Baylor fires president/football coach over dissuading rape victims from reporting assaults

[HoopsFan21]

I am guessing someone out here knows the answer - presume Baylor does decline the requests for LOI releases, the players all appeal, and all apeals are denied. What can the recruit do? Sit out and lose a year of eligibility and then enroll anywhere he wants? Is he bound to Baylor until his class graduates?

Aside generally agree most of this case is outside the purview of the NCAA. Given the speed with which they have dealt with UNC I have a better chance of becoming President or gaining a seat on the SCOTUS.

I would have agreed had coaches not gotten involved to protect their players. Why would a coach get involved? For the same reason academic fraud occurred at UNC: to keep players eligible and on the field or court. That puts it squarely in the NCAA's purview in my mind since one of the missions of the NCAA is maintaining and enforcing student-athlete eligibility standards. It would be pretty tough for a player to remain eligible if he were in prison which as you can imagine is quite the motivation for a coach to interfere with or prevent criminal investigations involving their player(s). Don't forget this is the same school whose men's basketball coach meddled in the murder investigation of one of his own players just to keep another member of the team who committed the murder eligible when NCAA rules violations were uncovered as part of that investigation. Baylor's athletic department is simply out of control.

 

[Fairfield Fan]

As far as I can see the PSU case involved an employee committing felonies primarily if not entirely off school grounds with the victims being non-students/non-athletes. Terrible crime and perhaps prolonged by the inaction of various administration and athletic department personnel.

The Baylor situation involves felony criminal actions by student athletes perpetrated at lease some of the time against fellow student athletes/fellow students, with active suppression of evidence/intimidation of victims/obstruction of investigations in order to enhance on-field performance of athletic teams in NCAA competition - no, this seems to fall well outside NCAA governance!

In fact, Sandusky was seen raping a boy in the Penn State shower room on one occasion.

 

[UcMiami]

In fact, Sandusky was seen raping a boy in the Penn State shower room on one occasion.

Not actually true. He was seen showering with the boy.

 

[HoopsFan21]

In fact, Sandusky was seen raping a boy in the Penn State shower room on one occasion.

That incident was pretty much the only way the NCAA could connect PSU football to the whole thing - because it happened in the football locker room, was witnessed by a football assistant coach, reported to the head coach, and on up the chain of command. The details of that whole incident were sketchy, and while Sandusky was charged with rape in that incident, he was acquitted of it at trial. Also the NCAA said PSU covered it up to protect their glorious football program (which looking back at the record books was actually in the toilet at the time), but to this day despite the initial charges, no one has been convicted of anything besides Sandusky because there is simply no evidence of such a thing occurring. The NCAA knew it screwed up which is why they rolled back the sanctions. With respect to PSU and its athletic department, this case was the classical trial in the court of public opinion where everyone grabbed their torches and pitchforks the day the indictments dropped despite not having all the facts, but in America an indictment equals guilt. There are several interesting aspects of this case, not to get too off topic, but I remember at the time saying to myself that I'll bet the school administrators eventually have their coverup and conspiracy charges quietly dropped long after everyone's attention has turned to something else and their reputations destroyed because the case against them was pretty flimsy to begin with.

 

[billnaples]

I would have agreed had coaches not gotten involved to protect their players. Why would a coach get involved? For the same reason academic fraud occurred at UNC: to keep players eligible and on the field or court. That puts it squarely in the NCAA's purview in my mind since one of the missions of the NCAA is maintaining and enforcing student-athlete eligibility standards. It would be pretty tough for a player to remain eligible if he were in prison which as you can imagine is quite the motivation for a coach to interfere with or prevent criminal investigations involving their player(s). Don't forget this is the same school whose men's basketball coach meddled in the murder investigation of one of his own players just to keep another member of the team who committed the murder eligible when NCAA rules violations were uncovered as part of that investigation. Baylor's athletic department is simply out of control.

You may be correct, but having the NCAA involved does not mean that justice will be served. Baylor is certainly more vulnerable to sanctions of significance if for no other reason that they don't have the cache of a UNC. A lesser school, regardless of the sport(s) than UNC would have been hammered by now. Continues to be a black mark against the NCAA to the question of which is the bigger fraud.

 

[BigBird]

You may be correct, but having the NCAA involved does not mean that justice will be served. A lesser school...than UNC would have been hammered by now. Continues to be a black mark against the NCAA to the question of which is the bigger fraud.

Have you seen the strange commercial Billy Jean King has cut for the NCAA? Ommagosh!
She says that it's good that college athletes play just "for the love" of it, not for money. They just want to be successful in whatever way they imagine, she intones. And the way college sports is dis-connected from big money is the reason we can all support it.

Lose my lunch.

 

[Kibitzer]

Have you seen the strange commercial Billy Jean King has cut for the NCAA? Ommagosh! She says that it's good that college athletes play just "for the love" of it, not for money. They just want to be successful in whatever way they imagine, she intones.

I'm sure BJK filmed this commercial "for the love" of it, not for money.

Sure.

 

[billnaples]

Have you seen the strange commercial Billy Jean King has cut for the NCAA? Ommagosh!
She says that it's good that college athletes play just "for the love" of it, not for money. They just want to be successful in whatever way they imagine, she intones. And the way college sports is dis-connected from big money is the reason we can all support it.

Lose my lunch.

I have not seen it. I tried to do a little research into how much of her early tennis life she gave playing for her high school or college just for the love of it. You know what? I couldn't find much. Maybe her HS and college didn't have girls tennis back in the day. (In the interest of full disclosure she is but a year older than me). Now maybe she played a lot of the tennis events as a amateur I can't really tell. But my guess is she played for earnings pretty early in the process. I think there are two levels of athletes in college. Those who are really good and have a strong chance of becoming a pro in their sport. And I include those who at the very least thinks they may have a pro future. And group 2 includes all the players who understand a pro career is not in their future and do in fact play which ever sport it is for the sheer love of it. BJK should be honest that many playing collegiate sports are there because of the money that will be available whenever they can make the leap.

 

[cordarone]

Have you seen the strange commercial Billy Jean King has cut for the NCAA? Ommagosh!
She says that it's good that college athletes play just "for the love" of it, not for money. They just want to be successful in whatever way they imagine, she intones. And the way college sports is dis-connected from big money is the reason we can all support it.

Lose my lunch.

NCAA says it "prioritizes academics, well-being and fairness."

Also, lol that comments were disabled and @ the dislike/like ratio for that clip (which I'm proud to say, I added to today).

 

[j66kicker]

Unbelievable. A group of Baylor boosters, including co-owner of the Texas Rangers, is pushing to bring Art Briles back as football coach in 2017. Baylor board of regents are voting on this tonight.

Reports: Baylor donors push for Briles return

 

[Zorro]

Hoopsfan-
<<What is it with schools from Texas? Are athletics that big of a deal there that they ... abandon any sort of morality and compliance...?>>

It's in the Constitution!
Because Tejas came into the US as a sovereign Republic in 1845.
They are allowed to break up into 6 states, force-feed their football teams, & form their own (secret, undercover) professional sport leagues.

Friday Night Lights cubed!! You really have to see it.

 

[Zorro]

NCAA says it "prioritizes academics, well-being and fairness."
And I say that i am the rightful hereditary king of Guatemala!!

 

[Carnac]

Unbelievable. A group of Baylor boosters, including co-owner of the Texas Rangers, is pushing to bring Art Briles back as football coach in 2017. Baylor board of regents are voting on this tonight.

Reports: Baylor donors push for Briles return

Well........well.........well. From the "Actions speak louder than words" file: Forget all of the rhetoric, banging of the drums, along with the shock and dismay the regents expressed after this story broke.
Forget that they said that: every student's safety and well being was their their highest concern and priority. Forget that they promised to get to the bottom of this, take corrective measures, and make sure it never happened again.

It's been documented that Briles had knowledge of those acts, and did nothing about them (which is why he was terminated). Like Lazarus, he died, and was buried. Now, they're trying to resurrect him. Now we know for sure exactly where Baylor's priorities really lay. If Briles is brought back after a year's suspension, the news media will have a field day with this. If the BOR vote to allow him back, this may be an act that they can not over come. They may find themselves removed from their seats on the board.

 

[KnightBridgeAZ]

I have not seen it. I tried to do a little research into how much of her early tennis life she gave playing for her high school or college just for the love of it. You know what? I couldn't find much. Maybe her HS and college didn't have girls tennis back in the day. (In the interest of full disclosure she is but a year older than me). Now maybe she played a lot of the tennis events as a amateur I can't really tell. But my guess is she played for earnings pretty early in the process. I think there are two levels of athletes in college. Those who are really good and have a strong chance of becoming a pro in their sport. And I include those who at the very least thinks they may have a pro future. And group 2 includes all the players who understand a pro career is not in their future and do in fact play which ever sport it is for the sheer love of it. BJK should be honest that many playing collegiate sports are there because of the money that will be available whenever they can make the leap.

It is quite a dichotomy. A small percentage of football and men's basketball players, some baseball players, a very few women's basketball players and a couple of isolated stars in other sports have a chance at really good money when they graduate. Another small percentage will get to play or compete in their sport, professionally, but not earn any significant money from doing so.

And that's the really sad thing about the folks chasing the financial pro success - there really are so few of them across the board of college athletics.

As to those who think they have a pro future - I saw a survey (I don't know how reliable) that 70% of DI men's BB players think they have a pro future. Delusional much?

 

[j66kicker]

Well...well....well. From the "Actions speak louder than words" file: Forget all of the rhetoric, banging of the drums, along with the shock and dismay the regents expressed after this story broke.
Forget that they said that: every student's safety and well being was their their highest concern and priority. Forget that they promised to get to the bottom of this, take corrective measures, and make sure it never happened again.

It's been documented that Briles had knowledge of those acts, and did nothing about them (which is why he was terminated). Like Lazarus, he died, and was buried. Now, they're trying to resurrect him. Now we know for sure exactly where Baylor's priorities really lay. If Briles is brought back after a year's suspension, the news media will have a field day with this. If the BOR vote to allow him back, this may be an act that they can not over come. They may find themselves removed from their seats on the board.

To be fair, this is being driven by a small group of boosters, albeit heavy contributors (including Bob Simpson, Rangers co-owner and benefactor of Baylor's Simpson Athletics and Academic Center). And the board of regents is saying last night's phone meeting was a pre-planned meeting and had nothing to do with Briles (although it was reported separately that a preliminary vote on bringing Briles back was "close").

Baylor prez confirms donor push for Briles return

 

[Rocket009]

Another Title IX lawsuit filed against Baylor.

"According to Mark Schlabach of ESPN.com, one of the women alleged a football player sexually assaulted her in April 2014. "

3 Unnamed Women File Title IX Lawsuit Against Baylor

 

[j66kicker]

I heard a legal opinion on the Baylor situation on the radio today. The gist was that Baylor is trying to figure out how to terminate Briles, not pay him his full contract, but minimize legal exposure. If they fire him for cause, then they must specifically identify the 'cause', and open themselves up (more than they are already) as an easier lawsuit target.

To date Baylor has not referred to any specifics in their communications on the allegations. Their 13-page "statement of fact" was written by Baylor themselves, condensed from Pepper's lengthy verbal report (the real facts, but not recorded). Pepper, their hired legal firm, retains the only recorded records of any details of their investigation. Of course attorney-client privilege shields them from being forced to divulge those details. The 13-page paper is vague regarding any specifics (hence it can't be used as hard evidence against the university). Baylor says it omitted any specifics "to protect the identity of the victims", even though many of the victims are coming forward, trying to get their stories listened to.

So, basically, Baylor is in full-on damage control mode, not even close to "full transparency, do everything we can to make things better" mode.

 

[JordyG]

Bottom line. All of this says "Parents, don't send your young women to Baylor." Football>The New Testament.

 

[ThisJustIn]

Donor: "Hey, it's a BCS Championship. So my daughter got raped. I'd say we'd all agree the 'ship was worth that sacrifice."

 

[Dillon77]

Bottom line. All of this says "Parents, don't send your young women to Baylor." Football>The New Testament.

Donor: "Hey, it's a BCS Championship. So my daughter got raped. I'd say we'd all agree the 'ship was worth that sacrifice."

The other bottom line: $$$, from BCS championships/success and related benefits (said donors) to increased visibility that apparently has been leading to a larger student body pool.

The initial/early reactions from those identifying themselves as Baylor supporters (fans, alums, parents) focused on the everything from "evidence" (which is being kept as private as possible, per other reports) to lashing out at 3rd parties (press, posters, etc.). As these Title IX cases come out, those reactions will have to change (the look in the mirror part), otherwise you'll have a "what a fool believes, he sees" situation. That's deleterious for all concerned at Baylor, from individuals to institutions.

We'll see how this affects the quality and quantity of enrollment...right now Baylor undergrad is nearly 60% female. If the institution keeps moving forward like they have to this point, I can't see good things happening there. And that, ironically, might catch some of these regent's eyes because that will-- at some point -- affect the bottom line: $$$.

 

[j66kicker]

Briles now filing a motion saying he was wrongly terminated and made a scapegoat for Baylor's overall institutional failure in addressing sexual assault. He also wants his own representation in a Title IX lawsuit naming the university, McCaw (recently resigned athletic director) and Briles. (The perpetrator - a former football player - was convicted of rape and sent to prison for 20 years.) Briles says the University is trying to agree to a quick settlement and he wants no part of it. Says the U has withheld info from him, excluded him from meetings on the issue, and made statements on his behalf without his consent. His lawyer says if they settle he isn't paying anything because he doesn't owe anything.

Briles accuses Baylor of wrongful termination

 

[UConnNick]

Wow. Briles certainly isn't getting very good advice, legal or otherwise, if he ever plans to coach again in college. Unless he can conclusively prove he turned in every single one of the players involved and the school elected to do nothing about it, he's gonna be toast when this gets through. Plus he was still solely responsible for suspension or expulsion of players from the team. If he persists on this course, it will be ten times uglier than Rich Rodriguez's very acrimonious departure from West Virginia.

 

[cordarone]

The purpose of the filing was to force BU to settle on the balance of Briles' contract ($40M or so).
Baylor could have argued his termination for cause but that would have meant having the litigation data he was seeking brought to court (including that Pepper Hamilton finding, which apparently still only exists in oral form).
So as not to weaken their defense against the Title IX lawsuits they're facing, Briles has been paid.
He's 60 and will never get a gig as good as the one he had, but someone else out there will be desperate or clueless enough to hire him (viz Dave Bliss).
If not, he now has a pretty expansive golden parachute to fall back on.
Reports: Baylor, Art Briles reach contract settlement

 

[j66kicker]

Nobody's saying how much of the remaining $40 million he'll be paid, but I think we can infer that part of the settlement was Briles being taken off the hook for any damages or settlements in the Title IX suits which name him along with the university.

 

[Charliebball]

Briles Financial Settlement Finalized

Regent: Briles, Baylor reach financial settlement