Best peak performance UConn team?

[Chin Diesel]

I tried doing this with everything in the post and it looked like crap. So, here's a snip of it. Take the five championship teams and the two teams I think were the best not to win- 1990 and 2009 and list out by position. I'll readily concede adding a column for overall bench strength is worthwhile and could make a difference.

It's one person's bored July afternoon of how I'd rank them against each other based on that season's performance and what I'd consider their peak abilities.

PG- Kemba, Bazz, KEA, Price, Tate, Taliek, Newton
SG- Smitty, Gordon, Boat, Hawkins, Lamb, Dyson, Moore
SF- Rip, Jackson, Burrell, Giffey, Robinson, D. Brown, 2011
PF- Dove, Adrien, Boone, Freeman, Karaban, Daniels, Smith
C- Okafor, Thabeet, Sanogo, Sellers, Voskuhl Oriakhi, Brimah

Figuring out the PG's after the first four was tough. I think it's pretty clear, Kemba, Bazz, KEA and Price are the top 4. How you shake out Tate, Taliek and Tristan isn't something I'd fight a whole lot over.
Putting Moore as the "worst" of the seven SG just feels awful. But I'm stuck what to do. I still think Smitty, Gordon, Boat and Hawkins are the top four but then you're saying Lamb, Dyson and Moore are below the mean average for that group. Nice problem to have.
Small forward seem like the easiest to rank. 2011 was a weird year with a bunch of different players starting but no one standing out statistically for minutes played or on court numbers.
Power Forward with Freshman Boone against Junior KFree is a tough one.
Voskuhl and Sellers for the fourth slot for C was tough too.

Just adding it up reminds of how good the two best non championship squads were and goes to the whole luck thing with the tourney. Also goes to show how dominant Kemba was willing that squad to victory.

 

[AZHuskiePop]

Saying that ‘99 and ‘23 both gelled hints at missing the point. The only bad games ‘99 had was when they were down two starters. They gelled for the entire season, not just the playoffs.

Was the question about potential peak or actual peak? The ‘99 Duke team was being considered one of the greatest teams of all time, certainly better than ‘04 Duke, and would have been had not UConn beat them. ‘99 UConn beat the toughest team and set a record for beating the spread in a championship game. I would call that an actual peak performance that bests ‘04.

Finally, using your metrics to support your claim, I would be forced to say that ‘99 Duke was better than ‘99 UConn, since they had more pro talent. Not happening. I insist that ‘99 UConn was a better team than ‘99 Duke despite having less pro talent. Sometimes the whole really is greater than the sum of the parts.

I’ve watched that 1999 game dozens of times and the coaching in that game is on a plain seldom seen . Packer’s analysis is also one of the best almost as though he understood what was happening was genius . It was probably JC single best coaching performance. and guys disrespecting K are pretty casual fans.
From a pure talent level the 2004 team was by far the best but I’m not sure they ever reached their full potential. That’s probably unfair because we returned the entire 1997-98 final 8 team which is unheard of today and becoming a true team is a reality when that occurs.,
2004 had some younger guys that were key . Charlie V, Marcus , Boone and Emeka back was an issue all year . He was the key to their success . The drop off without him was huge .
So more inconsistency is expected.
In 1999 we played a top 10 Stamford team on the road without RIP and blew them out . That’s what TEAMS do .
I said before if you could keep Emeka healthy and that cast together for a couple of years they were a pretty competitive NBA team. That’s a at least 3 very good NBA players 3 marginal ones and a couple just a step below on one team .

 

[Deleted at users request]

I tried doing this with everything in the post and it looked like crap. So, here's a snip of it. Take the five championship teams and the two teams I think were the best not to win- 1990 and 2009 and list out by position. I'll readily concede adding a column for overall bench strength is worthwhile and could make a difference.

It's one person's bored July afternoon of how I'd rank them against each other based on that season's performance and what I'd consider their peak abilities.



View attachment 89382




PG- Kemba, Bazz, KEA, Price, Tate, Taliek, Newton
SG- Smitty, Gordon, Boat, Hawkins, Lamb, Dyson, Moore
SF- Rip, Jackson, Burrell, Giffey, Robinson, D. Brown, 2011
PF- Dove, Adrien, Boone, Freeman, Karaban, Daniels, Smith
C- Okafor, Thabeet, Sanogo, Sellers, Voskuhl Oriakhi, Brimah

Figuring out the PG's after the first four was tough. I think it's pretty clear, Kemba, Bazz, KEA and Price are the top 4. How you shake out Tate, Taliek and Tristan isn't something I'd fight a whole lot over.
Putting Moore as the "worst" of the seven SG just feels awful. But I'm stuck what to do. I still think Smitty, Gordon, Boat and Hawkins are the top four but then you're saying Lamb, Dyson and Moore are below the mean average for that group. Nice problem to have.
Small forward seem like the easiest to rank. 2011 was a weird year with a bunch of different players starting but no one standing out statistically for minutes played or on court numbers.
Power Forward with Freshman Boone against Junior KFree is a tough one.
Voskuhl and Sellers for the fourth slot for C was tough too.

Just adding it up reminds of how good the two best non championship squads were and goes to the whole luck thing with the tourney. Also goes to show how dominant Kemba was willing that squad to victory.

This is a great list. Only thing I’d change is probably Karaban and Daniels. DD was a 1st round pick that year and had 27 and 10 in the sweet 16 and 20 and 10 in the Final Four. Karaban was an amazing role player, but it’d be hard for me to put him over someone who was one of the leading star guys.

I mayyy have Stanley Robinson higher too. He was a projected first rounder coming off 2009.

Kemba was college basketball Michael Jordan in 2011. Still surreal the level he played at all year for us to win games. Never seen anything like it.

 

[Chin Diesel]

This is a great list. Only thing I’d change is probably Karaban and Daniels. DD was a 1st round pick that year and had 27 and 10 in the sweet 16 and 20 and 10 in the Final Four. Karaban was an amazing role player, but it’d be hard for me to put him over someone who was one of the leading star guys.

I mayyy have Stanley Robinson higher too. He was a projected first rounder coming off 2009.

Kemba was college basketball Michael Jordan in 2011. Still surreal the level he played at all year for us to win games. Never seen anything like it.

Not arguing at all. It's meant for discussion and trying to put a bunch of info up there to look at in one post.

So, here's my thing with Robinson at SF. I put him #5. I had Rip, Jackson, Burrell and Giffey ahead of him. What I liked about Giffey in 2014 was Ollie used him at the 5 in small ball lineups and Giffey held his own on the defensive side and with rebounding. And his shooting throughout the year was lights out.

I won't argue with you on Daniels either. I honestly think I have Boone, who was a frosh in 2014, too high, but he filled in minutes at the 5 spot throughout the year when Emeka was hurt.

 

[uconngb]

Saying that ‘99 and ‘23 both gelled hints at missing the point. The only bad games ‘99 had was when they were down two starters. They gelled for the entire season, not just the playoffs.

Was the question about potential peak or actual peak? The ‘99 Duke team was being considered one of the greatest teams of all time, certainly better than ‘04 Duke, and would have been had not UConn beat them. ‘99 UConn beat the toughest team and set a record for beating the spread in a championship game. I would call that an actual peak performance that bests ‘04.

Finally, using your metrics to support your claim, I would be forced to say that ‘99 Duke was better than ‘99 UConn, since they had more pro talent. Not happening. I insist that ‘99 UConn was a better team than ‘99 Duke despite having less pro talent. Sometimes the whole really is greater than the sum of the parts.

The hair splitting on this board……

 

[Deleted at users request]

Not arguing at all. It's meant for discussion and trying to put a bunch of info up there to look at in one post.

So, here's my thing with Robinson at SF. I put him #5. I had Rip, Jackson, Burrell and Giffey ahead of him. What I liked about Giffey in 2014 was Ollie used him at the 5 in small ball lineups and Giffey held his own on the defensive side and with rebounding. And his shooting throughout the year was lights out.

I won't argue with you on Daniels either. I honestly think I have Boone, who was a frosh in 2014, too high, but he filled in minutes at the 5 spot throughout the year when Emeka was hurt.

I loved Giffey in 2014. He was a Swiss Army knife and pretty much didn’t miss from three it seemed like. Can’t speak on anything from the 90s as I didn’t watch then. It’s really so close the Giffey and Stanley that I wouldn’t even stress too much over it. Stanley straight up took over some of those games that postseason with the way he dominated the paint on both sides.

I’d probably agree with you on Boone too. May put Daniels above him as well if we’re talking about specific seasons. He’s kind of underrated and forgotten about when it comes to 2014.

 

[TheChamps990411]

'04 at their best is the answer. One of the best CBB teams in history IMO.

Ive said that for years. 04` by the time the tourney came around people were calling it the Uconn invitational and they delivered. If not for a couple questionable calls and JC taking his foot off the gas in the 2nd half after going up by like 25 points the final 4 couldve been two big blowouts. Ive said the two best teams ive seen in my 35 years of watching cbb was UNLV 90 and Uconn 04. 2023 maybe cracks my top 20. Although i must admit i cant remember many better teams defensively in that time frame. This years team was unbelievable defensively in the tourney.

 

[TheChamps990411]

2023 wouldn’t even be in my consideration. Yes, we looked great when we were rolling over all opposition, but how many teams did we beat that were real top ten teams? ‘Bama? In November? Marquette once out of three tries? Creighton one out of two?

Most of the other teams on your list beat national championship contenders again and again and again. Last year was great, and I love how that team developed, and we are national champions because we deserved to be. But we don’t have the basis that we have with the other teams on your list to know that they could overcome other great teams.

We held 4 of our 6 opponents under 60 points which is the big reason we won it all. Im not sure what the heck happened to this team between our loss to Marquette and halftime of the IONA game but they were absolute demons defensively and it was over. The offense could go on big runs but defensively they simply didnt allow big runs. Defense and big runs is why this team would be a threat to any team on that list and imho is a top 5 Uconn team ever and possibly top 3. Btw do you really think with the way were were playing that any of the top seeds or even 2 seeds wouldve beaten us? PUrdue who spent most of the season got bounced in the first round, Alabama we beat easily and they beat Houston. Kansas was in our bracket but they wouldve gotten crushed because they simply didnt have enough size.

 

[gsmooth]

We held 4 of our 6 opponents under 60 points which is the big reason we won it all. Im not sure what the heck happened to this team between our loss to Marquette and halftime of the IONA game but they were absolute demons defensively and it was over. The offense could go on big runs but defensively they simply didnt allow big runs. Defense and big runs is why this team would be a threat to any team on that list and imho is a top 5 Uconn team ever and possibly top 3. Btw do you really think with the way were were playing that any of the top seeds or even 2 seeds wouldve beaten us? PUrdue who spent most of the season got bounced in the first round, Alabama we beat easily and they beat Houston. Kansas was in our bracket but they wouldve gotten crushed because they simply didnt have enough size.

That sums up what I was thinking. Besides Iona, who was a tough mid major and not an easy 1st round opponent, the next 5 teams UConn played were in the KenPom top 25 and AP top 25. I think UConn was the 2nd or 3rd team to beat 5 teams in these top 25 lists in the last 15 years of the NCAAT.

I know people will say UConn caught a break by not having to play Texas or Houston in Houston at the Final Four, but I think UConn's size and defense would've overwhelmed both of those teams. I will be honest, when I watched Miami dismantle Houston in the Sweet 16 I got concerned knowing they could be UConn's opponent in the semifinals. Miami's offense scared the hell out of me.

 

[krinklecut]

Honestly, when clicking on all cylinders, there’s no team better than 2023. I’m not sure we ever even say them play the best basketball they could. We’re gonna look back at that team and be amazed at how much talent we stacked.

 

[AdamaNation]

Exactly!!! They still got a banner though. That Final Four banner matters

Despite no title. 09 defense at every position has them in my top 3.

 

[Horatio]

Despite no title. 09 defense at every position has them in my top 3.

09 is probably one of my top 3 UConn teams and they still have a banner hung. Just an injury short but final four banners still count.
5 championships + 1 Final Four * Dysons knee injury. I’ll stand on a soap box for that until the end. Lol

 

[Nick2005]

Caron butler teams and 05. 05 was crazy good. 23 is up there but we had teams that didn't win. 05 is the answer. I want it to be close be geez 05 just dominate.

 

[superjohn]

Watch the games again. This team had it's Big East funk where the refs didn't put us in such a good place and coaching didn't put us in such a good place. Once the tweaks were made with Sanogo and Jackson this team was really special.

The team didn't have the overall devastating size and talent 2004 did but the ball movement and making the right read was a step up from 2004. This was a pretty special team. You never know but I think next season could be pretty special as well which would be unique for UConn basketball. The teams tend to struggle coming off the national championship.

 

[Chin Diesel]

Watch the games again. This team had it's Big East funk where the refs didn't put us in such a good place and coaching didn't put us in such a good place. Once the tweaks were made with Sanogo and Jackson this team was really special.

The team didn't have the overall devastating size and talent 2004 did but the ball movement and making the right read was a step up from 2004. This was a pretty special team. You never know but I think next season could be pretty special as well which would be unique for UConn basketball. The teams tend to struggle coming off the national championship.

04 had Taliek Brown and Okafor who were both bad at FT's. Boone wasn't great either. UConn was fortunate to be able to put the ball in Ben Gordon's hands at the end of games since he was money at the FT line.

Other than that, '04 had no weaknesses.

 

[Deleted at users request]

Caron butler teams and 05. 05 was crazy good. 23 is up there but we had teams that didn't win. 05 is the answer. I want it to be close be geez 05 just dominate.

Funny how similar 05 and 2012 were.

Super talented teams with that was just too young to put it together after a title year.

Marcus and Shabazz first year running the show.

Jeremy Lamb and Charlie Villanueva stepping it up for it to be their team.

Andre and Rudy being the super talented hyped up freshman.

And a lot of guys finding their role in it all. 05 obviously having more success with it.

 

[Nick2005]

Despite no title. 09 defense at every position has them in my top 3.

Really wow. It has talent. Looked back on it, I see what you are saying but offensive talent just wasn't there. If you want defense shabazz and boatright were suffocating. Two Gary Payton's. That was nonsense defense. 09 was 100% we played in Detroit against MSU and got screwed again. We should really have 7 titles if it was not for reffing. When do we get calls? We have to win every game by 30, so ridiculous.

 

[Nick2005]

Funny how similar 05 and 2012 were.

Super talented teams with that was just too young to put it together after a title year.

Marcus and Shabazz first year running the show.

Jeremy Lamb and Charlie Villanueva stepping it up for it to be their team.

Andre and Rudy being the super talented hyped up freshman.

And a lot of guys finding their role in it all. 05 obviously having more success with it.

Everything you are saying is accurate. Those were good teams. Solid top ten teams that could easily win besides Drummond. We were lucky to make tournament. Drummond was not as advertised. Calhoun didn't retire bc he thought Drummond was Kareem.

 

[Ratso]

I know people will say UConn caught a break by not having to play Texas or Houston in Houston at the Final Four, but I think UConn's size and defense would've overwhelmed both of those teams. I will be honest, when I watched Miami dismantle Houston in the Sweet 16 I got concerned knowing they could be UConn's opponent in the semifinals. Miami's offense scared the hell out of me.

they said the same thing about denver & miami in the nba finals. phoenix, boston, milwaukee,la etc.. just weren’t good enough. philly definitely wasn’t good enough

 

[SportsFan88]

In my opinion what separates ‘04 and ‘23 from any of our other teams is when they were clicking on all cylinders, no other team in the country could or would make it a competitive game with those teams

 

[Chin Diesel]

In my opinion what separates ‘04 and ‘23 from any of our other teams is when they were clicking on all cylinders, no other team in the country could or would make it a competitive game with those teams

‘99 could do the same.

 

[Scoe]

2014 probably should’ve been on my list, you wanna talk about peak performance. Shooting everywhere ball handling and free throw shooting. Shabazz and Boatright got up in you (stealing a Kenny Smith line). When Deandre Daniels was on his game he was Durant lite, Giffey a jack off all trades and Kromah could give you double figures off the bench.