletic department, and a 30 percent increase in calls to UNI's admissions office on the Monday after the upset.[8]
[edit] Butler University

Two studies estimated that television, print, and online news coverage of Butler University's men's basketball team's 2010 and 2011 appearances in the NCAA tournament championship game resulted in additional publicity for the university worth about $1.2 billion. In an example of the "Flutie Effect", applications rose by 41% after the 2010 appearance.[5]

 

[junglehusky]

Let me clarify - they are related as I said, but one is not causative of the other. That's what I mean by coincident (happening at the same time). The cause is money / funding. I will concede that donors / alumni give more after a successful athletic season. But I'm guessing for UConn that most of the endowed professorships and large gifts for a new building happen about as often during periods of less athletic success as they do in periods of Final Fours or BCS games.

I did read the wikipedia article. Interestingly, the second paragraph of the section on the Flutie effect specifically at BC is actually questioning the legitimacy of the effect as being a fallacy that's repeated by the media. However I do think there is a demonstrated increase in undergrad applications after athletic success as shown in the other examples, and as we've seen here at UConn. But how long does it last? Two years maybe? Long term, established gains in both athletics and academics need the same thing - funding. In the case of UConn, both academic and athletic funding increased over the same period of time.

 

[rich1122]

Last thing and I'll leave it. Honestly I hope the this kid gets accepted, even if he was never to play for us, and applaud the fact that he graduated in 3 years. He deserves the best. Kids need to graduate - bottom line.

I know for a fact that Pharmacy takes 100 probably not 101. NEAG has a limit and it is one of the best Education schools in the country. Nursing, Engineering etc. are all competitive. If me or one of my kids did NOT get accepted then we would have a right to be pi$$ed. Yes??

Good luck Bryce and (hopefully) welcome aboard.

 

[gioff23]

Can I ask a dumb question for those more attuned to the school's academics - don't you get this answer before the kid announces he is oming? We have known for 7 months he chose UConn - this could not have been a shock to PP to find about one day reading the Boneyard. So, don't you do some due diligence - do we have a grad program Clemson does not; can he get in; will he - BEFORE August?

 

[Jimmy Serrano]

Can I ask a dumb question for those more attuned to the school's academics - don't you get this answer before the kid announces he is oming? We have known for 7 months he chose UConn - this could not have been a shock to PP to find about one day reading the Boneyard. So, don't you do some due diligence - do we have a grad program Clemson does not; can he get in; will he - BEFORE August?

He committed to us in Feb I believe. He didn't finish classes at Clemson until this summer. So there was no way to know, prior to graduting, what his academic standing would be.

 

[rich1122]

He committed to us in Feb I believe. He didn't finish classes at Clemson until this summer. So there was no way to know, prior to graduting, what his academic standing would be.

+1

 

[junglehusky]

Oh, one other note that I forgot but was mentioned today in John Silver's huskieblog: McNeal would have to enroll in a grad program that is not offered at Clemson. So that probably restricts things quite a bit.

 

[Jimmy Serrano]

Oh, one other note that I forgot but was mentioned today in John Silver's huskieblog: McNeal would have to enroll in a grad program that is not offered at Clemson. So that probably restricts things quite a bit.

Well, that should've been known when he committed in Feb.

 

[gioff23]

+1

That's a cop out. We signed 20 kids in February under the assumption they would graduate from HS. We screened them academically before they signed the LOI. This is a kid graduating in 3 years - not a big leap to assume he will graduate and have a backpocket answer as to whether he is eligible, when he graduates. If he didn't graduate, he can't go anywhere w/o sitting a year.

 

[rich1122]

That's a cop out. We signed 20 kids in February under the assumption they would graduate from HS. We screened them academically before they signed the LOI. This is a kid graduating in 3 years - not a big leap to assume he will graduate and have a backpocket answer as to whether he is eligible, when he graduates. If he didn't graduate, he can't go anywhere w/o sitting a year.

Maybe we are just making a mountain out of a mole hill and we can see what happens when camp breaks.