ACC proposes adding four teams to 68-team NCAA field

[billybud]

Do away with automatic bids....get rid of the Radfords, LIU Broolyns, and Stephen Austins as automatics (any conference champ, whether Kansas or Radford)...put teams in on merit as measured on a national basis.

64 spots...the best 64 teams...I know we can grouse for 500 pages about the relative subjectivity in defining "best".

 

[MattMang23]

I don't like the addition of another First Four, but I think a lot of board objection is dislike for the proposer.

Pretty much. Most of us don't like the league your school plays in. Sorry? This is a UConn message board. You know our feelings but continue to point out that we don't like the ACC and seem to be puzzled by that. If you're looking for us to be all kumbaya with that league, I think you'll be looking a while.

 

[storrsroars]

IF it's reserved for all four being non-P5 - I am all for it
If not, screw you ACC

I'd could be for it if it ensured conference champs from every conference got in the field of 64 and play-in games were limited to only at-large teams.

 

[freescooter]

Do away with automatic bids....get rid of the Radfords, LIU Broolyns, and Stephen Austins as automatics (any conference champ, whether Kansas or Radford)...put teams in on merit as measured on a national basis.

64 spots...the best 64 teams...I know we can grouse for 500 pages about the relative subjectivity in defining "best".

So let’s see? No UMBC beating UVA. No Loyola-Chicago, and those are just 2 stories from THIS year. You and everyone else who wants to get rid of “the little guys” really miss the point and miss the reason March Madness is, well, March Madness. You want to turn it into the ACC Tournament.

The statistics they use to rank teams are pretty flawed and virtually every one badly overvalued strength of schedule, which greatly benefits more prestigeos leagues. In essence mid to lower level teams from the Big 10, say, are rated more highly than they deserve because they are in the Big which is more highly rated because it’s teams are better because they are in the Big 10. And so it goes. Is it circular? Yup. Do the top leagues care? Nope.

 

[RichZ]

IF it's reserved for all four being non-P5 - I am all for it
If not, screw you ACC

That would solve nothing. The committee would just pick more P5 teams in the field of 64, and push four more teams that shoulda/coulda been in the real field down into the play in rounds.

 

[intlzncster]

Do away with automatic bids....get rid of the Radfords, LIU Broolyns, and Stephen Austins as automatics (any conference champ, whether Kansas or Radford)...put teams in on merit as measured on a national basis.

64 spots...the best 64 teams...I know we can grouse for 500 pages about the relative subjectivity in defining "best".

Those types of teams winning and going on runs is what makes the NCAA tournament fun.

The two biggest stories of the 2018 NCAA were UVA losing to UMBC and Loyola Chicago going to the Final Four. 40 years from now, those schools will still be mentioned.

Mercer beating Duke is one of my most cherished NCAAT memories.

 

[billybud]

So let’s see? No UMBC beating UVA. No Loyola-Chicago, and those are just 2 stories from THIS year. You and everyone else who wants to get rid of “the little guys” really miss the point and miss the reason March Madness is, well, March Madness. You want to turn it into the ACC Tournament.

The statistics they use to rank teams are pretty flawed and virtually every one badly overvalued strength of schedule, which greatly benefits more prestigeos leagues. In essence mid to lower level teams from the Big 10, say, are rated more highly than they deserve because they are in the Big which is more highly rated because it’s teams are better because they are in the Big 10. And so it goes. Is it circular? Yup. Do the top leagues care? Nope.

When the Raffords, UMBCs, and Loyola-Chicagos actually win a title....that will be something. Until then, they can pat themselves on the back with a participation trophy of sorts. But you may be right that they always have a punchers chance. And we like their "story".

And we can talk about the upsets, the occasional Cinderella run before Cinderella's clock inexorably strikes midnight.

Outside the current P5 teams and teams that have won in the Big East...has there been a national champion from another league in the last quarter century?

Going back fifty years...I can only think of UNLV and Marquette as teams from "outside" that group to win it all.

We do all love the drama of the "little guy" with a sling taking on Goliath, but in reality, over the last 50 years..David has won, what, 4% of the time?

In the way back in my day, the Texas Western Miners won it all....it can happen....

 

[Robertelamin]

Goliath’s like FSU basketball?

 

[Dream Jobbed 2.0]

Every team added hurts us.

Explain please?

 

[Walker11]

When the Raffords, UMBCs, and Loyola-Chicagos actually win a title....that will be something. Until then, they can pat themselves on the back with a participation trophy of sorts. But you may be right that they always have a punchers chance. And we like their "story".

And we can talk about the upsets, the occasional Cinderella run before Cinderella's clock inexorably strikes midnight.

Outside the current P5 teams and teams that have won in the Big East...has there been a national champion from another league in the last quarter century?

Going back fifty years...I can only think of UNLV and Marquette as teams from "outside" that group to win it all.

We do all love the drama of the "little guy" with a sling taking on Goliath, but in reality, over the last 50 years..David has won, what, 4% of the time?

In the way back in my day, the Texas Western Miners won it all....it can happen....

Here's a hint. In the college basketball landscape, you are a little guy. Where does this ego come from?

 

[XLCenterFan]

Let's not forget about the Kemba year. Weren't we .500 in the BE that year, losing something like 8 out of our final 10 games, and finished 8th in the conference? I would bet that in most years, the WORST teams from the BE or ACC are better than the best teams in some of these auto-bid conferences. Hence, these conferences get more respect and, and therefore, should get more teams into the dance. We cannot mess with the auto-bids though-it adds to parity which is awesome for the game, and incentivizes players to go to these schools where they will actually play, as opposed to going to a P5 school and riding the pine. Plus, I am a champion for underdogs. I watched the entire UMBC/Virginia game in pure amazement knowing that I witnessed history. It was an awesome day for college basketball, and we need more of that, not less. The auto-bids will allow for that to happen again, and I'm willing to bet it will happen again in the next ten years.

 

[Dream Jobbed 2.0]

When the Raffords, UMBCs, and Loyola-Chicagos actually win a title....that will be something. Until then, they can pat themselves on the back with a participation trophy of sorts. But you may be right that they always have a punchers chance. And we like their "story".

And we can talk about the upsets, the occasional Cinderella run before Cinderella's clock inexorably strikes midnight.

Outside the current P5 teams and teams that have won in the Big East...has there been a national champion from another league in the last quarter century?

Going back fifty years...I can only think of UNLV and Marquette as teams from "outside" that group to win it all.

We do all love the drama of the "little guy" with a sling taking on Goliath, but in reality, over the last 50 years..David has won, what, 4% of the time?

In the way back in my day, the Texas Western Miners won it all....it can happen....

So in not so many words you want the 65 P5 teams in a tournament? The worst P5 team has much less of a chance to win as “Rafford.” And Rafford actually has to earn it’s way in. You’d rather watch a 10-18 Oregon St team play Duke in the first round? Hell, why not just say the ACC regular season champ is the national champion and forgo the conference tournaments

 

[Dream Jobbed 2.0]

When the Raffords, UMBCs, and Loyola-Chicagos actually win a title....that will be something. Until then, they can pat themselves on the back with a participation trophy of sorts. But you may be right that they always have a punchers chance. And we like their "story".

And we can talk about the upsets, the occasional Cinderella run before Cinderella's clock inexorably strikes midnight.

Outside the current P5 teams and teams that have won in the Big East...has there been a national champion from another league in the last quarter century?

Going back fifty years...I can only think of UNLV and Marquette as teams from "outside" that group to win it all.

We do all love the drama of the "little guy" with a sling taking on Goliath, but in reality, over the last 50 years..David has won, what, 4% of the time?

In the way back in my day, the Texas Western Miners won it all....it can happen....

Also, I think an AAC team won in 2014...

 

[billybud]

Here's a hint. In the college basketball landscape, you are a little guy. Where does this ego come from?

Never said that FSU was a basketball top team. They are not,

And would not, most years play in the tourney (and they do not).

I am not sqawking that they should...I do believe in meritocracy.

This year they belonged and made the Elite Eight...most years? Not.

I can have an opinion about how a basketball tournament should be formulated regardless of my fan affiliation.

Just as a UConn guy can have an opinion about football....

The rush to make things personal is more a sign of irrational anger than it is of a rational thought.

Some will understand my post and rebut it with sense and logic and some will just lash out.

I still think that the 64 best teams should play for it.

(and excuse me if having an opinion that the best 64 should play (and no automatics) means that I have a monumental ego...although I cant personally follow any chain in your logic)

 

[David 76]

The tenth best team from any conference doesn’t need to be there.

 

[billybud]

The tenth best team from any conference doesn’t need to be there.

Maybe, maybe not.

I submit that a team with a Final NCAA Ranking of 237 probably did not need to be there, either.

 

[storrsroars]

Maybe, maybe not.

I submit that a team with a Final NCAA Ranking of 237 probably did not need to be there, either.

However, those kids on the 237th ranked team did what was asked of them - they beat most of whomever was on their schedule. The 9th place team from the ACC/SEC/Pac10, etc. assuredly did not. In fact they more likely failed at least 50% of the time in their own conference.

 

[superjohn]

Horrendous performance from billybud in this thread.

 

[MattMang23]

Horrendous performance from billybud in this thread.

Predictably.

 

[intlzncster]

Never said that FSU was a basketball top team. They are not,

And would not, most years play in the tourney (and they do not).

I am not sqawking that they should...I do believe in meritocracy.

This year they belonged and made the Elite Eight...most years? Not.

I can have an opinion about how a basketball tournament should be formulated regardless of my fan affiliation.

Just as a UConn guy can have an opinion about football....

The rush to make things personal is more a sign of irrational anger than it is of a rational thought.

Some will understand my post and rebut it with sense and logic and some will just lash out.

I still think that the 64 best teams should play for it.

(and excuse me if having an opinion that the best 64 should play (and no automatics) means that I have a monumental ego...although I cant personally follow any chain in your logic)

Problem is that scheduling is 'rigged'. It's damn near impossible to be ranked high if you don't play anybody, and a lot of the smaller schools struggle to get games. A P5 might give them an away game, but no home and home. That makes it even more difficult to win.

 

[freescooter]

I’m of the opinion that if you don’t win at least half your conference games AND finish in the top half of your league you should only get into the NCAA tournament if you but a ticket. Any team that wins it’s league has earned its slot. And they honestly are more deserving of a true first round game than somebtean that finished 7th in its league and “earns” a 12 seed. The last 8 at large teams should be forced to play in. But my hunch is that if the ACC free pass gets approved all the 16 seeds will be forced to play the extra round so a couple more also rams from the ACC can get spots.

 

[CL82]

Just as a UConn guy can have an opinion about football....

Mmm maybe wait for a better year for FSU before you through this down? You did curb stomp Souther Miss, though.

 

[UConnNick]

Never said that FSU was a basketball top team. They are not,

And would not, most years play in the tourney (and they do not).

I am not sqawking that they should...I do believe in meritocracy.

This year they belonged and made the Elite Eight...most years? Not.

I can have an opinion about how a basketball tournament should be formulated regardless of my fan affiliation.

Just as a UConn guy can have an opinion about football....

The rush to make things personal is more a sign of irrational anger than it is of a rational thought.

Some will understand my post and rebut it with sense and logic and some will just lash out.

I still think that the 64 best teams should play for it.

(and excuse me if having an opinion that the best 64 should play (and no automatics) means that I have a monumental ego...although I cant personally follow any chain in your logic)

The problem with eliminating the auto bids for all conferences is it would effectively eliminate all of the low major conferences from participating, and some of the mid majors as well. The tournament as structured is an attempt to give the little guys a small piece of the revenue pie, even though it's just window dressing. If you eliminate them all, you essentially would have a defacto split of the top NCAA division without a formal split, which may eventually happen anyway. Plus the upsets like UMBC beating a 1 seed are what make it interesting and exciting for the fans. Folks love the upsets. That whole dynamic would largely disappear if you exclude all the automatic qualifiers.

 

[David 76]

Yep. Everyone agrees. Except one person.

 

[billybud]

I’m of the opinion that if you don’t win at least half your conference games AND finish in the top half of your league you should only get into the NCAA tournament if you but a ticket. Any team that wins it’s league has earned its slot. And they honestly are more deserving of a true first round game than somebtean that finished 7th in its league and “earns” a 12 seed. The last 8 at large teams should be forced to play in. But my hunch is that if the ACC free pass gets approved all the 16 seeds will be forced to play the extra round so a couple more also rams from the ACC can get spots.

But then a 8th place conference team and 9th seed team like FSU won't get a chance to make the Elite Eight as they did this year.

While maybe being a better team than that Radford.