OT: Baseball HOF

[Mr. French]

Very excited for my favorite position player ever, Andruw Jones, to be inducted into the Baseball HOF.

I've thought he was underrated and underappreciated, particularly with his glove being all-time great and his power numbers being strong, but he fell off quick end of his career and his BA wasn't great. Oh well, I'm happy he's finally in.

Beltran also got in, and he was always solid though I never thought he was one of the best players in the league, he was very good for a long time though, and a great teammate and winner.

I saw somewhere today that there's only like 4 CFs in the last 50 years in the HOF, so definitely under represented. With Andruw's glove being the best of all time, I think it's fitting he gets in.

Hoping to make a trip to Cooperstown this summer, I missed it when Maddux and Glavine got inducted, I can't miss it this time.

Anyone with any thoughts or any players they hope to see make it soon?

 

[Deepster]

As a Mets fan, I don’t feel Beltran is a hall of famer at all. And there is talk about the Mets retiring his number which I am also vehemently against.

 

[Spaceman213J]

Glad to see them both get in, but when you look at their career numbers, makes me think more and more that Dwight Evans should be in.

In comparison to Beltran, Dewey had a similar average, about 60 less home runs, but may have had more if he played when Beltran did and his OBP is 20 points higher and has I think 5 more gold glove awards than Beltran.
Jones has about 500 less hits than Dewey, but again about 60 more homeruns. Jones has 2 more gold glove awards.

No criticism of the two who got in, but make me wonder why Dewey isn't in. Hope he gets honored while he can still enjoy it.

 

[Mr. French]

Glad to see them both get in, but when you look at their career numbers, makes me think more and more that Dwight Evans should be in.

In comparison to Beltran, Dewey had a similar average, about 60 less home runs, but may have had more if he played when Beltran did and his OBP is 20 points higher and has I think 5 more gold glove awards than Beltran.
Jones has about 500 less hits than Dewey, but again about 60 more homeruns. Jones has 2 more gold glove awards.

No criticism of the two who got in, but make me wonder why Dewey isn't in. Hope he gets honored while he can still enjoy it.

I never saw Evans play, but it seems he's got a case from the numbers I've already read about.

The main differentiator for me with Andruw, being biased but also thinking on the importance of how good he was defensively, is those gold gloves. I was a CF in my day and I watched almost every game of his career and I never saw anyone come close to him defensively in the outfield. Even the greats like Edmonds and Hunter weren't as good as Druw.

 

[Chin Diesel]

When you look at their numbers, they both belong. And baseball, more than any sport is numbers driven.

I go a bit different looking at impact. How long do you talk about baseball from 1995-2015 before you need to mention Jones or Beltran? It's a long conversation before they are talked about.

Jones had the GG's, but overall? One second place MVP season and no other top 5's. He had an eighth place as his only other top 10 MVP season. Only led the league in one major offensive category in his career- Led in RBI's one time.

Beltran is somewhat similar. A few gold gloves and a couple of top-10 MVP seasons. Never led the league in any offensive category.

No ill will towards either one of them. Congrats to them both. I just don't get excited when I see player profiles like theirs in the HoF. I'd spend more time at their Cooperstown exhibits wondering why they got in, rather than admiring their careers.

 

[Spaceman213J]

I never saw Evans play, but it seems he's got a case from the numbers I've already read about.

The main differentiator for me with Andruw, being biased but also thinking on the importance of how good he was defensively, is those gold gloves. I was a CF in my day and I watched almost every game of his career and I never saw anyone come close to him defensively in the outfield. Even the greats like Edmonds and Hunter weren't as good as Druw.

Jones was one of the best I've ever seen at getting a jump on the ball off the bat. I think Devon White was the other guy I'd watch get a great jump. Jones put his body on the line all the time with his defense. I wonder if that helped shorten his career some.

Evans won 8 gold gloves and probably should have won at least 3 or 4 more playing maybe the toughest right field in baseball. He was an underrated athlete and technically as sound as it gets. I enjoyed watching him set up his body to get in a perfect position to make a throw and he had a a great arm... maybe not in the Ichiro, Bo Jackson category, but he was incredibly accurate.

 

[Mr. French]

When you look at their numbers, they both belong. And baseball, more than any sport is numbers driven.

I go a bit different looking at impact. How long do you talk about baseball from 1995-2015 before you need to mention Jones or Beltran? It's a long conversation before they are talked about.

Jones had the GG's, but overall? One second place MVP season and no other top 5's. He had an eighth place as his only other top 10 MVP season. Only led the league in one major offensive category in his career- Led in RBI's one time.

Beltran is somewhat similar. A few gold gloves and a couple of top-10 MVP seasons. Never led the league in any offensive category.

No ill will towards either one of them. Congrats to them both. I just don't get excited when I see player profiles like theirs in the HoF. I'd spend more time at their Cooperstown exhibits wondering why they got in, rather than admiring their careers.

I agree with Beltran, I always felt he was really good but not great.

With Jones, again I’m biased he’s my favorite player but him being the all-time best defensive player at a tough position should get him in when he had good O numbers too.

 

[mauconnfan]

Both Hall of Very Good baseball players. This is now a joke. A .254 lifetime hitter who was a great fielder but still, and another guy who was solid but never had a “best player in the game” kinda year? Wow baseball continues on the Scott Rolen trend, not a good look for Cooperstown. If not deserving, you don’t have to put someone in every year.

Mattinglys career cut short but a much better baseball player than both, not close. At least he was the best player in the game a couple three years when playing.

 

[boog204]

Glad to see them both get in, but when you look at their career numbers, makes me think more and more that Dwight Evans should be in.

In comparison to Beltran, Dewey had a similar average, about 60 less home runs, but may have had more if he played when Beltran did and his OBP is 20 points higher and has I think 5 more gold glove awards than Beltran.
Jones has about 500 less hits than Dewey, but again about 60 more homeruns. Jones has 2 more gold glove awards.

No criticism of the two who got in, but make me wonder why Dewey isn't in. Hope he gets honored while he can still enjoy it.

So here’s my argument against Evans. I only saw him from 1985 on, so it was the tail end of his career, although he was still very productive, but I think the point remains. When was Evans the best OF on his own team? Beginning of his career its Rice and Lynn, then Rice, then Greenwell for a few years at the end. Evans put up solid #s for a long time. But I can never remember a time when he was a "feared" hitter or someone who was considered a regular all-star. He had some all-star seasons, but he was usually the 2nd or 3rd guy in his own OF.

Evans always struck me as a very good player for a long time. But was he ever considered one of the “best”? He had three All-Star games and two top five mvp finishes. I don't think Dale Murphy was a HOF'er, but he was clearly one of the best players in baseball for a 4-5 year period. I don't think you can say that for Evans.

The argument can be made through defensive metrics that I don't understand that Andruw Jones was the best defensive CF ever. You tie that into some really big offensive years. He had seven 30+ home run years; Evans had three, and I'm surprised it took Jones this long to get in.

Beltran has better numbers across the board than Evans and was a great postseason player. Evans was a .240 hitter in the postseason. Beltran over 300 with 16 hrs and historic postseason production, and Jones 273 with 10hrs.

I have the same vibe with Evans that I have with a guy like Lou Whitaker. Whitaker was a very good player for a long time. He was always one of the better 2Bs in the AL. But I never watched him and thought, "This guy is an all-time great. This is a hall of famer."

 

[Mr. French]

Both Hall of Very Good baseball players. This is now a joke. A .254 lifetime hitter who was a great fielder but still, and another guy who was solid but never had a “best player in the game” kinda year? Wow baseball continues on the Scott Rolen trend, not a good look for Cooperstown. If not deserving, you don’t have to put someone in every year.

Mattinglys career cut short but a much better baseball player than both, not close. At least he was the best player in the game a couple three years when playing.

10 gold gloves, the greatest defensive player at his position of all time, and 400+ HRs is rare and deserving.

 

[boog204]

Both Hall of Very Good baseball players. This is now a joke. A .254 lifetime hitter who was a great fielder but still, and another guy who was solid but never had a “best player in the game” kinda year? Wow baseball continues on the Scott Rolen trend, not a good look for Cooperstown. If not deserving, you don’t have to put someone in every year.

Mattinglys career cut short but a much better baseball player than both, not close. At least he was the best player in the game a couple three years when playing.

Jones has to be put in the Ozzie Smith category. Based on stats, Andruw Jones is the best defensive CF ever. Better than Mays, Mantle, DiMaggio, Griffey... fill in the blank. It was a no-doubter to put Ozzie in despite being a 262 singles hitter. Jones should've been a shoo-in because he was far more productive offensively.

Jones, for his prime 10-year period, averaged 265/35/103 while winning the GG every year. That's pretty damn impressive. His average and production absolutely plummeted over his last six years due to injuries and not taking care of himself, which really sunk his BA, halted his WAR accumulation because he couldn't field anymore, and had him done at 35. I think he should've been in far earlier. Not a first-ballot necessarily (Ozzie Smith was a first ballot at 92%?)

 

[cullaville]

Both Hall of Very Good baseball players. This is now a joke. A .254 lifetime hitter who was a great fielder but still, and another guy who was solid but never had a “best player in the game” kinda year? Wow baseball continues on the Scott Rolen trend, not a good look for Cooperstown. If not deserving, you don’t have to put someone in every year.

Mattinglys career cut short but a much better baseball player than both, not close. At least he was the best player in the game a couple three years when playing.

The Baseball Hall of Fame is becoming the Hall of very good players or I played along time so I have a lot of hits, homers etc.

The hall should be reserved for the GREATs not the very goods.

 

[Spaceman213J]

So here’s my argument against Evans. I only saw him from 1985 on, so it was the tail end of his career, although he was still very productive, but I think the point remains. When was Evans the best OF on his own team? Beginning of his career its Rice and Lynn, then Rice, then Greenwell for a few years at the end. Evans put up solid #s for a long time. But I can never remember a time when he was a "feared" hitter or someone who was considered a regular all-star. He had some all-star seasons, but he was usually the 2nd or 3rd guy in his own OF.

Evans always struck me as a very good player for a long time. But was he ever considered one of the “best”? He had three All-Star games and two top five mvp finishes. I don't think Dale Murphy was a HOF'er, but he was clearly one of the best players in baseball for a 4-5 year period. I don't think you can say that for Evans.

The argument can be made through defensive metrics that I don't understand that Andruw Jones was the best defensive CF ever. You tie that into some really big offensive years. He had seven 30+ home run years; Evans had three, and I'm surprised it took Jones this long to get in.

Beltran has better numbers across the board than Evans and was a great postseason player. Evans was a .240 hitter in the postseason. Beltran over 300 with 16 hrs and historic postseason production, and Jones 273 with 10hrs.

I have the same vibe with Evans that I have with a guy like Lou Whitaker. Whitaker was a very good player for a long time. He was always one of the better 2Bs in the AL. But I never watched him and thought, "This guy is an all-time great. This is a hall of famer."

One can also argue that Evans played before playoff expansion and before further expansion diluted pitching a little more. He also finished with more runs scored and more RBI's than Jones. His numbers are very comparable with Harold Baines, who is in the Hall, and only ever effected one side of play positively. Baines was mostly a Dan Hurley and when he was in the field was not known for his defense. Evans also has 2x the SBs tha Baines had.
I don't get the 'most feared' debate because I don't think a single pitcher ever feared Ozzie Smith, but I would never argue that he is not a HOF. Evans batted up and down that lineup, even leadoff at times. Evans also had about 500 more walks than Jones in his career.
Another guy who got in recently and was feared for a few years was Dave Parker. He had 5 seasons with a WAR at or above 4.0... 6 seasons with a WAR at or above 3.0. Evans had 8 season at/above 4.0 and 11 season at/above 3. I know WAR is relatively new, but by his stats, he never would have had a -WAR in any season he played over a 20 year career.
There is some old timers like Hack Wilson who put up like 6 good years. By his metrics, Don Mattingly who was the best hitter in baseball for about the same time should be in.

I'm not against Jones and Beltran getting in. I don't think Baines was HOF worthy. But if all 3 of them are in, I think one could easily argue for Dewey. Evans from all accounts was also a standup guy and great teammate from everything I heard. I just think there are a number of guys in who he measures equal to if not outright surpasses in overall production and contribution to his team.

 

[navery12]

Both of these guys should have already been in, glad they finally got in. Surprised by the comments here, these seem like very obvious inductees. But I guess this is the Boneyard after all

 

[cullaville]

One can also argue that Evans played before playoff expansion and before further expansion diluted pitching a little more. He also finished with more runs scored and more RBI's than Jones. His numbers are very comparable with Harold Baines, who is in the Hall, and only ever effected one side of play positively. Baines was mostly a Dan Hurley and when he was in the field was not known for his defense. Evans also has 2x the SBs tha Baines had.
I don't get the 'most feared' debate because I don't think a single pitcher ever feared Ozzie Smith, but I would never argue that he is not a HOF. Evans batted up and down that lineup, even leadoff at times. Evans also had about 500 more walks than Jones in his career.
Another guy who got in recently and was feared for a few years was Dave Parker. He had 5 seasons with a WAR at or above 4.0... 6 seasons with a WAR at or above 3.0. Evans had 8 season at/above 4.0 and 11 season at/above 3. I know WAR is relatively new, but by his stats, he never would have had a -WAR in any season he played over a 20 year career.
There is some old timers like Hack Wilson who put up like 6 good years. By his metrics, Don Mattingly who was the best hitter in baseball for about the same time should be in.

I'm not against Jones and Beltran getting in. I don't think Baines was HOF worthy. But if all 3 of them are in, I think one could easily argue for Dewey. Evans from all accounts was also a standup guy and great teammate from everything I heard. I just think there are a number of guys in who he measures equal to if not outright surpasses in overall production and contribution to his team.

Plus Evans had a cannon for an arm

 

[mauconnfan]

Jones has to be put in the Ozzie Smith category. Based on stats, Andruw Jones is the best defensive CF ever. Better than Mays, Mantle, DiMaggio, Griffey... fill in the blank. It was a no-doubter to put Ozzie in despite being a 262 singles hitter. Jones should've been a shoo-in because he was far more productive offensively.

Jones, for his prime 10-year period, averaged 265/35/103 while winning the GG every year. That's pretty damn impressive. His average and production absolutely plummeted over his last six years due to injuries and not taking care of himself, which really sunk his BA, halted his WAR accumulation because he couldn't field anymore, and had him done at 35. I think he should've been in far earlier. Not a first-ballot necessarily (Ozzie Smith was a first ballot at 92%?)

He couldn’t hold Don Mattinglys jock and Donnie baseball was the best player in baseball for 2-3 years at least and Jones never sniffed that. He was a great CFer, you can argue he was one of the best but that’s fine. He batted over .275 like once maybe twice? Sorry he had 7% of the vote his first year on the HOF scorecard how does it change that dramatically after very little respect. He is Scott Rolen and not as good of a hitter, sorry it’s a sham.

 

[mauconnfan]

10 gold gloves, the greatest defensive player at his position of all time, and 400+ HRs is rare and deserving.

Looked closer to his career and stats, from 97 to 07 pretty steady with 5 HOF type years. He’s closer than I thought, but .254 is awful. Closer to agreeing since he was one of the best CFers ever, but not all in.

 

[Mr. French]

Looked closer to his career and stats, from 97 to 07 pretty steady with 5 HOF type years. He’s closer than I thought, but .254 is awful. Closer to agreeing since he was one of the best CFers ever, but not all in.

Andruw's problem was 2-fold: He wasn't a great avg hitter, that I agree with. But he was very good in his peak, only his peak happened to only last about 8-10 years.

He started at 18 and by 30 he was pretty bad. After he left Atlanta, he stunk. But he had a bunch of great peak years and just by him being the best defensive player ever at his position, I think he's a definite.

 

[FfldCntyFan]

I'm not going to complain about who got in during this vote as it became The Hall of Very Good a number of years ago.

I will question the comment greatest defensive player at his position of all time . Yes, he is on an exceptionally short list, but there is no way to make an absolute statement on him topping that list.

 

[boog204]

One can also argue that Evans played before playoff expansion and before further expansion diluted pitching a little more. He also finished with more runs scored and more RBI's than Jones. His numbers are very comparable with Harold Baines, who is in the Hall, and only ever effected one side of play positively. Baines was mostly a Dan Hurley and when he was in the field was not known for his defense. Evans also has 2x the SBs tha Baines had.
I don't get the 'most feared' debate because I don't think a single pitcher ever feared Ozzie Smith, but I would never argue that he is not a HOF. Evans batted up and down that lineup, even leadoff at times. Evans also had about 500 more walks than Jones in his career.
Another guy who got in recently and was feared for a few years was Dave Parker. He had 5 seasons with a WAR at or above 4.0... 6 seasons with a WAR at or above 3.0. Evans had 8 season at/above 4.0 and 11 season at/above 3. I know WAR is relatively new, but by his stats, he never would have had a -WAR in any season he played over a 20 year career.
There is some old timers like Hack Wilson who put up like 6 good years. By his metrics, Don Mattingly who was the best hitter in baseball for about the same time should be in.

I'm not against Jones and Beltran getting in. I don't think Baines was HOF worthy. But if all 3 of them are in, I think one could easily argue for Dewey. Evans from all accounts was also a standup guy and great teammate from everything I heard. I just think there are a number of guys in who he measures equal to if not outright surpasses in overall production and contribution to his team.

"Feared" in the sense that he was a good offensive player, not a great one. It's basically the same vibe used against Baines. Played a long time, accumulated a lot of #s, but... If we're arguing HOF or not based largely on the "counting numbers," then I think you should have been a hitter whom teams/fans feared to some extent. Never got that vibe with Evans. There are really only a couple of guys in the hall solely for their defensive impact. Comparing him to Ozzie Smith is obviously irrelevant, as Ozzie is in there solely for his defense and his likability. In retrospect, it's ridiculous that Ozzie was a first-ballot HOF with 92% of the vote based entirely on being the "GOAT" of SS, where Andruw Jones had to wait nine years to get in. Just my $0.02 on that.

Anyways, obviously, Evans was a very good defensive player, and I remember him having a cannon of an arm. The WAR aspect is certainly in his favor, although I'm still trying to completely wrap my head around that metric, as it seems inconsistent in some areas. Dave Parker was a monster offensive player in Pittsburgh and later Cincinatti who by all accounts was a great defensive player in his prime. But his WAR is almost 1/2 that of Evans. Makes little sense to my small brain.

To me, it simply boils down to this... Was Evans considered one of the absolute best OFs of his era? I don't know if that's true, as indicated by his low all-star game attendance and really no signature year except for maybe 81, which is a tough one b/c of the strike.

If you argue that he's better than Baines, therefore a HOF'er, then that is problematic, as Baines is the clear WTF selection of the last 10 years. The hall can't change that, but that also shouldn't be a metric for letting guys in who don't necessarily deserve it. Arguing that Evans had more walks than Jones and that matters? Yeah, made his OBP higher, but honestly no voter is looking at walk totals to swing their choice.

Sorry for the essay, I just never got the vibe from watching him that Evans was a HOF'er. Very good all-around player for sure. But there was never a time (or a season) that screamed out HOF'er to me. And I don't think it's just my Yankee bias, as I don't think Mattingly should be in, or Posada, or Bernie, or any of the other hall of very good Yankees.

 

[boog204]

I'm not going to complain about who got in during this vote as it became The Hall of Very Good a number of years ago.

I will question the comment greatest defensive player at his position of all time . Yes, he is on an exceptionally short list, but there is no way to make an absolute statement on him topping that list.

If you're referring to Andruw with the second comment, his defensive metrics (whatever that means) have him as the greatest defensive OF of all time. The same metrics support Ozzie, Brooks Robinson, Mazeroski, and Hernandez - all commonly thought of as the best defensive players at their positions. There's never going to be an absolute, but the same data that acclaims those other guys supports Jones. That's some pretty strong evidence, imo.

 

[FfldCntyFan]

I'm curious as to where Willie Mays' metrics would have been if he had retired at 35 years old as Jones did.

I only saw Mays from when he was ~38-39 years old forward, and while he still had some pretty good seasons (until the Giants accepted it was over and traded him to the Mets), he obviously was no longer more than an adequate outfielder in his late 30's and less than that in his 40's.

I'm not sure that the data you are referencing is fully an apples to apples comparison.

 

[boog204]

Looked closer to his career and stats, from 97 to 07 pretty steady with 5 HOF type years. He’s closer than I thought, but .254 is awful. Closer to agreeing since he was one of the best CFers ever, but not all in.

His 10-year prime was very, very good, imo. Basically, 260/35/100 and winning the GG every year. Yes, the average is a little low. But dominant defensively and 30/100 every year is an outstanding player. He got hurt after going to LA, didn't really recover, and then got lazy and out of shape, and I'm sure you remember him as a Yankee as basically just a slow all-or-nothing Dan Hurley. His last five years, he was a 200 hitter, which dropped his career average in the ugly 250 range.

I really think you need to use Ozzie as the lens for Jones. Ozzie is considered the best defensive SS ever by the looks test, the hardware, and the metrics. He was an average (at best) offensive player. He was a shoo-in for the HOF.

Jones is often considered one of, if not the best, defensive CF of all time by the looks test, hardware, and metrics. He was an above average offensive player as well. No doubt HOF in my mind, and should have been on his second or third run through.

 

[boog204]

I'm curious as to where Willie Mays' metrics would have been if he had retired at 35 years old as Jones did.

I only saw Mays from when he was ~38-39 years old forward, and while he still had some pretty good seasons (until the Giants accepted it was over and traded him to the Mets), he obviously was no longer more than an adequate outfielder in his late 30's and less than that in his 40's.

I'm not sure that the data you are referencing is fully an apples to apples comparison.

Honestly, I don't understand how any of the metrics can work when these stats are relatively new. Can we now look at Tris Speaker and say he earned x amount of dWAR based on his range?

But, for your point, Jones basically was done as a defensive player at 31. All of his "metrics" were gained before that. If you only use dWAR, Mays was done as a useful OF at 35 (still won two gold gloves after that, though). Again, I don't really know what it all means, but the nerds who came up with it seem to, and it's something we can try to use as a comparison point.

 

[Spaceman213J]

"Feared" in the sense that he was a good offensive player, not a great one. It's basically the same vibe used against Baines. Played a long time, accumulated a lot of #s, but... If we're arguing HOF or not based largely on the "counting numbers," then I think you should have been a hitter whom teams/fans feared to some extent. Never got that vibe with Evans. There are really only a couple of guys in the hall solely for their defensive impact. Comparing him to Ozzie Smith is obviously irrelevant, as Ozzie is in there solely for his defense and his likability. In retrospect, it's ridiculous that Ozzie was a first-ballot HOF with 92% of the vote based entirely on being the "GOAT" of SS, where Andruw Jones had to wait nine years to get in. Just my $0.02 on that.

Anyways, obviously, Evans was a very good defensive player, and I remember him having a cannon of an arm. The WAR aspect is certainly in his favor, although I'm still trying to completely wrap my head around that metric, as it seems inconsistent in some areas. Dave Parker was a monster offensive player in Pittsburgh and later Cincinatti who by all accounts was a great defensive player in his prime. But his WAR is almost 1/2 that of Evans. Makes little sense to my small brain.

To me, it simply boils down to this... Was Evans considered one of the absolute best OFs of his era? I don't know if that's true, as indicated by his low all-star game attendance and really no signature year except for maybe 81, which is a tough one b/c of the strike.

If you argue that he's better than Baines, therefore a HOF'er, then that is problematic, as Baines is the clear WTF selection of the last 10 years. The hall can't change that, but that also shouldn't be a metric for letting guys in who don't necessarily deserve it. Arguing that Evans had more walks than Jones and that matters? Yeah, made his OBP higher, but honestly no voter is looking at walk totals to swing their choice.

Sorry for the essay, I just never got the vibe from watching him that Evans was a HOF'er. Very good all-around player for sure. But there was never a time (or a season) that screamed out HOF'er to me. And I don't think it's just my Yankee bias, as I don't think Mattingly should be in, or Posada, or Bernie, or any of the other hall of very good Yankees.

No need to apologize. One of the reasons I come here is for the thoughtful, intelligent debate by people who actually know their sports.

Is Jim Rice a HOF in your opinion? I just ask because the guys were teammates who played most of their career together and there stats are very similar. Now Rice hit the ball as hard as anyone I ever saw and how a few monster years, but in the end, his total stats are very similar to Evans. Rice has a higher career average and slugging. But Evans has a combined runs scored/RBI total over 100 more than Rice.
Not that you are, but it irks me when I see a sports writer argue for a guy like Omar Vizquel. Yes he has 3 more gold gloves than Evans and had over 400 SBs, but in the end he still scored less runs than Evans and had over 500 RBIs less than Dewey. For me Runs + RBIs is the best way to gage offensive production. I get he wasn't the most feared, but he was in lineups with Rice, Yaz, Armas, Boggs, Lansford, Fisk, Lynn, Greenwell, Burks and only 3 players hit more homeruns than he did for the 1980s... Mike Schmidt, Dale Murphy, Eddie Murray. I get the Murphy's stats are mostly similar, again, except for RBI and Run total where Evans has around a 400+ differential.

I agree that some guys have got in that just didn't really deserve it. Can't change that. But if they are in, then there are a few guys who should be in with them. Either keep all that guys at/about that level out or put them all in. It just seems very arbitrary to me.