‘24 vs. ‘23

[uconngb]

There were a few spots last night where I thought "Castle is Andre 2.0"

When he kept taking and missing 3s??

I kid, I kid.

 

[QDOG5]

At the present time I would vote for '23. '24 is still evolving. As was mentioned earlier in the thread the '23 center combo was insane. We won't see that this year. I hope Samson continues to improve. His rebound to minutes played rate is lacking.

 

[superjohn]

Agree to disagree. Fwiw Gordon averaged over 4 assists a game to go with Taliek’s 6.5. Pretty good at passing the ball. (Both averaged more assists than their counterparts actually up to this point).

We have to put some respect on just how good our program’s history is. It did not start in 2016. Lol

And turned it over a lot more. If stats are your thing it's really not going to go too well for you arguing Taliek and Ben over Tristen and Cam.

This is incredibly boring though.

 

[XLCenterFan]

When he kept taking and missing 3s??

I kid, I kid.

lol. That was part of it, yes. And how the D can give him threes.

 

[HuskyHawk]

Nope, I would take them overall over Taliek and Ben. Taliek couldn't score, let's not make it out that he chose not to because of all he had around him. He could make a layup and a little teardrop, that was it.

Gordon is by far the most talented player in that group and the best player in that group but I disagree on how huge the gap is at the college level. We all know Gordon was the best scorer of the bunch and by far the most athletic but I never liked Gordon handling the ball much. Newton and Cam are a more versatile backcourt, a better shooting backcourt, a better handling backcourt, a better passing backcourt. Taliek and Gordon were a better defensive backcourt.

You keep trying to do a simulation. I'm not playing that game. All I'll say is obviously Cam wouldn't be guarding Gordon.

Both Taliek and Ben are vastly better defenders than Cam or Tristen. Way, way better. Also just as good a passing backcourt if not better. Shooting to Cam and Newton. Ben and Taliek better ball handlers, both better than either guy this year.

 

[superjohn]

both better than either guy this year.

Lolz, Newton is way better than Taliek. They play different positions but Cam is also a better player than Taliek.

 

[Hans Sprungfeld]

We've got 6 more days to develop skirmishes like brushfires.

Do we have it in us to break out into a civil war? Can we avoid it?
Will someone claim that's the purpose of a message board?

Who's the least deserving UConn player to ever get a National Championship ring?

I think I'm going to watch a 2023 NCAA replay for each of the next six days. Anybody else?

 

[Kembafan]

‘23 beats ‘24 easily imo. This team can get much better but I think that team was better on both sides of the floor.

 

[Storrs South]

It really depends on the point in time. If we are talking at this exact point in the season both years it's hard to not pick 2024.

If we are talking first two months of season it's hard to not pick 2023.

Asymmetrical comparisons like March / April 2023 (what we can call the finished product) compared to today's team well its also a no brainer.

We now have 2 months and change to see how this team evolves hopefully at full health.

I agree with the notion the offense is better this year and defense last year generally and the analytics bear that out.

One other thing I'd add is this team is more poised. The close games and road wins are representative of that. Last year depth wise though was truly an embarrassment of riches.

 

[mauconnfan]

Hey question I have without looking it up. Is the 2010-11 team the last to start 17-2 or better?

 

[dennismenace]

All he did was ask the question. I think this team has a chance to become our best team ever if they stay healthy the rest of the season.

I agree. They have a much more flexible and consistent offense (Spencer) and, as has recently been shown, capable of playing very good D when properly motivated. Just stay healthy and keep developing the freshman (Castle, Ball and Stewart). They are reducing the number of turnovers which also indicates less mental mistakes.

 

[Scoe]

Hey question I have without looking it up. Is the 2010-11 team the last to start 17-2 or better?

Without even looking it up I say no question. I’m sure the 2010-11 team started 18-2.

 

[HuskyHawk]

Lolz, Newton is way better than Taliek. They play different positions but Cam is also a better player than Taliek.

Better ball handlers? You removed the context. Taliek is the best ball handler of the four, by far, and Ben is the next best.

 

[boog204]

I think 23 beats 24 nine times out of ten. The three missing starters from last years team, imo, are all better than their replacements. I LOVE Spencer but Hawkins is better and tourney Hawkins was an absolute assassin. AJax brought far more to the table than Castle and Amida was a dominant inside player and DC/Samson are not there, yet. Then factor in that last year's bench was more consistent and explosive with DC and Alleyne and, just for added emphasis, the 23 team's starting 5 was more athletic than this year's team which results in far too many guys getting beat off the dribble for layups. It's partly systemic, but I don't remember us struggling so much with athletic guards last year as we are this year.

 

[microfich]

If last year’s Huskies played the current Storrs Five, what would the final score be?

Some great posts, here.

I'll take the question as can 24 win the whole thing and if so would they beat 23 as a team? Easier than imagining Karaban, Clingan and Newton guarding themselves.

+1: 24. Holdovers are even better now.
+1: 23. Dependability with Sanogo, Hawkins spotlighted so important at tournament time. 24 has contenders and performers every night but we rely on the system more. So far so good but will it be enough every night?
+1: 23. Bench play with Joey and Nahiem as option 4s far superior to Ball and Stewart. Diarra creeping up, though.
0: 24 offensive scheme/flow better than 23 but that wouldn't have worked for 23 as Sanogo low was primary.
0: Castle is special and is comparable to Andre in some ways good and bad as the 5 option. He will be the reason 24 goes all the way or not and will move the needle closer toward 24 as the 23 vs. 24 winner if he finds ways to score.

23 ultimately wins 82-77 because they had a big game deadeye in Hawkins who could run over, under, around and through and find his slot.
24 will need to develop a way to spring Cam similarly, for the bench to deliver results beyond C and get points out of Castle.

 

[imno1]

I think 23 beats 24 nine times out of ten. The three missing starters from last years team, imo, are all better than their replacements. I LOVE Spencer but Hawkins is better and tourney Hawkins was an absolute assassin. AJax brought far more to the table than Castle and Amida was a dominant inside player and DC/Samson are not there, yet. Then factor in that last year's bench was more consistent and explosive with DC and Alleyne and, just for added emphasis, the 23 team's starting 5 was more athletic than this year's team which results in far too many guys getting beat off the dribble for layups. It's partly systemic, but I don't remember us struggling so much with athletic guards last year as we are this year.

Are we comparing last year’s full season to this year’s partial one? I think it’s too early to evaluate. Suppose this year’s team wins the title and doesn’t lose or only has 1 or 2 more loses the rest of the way? Would that sway anyone’s opinion?

 

[boog204]

Are we comparing last year’s full season to this year’s partial one? I think it’s too early to evaluate. Suppose this year’s team wins the title and doesn’t lose or only has 1 or 2 more loses the rest of the way? Would that sway anyone’s opinion?

Fair point and yes, I'm comparing last year's full season and us at our absolute best to what we've seen thus far this season... To answer your question, I would be surprised if/when we win it this year if we would be as dominant as last year's squad even if we have a team with fewer losses.

 

[CL82]

I think the Newton Cam backcourt is better than the Taliek Gordon backcourt.

I don't know. I think you have to give the athleticism nod to the Taliek Gordon backcourt. Taliek was an enormously quick player. I think that would bother Newton considerably. Gordon was such an athletic and strong guy. I don't think Cam can guard him and I think Cam would struggle to get a shot off.

 

[superjohn]

Better ball handlers? You removed the context. Taliek is the best ball handler of the four, by far, and Ben is the next best.

I misread your last sentence. I thought you were saying they were both better than either guy this year. I missed that you were talking about ball handling.

 

[gtcam]

Andre and Castle are a wash? Would love it if Castle could rain 3's like Hawkins (all due respect to the ONE Castle actually hit last night). And Hawkins could actually finish at the rim. Defensively, Castle is tough and he rebounds well. Another year or two at UConn and maybe his shooting and offensive game reach Hawkin's level.

So not even close offensively:
You are aware that Hawk's 1st name is Jordan and not Andre???
Luv Hawk - I was one of the 1st to introduce him to this board 4 years ago, however, Castle is a different type of offensive player than Hawk. Castle is more geared to the overall NBA game.
Castle has not hit his perimeter shots but Hawk couldn't even get to the rim at this comparable stage of his freshman year. Castle also hit a big 3 vs Creighton and a few others in January so it is more than ONE - all due respect.
1st 8 NBE game comparative - 3 pt shooting Freshman year
JH - 7/24 - .292
SC - 4/17 - .235

 

[Iluvsuebird]

Absolutely, Sanogo is the key difference, also last year's team was deeper. Non-starters last year were Clingan, Joey and Alleyne, who were much more potent than Johnson, Solo and Stewart. But Sanogo was an unstoppable beast who would always give you 15 - 20 points a game, and UConn will miss him more than anything this year. Defensively, I give the nod to last year's squad too, the main difference is Spencer's limited defensive ability (offensivly he is massive). And I sometimes think Andre and Stephon are a wash, but I'm less sure about that conclusion.

Sanogo DOES NOT score 15-20 points against Clingan. Sorry. Not happening.

 

[Mr. French]

As soon as Clingan has to play against Clingan, the world will explode.

 

[Mr. French]

And turned it over a lot more. If stats are your thing it's really not going to go too well for you arguing Taliek and Ben over Tristen and Cam.

This is incredibly boring though.

You’re taking college Newton over college Ben? Just curious I love both. I wouldn’t.

 

[superjohn]

You’re taking college Newton over college Ben? Just curious I love both. I wouldn’t.

No, as an overall backcourt I'm taking '23-24 Tristen and Cam over '03-04 Taliek and Ben. I'm not taking into account who had the most upside, NBA talent etc.

I think Ben was the best out of the bunch but I don't think the gap is huge. I think Taliek is the worst out of the group and I think he lags behind significantly.

 

[Mr. French]

No, as an overall backcourt I'm taking '23-24 Tristen and Cam over '03-04 Taliek and Ben. I'm not taking into account who had the most upside, NBA talent etc.

I think Ben was the best out of the bunch but I don't think the gap is huge. I think Taliek is the worst out of the group and I think he lags behind significantly.

Fair. Probably agree. But maybe you’re remembering Talieks warts a bit heavier than his qualities. I overall agree though.