Baylor Going Down to KU

[UcMiami]

Sims plays to much one on one and takes to many shots. She is a point guard and needs to get everyone else involved. The give her the ball and get out of the way and watch. When she misses everybody is standing around. Baylor better learn to play team ball because good opponents can make it a long nite for Sims if she continues to take all the shots. Shes not leading her team she is the team and that tells me there is an I in team. That's not good.

She actually isn't the 'point guard' on this team - that is Johnson. Agree with everything else.

 

[cohenzone]

Those were ridiculous shot attempts by Sims at the end unless she was sure somehow she would get foul calls. For a team that scores so much (against generally bad teams) they do not have much of a plan on offense. Oddly, in the KY game after Sims was heave-hoed, Mulkey's daughter Robertson had to take over and had a career day and nearly carried the Bears to the win. Sure, 6 of her 23 points that game came on FTs, and we know how she gets those, but she can score sometimes in the bigger games.

If a kid flops, 99.9% of the time it's on D and there are no foul shots taken by the flopper.

I think we need not concern ourselves with whether or not Baylor over flops. I can't see us shooting as badly against them if we face them again and unless they discover a shooting threat other than Sims, our D will make her take a lot of bad shots even if she makes a few. Our game today shows how many other players we have who can burn you if you focus on one or even two of our kids. A great luxury and an unselfish team. A not horrible Rutgers decided to chase KML and they did manage to stay within 35.

 

[ctfjr]

Does this mean Kansas will now rocket into ??? top 100? 50?

 

[triaddukefan]

This goes to show you how deep and well balanced the Big 12 is. Its no wonder that conference finishes as the top RPI conference at the end of most seasons. Even a bottom dweller can knock off a National top 10 squad on any given Sunday.

 

[MilfordHusky]

Sims 13 of 37 so in the last two games 17 of 62. She was also 4 of 19 in the second half I think. There are not many players who can consistently shoot that much and make a decent percentage. I know the rest of the team is young, but you need to try and develop them. Davis looks like a really good player and they seem to have enough other good players.
Baylor didn't leave home during OOC except the KY game up the road in Dallas. This was the third conference road game and the Big12 is notorious for teams having trouble on the road.

17 for 62 is under 30%! I'll give her a bit of a pass against UConn, because we do that to a lot of players, but 13 for 37?!

The Baylor kids impressed me with toughness and energy on Monday, but this was not a good performance at all.

 

[uconnfan68]

Here's the thing,

For the past few seasons Kansas has always been interesting in the NCAA tournament. They have scored some upsets before. This wouldn't be that surprising based on that.

Kara Lawson made a good call in the studio which I didn't realize. Baylor hasn't played outside the state of Texas this season until this game

That would be the country of Texas... if they had their druthers.

 

[EasyEd]

Sims is all about Sims. This result does not surprise me.

I agree! In the UConn game, they closed the gap when she got her other teammates involved. Once they got close, I think she wanted to be the one to "win the day" which made our defense more effective, by allowing us to focus more on her. The parts they showed in the Kansas game, it looked like she wanted to be the hero again. I think Simms could be more effective if she got her other teammates involved more. JMO

 

[UcMiami]

In Sims defense this seems to be what Mulkey wants. In previous years Sims was a great compliment to Griner, but all year she has been dominating the scoring and shooting - she averages 22 shots a game (30% of Baylor's shots), and that includes 9 OOC games against really dreadful teams where one assumes she was not playing 30+ minutes. If her shooting that often was an issue one would think Kim would have said something to her.

 

[DobbsRover2]

If a kid flops, 99.9% of the time it's on D and there are no foul shots taken by the flopper.

I think we need not concern ourselves with whether or not Baylor over flops. I can't see us shooting as badly against them if we face them again and unless they discover a shooting threat other than Sims, our D will make her take a lot of bad shots even if she makes a few. Our game today shows how many other players we have who can burn you if you focus on one or even two of our kids. A great luxury and an unselfish team. A not horrible Rutgers decided to chase KML and they did manage to stay within 35.

Um, I guess that depends on which game we're viewing, and yours is different than mine. You apparently only see players flop on defense (well, okay, there is another 0.1% of the time), whereas I see players flopping all over the place on offense. Under the basket, with no chance of putting it in they throw up the ball against the bottom of the rim and flop on the court to draw a foul (watch the Rutgers game today). Or going through a screen they draw a slight bit of contact and do a flop reel to the floor as if they were clotheslined. Or while shooting a 3 a defender goes hurtling by with no contact but the shooter throws up a wild air ball while flopping to the floor. Or ..... but actually I think we already exceeded the limit for those 0.1% offensive flops. Some of the most prolific scorers in WCBB history have been offensive floppers, but they have been able to do it on 0.1% of the plays.

 

[cohenzone]

Um, I guess that depends on which game we're viewing, and yours is different than mine. You apparently only see players flop on defense (well, okay, there is another 0.1% of the time), whereas I see players flopping all over the place on offense. Under the basket, with no chance of putting it in they throw up the ball against the bottom of the rim and flop on the court to draw a foul (watch the Rutgers game today). Or going through a screen they draw a slight bit of contact and do a flop reel to the floor as if they were clotheslined. Or while shooting a 3 a defender goes hurtling by with no contact but the shooter throws up a wild air ball while flopping to the floor. Or ..... but actually I think we already exceeded the limit for those 0.1% offensive flops. Some of the most prolific scorers in WCBB history have been offensive floppers, but they have been able to do it on 0.1% of the plays.

So UConn kids never fall down on their way to the hoop or fling the ball up as they are being hit. First of all, watch our game against Baylor again and then try to figure out how much the "flopping" affected the game. Not close to what the fevered imagination thinks. If someone really thinks our schemes on O or D were affected greatly by Baylor "flopping", they are plainly silly. Our bad shooting kept the margin down. Baylor scored three dozen points less than they normally do. And real "flopping" occurs overwhelmingly on D. You know why? Because if you truly flop on O more bad things can happen than good if you don't sell the "flop" and obviously worse if you also don't make the hoop. You've probably turned the ball over, given the other team a fast break and other stuff the coach doesn't like. By your definition of flopping, Tiff Hayes was a champion flopper since a lot of her falls were on aggressive attacks to the basket. I suppose only the other team fakes it and we never do.

Moreover, a true "flop" implies there was no contact at all, at worst, slight (as opposed to a ref getting a charge/block call wrong as happened in the 3rd Dolson foul vs. Baylor). When someone is attacking the basket and falls, it's way more often than not because they are either actually bumped, or because they've gotten themselves off balance and fall. It's up to the refs to make the right call. I'll also warrant you that kids you see tumble underneath playing against our front line don't all that often face such aggressive height under the hoop. It's pretty hard to outright flop on O because it's too easy to see a player with the ball fall without contact. As for jump shooters "flopping", about the only way I know for a jump shooter to sell a true flop to an official is to do what our defenders did that resulted in Sims 2 sets of 3 point fouls. A belated rush at the shooter where the defender's momentum is moving forward and it always looks like a foul or it really does cause the shooter to fall backward making it look even more like a foul. It is rare as heck for a "flop" induced foul to be called on someone defending a jump shooter who isn't moving forward at the shooter and even harder for the shooter to flop reflexively in that case than it is for a defensive "flopper". Most, even lousy, refs are actually pretty good at requiring real contact on a foul. I think more errors are made by refs on blocked shots that they think were fouls than they do in calling fouls where there was no contact and a player falls. I yield now to your expertise.

 

[DaddyChoc]

I was afraid of this game. I had a feeling that this young group would not receover well from the UCONN game. Now I see why Kim doesn't like that OOC game during conference play.

are you **ing me... the weakest excuse of the 13-14 season

 

[DobbsRover2]

So UConn kids never fall down on their way to the hoop or fling the ball up as they are being hit. First of all, watch our game against Baylor again and then try to figure out how much the "flopping" affected the game. Not close to what the fevered imagination thinks. If someone really thinks our schemes on O or D were affected greatly by Baylor "flopping", they are plainly silly. Our bad shooting kept the margin down. Baylor scored three dozen points less than they normally do. And real "flopping" occurs overwhelmingly on D. You know why? Because if you truly flop on O more bad things can happen than good if you don't sell the "flop" and obviously worse if you also don't make the hoop. You've probably turned the ball over, given the other team a fast break and other stuff the coach doesn't like. By your definition of flopping, Tiff Hayes was a champion flopper since a lot of her falls were on aggressive attacks to the basket. I suppose only the other team fakes it and we never do.

Moreover, a true "flop" implies there was no contact at all, at worst, slight (as opposed to a ref getting a charge/block call wrong as happened in the 3rd Dolson foul vs. Baylor). When someone is attacking the basket and falls, it's way more often than not because they are either actually bumped, or because they've gotten themselves off balance and fall. It's up to the refs to make the right call. I'll also warrant you that kids you see tumble underneath playing against our front line don't all that often face such aggressive height under the hoop. It's pretty hard to outright flop on O because it's too easy to see a player with the ball fall without contact. As for jump shooters "flopping", about the only way I know for a jump shooter to sell a true flop to an official is to do what our defenders did that resulted in Sims 2 sets of 3 point fouls. A belated rush at the shooter where the defender's momentum is moving forward and it always looks like a foul or it really does cause the shooter to fall backward making it look even more like a foul. It is rare as heck for a "flop" induced foul to be called on someone defending a jump shooter who isn't moving forward at the shooter and even harder for the shooter to flop reflexively in that case than it is for a defensive "flopper". Most, even lousy, refs are actually pretty good at requiring real contact on a foul. I think more errors are made by refs on blocked shots that they think were fouls than they do in calling fouls where there was no contact and a player falls. I yield now to your expertise.

So who said anything about only players from other teams hitting the floor for a call? Certainly not me, as I saw a case or two today where a UConn player drew a call, which is how basketball is played today. Obviously as a UConn fan, I seem to espy that certain teams like Baylor and ND take advantage a lot more, even if you don't as you have said repeatedly in many threads.

What I was questioning was your assertion that only defensive players flop around to draw fouls, which I believe a very imbecilic idea. My expertise says that a player who bangs a shot off the bottom of a rim and flops to the floor for the foul like in the game today actually is flopping. And it is also my expertise that is not the rare once-a season occurrence that exists in your BB-watching world but that it actually happens quite frequently, and that some teams like ND are very adept at it. But we can agree that your expertise says it happens on 0.1% of any play where a player inexplicably lays herself out on the floor, and that in my experience it seems to happen many orders of magnitude higher than that for players on offense.

 

[ThisJustIn]

are you *ing me... the weakest excuse of the 13-14 season

It's funny, 'cause Kim'd quotes suggest she thought the team was overconfident because of the effort they put in v. UConn

 

[Kibitzer]

are you *ing me... the weakest excuse of the 13-14 season

Blaming Baylor's loss to Kansas on the UConn game is like blaming the tsunami in Indonesia on a leaky water faucet in Jakarta.

 

[Icebear]

Drawing a charging foul is not flopping. There is, also, a correct way defensively to go about flopping that Bobby Knight taught all the way back at Army. It involved standing as tall as you can be flat footed on the floor and lifting your toes shortening your base and moving your balance onto your heels. At no point were you encouraged to through yourself or pre contact roll backwards, you allowed contact to do that. The flopping we are seeing frequently is to the point of taking a dive and is indeed more like what we see in soccer.

Offensive flops gain undeserved foul shots. Bad defensive flops draw undeserved offensive fouls. Fouls accrued because of both potentially changes who can be on the floor with foul trouble and how you can play defense and even offense and not risk more foul trouble or ejection. It is inaccurate to say it doesn't change the game it does.

It still can be overcome and must be by a great team. It should become controlled by the officials when it gets to the point of acting.

 

[Phil]

Anyone want to bet on how many Kansas fans, not only revelled in the win over Baylor, but noted they won by more than UConn?

 

[Phil]

Sims took as many shots as all other starters combined...then took six more.

 

[Phil]

So in consecutive games, Baylor loses their 69 home court winning streak and their 136 game streak without back to back losses. Their last back to back losses were to to Oklahoma and Iowa State in February 2010.

Not close to the UConn mark, but a very respectable string.

 

[DobbsRover2]

Anyone want to bet on how many Kansas fans, not only revelled in the win over Baylor, but noted they won by more than UConn?

Well, yeah, but they were playing at home, so when you factor in the home court point advantage plus give UConn some credit for softening up Baylor and also making them overconfident of their abilities, I think UConn and Kansas are just about even. Likely they should be allowed to share the #1 ranking in the AB (After Baylor) polls this week.

 

[Phil]

Well, yeah, but they were playing at home, so when you factor in the home court point advantage plus give UConn some credit for softening up Baylor and also making them overconfident of their abilities, I think UConn and Kansas are just about even. Likely they should be allowed to share the #1 ranking in the AB (After Baylor) polls this week.

Sounds about right.

 

[DobbsRover2]

So in consecutive games, Baylor loses their 69 home court winning streak and their 136 game streak without back to back losses. Their last back to back losses were to to Oklahoma and Iowa State in February 2010.

Not close to the UConn mark, but a very respectable string.

Plus yesterday they also lost their nation-leading streak of road wins, and now ND takes over the top spot. Not a great six days for Baylor.

 

[Phil]

Plus, didn't this end a streak of consecutive games in one state? Just kidding, but I wouldn't be surprised.

 

[cohenzone]

Um, I guess that depends on which game we're viewing, and yours is different than mine. You apparently only see players flop on defense (well, okay, there is another 0.1% of the time), whereas I see players flopping all over the place on offense. Under the basket, with no chance of putting it in they throw up the ball against the bottom of the rim and flop on the court to draw a foul (watch the Rutgers game today). Or going through a screen they draw a slight bit of contact and do a flop reel to the floor as if they were clotheslined. Or while shooting a 3 a defender goes hurtling by with no contact but the shooter throws up a wild air ball while flopping to the floor. Or ..... but actually I think we already exceeded the limit for those 0.1% offensive flops. Some of the most prolific scorers in WCBB history have been offensive floppers, but they have been able to do it on 0.1% of the plays.

As you suggested,I re-watched the RU game. In the first half, Rutgers hit the deck on offense a grand total of zero times. On D, they hit the floor once and were called for a block on a drive by MJ. All other cases of RU on the floor were loose ball scrambles. There were several instances of contact where floppers could have flopped on either side of the ball.

In the 2nd half, the first time RU hit the deck on a shot was with less than 5 minutes left and that was on a block by Stewart where no foul was called. That was the only time RU hit the deck on O aside from loose ball scrambles.

You really did watch a different game. There probably has never been a game where so few players hit the deck. This was not a prototype CViv team. Go Huskies.

 

[Kibitzer]

Sims took as many shots as all other starters combined...then took six more.

Show me a team that has one player take 37 shots and I'll show you a team that has either no game plan or one that stinks.

I'll reiterate a question I posed a little while ago. What would happen if Kim demanded that Odyssey get at least ten assists?

 

[easttexastrash]

This is not the first time that a team has has a BIG letdown after a big game, and won't be the last. This is not the first time a top 10 team has lost to an unranked opponent, and it won't be the last. Seems like I remember UCONN losing at home a couple of years back to an unranked opponent and still getting to the Final Four.

BUT, on the bright side, my Broncos whomped on some Patriot ass yesterday!!! That was what counted yesterday!

 

[DobbsRover2]

Show me a team that has one player take 37 shots and I'll show you a team that has either no game plan or one that stinks.

I'll reiterate a question I posed a little while ago. What would happen if Kim demanded that Odyssey get at least ten assists?

The other Baylor players have to be prepared for a change in Sims behavior on the offensive end. To get assists, the other players have to set up looking for a pass, and it appears in much of the games they are looking more to clean off her misses with an offensive rebound and a put back. It's not necessarily the worst strategy, since Sims does draw a lot of defenders near the basket and opens up spaces for her teammates to set up for rebounds. But much of the offense is predicated on Sims making a much higher percentage of her shots or racking up the FT attempts.

So yes, Kim should definitely challenge OS to get 10 assists, but the question is, does the practice time work on offensive plays that have Baylor players moving around to set up for a Sims assist, or are they just working on largely just wrinkles of Sims driving. And when Sims drives she is almost invariably putting up a shot.

 

[DobbsRover2]

This is not the first time that a team has has a BIG letdown after a big game, and won't be the last. This is not the first time a top 10 team has lost to an unranked opponent, and it won't be the last. Seems like I remember UCONN losing at home a couple of years back to an unranked opponent and still getting to the Final Four.

BUT, on the bright side, my Broncos whomped on some Patriot ass yesterday!!! That was what counted yesterday!

Don't remember that UConn team losing back-to-back though. In fact the last time that happened, my ancestors were chasing mastodons.

 

[easttexastrash]

In Sims defense this seems to be what Mulkey wants. In previous years Sims was a great compliment to Griner, but all year she has been dominating the scoring and shooting - she averages 22 shots a game (30% of Baylor's shots), and that includes 9 OOC games against really dreadful teams where one assumes she was not playing 30+ minutes. If her shooting that often was an issue one would think Kim would have said something to her.

Kim has flat out stated that this is what she wants Sims to do this year...shoot, shoot, shoot! Maybe Kim has less confidence in the youngsters than she should. Small needs to work on her shot but the girl can handle the ball and get to the rim. I think she should be at the PG position as Johnson has no offense. Little Mulkey plays hard but she cannot guard anyone and she can only shoot if she is wide open. She has zero ability to dribble past her opponent and get off her own shot. I would like to see Wright, another freshman, on the floor more.

Anyway, this is the way it goes with Mulkey. She tinkered with the forward and guard positions a lot last year and I hope that she does that this year.