Best 2015 WCBB Players By Position...

[CocoHusky]

My post may wander a bit off topic, but I've long followed RU WBB, and this seems as good a time as any to add this:

Scaife and Copper are tremendous talents- I've been to a dozen Rutgers home games and that's quite apparent. And Betnijah Laney was even better! So what's happened to RU? Rutgers is perhaps THE most under-achieving program in America. For the past several years, RU has had a nucleus of dynamite players, every starter a top 50 Hoopgurlz HS recruit, with both Laney and Rachel Hollivay rated as #2 at their positions in the nation, while Scaife was top ten! That's a really impressive recruiting class with decidedly unimpressive results. So far only Laney has managed to live up to her lofty ranking, though Scaife and Copper may yet do so.

C Vivian Stringer may be a HOF-honored coach, but she hasn't gotten the job done in many years at RU, and I think she is the problem- whether it's her coaching or playing strategy or whatever, a team with Laney, Scaife and Copper (and despite Hollivay and Davis injuries) should have been way more successful. I've long liked RU WBB, but it is a huge enigma and a disappointment, and I gotta blame coach.

Not that I think she deserves or needs it but in Vivian's defense the injuries to Briyona Canty- # 6 and the transfers of Shakena Richardson- # 18 should also be considered.

 

[TFintheMix]

My post may wander a bit off topic, but I've long followed RU WBB, and this seems as good a time as any to add this:

Scaife and Copper are tremendous talents- I've been to a dozen Rutgers home games and that's quite apparent. And Betnijah Laney was even better! So what's happened to RU? Rutgers is perhaps THE most under-achieving program in America. For the past several years, RU has had a nucleus of dynamite players, every starter a top 50 Hoopgurlz HS recruit, with both Laney and Rachel Hollivay rated as #2 at their positions in the nation, while Scaife was top ten! That's a really impressive recruiting class with decidedly unimpressive results. So far only Laney has managed to live up to her lofty ranking, though Scaife and Copper may yet do so.

C Vivian Stringer may be a HOF-honored coach, but she hasn't gotten the job done in many years at RU, and I think she is the problem- whether it's her coaching or playing strategy or whatever, a team with Laney, Scaife and Copper (and despite Hollivay and Davis injuries) should have been way more successful. I've long liked RU WBB, but it is a huge enigma and a disappointment, and I gotta blame coach.

Good post and I appreciate your frustration! Coach Stringer 's offense has been perplexing at best over the years (though you have to admit to huge changes over the past 2 years) and she does not to recruit shooters. Over the past two years, they finally put an offense in place that compliments their athletic players but you also need players who can shoot with range who are in your regular rotation. I'm not sure if they were not capable or whether Stringer discouraged it but Rutgers simply takes too few many 3 pt shoots. I believe that they were more capable than we saw last year. Scaife and Laney were too good to not be able to take one step back to hit a 3 pter.

I am also hopeful that the new recruits will be contributors. I am rooting for Aliyah Jeune who is a very good player.

 

[TFintheMix]

Good write-up. Watching them a few times in the past years on TV, CV seems to be going thru the motions. Kind of reminds me of the final few years of Bobby Bowden and Paterno. What have you done for me lately!

You may be write a year or two ago. I read that she was dealing with some fairly severe health issues including something (I can't recall) that impaired her vision.

 

[Orangutan]

Nothing. Great place to park it with minimum effort.

Typically it takes quite a bit of effort to score in the low post. Besides, achieving maximum results with minimum effort isn't lazy; it's efficient.

 

[WestCoastFan]

Typically it takes quite a bit of effort to score in the low post. Besides, achieving maximum results with minimum effort isn't lazy; it's efficient.

It is efficient. Now, use that "saved" energy, by being efficient, and play some tight D!

 

[WestCoastFan]

You may be write a year or two ago. I read that she was dealing with some fairly severe health issues including something (I can't recall) that impaired her vision.

Hmmmm...maybe it's time to retire and enjoy life.

 

[Kibitzer]

they finally put an offense in place that compliments their athletic players.

Ahem.

I think you meant to use the verb complements (which basically means "to support") instead of compliments (which means "to praise").

This is a very common error (like reins vs. reigns), not disastrous but easily correctable.

I will be pleased to compliment you when you nail it down. Good luck.

 

[KnightBridgeAZ]

I have felt that it is a while since RU has had a balanced and talented roster - great individual talents at some positions, but especially at guard though also at center their have been gaps in available talent (or coaching or execution.) Lately they have been lacking in anyone to spread the floor from three point land.

Yes, combined with the injuries another poster mentioned, there have been flaws. Hollivay at center is a tremendous blocker - she may go down with the most blocks in Rutgers history - but in addition to injuries she commits way to many fouls, isn't that much of a scorer, and has had no real back-up. Christa Evans, the back-up center, who was no star but at least knew what she was doing, purportedly had such foot issues that she could barely walk - and played anyhow.

As to 3 point shooting, Beknighted on the RU board has shown - statistically - that it isn't truly required to be successful, and that Vivian is not in principle adverse to 3 point shots. But not having a 3 point threat did hurt last year, I think. Still, the 2 disasters for Rutgers last year were Northwestern at the end of season and in the B1G Tourney - Joe McKeown has always been a problem for CVS teams, and he had RU's number last year - and of course UConn in the big dance. I am convinced that - in the right match-up - Rutgers could have been a Sweet 16 team last year.

 

[KnightBridgeAZ]

Good write-up. Watching them a few times in the past years on TV, CV seems to be going thru the motions. Kind of reminds me of the final few years of Bobby Bowden and Paterno. What have you done for me lately!

I disagree that she seemed to be going through the motions. The success did fall off - but once the great recruiting class after the Imus situation turned out to be a disappointment (2 transfers, 2 players that went through the motions, really) the recruiting fell off, then the injuries to Canty that was very well thought of (she also required heart surgery as it turned out). Yes, someone mentioned health, she had an eye infection that required dark glasses, but we saw her the season before last when Rutgers won the WNIT and she seemed quite energized, as several folks who know her personally have confirmed.

That said, her entire coaching staff turned over this year - and there is a hint of the AD in the staff selected. Her contract is probably her last and I don't expect her to coach more than 3 more years. I do expect success, as in NCAA's, I'm not sure how deep RU can go as that will depend on the recruits.

 

[BlueDevils]

I like this thread a lot, so with that being said
Point Guards:
1. Moriah Jefferson,Uconn
2. Leticia Romero, FSU
3. Alexis Jones, Baylor (would be number 2 but is returning from injury)
4. Niya Johnson, Baylor
5. Lili Thompson, Stanford

Two-Guards (all other guards, not pg):
1. Tiffany Mitchell, South Carolina
2. Kia Nurse, Uconn
3. Kelsey Mitchell, Ohio State
4. Tyler Scaife, Rutgers
5. Courtney Walker, Texas A&M

Forwards (big and small):
1. Some girl with the last name Stevens , Uconn
2. Diamond Deshields, Tenn
3. Nina Davis, Baylor
4. Some other girl with the last name Stevens , Duke
5. Aja Wilson, South Carolina

Centers:
1. Morgan Tuck, Uconn
2. Jillian Alleyne, Oregon
3. Briana Turner, ND
4. Adut Bulgak, FSU
5. A. Coates, South Carolina

Side notes: I'm not a big L. Allen fan. I'm not completely sold that she can lead while putting the team on her back whether with scoring, passing, or defense. Something my top 5 point guards can do. Also, I feel bad for Tuck. Tuck is the BEST back to the basket player on the collegiate level, but for w/e reason people are SCARED to say it because nobody wants to speak that UCONN has 3 of the best position players at point, power forward, and center. Shame on anyone who rank any center over TUCK. I'm convinced you don't watch basketball if ANY of you ranked any center ahead of Tuck. And for the Tennessee fans I will be watching M. Russell this year.

 

[Orangutan]

Side notes: I'm not a big L. Allen fan. I'm not completely sold that she can lead while putting the team on her back whether with scoring, passing, or defense. Something my top 5 point guards can do.

Let's look back to the NCAA regional last year.

vs. Stanford - 28 points (9-17 FG, 4-7 3FG, 6-6 FT), 5 reb, 4 ast, 1 stl;
vs. Baylor - 23 points (10-16 FG, 3-4 FT), 5 reb, 7 ast, 4 stl

How do you explain that when the chips were down in last year's tournament LA (not Niya Johnson or Lili Thompson) was the regional MOP? I really have to assume that you either didn't watch or don't remember those games to put Thompson and Johnson on your list but omit Allen.

Now, her final four numbers were not good, but we have clear proof that LA can take over games against top opposition in high-stakes games. And she's 73-4 in two years as a starter.

Side rant: It seems like the only two ND players anyone thinks were very good last year were Lindsay Allen. If LA, Reimer, Mabrey, Cable, and Westbeld are as limited as I've read that they are, Loyd should have won NPOY hands down and Turner should have been NFOY easy for dragging such mediocre players to the National Championship game.

 

[BlueDevils]

Let's look back to the NCAA regional last year.

vs. Stanford - 28 points (9-17 FG, 4-7 3FG, 6-6 FT), 5 reb, 4 ast, 1 stl;
vs. Baylor - 23 points (10-16 FG, 3-4 FT), 5 reb, 7 ast, 4 stl

How do you explain that when the chips were down in last year's tournament LA (not Niya Johnson or Lili Thompson) was the regional MOP? I really have to assume that you either didn't watch or don't remember those games to put Thompson and Johnson on your list but omit Allen.

Now, her final four numbers were not good, but we have clear proof that LA can take over games against top opposition in high-stakes games. And she's 73-4 in two years as a starter.

Side rant: It seems like the only two ND players anyone thinks were very good last year were Lindsay Allen. If LA, Reimer, Mabrey, Cable, and Westbeld are as limited as I've read that they are, Loyd should have won NPOY hands down and Turner should have been NFOY easy for dragging such mediocre players to the National Championship game.

Those were two nice gms when it matters most but let's be realistic teams were game planning against Turner and Loyd so for ND to be successful others were FORCE to step up. I believe the Baylor game Loyd was off and every other guard on Notre Dame couldn't miss. I want to say between mabrey n cable one shot was missed. One could argue that wasn't just Allen but muffet countering a gameplay.

The games against Duke Allen played down to her level of competition. Does Mo do that? No. Does lex do that? No. What about Niya Johnson? no. And what does the three have in common? When teams are game planning against those 3 players they make sure those 3 are in check every possession or atleast try. (I've seen teams sag off niya because of her passing ability). Those two years Allen started she was behind a nucleus of go to players. How does she perform this year when now you're the go to player and film is being studying on your game MUCH HARDER? That's what I'm curious about. I expect lili Thompson to have a good year this year hence why I have Stanford in my preseason top 5 n another thread. Bottom line is that just because you're on a great team and aren't ask to do as much doesnt make you top in your position. Let's see how she holds up when you're now a top 2 player on your team. Something every top 5 point guard I listed was at some point of their career. Nonetheless, Allen has had a good college career thus far.

 

[Huskies Rule]

Let's look back to the NCAA regional last year.

vs. Stanford - 28 points (9-17 FG, 4-7 3FG, 6-6 FT), 5 reb, 4 ast, 1 stl;
vs. Baylor - 23 points (10-16 FG, 3-4 FT), 5 reb, 7 ast, 4 stl

How do you explain that when the chips were down in last year's tournament LA (not Niya Johnson or Lili Thompson) was the regional MOP? I really have to assume that you either didn't watch or don't remember those games to put Thompson and Johnson on your list but omit Allen.

Now, her final four numbers were not good, but we have clear proof that LA can take over games against top opposition in high-stakes games. And she's 73-4 in two years as a starter.

Side rant: It seems like the only two ND players anyone thinks were very good last year were Lindsay Allen. If LA, Reimer, Mabrey, Cable, and Westbeld are as limited as I've read that they are, Loyd should have won NPOY hands down and Turner should have been NFOY easy for dragging such mediocre players to the National Championship game.

Objectively (I'm trying, I'm really trying), Reimer, Mabrey, Cable and Westbeld are good players who ARE definitely "limited," each having clear-cut, exploitable weaknesses in their games. Yes, Loyd and Turner played great all year, they are special athletes and ballplayers, but I would not credit them for "dragging" the rest along to the NC. Rather, I strongly believe it was MM, the second best coach in all of WCBB, who was responsible for that accomplishment.

 

[WestCoastFan]

I disagree that she seemed to be going through the motions. The success did fall off - but once the great recruiting class after the Imus situation turned out to be a disappointment (2 transfers, 2 players that went through the motions, really) the recruiting fell off, then the injuries to Canty that was very well thought of (she also required heart surgery as it turned out). Yes, someone mentioned health, she had an eye infection that required dark glasses, but we saw her the season before last when Rutgers won the WNIT and she seemed quite energized, as several folks who know her personally have confirmed.

That said, her entire coaching staff turned over this year - and there is a hint of the AD in the staff selected. Her contract is probably her last and I don't expect her to coach more than 3 more years. I do expect success, as in NCAA's, I'm not sure how deep RU can go as that will depend on the recruits.

Not sure you could hang your hat on winning the WNIT...doesn't that make you the 65th best team in country? My point is that they haven't been that competitive on the National stage. Very good coach, no doubt.

 

[Orangutan]

Those were two nice gms when it matters most but let's be realistic teams were game planning against Turner and Loyd so for ND to be successful others were FORCE to step up. I believe the Baylor game Loyd was off and every other guard on Notre Dame couldn't miss. I want to say between mabrey n cable one shot was missed. One could argue that wasn't just Allen but muffet countering a gameplay.

The games against Duke Allen played down to her level of competition. Does Mo do that? No. Does lex do that? No. What about Niya Johnson? no. And what does the three have in common? When teams are game planning against those 3 players they make sure those 3 are in check every possession or atleast try. (I've seen teams sag off niya because of her passing ability). Those two years Allen started she was behind a nucleus of go to players. How does she perform this year when now you're the go to player and film is being studying on your game MUCH HARDER? That's what I'm curious about. I expect lili Thompson to have a good year this year hence why I have Stanford in my preseason top 5 n another thread. Bottom line is that just because you're on a great team and aren't ask to do as much doesnt make you top in your position. Let's see how she holds up when you're now a top 2 player on your team. Something every top 5 point guard I listed was at some point of their career. Nonetheless, Allen has had a good college career thus far.

I'm sure that McGraw did draw up some good stuff against Baylor but Allen still had to actually make the 10 shots, dish out the 7 assists, and steal the ball 4 times.

"Just because you're on a great team and aren't ask to do as much doesnt make you top in your position" I would say conversely that being the 2nd best player on a good team doesn't mean that you're automatically better than the 3rd best player on a great team.

When she doesn't have to do much, she's "playing down" to the opposition. When teams key on her teammates and she is asked to do a lot, you downplay it because she only was able to take that shot because of her teammates.

The way I follow your logic, Niya Johnson is a better player because she puts up big numbers against lesser opposition but her getting shut down against better opposition (like ND) is proof that the other team gameplanned to shut her down.

"I've seen teams sag off Niya because of her passing ability." Really?! She's a career 38.8% shooter who has 4 3-pointers in her entire career. They sag off of her because she can't shoot and can only pass. Of course teams sag off of her. I want her taking every single shot.

This really shouldn't bother me because Lindsay is always underrated so it's nothing new, but I guess I'm just in a quarrelsome mood.

 

[triaddukefan]

This really shouldn't bother me because Lindsay is always underrated so it's nothing new, but I guess I'm just in a quarrelsome mood.

I agree she is underrated by many (not by me) ..... but at least she isnt soft, slow, and lazy.

 

[BlueDevils]

Orangutan, IMHO Allen is a top 6 point guard coming into the season. Now that she's no longer living in the shadow behind go to players we will see can she CONSISTENLY CARRY a team. Something Niya Johnson showed throughout the year with limited wing help. Mo plays behind go to players but she's established herself as a go to player by dictating offensively AND defensively. Something Allen hasn't showed us consistently. Now if she's putting up the same numbers against top competition as well as good numbers against lesser competition than she has the potential to jump to a top 3 point guard in 2016-2017.

Ironically, I actually think Allen is overrated.

 

[UcMiami]

Not sure you could hang your hat on winning the WNIT...doesn't that make you the 65th best team in country? My point is that they haven't been that competitive on the National stage. Very good coach, no doubt.

With 32 automatic bids and at least 20 of them being seeded in the last 6 rows, it puts you at least say in the low to mid forties I would think.

 

[MilfordHusky]

Two-Guards:

1. Kia Nurse, UConn
2. Katie Lou Samuelson, UConn
3. Some other players

 

[Orangutan]

Orangutan, IMHO Allen is a top 6 point guard coming into the season. Now that she's no longer living in the shadow behind go to players we will see can she CONSISTENLY CARRY a team. Something Niya Johnson showed throughout the year with limited wing help. Mo plays behind go to players but she's established herself as a go to player by dictating offensively AND defensively. Something Allen hasn't showed us consistently. Now if she's putting up the same numbers against top competition as well as good numbers against lesser competition than she has the potential to jump to a top 3 point guard in 2016-2017.

Ironically, I actually think Allen is overrated.

I don't see how Allen is overrated in general. Maybe she gets kudos on these message boards but irl she gets almost no recognition. Didn't even make All-ACC last year, which is preposterous to me.

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. At least you're not as bad as the guy on Rebkell that had Salvadores in his top 5 over Allen...

I look forward to Ogunbowale having a big freshman year and us having the "but can she carry a team" discussion again next year.

 

[Bonpland]

Orangutan your comment reinforces Mark Twain's obsevation that:

"There are lies, damned lies, and then there are statistics."

 

[Bonpland]

Orangutan, I meant your earlier comment about interpreting the numbers.

 

[UcMiami]

Orang - I like Allen and think she is a very good player - her stepping up in the regionals was a surprise to most including obviously the opponents! Reminded me a little of Tiffany against I believe Louisville. Every year in college is different with the roster turnover - will be interesting to see how she does, but I expect her to be solid again. ND runs a great offense and she understands it so she has a head start on a lot of other PGs in that respect.

 

[RSHERMVIKES]

KnightBridgeAZ- - -That said, her entire coaching staff turned over this year - and there is a hint of the AD in the staff selected. Her contract is probably her last and I don't expect her to coach more than 3 more years. I do expect success, as in NCAA's, I'm not sure how deep RU can go as that will depend on the recruits.

Hey I agree! I was tremendously surprised when Rutgers entered the B1G and CVS' contract was up they didn't go and hire New Blood a younger hot coaching prospect to lead them on their new adventure!

 

[Frodo]

Point Guards:
1. Moriah Jefferson, UConn
2. Niya Johnson, Baylor
3. Letitia Romero, FSU
4. Lindsay Allen, ND
5. Rachel Theriot, Nebraska

Two-Guards (all other guards, not pg):
1. Tiffany Mitchell, SC
2. Courtney Williams, USF
3. Kelsey Mitchell, OSU
4. Kia Nurse, UConn
5. Shatori Walker-Kimbrough, Maryland

Forwards (big and small):
1. Breanna Stewart, UConn
2. Aerial Powers, MSU
3. Azura Stevens, Duke
4. A'ja Wilson, SC
5. Morgan Tuck, UConn
6. Nina Davis, Baylor
Centers:
1. Alaina Coates, SC
2. Briana Turner, ND
3. Adut Bulgak, FSU
4. Ruth Hamblin, OSU

Point Guard: Probably Lexie Brown needs to be on the list someplace and maybe Allen at #2.

2 Guard: Seems to be a dearth of these this year so there might be a chance for a incoming freshman like Patberg to emerge, but I think Mabrey at ND needs to be on the list. I'm assuming that Samuelson will mostly play the 3, but if she can defend well enough may see some time at the 2. If she shoots like she has so far in her career she could make that list by the end of the year at either the 2 or at forward. Might make similar arguments for Collier. ( I know, that's a lot of ifs and I really do expect that they will both play more wing/small forward.)
Forwards: Tuck, Davis, DeShields and Graves should be ahead of Wilson, and probably Stevens and Powers.

Center:Alleyne, Turner are both better than Coates, who is seriously overrated in my view. Stafford-McGee needs to be there as well.