Arkansas-Lady Vols

[Bestiarius]

as a lady vol fan, i can tell you that i LOVE glory johnson but i am already looking forward to next season. the seniors are just doomed and now they are head cases.

Do you think it is realistic to expect next year to be better? The 4 graduating seniors, two of whom are (grad school students) were highly ranked and have oodles of experience. Pat was a huge part of past successes and regardless of how the coaching issues are resolved, she really can't be replaced. Any new coach will have to prove themselves over a number of years to gain the confidence of potential recruits. The 300 Div 1 programs will all be trying to take advantage of Tennessee's weakened state.

Uconn is in a similar state except that Geno is still at the top of his game. Perhaps his reputation will enable him to keep Uconn at or near the top until he decides to hang it up. After that, I think long term domination by any team will be over. There are just too many girls playing Bball and too many schools that are taking their programs seriously. Where in the past, there might have been a dozen top players most of whom wanted to play for TN or more recently Uconn. In the future, starting now, there may be 30 players who are very close in talent and perhaps a hundred more that are close behind. It will be impossible for any school to capture the majority of the talent. Thus, it is unlikely that dynasty's will develop in the future.

Pat got into the game ahead of anyone else and built a reputation before most other schools gave women's bball a cursory thought. No one will ever be in that position again. Today, how many can get the head coach position at age 22 today and keep at it for 38 years? As the stock brokers say, past performance is no guarantee of future results.

 

[msf22b]

I disagree. dynasty's are caused by great coaches who can get more from their players than they thought they had to give, are great technical teachers and shrewd judges of talent. Will these qualities not surface again. Consider: The two Red's in Pro BB: Auerbach and Holzman, Toe Blake, Don Shula, Bela Karolyi; many sports, same characteristic. One might complain that my list is decades old. Ok, add Geno and Pat to the list.

Great coaches=great teams and dynasty's.

 

[DaddyChoc]

holy crap..... WOW! I had no clue til just now WOW

 

[HuskyNan]

as a lady vol fan, i can tell you that i LOVE glory johnson but i am already looking forward to next season. the seniors are just doomed and now they are head cases.

In the handful of LV games I've seen this year, Glory has been tremendous, a real warrior. I feel for the kids in the program, too, who've had what must be a disappointing season. It would be good to see the LVs get back on track; a strong Tennessee program is good for wcbb.

I hope people are able to differentiate between the kids on the LV team and the more, um, let's say outspoken LV fans and direct their dislike in the right direction.

 

[Icebear]

I feel very much for this bunch of kids. I, also, feel they have unfairly received the brunt of frustration for awhile noe that really is about the deterioration of the management of the coaching staff. They have had a tremendous amount of blame heaped on them by both fans and staff. I am not sure either of those groups are right.

 

[doggydaddy]

I feel very much for this bunch of kids. I, also, feel they have unfairly received the brunt of frustration for awhile noe that really is about the deterioration of the management of the coaching staff. They have had a tremendous amount of blame heaped on them by both fans and staff. I am not sure either of those groups are right.

Players have to play. But it's been incredibly distracting. They are the ones on the court but do the coaches put them in the best position to perform? It doesn't appear so.

There is much talk about the players not getting to the gym enough on their own. Why aren't these kids motivated?

It's a very strange situation in Knoxville. And not easy for young kids to handle. Sounds like they are just playing out the string until the season is over.

Odds are this team will have 10 losses. Who would have guessed that?!

 

[VAMike23]

I feel very much for this bunch of kids. I, also, feel they have unfairly received the brunt of frustration for awhile noe that really is about the deterioration of the management of the coaching staff. They have had a tremendous amount of blame heaped on them by both fans and staff. I am not sure either of those groups are right.

Amen.

 

[Icebear]

Players have to play. But it's been incredibly distracting. They are the ones on the court but do the coaches put them in the best position to perform? It doesn't appear so.

There is much talk about the players not getting to the gym enough on their own. Why aren't these kids motivated?

It's a very strange situation in Knoxville. And not easy for young kids to handle. Sounds like they are just playing out the string until the season is over.

Odds are this team will have 10 losses. Who would have guessed that?!

Exactly the kinds of things I mean, DD.

 

[Phil]

In the handful of LV games I've seen this year, Glory has been tremendous, a real warrior.

I agree with Nan. Glory has become my favorite LV.

 

[doggydaddy]

I agree with Nan. Glory has become my favorite LV.

Gotta love her energy. If she can improve that shot, she will be an impact player in the WNBA. She does have to learn to keep those elbows lower.

 

[Icebear]

The truth is Glory is coming pouring her heart out every game in what is a very difficult situation.

 

[DaddyChoc]

Gotta love her energy. If she can improve that shot, she will be an impact player in the WNBA. She does have to learn to keep those elbows lower.

I like the elbow high, keeps defenders away as long as she's not swinging or making intentional contact.

 

[doggydaddy]

I like the elbow high, keeps defenders away as long as she's not swinging or making intentional contact.

Ask the Arkansas player how she liked it.

Johnson has a reputation for swinging her elbows. Well deserved from what I've observed.

 

[meyers7]

I didn't see the game, was on the bus to Vermont, but I am not happy to see the Vols having such a difficult season.
This has been a difficult group to coach,
the Staff is struggling with finding their roles and the girl's play is inconsistent and unpredictable.
As I've said many times: it could happen to anyone, even us!
Please friends, no gloating!

Well we may not gloat, but we can be happy.

Any day TN loses is a good day.

 

[UcMiami]

I feel very much for this bunch of kids. I, also, feel they have unfairly received the brunt of frustration for awhile noe that really is about the deterioration of the management of the coaching staff. They have had a tremendous amount of blame heaped on them by both fans and staff. I am not sure either of those groups are right.

And a second Amen.
I just think they have had a really tough road the whole way - they come in at the end of the CP era as the next stars - have some injuries, some over hyped expectations, and a deteriorating coaching situation - and then this year get hit with a bomb shell before they even take the court. Everything but the coaching issue played out in a similar fashion in CT after Diana left. I like to think the CT fans were a little more realistic, and a little more supportive (or rather we had fewer vocal 'trashers' of the players.)

 

[Enigma64]

I do feel for the LV players. I’ve never been a fan of coaches putting the weight of the losses solely on their players. You can be out-played and out-coached. The team concept includes the coaches. We all win or we all lose… period.

 

[BigO]

well, to me it's just been the perfect storm for disaster. the older players are passive, the coaching by committee is not working, and the program has had many injuries over the last couple of years. pat's illness was the final straw. that being said, every program has a down turn....keep in mind that UT is THE top sports priority in the state. the governor and many of the board of trustees and donors are very close family friends of Pat. they will fix this with money and a top notch coach. this will pass and us LV fans will be a bit more humbled than we have been in the past.

 

[doggydaddy]

us LV fans will be a bit more humbled than we have been in the past.

Some will. Some won't.

 

[Bestiarius]

I disagree. dynasty's are caused by great coaches who can get more from their players than they thought they had to give, are great technical teachers and shrewd judges of talent. Will these qualities not surface again. Consider: The two Red's in Pro BB: Auerbach and Holzman, Toe Blake, Don Shula, Bela Karolyi; many sports, same characteristic. One might complain that my list is decades old. Ok, add Geno and Pat to the list.

Great coaches=great teams and dynasty's.

I kind of agree with you that there will be teams that stay near the top for a number of years because the coaches have the abilities you mention. But the differences now are 1. Coaches will probably be older when they start out as head coach giving them fewer years to work their magic. 2. Higher salaries will attract more people like Pat & Geno, thereby making it tougher for a coach to be head-and-shoulders above the competition. 3. When a Pat or Geno leaves, what are the odds that the replacement will have equal skills? Not very high in my estimation. 4. If another dynasty comes along, the odds say it will not be in Storrs or Knoxville. Looking at the list of examples above, when the coach left, so did the domination. Plus in pro sports, it's perhaps easier to maintain superiority because there are a limited number of teams and the players don't turn over every four years.

One of Pat's failings seems to have been that she hasn't developed a successor. This seems apparent give what is going on at TN. Chris D seems to be more ready to take over at Uconn, but she's about Geno's age and her run would not be a long one.

Although it's great as a fan to be able to bask in the glory of TN or Uconn's long run of success, I was touched by the sheer joy on the faces of the St. Johns players when they defeated Uconn. It gives others hope for the future and is a good thing for women's basketball.

 

[Bestiarius]

Gotta love her energy. If she can improve that shot, she will be an impact player in the WNBA. She does have to learn to keep those elbows lower.

As a TN fan once said, "That's not a foul, the opposition has to learn to keep their faces where they shouldn't be".

 

[RadyLady]

And a second Amen.
I just think they have had a really tough road the whole way - they come in at the end of the CP era as the next stars - have some injuries, some over hyped expectations, and a deteriorating coaching situation - and then this year get hit with a bomb shell before they even take the court. Everything but the coaching issue played out in a similar fashion in CT after Diana left. I like to think the CT fans were a little more realistic, and a little more supportive (or rather we had fewer vocal 'trashers' of the players.)

Consider - how long has the coaching situation been bad? How long has what has been going on been kept under wraps? Just thinking out loud. I feel for the kids and especially Glory.

 

[VAMike23]

The truth is Glory is coming pouring her heart out every game in what is a very difficult situation.

It will be interesting to see if she is available for the Lynx - a player like that would be tough to pass up. With Swin gone, I'm not sure how Seattle is set at the forward spot, so they might grab her first.

 

[Bestiarius]

well, to me it's just been the perfect storm for disaster. the older players are passive, the coaching by committee is not working, and the program has had many injuries over the last couple of years. pat's illness was the final straw. that being said, every program has a down turn....keep in mind that UT is THE top sports priority in the state. the governor and many of the board of trustees and donors are very close family friends of Pat. they will fix this with money and a top notch coach. this will pass and us LV fans will be a bit more humbled than we have been in the past.

I admire your optimism, BigO. I do agree that Tennessee is sports minded and focused on UT. But interest isn't everything. For example, Connecticut is not at all sports minded and what sports interest there is, is divided many ways. There's the Boston contingent, the New York team fans, and a large percentage of college grads go to school out of state and retain loyalty to their alma mata. I rarely hear people talking about sport from day-to-day. Despite this, the Uconn women have been consistently the best for a long time now.

Also, money is not as big a factor as one might expect. Of the top six conferences, the The Big East spends the least amount of money on recruiting. The SEC spends more than twice what the Big East spends. This isn't reflected in how the teams are doing. Also, there are perhaps 60 schools who have endowments that are larger than UTs, some much larger. Plus, UT has to overcome some obstacles to attract recruits. Some students don't like hot and stickey weather or want to be near a large city, etc. I've noticed recently recruits are from TN or surrounding states. Could this be an indication that widespread appeal on UT is dwindling? I guess Simmons is from TX, so perhaps I might be reaching here.

You're right, every program has a downturn. The invincible UCLA's downturn after Wooden left was 20 years then 11 years after that. Patience is a virtue.

 

[vtcwbuff]

I too gloat over every UTenn loss. However, I have zero animosity towards the players and I never have had any "hate" when it came to the players - well maybe just a teensy bit for Parker.

I gloat because I dislike the program and I really dislike the head coach and her staff, but mostly I gloat because I absolutely detest most of the orange crowd that hangs out over there. It makes me feel good to see them miserable.

Does that make me a bad person?

 

[CCinCT]

I too gloat over every UTenn loss. However, I have zero animosity towards the players and I never have had any "hate" when it came to the players - well maybe just a teensy bit for Parker.

I gloat because I dislike the program and I really dislike the head coach and her staff, but mostly I gloat because I absolutely detest most of the orange crowd that hangs out over there. It makes me feel good to see them miserable.

Does that make me a bad person?

In my estimation (not that anybody cares) that makes you a good person !!