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Big Monday...

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. Yet, there is something about a Lady Mule that is off-putting. If they had called themselves the Lady Bergs, well then.....

Back when Ursusminor was a Gettysburg Bullet, I had a chance to visit Muhlenberg, and watch some softball. Didn't mind it at all, 'tho my little dog found the day to be a bit chilly for his liking. Now, what I really object to is CZ saying that lady mules are "off-putting". Mules are great animals - intelligent, curious, patient. I have a fondness for 'em, just from visiting the livestock wing of the Kentucky State Fair, many years when I was a child. They're handsome and strong. True, in one sense they're "off-putting" - they're almost always sterile (male mules always are). But, certainly warmer and friendlier than Lady Bergs!;)
 
Your original post indicated that TN gets some unfair number of fouls called against them when compared to other teams. However, after doing the math it lines up like this:

Baylor's opponents get called for 60% of the fouls
Notre Dame's opponents - 54.95%
Tennessee's opponents - 54.59%
Delaware's opponents - 53.75%
UConn's oppoments - 53.40 %
Maryland's opponents - 5281%
Stanford's opponents = 51.56%
Duke's opponents - 50.83%

There's actually only a 1% difference between TN and UConn, with ND barely above that, so not the discrepancy that was alluded to. In other words, TN doesn't get any more of a break than anyone else. Baylor's being so out of line is understandable considering Griner gets fouled quite a bit due to her overwhelming size and power.

I hate it when people abuse statistics. It was only a minor for me, but at one point they figured prominently into my role as a program evaluator. A 1% difference can be significant depending on the numbers and context, just as a 10% difference could mean little. If the numbers above were in the 100-150 range this would be much ado about nothing. In reality they are at a range where for many a game just a two foul average difference between teams can mean the difference between 1 and 1, double bonuses and foul trouble. They are in a range where one team's opponents may be consistently sitting on the bench earlier due to foul trouble than another.

I'm not inclined to blame the refs in terms of "unfair" calls. Because of the number of games involved that should be factored out. If the numbers were broken into home and away games perhaps something surfaces, perhaps not. What you can conclude from this, despite the misleading 1% difference you framed it in, is that teams like Baylor, Notre Dame and particularly Tennessee are quite adept at drawing fouls in comparison to a second tier of teams, with Tennessee being the best of all. At almost 20 per game, versus 2-3 per game less, that means many times where Tennessee has gained an early advantage due to their ability to draw fouls. The UConn men were once very adept at the same thing so I'm not going to complain too much about it; it just bugs me when people pull a fast one with statistics.
 
I'm personally rooting for Tennessee. It pains me to do so, however, I can't stand Diggins or the ND Team and would like to see their cockiness brought down a couple notches.
 
Ahh, I tried to make one of those and post it here. Couldn't get it to work.
Thank you!
It was kind of quirky. You need to get out of the meme and then get back in.
 
My original post called Tenn getting an unusual break at home a "theory." That's all it is. But ND is adept at getting fouls called on opponents when they drive. The Tenn theory was advanced by CharlieF at a boneyard meeting a few games ago. It so happened that I had looked at team fouls for a completely different reason when you asked about them. So I listed them for you. I think it interesting that almost all good teams commit fewer fouls than their opponents. You put your own interpretation on the stats I listed.
 
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I hate it when people abuse statistics. It was only a minor for me, but at one point they figured prominently into my role as a program evaluator. A 1% difference can be significant depending on the numbers and context, just as a 10% difference could mean little. If the numbers above were in the 100-150 range this would be much ado about nothing. In reality they are at a range where for many a game just a two foul average difference between teams can mean the difference between 1 and 1, double bonuses and foul trouble. They are in a range where one team's opponents may be consistently sitting on the bench earlier due to foul trouble than another.

I'm not inclined to blame the refs in terms of "unfair" calls. Because of the number of games involved that should be factored out. If the numbers were broken into home and away games perhaps something surfaces, perhaps not. What you can conclude from this, despite the misleading 1% difference you framed it in, is that teams like Baylor, Notre Dame and particularly Tennessee are quite adept at drawing fouls in comparison to a second tier of teams, with Tennessee being the best of all. At almost 20 per game, versus 2-3 per game less, that means many times where Tennessee has gained an early advantage due to their ability to draw fouls. The UConn men were once very adept at the same thing so I'm not going to complain too much about it; it just bugs me when people pull a fast one with statistics.
I don't think justavisitor was abusing or pulling a fast one about statistics. Justavisitor was just interpreting the stats I listed. There are many other interpretations that could be made besides yours. One is that opponents who are behind, foul to put the other team on the line. None of us, myself included, have been willing to take the time to check out the fouls on a game by game basis. Until then, we're all guessing as to what the stats really show.
 
Thanks huskybill. You're right. I wasn't trying to pull anything. I wanted to convert it to %s because the total number of fouls called can fluctuate based on the officiating crew, style of play, etc. The % was easier for me to see how much descrepancy truly existed. It also made it easier to compare teams. I don't see much difference in the above metioned teams. Typically, over matched teams foul more. Also, as you stated, teams that get behind foul alot in the closing minutes. Alot of times, the opponent is smaller, slower, etc. and grabbing and holding is the only way they can keep up.
 
Then you will have to live with your choice........forever.


Just like Dante, there are levels of evil. ND football, yes is at a great, great evil level. And sure that evil spreads like a plague. However, we are talking about women's basketball. And in WBB there is no greater evil than TN Lady Vols.
Geno has often said for it to be a significant rivalry both teams have to be able to win. We have seen that from no other than ND for 6 years!!! ND is the new evil empire
 
You don't like Diggins; too bad, she's taken over the early part of the game.
 
say what you want about Diggins... she shows up, All-American performance tonight
 
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"Pulling a fast one" was overstepping my bounds; my apologies. I was not implying that the refs are bad (as I already stated), nor that teams are unscrupulous. As I said the UConn men used to be great at drawing fouls; I certainly did not condemn them.

If teams have consistently close games, then the fouling at the end could go either way and should balance themselves out. If a team like Baylor or UConn consistently overmatches an opponent then the fouling at the end of the game does not come into play. Differences between Baylor and UConn simply are not due to this factor. Tennessee could be because they've had closer games, but note that Tennessee themselves also foul quite a bit more, meaning once again that fouling at the end could have gone in both directions.

What I get from this data is that an opponent of Tennessee's likely gets into some type of foul difficulty on an average of 4-6 minutes earlier than Tennessee; with "second tier" foul discrepancies such as UConn that average appears to be 2-3 minutes earlier. You now can manipulate the data to say there's a 100% difference between Tennessee and UConn with foul discrepancy impact, which also would be very misleading.

These are averages. Sometimes the foul difficulty for the opponent happens even earlier; sometimes Tennessee or UConn even experiences the foul difficulty first. That does not mean Tennessee is doing anything wrong; that does not mean the refs are doing anything wrong. It is, indeed, a viable strategy to pursue. It's not an automatic game-changer, but it still is more significant than the 1% difference in foul discrepancy would lead one to believe, though less significant than the 100% difference in foul discrepancy impact would lead one to believe.
 
I will say, Muhlenberg more than fills its quota of Jewish kids. Tolerance is a beacon (this thread does not qualify). Beats the daylights out of ND. Yet, there is something about a Lady Mule that is off-putting. If they had called themselves the Lady Bergs, well then.....

There was a time when there was a movement that wanted the Franklin & Marshall (Lancaster, Pa.) college football team to be referred to as the "Fighting Amish." The locals were reportedly not amused. No word of any reaction from ND alums living in the region.
 
They really show that TN and ND are both cheating, unscrupulous teams in cahoots with cheating, unscrupulous refs.

JS, be reminded that it is improper for you to have TonyC write posts in your name.
 
There was a time when there was a movement that wanted the Franklin & Marshall (Lancaster, Pa.) college football team to be referred to as the "Fighting Amish." The locals were reportedly not amused. No word of any reaction from ND alums living in the region.

Maybe we should suggest "Fighting Jews" for Yeshiva U. (I had to Google to find out their teams are called the Maccabees.) I hear their hoops players make the sign of the Star of David before shooting foul shots. Takes an extra minute.
 
Maybe we should suggest "Fighting Jews" for Yeshiva U. (I had to Google to find out their teams are called the Maccabees.) I hear their hoops players make the sign of the Star of David before shooting foul shots. Takes an extra minute.
Yeah, they can't remember if it is left to right or right to left, top to bottom or bottom to top.
 
Yeah, they can't remember if it is left to right or right to left, top to bottom or bottom to top.

It is a secret we are taught only after 36 (double Chai) years of Torah study. Women can only do it in the balcony. People like me who dropped from the fold before the magic year are forever left to ponder this mystery. BTW, I've always wondered about something. What if the Roman's had had the electric chair?
 
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BTW, I've always wondered about something. What if the Roman's had had the electric chair?

CZ, many thoughts, all innappropriate to some degree, popped into my head when I read this. Suffice it to say, the one least apt to get some of my more religious brethren to declare a fatwha (sp?) against me is,

"would this mean that, instead of hauling a cross on his back, through town and up a hill, Christ would have had to have hauled a friggin' chair?":confused:
 
BTW, I've always wondered about something. What if the Roman's had had the electric chair?
The sign of the switch is a complex gesture involving a parabolic wrist motion.

1.jpg
 
I hope that HuskyNan appreciates the fact that this thread most certainly did not veer toward Baylor or Tennessee topical posts.
 
The sign of the switch is a complex gesture involving a parabolic wrist motion.

1.jpg

OK, who remembers the standard use for the switch above? I do for one.
 
It is a secret we are taught only after 36 (double Chai) years of Torah study. Women can only do it in the balcony. People like me who dropped from the fold before the magic year are forever left to ponder this mystery. BTW, I've always wondered about something. What if the Roman's had had the electric chair?
Don't feel bad the Easter Rite and Western Rite churches can not agree on which direction to make the Sign of the Cross.
 
I hope that HuskyNan appreciates the fact that this thread most certainly did not veer toward Baylor or Tennessee topical posts.

There is still time.
 
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