An alternate view: UConn to B1G 2016 via hockey affiliation

[mainlinedave]

I promise I won't touch them, but I'd keep an eye on that Rutgers Guy. He told me that their 1947 Fencing National Championship Trophy was looking kind of lonely.

And I'd keep a close eye on the Landy guy. If UCONN doesn't watch it, he just might put up a JOEPA statue on the campus in Storrs, to honor his hero who has been mercilessly attacked and wrongly vilified.

 

[FDNY99]

And I'd keep a close eye on the Landy guy. If UCONN doesn't watch it, he just might put up a JOEPA statue on the campus in Storrs, to honor his hero who has been mercilessly attacked and wrongly vilified.

@mainlinedave if you are going to come here and throw shots at people...the LEAST thing you can do is know how to properly spell and tag screen names...

 

[Ldandy]

And I'd keep a close eye on the Landy guy. If UCONN doesn't watch it, he just might put up a JOEPA statue on the campus in Storrs, to honor his hero who has been mercilessly attacked and wrongly vilified.

You fail at failing.

 

[Huskyforlife]

@Ldandy Wouldn't that imply he's winning?

 

[Gfunk]

Yale boasts 27 FB titles.

While your reply is humorous and makes a slight point, it's incredibly devoid of critical thinking.

Btw, I've been a big proponent of UConn to the BIG, but as a full member. I have counter-argued every naysaying BIG fan opposed to UConn in the BIG for well over a year on various boards. I've given well documented reasons for UConn in the BIG, to me it's a no-brainer. I've even written official letters to BIG offices, various administrators, for UConn's inclusion in the BIG.

Yale doesn't even play FBS football anymore and their NCs are ancient. The game changer in football, Black Americans, were hardly playing football during Yale's heyday.

To your humorous / slight point, many things here: CF doesn't have a truer format NC process like college hockey. In fact, even the current playoff format is filled with holes.

Since 1948, the first year of official NCAA hockey championships, so-called BIG programs, albeit under non-BIG conference arrangements, have won at least 1 NC per decade. Even since 2000, 3 different programs have accounted for 4 NCs and 3 runners up.

BIG hockey is new & with its formation comes very challenging logistics and expenses. Its down cycle is by no means permanent, way too much tradition and the availability of in-state talent in states like Michigan, Minnesota & to a smaller degree Pa & Wi are constant realities. I mean good Lord, Minnesota has an embarrassment of riches when it comes to hockey talent & these kids, unlike east coast kids, go everywhere to play.

My discontent with BIG hockey is much like the death of the original Big East. It continues to be a terrible, bitter pill to swallow: the seismic destruction & partial renewal of the WCHA, especially, and CCHA - it was not a carefully considered decision. But worse, ice hockey doesn't have the popularity and influence of men's basketball, so the negatives of BIG hockey at the expense of the WCHA and CCHA gets far less media exposure and public debate.

Got nothing but kindness for you man or woman - have to be PC here.

 

[Gfunk]

I'm guessing you are directing the post above to the conversation between GFunk and myself. Therefore I'll try to answer from my end. I enjoy following conference realignment more than the average fan, but there is very little discussion about it on my team's boards.

I am also a fan of UCONN Sports and think you all got a raw deal in realignment to date. I imagine GFunk feels about the same. As to why our conversation? It was really an extension of A B1G v. Hockey East discussion started by A UCONN fan.

I responded to his post because I disagreed with it. That's pretty much it. I get that I'm a guest and unlike some others I spend very little time talking about how great I think my school is or how great The Big is. Both have good and bad points. Hopefully that clears things up on my end.

I'm sorry for not keeping pace with this thread. I've been mostly glued, with any sort of sports time, to the basketball tourney and I actually attended the hockey tourney here in Minneapolis/St. Paul. Denver won the regional & is on to the Frozen Four, in case you are wondering.

To UConn fans, I'll keep it simple:

I will continue to endorse your hopeful membership into the BIG as a full member and nothing but - various, obvious reasons. I am terribly opposed to partial membership for a flagship state school that has multiple D1 programs & an FBS program that is certainly on par in the current and foreseeable landscape with Minnesota, Purdue, Illinois, Rutgers, Maryland, IU and NW. Moreover, AAU status aside, UConn is certainly a worthy academic national university. Other points here: I get the JHU angle (there so d3 in most sports) and to a smaller degree ND. ND, despite my genuine discontent for their various arguments, does have an inexplicable claim to football independence. I mean this indie status has been going for 100 plus years if I'm not mistaken. BIG hockey does make sense for ND due to travel and traditional rivalries. If I'm not mistaken, ND's longest tenure with a conference may just be their WCHA days when Michigan and MSU were also in the conference. On a personal note, my first college hockey experience (mid 1970s, yes I'm old) was Minnesota versus ND, WCHA conference play.

As stated in previous posts, the destruction of the WCHA for BIG hockey was absolutely similar to what happened to the Big East. I supported neither. Unfortunately, and this is the big difference with the above argument, college hockey does not get even close to the press, thus public dissent, as college basketball. So in my opinion, BIG hockey went unchecked with its rapid decision.

LLandy, I'll respect UConn fans here and keep a BIG quarrel limited here. I do think BIG hockey could have still included former WCHA members and a far more careful process - I'm all for PSU hockey. I continue to know that other BIG schools are 5-10 years out from d1 hockey & we really can't be naive here and think college hockey will produce a p5 structure, so non-traditional conference alignment is expected, coupled with affiliated membership. We must respect travel costs and the traditional home and home format.

 

[Adios]

The game changer in football, Black Americans, were hardly playing football during Yale's heyday.

WT*? Race has nothing to do with how well the game progressed. The NFL had 2 black players in it's first year. It was the owner of the Redskins who instituted segregationalist policies. Race has no relevance unless you think African-Americans are more athletic, somehow.

 

[Hoophound]

WT*? Race has nothing to do with how well the game progressed. The NFL had 2 black players in it's first year. It was the owner of the Redskins who instituted segregationalist policies. Race has no relevance unless you think African-Americans are more athletic, somehow.

GFunk didn't say it, you did. He simply stated a major portion of the American population was not represented. That means the league wasn't drawing from nearly as big a talent pool as it did when blacks started playing.

 

[Gfunk]

WT*? Race has nothing to do with how well the game progressed. The NFL had 2 black players in it's first year. It was the owner of the Redskins who instituted segregationalist policies. Race has no relevance unless you think African-Americans are more athletic, somehow.

Butch, I think Hoophound got my point. I apologize if you misread me due to my details.

CF was absolutely segregated for a long, long time. Heck, I don't think the SEC had fully de-segregated until the early 1970s.

It's all about the inclusion of anyone who plays, regardless of race-ethnicity. JJ Watt is an outstanding athlete as is Richard Sherman.

 

[B1GOSU]

The same wave of realignment we saw in hockey with the B1G happened in men's and women's lacrosse when the B1G added those sports.


B1G Men's Ice Hockey:
Michigan
Michigan State
Minnesota
Notre Dame (joins July 1, 2017)
Ohio State
Penn State
Wisconsin

B1G Men's Lacrosse:
Johns Hopkins
Maryland
Michigan
Ohio State
Penn State
Rutgers

B1G Women's Lacrosse:
Johns Hopkins (joins July 1, 2016)
Maryland
Michigan
Northwestern
Ohio State
Penn State
Rutgers

 

[FDNY99]

The same wave of realignment we saw in hockey with the B1G happened in men's and women's lacrosse when the B1G added those sports.


B1G Men's Ice Hockey:
Michigan
Michigan State
Minnesota
Notre Dame (joins July 1, 2017)
Ohio State
Penn State
Wisconsin

B1G Men's Lacrosse:
Johns Hopkins
Maryland
Michigan
Ohio State
Penn State
Rutgers

B1G Women's Lacrosse:
Johns Hopkins (joins July 1, 2016)
Maryland
Michigan
Northwestern
Ohio State
Penn State
Rutgers

What happens to schools like JHU and UND if the B1G ever expanded with a school that have those 3 sports...or had a member school(s) add those 3 sports?

 

[MattMang23]

The same wave of realignment we saw in hockey with the B1G happened in men's and women's lacrosse when the B1G added those sports.


B1G Men's Ice Hockey:
Michigan
Michigan State
Minnesota
Notre Dame (joins July 1, 2017)
Ohio State
Penn State
Wisconsin

B1G Men's Lacrosse:
Johns Hopkins
Maryland
Michigan
Ohio State
Penn State
Rutgers

B1G Women's Lacrosse:
Johns Hopkins (joins July 1, 2016)
Maryland
Michigan
Northwestern
Ohio State
Penn State
Rutgers

UConn has a women's lax team that is an affiliate member of a different lax conference because the AAC doesn't sponsor lax. Just sayin'...

 

[DarthGrumpy]

UConn has a women's lax team that is an affiliate member of a different lax conference because the AAC doesn't sponsor lax. Just sayin'...

Same with UConn's very good field hockey team, which is in the Big East.

 

[NYUConn]

What happens to schools like JHU and UND if the B1G ever expanded with a school that have those 3 sports...or had a member school(s) add those 3 sports?

If the schools are good and making the conference money, they stay.

If they are bad then they get the boot. See Temple/Big East Football circa 2004 and UMass/MAC Football 2013.

 

[Rappin'Rodney]

What happens to schools like JHU and UND if the B1G ever expanded with a school that have those 3 sports...or had a member school(s) add those 3 sports?

The B1G has never asked a university to withdraw from the conference, and I highly doubt that they would do so in the future. Besides, the more the merrier.

 

[B1GOSU]

What happens to schools like JHU and UND if the B1G ever expanded with a school that have those 3 sports...or had a member school(s) add those 3 sports?

I don't think future expansion will have any harm on affiliate memberships for JHU and UND. First, hockey and lacrosse are niche sports. If you look at all the schools the B1G could possibly add, very few offer either sport and even fewer offer both. Second, lacrosse and hockey have the fewest number of participating schools in the B1G. Let's say a current B1G school adds hockey or lacrosse in the coming decade. Well, hockey only has 7 (with Notre Dame) and lacrosse only has 6 (7 for women with the JHU addition). Those are still fairly small numbers. It would be easy to expand and still play a round robin schedule. And if the sports ever grew so much in the conference that it would be impossible to play a round robin schedule, the B1G already has some Olympic sports where teams go a full season without playing each other (ex. baseball, softball, women's soccer). Maybe you just get to the point where you don't play a full round robin schedule in lacrosse or instead of a home series and an away series in hockey, you only play a team home OR away. I don't think those sports will ever grow to that point, but that is the easy solution if they do. I honestly don't see any B1G schools adding lacrosse or hockey anytime in the foreseeable future. And most of the realistic expansion targets for the B1G outside of Notre Dame or UConn would all be schools in a region where hockey isn't played and outside of the 4 ACC schools, a region where lacrosse isn't played. I don't see Kansas, Oklahoma or Texas playing hockey or lacrosse anytime soon. Same goes for Georgia Tech or any southern school outside of Virginia or North Carolina.

Finally, its important to realize that no one has ever left the B1G once a member of the conference except for Chicago who left D1 sports all together. Once you are in, you are in.

 

[FDNY99]

I don't think future expansion will have any harm on affiliate memberships for JHU and UND. First, hockey and lacrosse are niche sports. If you look at all the schools the B1G could possibly add, very few offer either sport and even fewer offer both. Second, lacrosse and hockey have the fewest number of participating schools in the B1G. Let's say a current B1G school adds hockey or lacrosse in the coming decade. Well, hockey only has 7 (with Notre Dame) and lacrosse only has 6 (7 for women with the JHU addition). Those are still fairly small numbers. It would be easy to expand and still play a round robin schedule. And if the sports ever grew so much in the conference that it would be impossible to play a round robin schedule, the B1G already has some Olympic sports where teams go a full season without playing each other (ex. baseball, softball, women's soccer). Maybe you just get to the point where you don't play a full round robin schedule in lacrosse or instead of a home series and an away series in hockey, you only play a team home OR away. I don't think those sports will ever grow to that point, but that is the easy solution if they do. I honestly don't see any B1G schools adding lacrosse or hockey anytime in the foreseeable future. And most of the realistic expansion targets for the B1G outside of Notre Dame or UConn would all be schools in a region where hockey isn't played and outside of the 4 ACC schools, a region where lacrosse isn't played. I don't see Kansas, Oklahoma or Texas playing hockey or lacrosse anytime soon. Same goes for Georgia Tech or any southern school outside of Virginia or North Carolina.

Finally, its important to realize that no one has ever left the B1G once a member of the conference except for Chicago who left D1 sports all together. Once you are in, you are in.

Thanks...

 

[NYUConn]

The B1G has never asked a university to withdraw from the conference, and I highly doubt that they would do so in the future. Besides, the more the merrier.

The B1G has also only lost one member ever and that was in 1946.

 

[dayooper]

The B1G has also only lost one member ever and that was in 1946.

Technically, that's not correct. Michigan was voted out in 1908. Apparently they wouldn't "adhere to the conferences rules." They were brought back in 1917. Since then, the only member that has left was the University of Chicago in 1946. They are still associated with the Big10 as a member of the CiC.

 

[TruthNnumbers]

Since we are playing B1G trivia one of my favorites is that the conference’s official name was the Intercollegiate Conference of Faculty Representatives. It did not formally adopt the name Big Ten until 1987, 3 years later the league had 11 members.

 

[tiger paw]

What does moving hockey to the B1G do for UConn, besides nothing?

If B1G wanted just a hockey program , they would invite Quinnipiac . Bobcats ranked #1 in country. First rate facility to boot.