Billy Donovan to Kentucky? NM

[Jaydumo20]

I didn't have particularly strong feelings about them one way or another during the Tubby Smith era.

I agree. I think it's a knee jerk reaction of any sports fans to act like they don't like other programs, especially the great ones. A few years ago I was in Wisconsin and was talking to someone or other and I mentioned I went to UConn and they made the anti-vampire finger cross sign and said "oh no. Stay away" I thought, am I missing something that happened between WI and CT?
I have no beef with kentucky, or Cal. I only care about UConn. That's where my feelings go.

 

[nomar]

I mean, I guess you'd have to believe that those top 5 classes were all overrated for 15 years in a row in order to believe he's a bad recruiter.

But rather than the mental gymnastics, I'd straightforwardly argue that he's a good recruiter and a bad coach. Other coaches would have gotten much more out of those recruiting classes, or done a better job structuring the roster to have a mix of veteran players and 1-and-dones.

Yeah, everybody agrees with that except for one person.

 

[nomar]

I liked BC taking care of Carolina for two reasons 1) It cleared our path to what shouldve been our first FF (oh Donyell) 2) We were in the middle of beating BC about a kazillion times in a row that period, there was very little animosity toward BC back then. They were an inconsequential little brother. BC hatred didnt become a real thing until they torpedoed the whole BigEast in confernce realighment and then doubled down by lobbying against us.

So yea I was rooting for BC then.

Syracuse? Never. Was totally rooting for Kentucky.

I rooted for Kentucky in '96. Weirdly, however., I also rooted for Syracuse in the '03 title game. Seems odd now, but it wasn't even a question. No love for KU. Big East team. And we had some bragging rights having beaten them twice, IIRC. And, I guess, we'd already won a title, whereas in '96 we hadn't? Like I said, seems weird now.

I also rooted for BC in '94 because, yeah, we were going to destroy them.

 

[huskymedic]

 

[nelsonmuntz]

I mean, I guess you'd have to believe that those top 5 classes were all overrated for 15 years in a row in order to believe he's a bad recruiter.

But rather than the mental gymnastics, I'd straightforwardly argue that he's a good recruiter and a bad coach. Other coaches would have gotten much more out of those recruiting classes, or done a better job structuring the roster to have a mix of veteran players and 1-and-dones.

Despite Nomar’s complaining, my argument is not inconsistent or complicated. Cheating is not good recruiting. Now it is not cheating anymore, and Calipari is beclowning himself. Even Kentucky’s delusional fans agree with me that Calipari sucks.

 

[Tenspro2002]

Despite Nomar’s complaining, my argument is not inconsistent or complicated. Cheating is not good recruiting. Now it is not cheating anymore, and Calipari is beclowning himself. Even Kentucky’s delusional fans agree with me that Calipari sucks.

That would make sense if Kentucky was bringing in #1 classes before but struggling to bring in top classes now.

In fact, the issue they're having seems to be the same one it's been for 10 years: consistently bringing in top recruits for whom the whole is less than the sum of the parts.

 

[Hunt for 7]

Kentucky is running the stupidest coaching search in history by leaking every name they are interested in. Way to let their ultimate choice know he was the 12th option.

They are afraid of their fan base. They are leaking to get reaction data. But when you leak too much you can sink……

 

[nomar]

That would make sense if Kentucky was bringing in #1 classes before but struggling to bring in top classes now.

In fact, the issue they're having seems to be the same one it's been for 10 years: consistently bringing in top recruits for whom the whole is less than the sum of the parts.

Exactly. It only came to a head now after and because the chronic underperformance snowballed over the years. One title from dozens of NBA players.

 

[WhereistheDove?]

Interesting phrasing….

 

[Khal Drogo]

x.com

x.com

 

[JungleLobo]

Intro

 

[brihman]

It’s been only 5 minutes and I need a shower gross

 

[nelsonmuntz]

Exactly. It only came to a head now after and because the chronic underperformance snowballed over the years. One title from dozens of NBA players.

For your "good recruiter, bad coach" theory to be correct, you would have to be smarter than Devin Booker, Lamar Murray, and the rest of the NBA superstars that played for Calipari. Do you really think you know more about basketball than ALL of those Kentucky players, and their entourages, over the last 15 years? Or were they making a simple financial decision by taking the cash from a coach they knew sucked because he was the only one offering them a big bag of cash?

 

[huskyjawz]

You would think that they hired away John Wooden in his prime from UCLA by the way they are rejoicing.

 

[MilliniumPrince]

Getting top recruits to commit to UK doesn't mean you are a good recruiter. Failing to do so would show you suck.

Squid's advantage to a major hit with the advent of the portal-NIL combo. He is a terrible in-game coach, and his recruiting advance was reduced. I think he will flame out in Arkansas by year 5.

 

[superjohn]

@nomar Do you really think you're smarter than Lamar Murray?

 

[nomar]

@nomar Do you really think you're smarter than Lamar Murray?

Considering he doesn't exist, yeah. As for Jamal, just like I never had a 40" vertical, he never got a 170 on the LSAT.

 

[nomar]

For your "good recruiter, bad coach" theory to be correct, you would have to be smarter than Devin Booker, Lamar Murray, and the rest of the NBA superstars that played for Calipari. Do you really think you know more about basketball than ALL of those Kentucky players, and their entourages, over the last 15 years? Or were they making a simple financial decision by taking the cash from a coach they knew sucked because he was the only one offering them a big bag of cash?

Do you think anyone following this exchange hasn't realized that you keep failing to explain why Calipari continued to bring in top-50 recruits after NIL allowed everyone to throw bags of cash at players?

Also, there was always dirty recruiting, and Calipari's special sauce wasn't promising cash, it was the promise of NBA riches. That's why he's kept luring in 5* star recruits. This is pretty obvious to everyone, even Lamar Murray.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

Do you think anyone following this exchange hasn't realized that you keep failing to explain why Calipari continued to bring in top-50 recruits after NIL allowed everyone to throw bags of cash at players?

Also, there was always dirty recruiting, and Calipari's special sauce wasn't promising cash, it was the promise of NBA riches. That's why he's kept luring in 5* star recruits. This is pretty obvious to everyone, even Lamar Murray.

What was special about Calipari promising NBA riches that weren’t his? Every coach could promise that. Calipari was getting 4 and 5 a class. I don’t know if you have ever watched a basketball game, but it is played with only one ball. Most of those players would have been better off going somewhere where they could get 20 shots a game, but they went to Kentucky anyway, because they were going to get paid, a lot.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

As for you demanding I explain Calipari’s stupid recruiting strategy, I already have. He sucks as a coach. He is at one of the biggest programs with what is likely one of the biggest NIL budgets, and he keeps blowing it. That is why he just got run off. Are you having trouble wrapping your head around this?

 

[Scrutineer]

Not sure if this has been posted, but it's got a lot of interesting tidbits including some people watching flight plans to identify from where the private jets are coming into and out of Lexington.

Also a quote that Kentucky is prepared to make Hurley the HIGHEST PAID COLLEGE COACH IN ANY SPORT if he initially turns them down.

Kentucky Coaching Search Update: Eyes on the Sky

 

[nomar]

As for you demanding I explain Calipari’s stupid recruiting strategy, I already have. He sucks as a coach. He is at one of the biggest programs with what is likely one of the biggest NIL budgets, and he keeps blowing it. That is why he just got run off. Are you having trouble wrapping your head around this?

You’re having trouble wrapping your head around the fact that you can be both (a) good at attracting the consensus top recruits and (b) bad at winning with them. Which is clearly the case with Calipari and I have no idea why you can’t concede that so we can move on.

 

[nomar]

What was special about Calipari promising NBA riches that weren’t his? Every coach could promise that. Calipari was getting 4 and 5 a class. I don’t know if you have ever watched a basketball game, but it is played with only one ball. Most of those players would have been better off going somewhere where they could get 20 shots a game, but they went to Kentucky anyway, because they were going to get paid, a lot.

Jesus. UK’s been an NBA factory. There are 28 UK players currently on NBA rosters and 13 are making between $8M and $41M a year. And all of them played on a team where there were numerous 5* recruits and only one ball. Calipari is a master salesman; while he strikes me as sleazy, his sales pitch has always worked and he’s been able to deliver in the sense he’s put more guys in the NBA than anyone else.

If you want to keep insisting he’s not good at pitching recruits and their families and instead landed top classes because his boosters paid more, by all means keep showing off the fact that you haven’t been paying attention over the past 15 years. And haven’t been paying attention over the past couple years when he’s continued to land great classes (and underperform with them) despite the sea change effected by NIL.

I mean, you couldn’t be more wrong about any of this, except for the fact he hasn’t won enough, which is why he’s going to Arkansas.

 

[nomar]

You’re having trouble wrapping your head around the fact that you can be both (a) good at attracting the consensus top recruits and (b) bad at winning with them. Which is clearly the case with Calipari and I have no idea why you can’t concede that so we can move on.

P.s. Also, I’ve explained repeatedly the difference between “recruiting” and “roster construction.” Now you’re trying to blur the lines by using the term “recruiting strategy.” The fact remains that when Calipari recruits a kid, he’s better than anyone at landing him. Not a controversial point, you’re just stubborn as a mule.

 

[Hoophound]

Jesus. UK’s been an NBA factory. There are 28 UK players currently on NBA rosters and 13 are making between $8M and $41M a year. And all of them played on a team where there were numerous 5* recruits and only one ball. Calipari is a master salesman; while he strikes me as sleazy, his sales pitch has always worked and he’s been able to deliver in the sense he’s put more guys in the NBA than anyone else.

If you want to keep insisting he’s not good at pitching recruits and their families and instead landed top classes because his boosters paid more, by all means keep showing off the fact that you haven’t been paying attention over the past 15 years. And haven’t been paying attention over the past couple years when he’s continued to land great classes (and underperform with them) despite the sea change effected by NIL.

I mean, you couldn’t be more wrong about any of this, except for the fact he hasn’t won enough, which is why he’s going to Arkansas.

Cal has continued to recruit in the NIL era, but he may still have the biggest war chest in the game. Prior to NIL, World Wide Wes delivered him player after player and everyone turned a blind eye to it. His recruiting talent was just as much about getting illegal resources as it was about talking to players. He was able to use his relationship with WWW to cheat brazenly. Major publications wrote articles about it, yet no one would stop it. That tells me Cal and UK made relationships at the NCAA that allowed him to cheat. They didn’t try to figure out what he was doing. His talent is talking his way in and out of situations. He’s a mediocre coach but a hell of a smooth talker. If you worked with him in a corporate setting, he’d be the guy always eating lunch and playing golf with the executives and falling into promotion after promotion while producing no actual work.