Big 12 or B1G

[Adios]

ACC over B12 any day, the minute OU and/or Texas decides they want to look elsewhere when that six year agreement ends, the conference is toast.

If they can add ND and other pre-eminent eastern markets, that might have more an allure than the Pac-12.

 

[upstater]

And becoming a Penn State is good? With all that has happened recently, that's a school I won't choose to emulate.

Assuming you can avoid having your coach rape a child, it wouldn't be a bad school to emulate, in terms of record, fan support, graduation rate, academics, one of two schools to never go on probation.

 

[businesslawyer]

Assuming you can avoid having your coach rape a child, it wouldn't be a bad school to emulate, in terms of record, fan support, graduation rate, academics, one of two schools to never go on probation.

Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, did you enjoy the play?

 

[upstater]

Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, did you enjoy the play?

PSU died?

 

[businesslawyer]

PSU died?

The reputation that you hold so dear did, in fact, die. You talk about it as if it's a small thing that doesn't tar everything else. It does.

There was only one criminal here, and it was not the University's fault that it happened to hire a pedophile. However, the fact that, over a decade, not one person affiliated with the football program or the university did what needed to be done to make it stop has killed PSU's reputation. And, given that the decision was tied in to protecting a football program, rightly so.

 

[whaler11]

There is almost nothing better than Francesa talking to Kim Jones about Penn State. He is right, Penn State is so completely lost right now it would be funny if it wasn't for such a horrible reason. People will write books for decades about the lack of leadership on that campus.

 

[NHUConnfan]

F BCU, they're horrible at everything (except academix!!!!1). The B12 is certainly more deep overall in football than the ACC. I'd never argue that one. But the B12 does have its lackluster programs. Kansas is another. I guess an argument can be made though that the level of competition in the B12 makes these teams look worse than a team with, say, the same record in the ACC.

Wherever UConn is going for football, they're going to start at the bottom of the league. I understand money is a huge driving factor and football is the big $$$$$ but the fact is, ACC, B1G, B12 - it's going to be close to the same amount of money.

In efforts to keep UConn from ever being irrelevant in sports, I want them to end up in a fantastic basketball conference. So I think the ACC should be our top choice. B1G would be nice, but it probably isn't happening. And I really think the B12 has nothing to offer.

 

[NHUConnfan]

The reputation that you hold so dear did, in fact, die. You talk about it as if it's a small thing that doesn't tar everything else. It does.

There was only one criminal here, and it was not the University's fault that it happened to hire a pedophile. However, the fact that, over a decade, not one person affiliated with the football program or the university did what needed to be done to make it stop has killed PSU's reputation. And, given that the decision was tied in to protecting a football program, rightly so.

Given the trouble PSU is having raising funds, if it doesn't drastically turn around, then they will become irrelevant for quite a while, regardless of what happens in the upcoming months/years.

 

[Adios]

And I really think the B12 has nothing to offer.

Really? You won't be saying that if Cincinnati gets in.

 

[upstater]

The reputation that you hold so dear did, in fact, die. You talk about it as if it's a small thing that doesn't tar everything else. It does.

There was only one criminal here, and it was not the University's fault that it happened to hire a pedophile. However, the fact that, over a decade, not one person affiliated with the football program or the university did what needed to be done to make it stop has killed PSU's reputation. And, given that the decision was tied in to protecting a football program, rightly so.

The reputation died, the standards didn't. So now you're saying they should go rogue?

 

[NHUConnfan]

Really? You won't be saying that if Cincinnati gets in.

Lol, you think I really care about them? I casually watch Cincinnati and I'll root for them wherever they go. But let's be honest, UConn >>>>>>>>>>>>> Cincinnati. If Cincinnati ends up in the B12, that's good for them. Better fit location too - and if L'Ville in addition to WVU, then they'll be in the right spot.

UConn belongs in an East Coast conference. They belong in a basketball conference. And it doesn't matter which super conference they join, all of the $$$ from TV contracts will basically be the same down the road. That's why I think the B12 has nothing to offer UConn.

 

[businesslawyer]

I'm flummoxed by your response.

This is about a guy who is very loyal to his old coach. Short to Bradley. And though he's loyal, he also said some stupid things. As many other ex-players pointed out. But the least offensive part of his post is his discussion of PSU standards and what the school stood for. Why? Because the vast vast majority of schools in this country do not have those standards. The fact that PSU royally screwed up, and I agree with the firings (though after reading the new pretrial testimony I know things are not as you present them to be) Short only meant that PSU has higher standards when it comes to football. When it comes to pedophiles, no. But this is what he was referring to, and he's right. Any outsider that comes in there will be battling scrutinized on academics, African-American grad rate, the lack of NCAA sanctions, etc. It's quite different than say Ohio Sate. Urban Meyer comes right in and no one will care there whether the culture has changed (a culture that was like that long, long, long before Jim Tressel).

We are discussing totally different things. Have a nice day

 

[whaler11]

I'm flummoxed by your response.

This is about a guy who is very loyal to his old coach. Short to Bradley. And though he's loyal, he also said some stupid things. As many other ex-players pointed out. But the least offensive part of his post is his discussion of PSU standards and what the school stood for. Why? Because the vast vast majority of schools in this country do not have those standards. The fact that PSU royally screwed up, and I agree with the firings (though after reading the new pretrial testimony I know things are not as you present them to be) Short only meant that PSU has higher standards when it comes to football. When it comes to pedophiles, no. But this is what he was referring to, and he's right. Any outsider that comes in there will be battling scrutinized on academics, African-American grad rate, the lack of NCAA sanctions, etc. It's quite different than say Ohio Sate. Urban Meyer comes right in and no one will care there whether the culture has changed (a culture that was like that long, long, long before Jim Tressel).

Do you not get that there were no PSU standards and it turned out they didn't stand for anything? It was all horse#*&t? That the 'standards' PSU set were actually MUCH LOWER than the standards that Ohio State set?

 

[ZooCougar]

Penn State. The school had no institutional control over the football program. Paterno had his fiefdom, he did some good and some bad. But The climate he created is what allowed Sandusky to continue on like he did. Sandusky type tragedies NEED a climate like that to occur.

Their priorities were totally out of whack. Sandusky showed that to us.

Oh and Big 10 hands down. The Big 12 is like the middle east of college football.

 

[upstater]

Do you not get that there were no PSU standards and it turned out they didn't stand for anything? It was all horse#*&t? That the 'standards' PSU set were actually MUCH LOWER than the standards that Ohio State set?

OK then, start the $$$, forget about classes, recruit partials, cheat on APR (like everyone else), etc. Those standards were phony. Didn't exist. It'll be a lot easier to win games now.

 

[whaler11]

OK then, start the $$$, forget about classes, recruit partials, cheat on APR (like everyone else), etc. Those standards were phony. Didn't exist. It'll be a lot easier to win games now.

You only get to be pompous about making football players write their own term papers if you can keep your assistant coaches from raping children in your locker room showers. Penn State is 10000000x worse than Auburn, Ohio State or SMU.

Penn State and many of their supporters have gotten so far away from reality and common sense it's difficult to believe.

 

[kibblesnbits]

The public doesn't want to hear any more about the supposedly superior standards of PSU because:

1) Protecting that perception was the implicit justification for turning their backs on far worse activities.

2) How real was the basis for that perception? If they could cover up felony abuse of children for more than a decade, how hard would it be to cover up mere NCAA violations?

 

[Chin Diesel]

Penn St. and Syracuse fans and alums are starting a 10-20 year process of having every school be able to look down on them. The U had a booster scream and physically assault a member of the University in a luxury box at a football game, pay cash and photograph players on a yacht and their fans can look at PSU and 'cuse and rightfully say that those schools are scum.

We know Cecil Newton sold his sons services for $200K and he could go on TV with a straight face and say PSU and 'cuse had a culture of corruption.

Protecting a serial pedophile while on the staff and afterwards is pretty much the lowest you can go. Short of actually training terrorists to kill Americans I can't think of any more heinous crime. Marge Schott can look up at what's going on in Happy Valley and say they're scum.

 

[businesslawyer]

Penn St. and Syracuse fans and alums are starting a 10-20 year process of having every school be able to look down on them. The U had a booster scream and physically assault a member of the University in a luxury box at a football game, pay cash and photograph players on a yacht and their fans can look at PSU and 'cuse and rightfully say that those schools are scum.

We know Cecil Newton sold his sons services for $200K and he could go on TV with a straight face and say PSU and 'cuse had a culture of corruption.

Protecting a serial pedophile while on the staff and afterwards is pretty much the lowest you can go. Short of actually training terrorists to kill Americans I can't think of any more heinous crime. Marge Schott can look up at what's going on in Happy Valley and say they're scum.

No, no, no. As much as I'd love to badmouth Syracuse given their imminent departure, this is too important. Syracuse did not do anything wrong. They hired a pedophile, but that can happen to anyone who hires employees. I have not seen any reason to believe that a single person at Syracuse believed that Fine raped underage kids, and if you don't believe it happened and an investigation doesn't turn anything up there is no blame to allocate (beyond the perpetrator himself). Let me ask a question -- if it turned out that Clive Vaughn offered a $20 to a prostitute who happened to be underage, does that mean UConn is a scum university? The answer should be of course not.

Frankly, you're trivializing the horrors at PSU by comparing it to Syracuse because it puts the emphasis on what the university can't control and ignores what the university can.

 

[Chin Diesel]

No, no, no. As much as I'd love to badmouth Syracuse given their imminent departure, this is too important. Syracuse did not do anything wrong. They hired a pedophile, but that can happen to anyone who hires employees. I have not seen any reason to believe that a single person at Syracuse believed that Fine raped underage kids, and if you don't believe it happened and an investigation doesn't turn anything up there is no blame to allocate (beyond the perpetrator himself). Let me ask a question -- if it turned out that Clive Vaughn offered a $20 to a prostitute who happened to be underage, does that mean UConn is a scum university? The answer should be of course not.

Frankly, you're trivializing the horrors at PSU by comparing it to Syracuse because it puts the emphasis on what the university can't control and ignores what the university can.

We'll agree do disagree, but for me, while not as horrible as PSU, 'cuse isn't clean on this one.

I don't believe that a coach that coaches that long and has a history of taking underage ball boys on road trips with him amongst other things did so in complete secrecy. I'm not accusing any particular person in a coverup, but I refuse to believe no one knew anything.

In a way, 'cuse should be sending roses every day to PSU. Because the depravity that went on at PSU is so extreme that people aren't as shocked at the disgusting crimes being committed at 'cuse.

 

[upstater]

You only get to be pompous about making football players write their own term papers if you can keep your assistant coaches from raping children in your locker room showers. Penn State is 10000000x worse than Auburn, Ohio State or SMU.

Penn State and many of their supporters have gotten so far away from reality and common sense it's difficult to believe.

What's difficult to believe is that some people are saying PSU should maintain its standards (in all the obvious areas but one) and people with 2 cents think there's something wrong with this.

Bizarre.

This isn't morals. It's about continuing to do things the way they've been done in the past (in all the areas but one).

Pretty basic stuff to understand.

 

[upstater]

No, no, no. As much as I'd love to badmouth Syracuse given their imminent departure, this is too important. Syracuse did not do anything wrong. They hired a pedophile, but that can happen to anyone who hires employees. I have not seen any reason to believe that a single person at Syracuse believed that Fine raped underage kids, and if you don't believe it happened and an investigation doesn't turn anything up there is no blame to allocate (beyond the perpetrator himself). Let me ask a question -- if it turned out that Clive Vaughn offered a $20 to a prostitute who happened to be underage, does that mean UConn is a scum university? The answer should be of course not.

Frankly, you're trivializing the horrors at PSU by comparing it to Syracuse because it puts the emphasis on what the university can't control and ignores what the university can.

Absolute BS.

Have you been following Syracuse?

Sounds like you haven't.

 

[upstater]

The public doesn't want to hear any more about the supposedly superior standards of PSU because:

1) Protecting that perception was the implicit justification for turning their backs on far worse activities.

2) How real was the basis for that perception? If they could cover up felony abuse of children for more than a decade, how hard would it be to cover up mere NCAA violations?

The standards were superior in most cases. Whether I give a shit what the public thinks, that's another story.

 

[Chin Diesel]

What's difficult to believe is that some people are saying PSU should maintain its standards (in all the obvious areas but one) and people with 2 cents think there's something wrong with this.

Bizarre.

This isn't morals. It's about continuing to do things the way they've been done in the past (in all the areas but one).

Pretty basic stuff to understand.

And Ted K, Ted Bundy and Jeffrey Dahmer were good guys in all areas but one too. Sometimes that "one" is a big deal and can rightfully overshadows everything else.


Big difference between having written standards and actually having a culture that lived those standards. PSU talked the talk but didn't walk the walk. They were all hat and no cattle. Etc, etc, etc.

 

[upstater]

And Ted K, Ted Bundy and Jeffrey Dahmer were good guys in all areas but one too. Sometimes that "one" is a big deal and can rightfully overshadows everything else.


Big difference between having written standards and actually having a culture that lived those standards. PSU talked the talk but didn't walk the walk. They were all hat and no cattle. Etc, etc, etc.

Really? Dahmer, Bundy and Ted K were sweethearts? Errr, I wouldn't want to hang out with those guys even if I were oblivious to their secrets.

PSU football even now is #1 in measurables in academics. It wasn't just written.

 

[whaler11]

The standards were superior in most cases. Whether I give a **** what the public thinks, that's another story.

That's great. You have to understand that the public doesn't give a **** about the academic standards the football team was held to.

If they go in that direction after they cleanse themselves, bully for them - but PSU has lost the right to look down their noses at Ohio State or anyone else.

 

[Chin Diesel]

Really? Dahmer, Bundy and Ted K were sweethearts? Errr, I wouldn't want to hang out with those guys even if I were oblivious to their secrets.

PSU football even now is #1 in measurables in academics. It wasn't just written.

Jeffrey Dahmer provided shelter for young men, then ate them.
Ted Bundy was known for taking sorority girls on nice country strolls before murdering them.
Ted K was a minimalist with a low carbon footprint who happened to mail bombs to people and killed them.
Penn State has great football academics and allows a coach to corn hole boys in the shower.

 

[upstater]

That's great. You have to understand that the public doesn't give a **** about the academic standards the football team was held to.

If they go in that direction after they cleanse themselves, bully for them - but PSU has lost the right to look down their noses at Ohio State or anyone else.

The public doesn't care about academics.
Good for them.
If a PSU person says we should maintain high standards, we all know what he's referring to. If he had said, now that we're all pedophile enablers, we should just go for wins, because the public doesn't care, now that would have been an interesting tack.

 

[upstater]

Jeffrey Dahmer provided shelter for young men, then ate them.
Ted Bundy was known for taking sorority girls on nice country strolls before murdering them.
Ted K was a minimalist with a low carbon footprint who happened to mail bombs to people and killed them.
Penn State has great football academics and allows a coach to corn hole boys in the shower.

Let's see if your logic works.

Dahmer provided shelter SO he could eat them.
Bundy took women on strolls SO he could murder them.
Penn State has great academics SO they can molest boys in the shower.

HMMMM, impeccable logic.

 

[whaler11]

The public doesn't care about academics.
Good for them.
If a PSU person says we should maintain high standards, we all know what he's referring to. If he had said, now that we're all pedophile enablers, we should just go for wins, because the public doesn't care, now that would have been an interesting tack.

No, the public doesn't care about your academics if you are protecting and enabling child molesters. I know that's probably hard to wrap your head around since it's such a nuanced opinion.

"PSU person" is exactly right. It's like some sort of bizarre cult. Yeah, look down your noses at Ohio State because the kids don't go to class or Auburn because they pay their QB. You can all rest easy that your heroes that had a great APR result... certainly they should be commended for that.