Big 12

[Figurehead]

Doubtful they would take Oregon over UW in any scenario. UW is a research powerhouse, and dwarfs Oregon and their Nike money.

Well it is known the Washington Chancellor does not care about football. Maybe a better fit would in the Ivy league?

 

[huskymedic]

UCLA/USC are getting full share revenue from B1G from Day 1 but they are UCLA/USC and have leverage (which UConn does not).

Rutgers took out league loans against their future earnings so won’t get full share revenue until 2027 I believe.

UCLA gets a full share immediately from the Big Ten??? Why? and how do you know that? They’ve not done anything in any major college sport in decades.

How do I know that… Really?

USC, UCLA to enter Big Ten as full members

Big Ten commissioner Kevin Warren: “We think that's important for various reasons. They bring a lot of value to our relationship."

theathletic.com

-> USC and UCLA will enter the Big Ten as vested members in 2024, a departure from the league’s previous position of requiring a waiting period for new schools.

“USC and UCLA will come in as full members,” Big Ten commissioner Kevin Warren said Tuesday. “We think that’s important for various reasons. They bring a lot of value to our relationship. They bring a lot of panache to our relationship, and we look forward to welcoming them into the Big Ten family here in 2024.” <-

 

[kibblesnbits]

Can you lay out a better path to the upper tiers?

No, but none of us know what's really going on so my proposal would just be another exercise of spitting into the wind as we've been doing for the last decade. I know what I'd prefer but I'm not going to package that as anything with credibility. I do know that I don't feel any great affinity or enmity for any school in the Big 12 so it's just a big "meh" for me. I think that's why some people call this the AAC+ - not because the schools, athletics and pay day aren't better (or even much better), but that there's no feeling that we have anything in common beyond TV contracts. If you asked me which schools I could see as a rival in a decade it would be, perhaps, KU in hoops. In football I'm sure we'd have interest when whatever school is on top visits, but I don't see any of the current members really becoming a rival.

 

[FfldCntyFan]

No, but none of us know what's really going on so my proposal would just be another exercise of spitting into the wind as we've been doing for the last decade. I know what I'd prefer but I'm not going to package that as anything with credibility. I do know that I don't feel any great affinity or enmity for any school in the Big 12 so it's just a big "meh" for me. I think that's why some people call this the AAC+ - not because the schools, athletics and pay day aren't better (or even much better), but that there's no feeling that we have anything in common beyond TV contracts. If you asked me which schools I could see as a rival in a decade it would be, perhaps, KU in hoops. In football I'm sure we'd have interest when whatever school is on top visits, but I don't see any of the current members really becoming a rival.

Fair answer.

In football (and other sports) WVU and Cincinnati will immediately return as rivals. We have some minor history with ISU and Baylor while K St and TCU should become rivals as quickly as Xavier and Creighton did.

This isn't a conference with Tulsa and Tulane. Your response was legitimate but too many are behaving as if it's the same as being in a conference with Tulsa and Tulane.

 

[John]

I don’t disagree, but that’s the point. We should join a conference if it makes sense on an extended basis and not because of a transient condition like “they are the #1 basketball conference” (today). If the powers that be determine this is our only path to the upper tiers then I’ll support the decision. However, I’m not excited about it because it lacks the critical elements that made college sports attractive to me - rivalries against schools that have a lot in common (geography, student body recruiting base, similar demographics, etc.). Those are what college sports are built on. Old fashioned I know……

geography - roughly half the Big East is in the Midwest

student body - small private mostly Catholic colleges vs. a State land grant university

recruiting base - national

similar demographics - see #1 and #2

 

[noeynox]

UCLA gets a full share immediately from the Big Ten??? Why? and how do you know that? They’ve not done anything in any major college sport in decades. I know what DB must of said to Yormark, when he heard about UCLA getting a full share “We just won the NC in men’s basketball for the fifth time”, and all you’re offering is a half share????

Its been reported they will. Its because of the value the LA market brought to the B1G's media rights.

 

[noeynox]

UCLA gets a full share immediately from the Big Ten??? Why? and how do you know that? They’ve not done anything in any major college sport in decades. I know what DB must of said to Yormark, when he heard about UCLA getting a full share “We just won the NC in men’s basketball for the fifth time”, and all you’re offering is a half share????

Are they really only offering a half share?

 

[jostar1]

“USC and UCLA will come in as full members,” Big Ten commissioner Kevin Warren said Tuesday. “We think that’s important for various reasons. They bring a lot of value to our relationship. They bring a lot of panache to our relationship, and we look forward to welcoming them into the Big Ten family here in 2024.”

That's what David Benedict has to tell the Big 12---UConn brings a lot of panache.

 

[Patman]

How in heavens name would UConn fans see Kansas (2022 Champ), Baylor,(2021 Champ) K-State, Iowa State, Oak State, Houston 2021 Final Four) Gonzaga as the AAC light. I know there are a bunch of Big East or die fans in the group but the dominant basketball conference in the country, is still the best conference in the country. On the football side TCU and Cincinatti have been to the Nation Championship tournament recently. And FWIW for all the blather about Texas, they haven’t won a B12 title since 2009. Oklahoma is the big loss, not the longhorns.

what happens if the top half of those leave for a revamped ACC?

That's the problem with the situation right now, a lot of ways to be screwed.

 

[kibblesnbits]

geography - roughly half the Big East is in the Midwest

student body - small private mostly Catholic colleges vs. a State land grant university

recruiting base - national

similar demographics - see #1 and #2

I never said a word about the Big East. To me it’s an odd fit that only works because of the history that UConn built in the league back when it was a better fit (I.e. back when it was the dominant multi-sport conference for larger Northeastern schools as well as a basketball-centric power). If there was no such history and you were starting a new league today, I doubt UConn joins the current BE schools and I doubt they are interested in competing with UConn. Even so, at least it offers some geographically interesting opponents. When I referred to recruiting base I wasn’t talking just athletics. Every year I’ve seen kids from our HS deciding between BE privates and UConn. I’ve never seen a kid deciding betweenUConn and any Big 12 school. There’s almost no overlap because they are geographically and socially distinct regions.

 

[kibblesnbits]

Continued……

It would even be interesting to compare alumni club sizes for UConn and Big 12 schools across different geographies. I’ll bet that outside of Dallas/FW UConn doesn’t have a significant alumni presence in B12 areas (if you include retirees then add Orlando) and NE is not a major area for the future B12 schools.

 

[CONN78SEJ]

How do I know that… Really?

USC, UCLA to enter Big Ten as full members

Big Ten commissioner Kevin Warren: “We think that's important for various reasons. They bring a lot of value to our relationship."

theathletic.com

-> USC and UCLA will enter the Big Ten as vested members in 2024, a departure from the league’s previous position of requiring a waiting period for new schools.

“USC and UCLA will come in as full members,” Big Ten commissioner Kevin Warren said Tuesday. “We think that’s important for various reasons. They bring a lot of value to our relationship. They bring a lot of panache to our relationship, and we look forward to welcoming them into the Big Ten family here in 2024.” <-

I’ll say it again, UCLA has not done anything in major college sports for decades and they get to waltz into the Big Ten as full members immediately.

 

[CONN78SEJ]

Are they really only offering a half share?

I hope not!!!

 

[RSTuthill]

UCLA gets a full share immediately from the Big Ten??? Why? and how do you know that? They’ve not done anything in any major college sport in decades. I know what DB must of said to Yormark, when he heard about UCLA getting a full share “We just won the NC in men’s basketball for the fifth time”, and all you’re offering is a half share????

Well ... looking at it as dispassionately and objectively as possible, doing that locks up LA.

 

[FfldCntyFan]

what happens if the top half of those leave for a revamped ACC?

That's the problem with the situation right now, a lot of ways to be screwed.

Please walk me through all of the details on how this could happen. Please include the size of the ACC after adding 6-8 more schools and the B-12's GOR which runs through 2031

 

[CL82]

I don’t disagree, but that’s the point. We should join a conference if it makes sense on an extended basis and not because of a transient condition like “they are the #1 basketball conference” (today). If the powers that be determine this is our only path to the upper tiers then I’ll support the decision. However, I’m not excited about it because it lacks the critical elements that made college sports attractive to me - rivalries against schools that have a lot in common (geography, student body recruiting base, similar demographics, etc.). Those are what college sports are built on. Old fashioned I know……

I could not agree more! It's like taking a land grant state university and sticking them in a legal with a bunch of small Catholic private colleges. It would always be an odd fit because there isn't enough commonality.

 

[Bonamassa]

UConn maintaining the status quo = Whistling past the graveyard.

 

[freescooter]

Well ... looking at it as dispassionately and objectively as possible, doing that locks up LA.

Right, and similar to when the Dodgers left Brooklyn, they needed the Giants to move west as well to make it viable. The Big 10 needed a west coast partner for USC. UCLA made sense.

 

[RSTuthill]

Right, and similar to when the Dodgers left Brooklyn, they needed the Giants to move west as well to make it viable. The Big 10 needed a west coast partner for USC. UCLA made sense.

You are hitting a little close to home, lad. I have always been a Dodger fan and in fact wear a 59/50 fitted Brooklyn hat occasionally today. Saw two games at Ebbetts Field.

 

[DoctorWho85]

I'm not a big face othe Big 12, but they're a really good baseball conference too. So that'll help the baseball program too.

 

[freescooter]

No, but none of us know what's really going on so my proposal would just be another exercise of spitting into the wind as we've been doing for the last decade. I know what I'd prefer but I'm not going to package that as anything with credibility. I do know that I don't feel any great affinity or enmity for any school in the Big 12 so it's just a big "meh" for me. I think that's why some people call this the AAC+ - not because the schools, athletics and pay day aren't better (or even much better), but that there's no feeling that we have anything in common beyond TV contracts. If you asked me which schools I could see as a rival in a decade it would be, perhaps, KU in hoops. In football I'm sure we'd have interest when whatever school is on top visits, but I don't see any of the current members really becoming a rival.

I think you could say both Cincinnati and West Virginia were becoming football rivals during the old Big East. Cincy might have been had we had a commissioner who basically stopped watching once basketball practice began. And didn’t pay attention after the season ended.

 

[Jimdish255]

Can you lay out a better path to the upper tiers?

Adjusting to reality is really tough for some people. I get it but this isn't new and it's not changing back any time soon. Playing Providence and SJU every year (we still can), MSG (we still can), and memories of wacking BC and Cuse' doesn't help us long term. And not just in hoops men's or women's. We need to play the best and get paid with the best. We can sustain for a little longer but the waves are getting higher we're going to need a bigger boat.

 

[Jimdish255]

what happens if the top half of those leave for a revamped ACC?

That's the problem with the situation right now, a lot of ways to be screwed.

Then we'll be in that top half. You can throw out a million what-ifs but the reality is staying put equals sliding back at some point. Gino, Hurley and Mora won't be here forever. If nothing else, revenue helps pay for the Coaches we need.

 

[FfldCntyFan]

I don’t disagree, but that’s the point. We should join a conference if it makes sense on an extended basis and not because of a transient condition like “they are the #1 basketball conference” (today). If the powers that be determine this is our only path to the upper tiers then I’ll support the decision. However, I’m not excited about it because it lacks the critical elements that made college sports attractive to me - rivalries against schools that have a lot in common (geography, student body recruiting base, similar demographics, etc.). Those are what college sports are built on. Old fashioned I know……

This is entirely thought of on an extended basis. How much longer do you believe the current financial situation within our athletic department is sustainable? Within a handful of years we are going to need to cut more programs if we don't increase our revenues substantially, then this will repeat until there is nothing left.

 

[kibblesnbits]

This is entirely thought of on an extended basis. How much longer do you believe the current financial situation within our athletic department is sustainable? Within a handful of years we are going to need to cut more programs if we don't increase our revenues substantially, then this will repeat until there is nothing left.

Not long. That's why I said I'd support the decision if it's believed to be the only option. All I said was that the Big 12 does not excite me as we (and everyone else apparently) continue to deviate from the things that attracted me to college sports. If it is essentially a minor league with no geographic/demographic rivalries, players adding more frequent flyer miles than I ever acquired in corporate America, rosters being massively remade every year as players transfer multiple times with little allegiance to the school (or the school to them), outright and public buying of players via NILs, etc., then I'll probably just be apathetic about the whole thing.

 

[Stinger92860]

Not long. That's why I said I'd support the decision if it's believed to be the only option. All I said was that the Big 12 does not excite me as we (and everyone else apparently) continue to deviate from the things that attracted me to college sports. If it is essentially a minor league with no geographic/demographic rivalries, players adding more frequent flyer miles than I ever acquired in corporate America, rosters being massively remade every year as players transfer multiple times with little allegiance to the school (or the school to them), outright and public buying of players via NILs, etc., then I'll probably just be apathetic about the whole thing.

Or you can watch the Ivies, who have it right.

 

[RSTuthill]

I’ll say it again, UCLA has not done anything in major college sports for decades and they get to waltz into the Big Ten as full members immediately.

I will say it again. UCLA has a competitive football program, is already P5, and brings LA eyes to the media contract. Same as USC. Its not hard to understand. So they are a poor comparison. Do we know of any G5 or non-Notre Dame independent school that got a full share right off the rip? If so, that is a true comparable and where we should be looking.

 

[RSTuthill]

Are they really only offering a half share?

No one knows what the offer will be or even if there will be one. That was just speculation.

 

[Patman]

Then we'll be in that top half. You can throw out a million what-ifs but the reality is staying put equals sliding back at some point. Gino, Hurley and Mora won't be here forever. If nothing else, revenue helps pay for the Coaches we need.

Geno... and, no, no we won't be in that top half.

 

[RSTuthill]

Or you can watch the Ivies, who have it right.

In the Ivies the compensation package is deferred. But there is indeed a compensation package. Let's not kid ourselves. And it is operative over the entire professional lifetime, not just in college and perhaps five years after for the select few.