#44 Aubrey Griffin (6'1" Forward)

[jazz]

Although I "might" forgive you for confusing Paige with MJ this version of UCONN WBB does not have anyone who could possibly equate to Scottie Pippen. Dennis Rodman was able to specialize because on those Bulls teams because he was HoF specialist sharing the floor with at least two other HoF players who would have made the HoF solely based on the way they played defense. This makes your comparison kinda of luda.

He did it with Detroit and SA as well. There are numerous examples of this. I would take AG shooting skills over Rodman any day.

I think the point he is making is that it is possible and has been done before and is being done now with other teams. If she played 25 plus minutes consistently, I think she would be close to a double double day in day out and we would still be #1 ranked team but just do it a little differently. I think her shooting and confidence would increase as well and we would be that much better.

Yes I know GA is a HOF and doesn't agree with me.

 

[jazz]

This is simply not accurate and a common misconception. Aubrey has been asked to play 2 positions in her entire time at UCONN. Playing 2 Positions is standard for all UCONN players. Aubrey has been asked to play the (3) SF and (4) PF. A big part of the misconception is because people are confusing the substitutions. For example Aubrey came into the last game for Liv. This did not mean that Aubrey went into the game to play the center position. Even in Garbage time Aubrey is never asked to play the center it is usually Mir or Piath sliding into the center position.

They often don't play with a center.

 

[CocoHusky]

He did it with Detroit and SA as well. There are numerous examples of this. I would take AG shooting skills over Rodman any day.

I think the point he is making is that it is possible and has been done before and is being done now with other teams. If she played 25 plus minutes consistently, I think she would be close to a double double day in day out and we would still be #1 ranked team but just do it a little differently. I think her shooting and confidence would increase as well and we would be that much better.

Yes I know GA is a HOF and doesn't agree with me.

I understand and agree that it can be done. Do you understand my (this) point: Dennis Rodman is an EXTREME example to use to prove that it can be done. I hate to seem like I'm knocking the player just to shoot down this extreme but Aubrey's impact is not even close to Dennis Impact and this UCONN roster aren't the 96 Bulls. Let's deflate this hyperbole a just a little bit. Since there a "numerous examples" can you cite an example in WCBB?

 

[diggerfoot]

? This is puzzling:

I think you have not read my response clearly, it was in response to Aubrey needing to develop an outside shot to be an effective contributor on offense for her team... That is simply not true..onsistently than several others who are supposedly ahead of her..

Here is the post you were reacting to:

That decline is not just in the deep shooting. As a Freshman Aubrey did not understand the read and react offense well enough and you could see the hesitation and overthinking what to do next . Her understanding and movement in the offense increased greatly at the start of this season. Lately the hesitation is back for Aubrey as are these two notable things: 1)She has become god awful a setting screens and rarely gets a piece of defender. 2) Whether it is off a rebound or in the half court sets Aubrey is treating the ball like a hot potato and can't wait to get rid of it.

To clarify/reiterate, an outside shot is not the issue in the narrative, it is hesitation as revealed in 1. Griffin’s lack of screening and 2. Not wanting the ball. The counters then is ti 1. Claim that others are just as slow at learning when and how to screen; 2. Claim that others also do not want to handle the ball (Makurat shows an even greater reluctance to shoot, but not to handle the ball and facilitate offense); or 3. Bring up a separate read and react metric that others are having a bigger problem with than Griffin.

I don’t think anyone disputes your assertion that giving Griffin more playing time will develop her faster. The issue is comparing her rate of learning to read and react with others and whether that should warrant more or less playing time within the UConn system.

 

[King Kong]

Well, when Nika went down, I’m pretty sure Anna was put in as a ball handler. If Nika isn’t ready today, the choice would be start Aaliyah or start Anna. Aubrey is an unlikely first or second choice. Obviously she’s a disrupter and occasional scorer. But Aaliya is already way ahead of her as far as playing in the post area. Anna is way ahead of her as a ball handler. Aubrey is a net plus and would start for plenty of teams. UConn has the luxury of using her as needed.

As far as the High Point game goes, that team would’ve shot from half court if need be. The game wasn’t close ever and two or three of their 3s were banked, in otherwise known as an air ball that hit the backboard. So if Aubrey played more maybe they don’t get more than 45 points. Aubrey has played two full seasons and hasn’t shown a lot more reliable offense. I know, neither has Anna, but at the moment, both have pretty specific skills and Anna fills the bill for a missing Nika. Could be different against a more athletic team.

Interesting phraseology, "two or three of their 3s were banked, in otherwise known as an air ball that hit the backboard". I will now have to think of a bank shot "as an air ball that hit the backboard". Purposely or accidentally?

 

[GW15MJ4MM23]

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Kiah Stokes might have been the best rebounder per minute and the best shot blocker per minute in UConn WBB history. Geno loves defense, but dislikes inconsistent flow on offense.
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Aubrey Griffin obviously plays a different position with different teammates. Geno might be using similar decision making process as he did with Stokes. Just a thought.
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Player	Season	Eligibility	Minutes	Rebounds	Blocks	Points
Stewie	2014-5	Junior	1104	303	104	686
Stokes	2014-5	Senior	715	265	147	177

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2015-6 UConn Media Guide contains Final Statistics for 2014-5 on Page 37 (38).
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w baskbl media guide 16 (PDF) - University of Connecticut Athletics
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[jazz]

I understand and agree that it can be done. Do you understand my (this) point: Dennis Rodman is an EXTREME example to use to prove that it can be done. I hate to seem like I'm knocking the player just to shoot down this extreme but Aubrey's impact is not even close to Dennis Impact and this UCONN roster aren't the 96 Bulls. Let's deflate this hyperbole a just a little bit. Since there a "numerous examples" can you cite an example in WCBB?

ok but now you are saying it is not just HOF players but an extreme example in Rodman. I'd agree with that. I disagree that AG does not impact the game even closely to Rodman. That just isn't true. If it was, AG would never play.

You want examples? Are you saying that every single team has 5 players that are proven shooters from distance because this is what everybody is saying the reason in large part why AG doesn't play. Examples abound this year and every year.

Let's take Thomas from ARk, Egbo and oliver from Baylor and SAxton from SC. None are proven shooters from deep and in fact, I think if AG had more time to develop confidence in her shot (since apparently she makes them all the time in practice - what I heard GA or maybe it was CD say some time ago), then I think she would hit them with more regularity. Even NM missed her first 10 or so. A bit similar to AM last year who couldn't throw it in the ocean for half the year and finally she got her grove.

No, I am not saying that AG could possibly shoot 45% from three like AM did last year down the stretch, but I think she could reach say EW or CW levels in the low 30s.

 

[jazz]

? This is puzzling:


Here is the post you were reacting to:



To clarify/reiterate, an outside shot is not the issue in the narrative, it is hesitation as revealed in 1. Griffin’s lack of screening and 2. Not wanting the ball. The counters then is ti 1. Claim that others are just as slow at learning when and how to screen; 2. Claim that others also do not want to handle the ball (Makurat shows an even greater reluctance to shoot, but not to handle the ball and facilitate offense); or 3. Bring up a separate read and react metric that others are having a bigger problem with than Griffin.

I don’t think anyone disputes your assertion that giving Griffin more playing time will develop her faster. The issue is comparing her rate of learning to read and react with others and whether that should warrant more or less playing time within the UConn system.

Never seen or heard of a lack of screening from AG....See her do it all the time. AG has a good handle and has shown it on several occasions in the half court and in the open court going coast to coast on steals.

 

[cohenzone]

Interesting phraseology, "two or three of their 3s were banked, in otherwise known as an air ball that hit the backboard". I will now have to think of a bank shot "as an air ball that hit the backboard". Purposely or accidentally?

No. Lots of shooters use the bank shot on purpose from say 10-12 feet on in. I don’t know of a single player who tries to bank in a 3. It’s a bad miss and the backboard happens to get in the way.

 

[freshler40]

This is simply not accurate and a common misconception. Aubrey has been asked to play 2 positions in her entire time at UCONN. Playing 2 Positions is standard for all UCONN players. Aubrey has been asked to play the (3) SF and (4) PF. A big part of the misconception is because people are confusing the substitutions. For example Aubrey came into the last game for Liv. This did not mean that Aubrey went into the game to play the center position. Even in Garbage time Aubrey is never asked to play the center it is usually Mir or Piath sliding into the center position.

Well for the limited minutes we see Aubrey and the fast action, this common misconcepton becomes real. Some teams play positionless for several players, just let them play. She might have fallen into this trap with coach comments during time outs that tell her to steal the ball, create mayhem. What's a girl to do? The luxury we have with this and hopefully in coming years has created a wonderful dilemma. I do love the thought of having all players able to play two positions at least. Interchangeable parts are the wave of the future for this team! I also love that Liv has adopted well to being a passing Center / forward as needed. She has grown immensely. It does work to be flexible in all things called life! Thanks.

 

[CocoHusky]

Never seen or heard of a lack of screening from AG....See her do it all the time. AG has a good handle and has shown it on several occasions in the half court and in the open court going coast to coast on steals.

Please watch two minutes of the Marquette game (3:18- 1:20) and focus on Aubrey specifically. Not only is the hesitation very very evident with Aubrey but her first two attempts at screening resulting in "complete" whiffs. It is a major problem!

 

[huskiemaniac]

What exactly does Aubrey have to do to get some love from you folks?

I just wish she'd use a head fake.

 

[UcMiami]

Love AG's athleticism and her intensity on defense. She is a great offensive rebounder. She is a great chaos generator which can be very useful in increasing rate of play and adding confusion to an opponent's offensive rhythm thus generating more transition offense for Uconn.

On the down side, in the half court set, she can also be a chaos generator for Uconn's offense as she does not seem to integrate smoothly within the read and react - she can have some brilliant moments, but it just seems a little out of sync most of the time. Defenders also do not need to guard her more than 10 feet from the basket, which decreases the effectiveness of her speed as they can play off her. (Think Tiffany Hayes early in her career, and Jeff Waltz's defense which left Hayes all alone at the arc - and that game for the first time in her career she calmly sank 3 or 4 threes, and Jeff had to go to plan B.)

And recently her shots from 4' have seemed almost random tosses toward where the basket should be - people complain about Ono and missed bunnies and Aubrey is shooting a lower percentage while taking fewer shots outside the paint.

Evina and Anna and Nika are sometime reluctant to shoot, but they are more in tune with what the Uconn offense is trying to do, and more in sync with their teammates. One example is assists: Aubrey gets 1 assist for every 19.6 minutes on the court; Muhl 1 every 8.9; Anna 1 every 8.1; Evina 1 every 7.1. The only player getting more minutes and fewer assists/minute is Edwards, but Edwards seldom touches the ball outside the paint where her shooting percentage is leading the team.

I am reminded a little of Geno's frustration with Tina Charles in her first 2 plus years - incredible talent, incredible inconsistency. And also to Gabby's comment after the team lost to Stanford and she was glued to the bench - she realized that she had not yet given Geno a reason to trust her in a game, and she vowed to herself that she would never give him that excuse again.

 

[jazz]

Please watch two minutes of the Marquette game (3:18- 1:20) and focus on Aubrey specifically. Not only is the hesitation very very evident with Aubrey but her first two attempts at screening resulting in "complete" whiffs. It is a major problem!

 

[jazz]

can you supply a direct quote of a teammate saying that they dont trust her?

 

[Bajan Best]

? This is puzzling:


Here is the post you were reacting to:



To clarify/reiterate, an outside shot is not the issue in the narrative, it is hesitation as revealed in 1. Griffin’s lack of screening and 2. Not wanting the ball. The counters then is ti 1. Claim that others are just as slow at learning when and how to screen; 2. Claim that others also do not want to handle the ball (Makurat shows an even greater reluctance to shoot, but not to handle the ball and facilitate offense); or 3. Bring up a separate read and react metric that others are having a bigger problem with than Griffin.

I don’t think anyone disputes your assertion that giving Griffin more playing time will develop her faster. The issue is comparing her rate of learning to read and react with others and whether that should warrant more or less playing time within the UConn system.

1st my My response about Aubrey needing outside shooting to be an effective scorer was with reference to Pvdoogy's post..
2nd I'm not sure where anybody got the idea that Aubrey doesn't want the ball, if Aubrey is hesitating with the ball anywhere on the court, it is most likely if it is given to her at the three-point line, I cannot ever remember seeing Aubrey hesitate with the ball when it is given to her anywhere near the paint. EVER! If anything she may need to slow down a tad bit when it is given to her.

3rd I never made reference to any player's ability to learn the read and react system, I simply said to play in a read and react system, it requires thought therefore how can a player not be thinking?
I also added it's not only Aubrey who shows hesitation at times on the court, as several players on the team are hesitant to shoot the ball when open... So why just pick on Aubrey? My Comments had Absolutely Nothing to do with handling the ball.

Finally, and this is a new wrinkle, does it matter how well a person knows the read and react system if they still don't use it as they ought to? How many times have the coaches been on players other than Aubrey to Shoot the ball when open, Including Paige? Actually, Aubrey should be thanking some of those players because due to their lack of confidence, it has allowed her and Aaliyah mostly to clean up their mess for an easy put-back.

With regards to setting screens unless my eyes are deceiving me, she has been actively setting screens and would get much better at it in my opinion if given the time in games.. Anywho my aging brain is hurting at this point, bottom line, I still think she is a better option than some of the players who are currently ahead of her in rotation, but that is just my opinion and despite other's attempt, It will remain so for the remainder of this season

 

[jazz]

Please watch two minutes of the Marquette game (3:18- 1:20) and focus on Aubrey specifically. Not only is the hesitation very very evident with Aubrey but her first two attempts at screening resulting in "complete" whiffs. It is a major problem!

i thought you might show me this. i agree it was poor and i believe i commented on it in my 2 cents analysis after that game. to be fair, the first one was a bit of a fumble and the second, she was waiting for PB to angle up close to the paint but PB was just standing and not doing much. anyway, i agree it didnt look good but dont think it was on all on AG. She did whiff on the screen but PB has to help her out a bit by angling the player better. Similar to AE's complete whiff on the screen at the beginning of your clip. We should not pretend that AG whiffs anymore than others on screens. As i said, players have to run their man tight off the screen as well.

but, i can show you lots of clips where she does set good screens as well. i can show you clips of other players setting poor screens (if fact you showed one with AE as i mentioned above), heck they get called for offensive fouls setting screens every game. it is not a game to game recurring issue for AG. if so, you would be supplying me 25 clips of this.

i could also show you 25 clips of great plays that AG makes in each game she has played.....

 

[chrissaran]

What exactly does Aubrey have to do to get some love from you folks?

Imagine against Highpoint, a team that thrives on the 3 Ball, our defense allowed 34 Attempts, 34!!
Guess how many of those attempts were by a player guarded by Aubrey? Go ahead guess.
The only other player that was effective in preventing Highpoint from hoisting up 3's may have been Olivia.
Even everybody's Defensive Darling, (and rightfully so) Nika gave up at least one, before her unfortunate injury..

In 13 Mins of Playing time, besides being effective at slowing down the deep threat, Aubrey still managed to Score 9pts on 4 of 6 Shooting, which is 66% (3rd Best) behind Aaliyah 80%, Paige 69%, snatched 7 rebounds (Roughly 1 every 2 mins of playing time, the best rate of the entire team). 1 assist, (worthy of play of the game) and 0 Turnovers.
Yet I do not see one single topic thread acknowledging her contributions to the first-round win.

You guys are a tough crowd. SMH
One could only imagine if she was given 26 mins of playing time..

Aubrey extremely athletic and did a great job on defense against High Point. Now if she could only hit a layup.

 

[Blueconn]

Let's be clear, every individual player has what the coaching staff deems to be a projected growth path. however to take out one player for being inconsistent, and not Confident etc to play another player who suffers from pretty much the same issues is kinda crazy.. especially when you look at the comparable game stats of each player.

Unless of course, they are viewing the other players to be "consistently" passing up open shots or to be "confident" another player will make the shot and therefore are trusted to rely on someone else to make the play for them as positives

I love our coaches to death, but they are human and therefore subject to error.. I've lived long enough to know some players need different approaches to be successful.. How many well-intended parents have caused damage to their children by holding on to the same approach that was successful with another child? it doesn't always work. They took a chance on Nika by giving her more playing time despite her horrid shooting initially and look how that turned out.. So why not do the same for Aubrey despite her inconsistencies?

Out on a limb but I wonder if Aubrey is physically 100%.

 

[Bajan Best]

Aubrey extremely athletic and did a great job on defense against High Point. Now if she could only hit a layup.

SHe shot 66% from the field that game, made 4 of 6 layups, Good Lord, LOL

 

[RedStickHusky]

Who doesn't love Aubrey? We'd all be happy to see her get more minutes and have great success. Forgive me for believing that no one posting on this board is remotely qualified to judge GA/CD/JE/SR on their choices of who to play. You are offering an uniformed, emotional opinion and arguing with anyone who doesn't agree with you. Trusting Geno does not mean I hate Aubrey.

 

[Penn]

I think both sides have presented very compelling arguments concerning AG’s playing time but

Let Geno and the coaches decide. They have done a great job so far.

 

[HuskyNan]

I think both sides have presented very compelling arguments concerning AG’s playing time but View attachment 66199
Let Geno and the coaches decide. They have done a great job so far.

Thank you! This horse was beaten to death two threads ago