2024 Recruiting: Ahmad Nowell OV 6/8

[Deleted at users request]

This stat doesn't take defense into account whatsoever, so take that for what it's worth (especially in regards to Clingan).

To be clear, 3.9 is around the best 100 players in the country. So maybe the 3rd best player on a top-heavy top 5 team or the best player on a really good midmajor or mediocre major conference team. Either way, Spencer's PRPG! will likely drop with the transfer as he takes on a smaller role on a new team with a lot of depth. Size of role is a big factor in PRPG!.

Right, and the basis of this conversation is that a team would rather have Cam Spencer than the #1 or #2 freshmen in the country because Cam is more experienced. And I just can’t agree with that at all.

 

[superjohn]

Right, and the basis of this conversation is that a team would rather have Cam Spencer than the #1 or #2 freshmen in the country because Cam is more experienced. And I just can’t agree with that at all.

In terms of winning in college I would.

 

[Deleted at users request]

In terms of winning in college I would.

But he didn’t win though.. the other guys did as the leaders on their teams.

He didn’t win more games, he’s not getting drafted higher, and he didn’t receive any conference awards. But he’s better because of this chart? That’s where y’all lose me on some of these numbers.

 

[auror]

Right, and the basis of this conversation is that a team would rather have Cam Spencer than the #1 or #2 freshmen in the country because Cam is more experienced. And I just can’t agree with that at all.

In terms of winning in college I would.

If you could guarantee me I'd get the top 1 or 2 freshman, I'd take that over Spencer. But the top freshman is usually someone in the 5* range and isn't always the guys ranked #1 coming in, and the dropoff from the top freshman to the 10th freshman is usually pretty massive. It's easier to predict the impact and role of a guy with several years in college.

But he didn’t win though.. the other guys did as the leaders on their teams.

He didn’t win more games, he’s not getting drafted higher, and he didn’t receive any conference awards. But he’s better because of this chart? That’s where y’all lose me on some of these numbers.

Those guys played in easier leagues than Spencer. Spencer would've been all conference in the AAC.

 

[Deleted at users request]

If you could guarantee me I'd get the top 1 or 2 freshman, I'd take that over Spencer. But the top freshman is usually someone in the 5* range and isn't always the guys ranked #1 coming in, and the dropoff from the top freshman to the 10th freshman is usually pretty massive. It's easier to predict the impact and role of a guy with several years in college.

Those guys played in easier leagues than Spencer. Spencer would've been all conference in the AAC.

I hope they get him.

But I think it’s worth pointing out that Harper and Bailey are both 1 and done that probably won’t be as good in college as Cam Spencer was last season. So UConn getting Spencer this year might be a bigger L for them than landing either of Harper or Bailey are Ws

This was the original comment. Talking about the #1 and #2 players in the country.

Kyle also played in the ACC who the chart has as below Spencer.

Spencer is going to be amazing in his role here. My personal projection would be the 4th option behind guys like Castle, Karaban, and Clingan. There’s no way I’d take him as the go to on a team over a lot of the way more talented freshman out there though. If you ask me if I wanted to start my team around Castle or Spencer I’m saying Castle without thinking twice and he’s fringe top 10.

 

[navery12]

This was the original comment. Talking about the #1 and #2 players in the country.

Kyle also played in the ACC who the chart has as below Spencer.

Spencer is going to be amazing in his role here. My personal projection would be the 4th option behind guys like Castle, Karaban, and Clingan. There’s no way I’d take him as the go to on a team over a lot of the way more talented freshman out there though. If you ask me if I wanted to start my team around Castle or Spencer I’m saying Castle without thinking twice and he’s fringe top 10.

You are completely missing the point of this entire discussion, over and over again

 

[Deleted at users request]

You are completely missing the point of this entire discussion, over and over again

I’m confused then. Especially as the person who kind of started it. What’s the point?

I thought it was that a coach would rather have Cam than the #1 and #2 player in the country. Which is pretty blasphemous.

 

[navery12]

I’m confused then. Especially as the person who kind of started it. What’s the point?

I thought it was that a coach would rather have Cam than the #1 and #2 player in the country. Which is pretty blasphemous.

Yup, exactly. Entirely missing the point

You keep fixating on awards and all conference teams, who you'd take to build a team around, who has the most NBA potential when none of that is relevant. The point of the discussion is that a 22 year old Cam Spencer (and 23 this season) will likely have a bigger impact than an 18 year old freshman. Nobody is saying Spencer would be better as a go to scorer or a #1 option than a top recruit, but you keep bringing that up.

 

[Deleted at users request]

Yup, exactly. Entirely missing the point

You keep fixating on awards and all conference teams, who you'd take to build a team around, who has the most NBA potential when none of that is relevant. The point of the discussion is that a 22 year old Cam Spencer (and 23 this season) will likely have a bigger impact than an 18 year old freshman. Nobody is saying Spencer would be better as a go to scorer or a #1 option than a top recruit, but you keep bringing that up.

Then how would he be able to have a bigger impact…. That makes absolutely no sense.

Doing a lot of mental gymnastics to try and say why you would take a 4th year transfer over the #1 or #2 player. Even as role players, our freshmen were the best ones on the team over transfers (one who was all-conference). I don’t understand what angle y’all are trying to take here.

He wouldn’t be a better #1 option, wouldn’t be good enough for NBA, wouldn’t be in consideration for awards, didn’t win on his own team (that actually had an All Big Ten player and another guy who was 2x conference DPOY), but he would make a bigger impact than the guys who do all those things??

 

[navery12]

Then how would he be able to have a bigger impact…. That makes absolutely no sense.

Doing a lot of mental gymnastics to try and say why you would take a 4th year transfer over the #1 or #2 player. Even as role players, our freshmen were the best ones on the team over transfers (one who was all-conference). I don’t understand what angle y’all are trying to take here.

He wouldn’t be a better #1 option, wouldn’t be good enough for NBA, wouldn’t be in consideration for awards, didn’t win on his own team (that actually had an All Big Ten player and another guy who was 2x conference DPOY), but he would make a bigger impact than the guys who do all those things??

Yeah I'm done, because once again you are completely missing the point. If I thought you had any chance of comprehending what I said I might try to explain it again. But as is usual, you just move the goalposts and spin narratives that nobody is saying. I'm beginning to remember why you spent all season on my ignore list

 

[Deleted at users request]

Yeah I'm done, because once again you are completely missing the point. If I thought you had any chance of comprehending what I said I might try to explain it again. But as is usual, you just move the goalposts and spin narratives that nobody is saying. I'm beginning to remember why you spent all season on my ignore list

LMAO you basically said every tangible thing that talks about player impact doesn’t matter when saying who would be more impactful. But I’m moving goalposts.

 

[navery12]

LMAO you basically said every tangible thing that talks about player impact doesn’t matter when saying who would be more impactful. But I’m moving goalposts.

I posted their literal on the court impact numbers, yet they don't support your insane argument so you ignore them. Go back to arguing Clingan is the next Jokic. Clown

 

[Deleted at users request]

Yes, your math sheet is a better determination of who is a better player than wins, conference awards, and NBA projection.

This is hysterical.

Aw poor guy put me on ignore because I didn’t like his math sheet.

 

[navery12]

Yes, your math sheet is a better determination of who is a better player than wins, conference awards, and NBA projection.

This is hysterical.

Aw poor guy put me on ignore because I didn’t like his math sheet.

That's been my point, we're not arguing who's a better player. The discussion is who will have a bigger impact

 

[Storrs South]

 

[Deleted at users request]

To clarify because I know there’s a lot of people who use analytics on this board in a great way.

I love using analytics and numbers in context to explain things that happen in basketball. They’re a great thing.

But when they start being used as a lone factor to ignore other things when talking about how good someone is is where I get turned off by them. I don’t want to make it seem like I’m completely against analytics. Sorry if it comes off that way.

 

[auror]

The only real insiders in college basketball are the guys making the edits.

 

[huskiesNhoos]

Nowell's rebounding is insane for a 5'10 guard. He really mixes it up and gets physical when he wants to.

But is he better than Jr yr cam Spencer?

 

[Jbirdp5]

To clarify because I know there’s a lot of people who use analytics on this board in a great way.

I love using analytics and numbers in context to explain things that happen in basketball. They’re a great thing.

But when they start being used as a lone factor to ignore other things when talking about how good someone is is where I get turned off by them. I don’t want to make it seem like I’m completely against analytics. Sorry if it comes off that way.

How does someone’s nba draft stock make a better college player? Sanogo is a great example, were the 58 draft picks all better than him? Nba draft is about nba potential not college production. College production is more of a sure thing with a 5th year player. Awards? Pretty meaningless because who had more impact as a freshman whitmore or karaban? I think even you would say karaban no?

 

[CardiacAndre7]

This is the stuff I come to this thread for. Thank you.

 

[Deleted at users request]

How does someone’s nba draft stock make a better college player? Sanogo is a great example, were the 58 draft picks all better than him? Nba draft is about nba potential not college production. College production is more of a sure thing with a 5th year player. Awards? Pretty meaningless because who had more impact as a freshman whitmore or karaban? I think even you would say karaban no?

Karaban was all freshman team and Sanogo was All conference. They had awards. They were also winners.

Cam doesn’t have anything on his side but that chart.

For fun, I went back to see what Newton’s score was at ECU. It was better than Cam’s at 4.2. But two freshman still had bigger “impacts” than him last year. Neither were 5* top ranked one and done’s either. So what’s the next spin? Lol

 

[superjohn]

If you could guarantee me I'd get the top 1 or 2 freshman, I'd take that over Spencer. But the top freshman is usually someone in the 5* range and isn't always the guys ranked #1 coming in, and the dropoff from the top freshman to the 10th freshman is usually pretty massive. It's easier to predict the impact and role of a guy with several years in college.

Those guys played in easier leagues than Spencer. Spencer would've been all conference in the AAC.

I'm taking Spencer for 1 year as a 5th year guy over 1 year of Nick Smith or Dariq Whitehead.

 

[Deleted at users request]

I just started a thread on all this to get back to Ahmad. @temery if you feel like it’s necessary. All the posts about this topic that moved the thread off track can get moved over there.

Sorry guys. Is a thread really a boneyard thread if it doesn’t go off the rails?

 

[temery]

I just started a thread on all this to get back to Ahmad. @temery if you feel like it’s necessary. All the posts about this topic that moved the thread off track can get moved over there.

Sorry guys. Is a thread really a boneyard thread if it doesn’t go off the rails?

What thread?

 

[Deleted at users request]

What thread?

This one right here

Freshmen vs Transfers

I’m just starting this thread because I feel like this topic takes a lot of threads off track. So this could help keep it contained in one place. There’s a discussion going on in the Ahmad thread that Rutgers would’ve preferred to have Cam Spencer over the #1 and #2 freshman in the country for...

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