XL Center reno costs skyrocket

[UCMB88]

Maybe that state needs to re-evaluate the worth of the CRDA and Mr. Freimuth.

From today's Hartford Courant:

"A major renovation of Hartford’s XL Center would cost tens of millions of dollars more than an estimate of $107 million, throwing into uncertainty a long-debated makeover of the aging arena and likely forcing another downsizing.

Five months ago, the Capital Region Development Authority sought bids for what the already-downsized renovation of the sports and entertainment arena would actually cost. Since then, an analysis by the quasi-public CRDA of the bids — covering the individual components of the project — came in at more than $140 million. That’s not only well above the estimate, but also the state funding and private investment tentatively in place to finance the renovation.

“The dilemma is this: we can spend the $100 million and just make a lot of repairs and not have much to show for it,” Michael W. Freimuth, executive director of CRDA, which oversees the arena’s operations, said. “We can do a lot of sexy things and not do the base repairs. Then the elevator stops and then it’s ‘What did you do?’ We’re kind of between a rock and a hard place.”

 

[TheRealKBuks]

Have we ever seen the projections for a brand new arena? They keep trying to put lipstick on this pig, I just have 0 clue what a new arena would actually cost.

 

[NowInStorrs]

Play all games in Storrs. Ez pz.

 

[huskiesouth]

A government contract being underestimated? Color me not surprised.

 

[UCMB88]

Have we ever seen the projections for a brand new arena? They keep trying to put lipstick on this pig, I just have 0 clue what a new arena would actually cost.

This story is from 2015:

"After a three-month study, consultants came forward with two ideas for more long term plans. They told the Capital Region Development Authority board members just how outdated the XL Center really is and how recent upgrades only amount to a five-year "band-aid" at best. A big concern is that electrical and mechanical infrastructure issues persist.
So the consultants presented two options:
1. Spend $250 million expanding and renovating the current arena onto Trumbull Street and/or across Church Street.
2. Spend $500 Million tearing down the XL Center and rebuilding a bigger one on the same site."

I would imagine $500M in 2015 would be around $750-$800M today.

 

[GiladKatzDeli]

I love the Hartford Civic Center, that place will always have a special place in my heart, and I have so many great memories there. But it's been what, 50 years? It's past time for a new, modern building.

 

[UCann]

Makes no sense to keep pouring millions, hundreds of millions, into trying to upgrade the arena. It’s just more efficient (albeit more costly upfront) to build a new arena. The state needs it. The people deserve it. Who cares if it costs $1B. The return in terms of civic engagement, community building and morale would be worth it. We’d get way more events. Fewer people would grumble about UConn playing there. Heck even the NHL become a slightly more likely (still low) option. The possibilities a new state of the art arena opens up are tremendous.

 

[BPT2Storrs]

A government contract being underestimated? Color me not surprised.

I am in no way disputing this, but when state or federal funds are used, the regulations become so burdensome. It’s almost impossible to get an accurate estimate because somewhere along the way the regulators find something that increases the cost or delays the project.

 

[Stew Crew]

I am in no way disputing this, but when state or federal funds are used, the regulations become so burdensome. It’s almost impossible to get an accurate estimate because somewhere along the way the regulators find something that increases the cost or delays the project.

It's not just government projects. I worked in the chemical industry for years. Any project manager will tell you that a minimum 15% contingency is needed for unexpected changes. Also, construction companies will come in low on the initial bid to win it. Then, they make all their profit on the changes the customer wants after the bid is won. The two favorite words that a contractor wants to hear is "change order."

At this point, a few strategically placed sticks of dynamite is the best option. UConn has all the facilities they need on campus. The casinos have stolen almost all the concerts. Events like the Home and Garden show and Bridal Expo can be moved to the convention center. The only question is what to do with the Wolfpack. Any aspiration for an NHL team is a pipedream if the XL is the home ice arena.

 

[Palatine]

Inflation is not going to stop. It will never be cheaper than it is right now. Spend the money get it done.

 

[JohnnyJr]

Makes no sense to keep pouring millions, hundreds of millions, into trying to upgrade the arena. It’s just more efficient (albeit more costly upfront) to build a new arena. The state needs it. The people deserve it. Who cares if it costs $1B. The return in terms of civic engagement, community building and morale would be worth it. We’d get way more events. Fewer people would grumble about UConn playing there. Heck even the NHL become a slightly more likely (still low) option. The possibilities a new state of the art arena opens up are tremendous.

The governor has said before that he has a group willing to buy an NHL team but there’s no way that’s ever happening without a new arena. I went to Whalers games as a kid and don’t really watch NHL because of the move. I gave up because I don’t ever see the state spending that kind of money.

 

[alexd]

Did they think if they dragged their feet and waited maybe the cost would come down??

 

[StllH8L8ner]

My rule of thumb these days is whatever I think some sort of house repair/reno will cost, I double it. Then I’m not disappointed when I get the real estimate.

 

[Uconn77Duke74]

What about a New Trisha Bailey Arena?

 

[How Sway?!]

The governor has said before that he has a group willing to buy an NHL team but there’s no way that’s ever happening without a new arena. I went to Whalers games as a kid and don’t really watch NHL because of the move. I gave up because I don’t ever see the state spending that kind of money.

The governor should ask those investors to pony up some money to build a new arena as well.

 

[TheHorde]

My dream is having the Fenway Sports Group sell the Penguins, tear down the Civic Center, build a brand new arena, and get an NHL expansion franchise named the Hartford Whalers.

 

[Stew Crew]

The governor has said before that he has a group willing to buy an NHL team but there’s no way that’s ever happening without a new arena. I went to Whalers games as a kid and don’t really watch NHL because of the move. I gave up because I don’t ever see the state spending that kind of money.

There is a big difference between having investors willing to buy a team and the NHL willing to put a team in a small market that is squeezed by Boston and New York.

 

[freescooter]

There are really 2 problems with the XL. The biggest one is it is just old. These places just wear out. Plumbing, electrical all the major systems. They might have been Stste of the art in 1978, but they are both worn and out of date now. Elevators have a life span of 25-30 years after which they need major rebuilds. Not even to mention technological improvements..

The 2nd problem is that it takes so long to get things done. It has gotten a little better but construction costs have been growing at crazy rates. We had a project just recently that was estimated at $6 million in August. We are finishing financing now an the cost grew by a million bucks.

 

[CL82]

So how much was the cost to build the exterior concourse around Gampel, again? That seems like a better investment.

 

[JohnnyJr]

There is a big difference between having investors willing to buy a team and the NHL willing to put a team in a small market that is squeezed by Boston and New York.

Well before we didn’t even have investors so it’s an improvement. It’d be a long shot to ever get the NHL here. I also don’t think you could sell a new arena to the public without a commitment from the NHL, won’t happen just for UConn basketball.

 

[UconnU]

So how much was the cost to build the exterior concourse around Gampel, again? That seems like a better investment.

Houston turned the Fertitta Center into an NBA style arena for less than $60 million a few years ago. Nothing ever gets done in state because of the costs and regulatory barriers have made these types of upgrades, even normal upkeep, too much of an hassle and too expensive.

 

[bendm]

burn it down for the insurance money and play all games at Gampel. win win.

 

[UConnJim]

DePaul's arena which holds 10.4k was built for $170 million in 2015 to 2017. Baylor's 7k seat arena cost ~$212 million. Texas new arena which seats 10.8k cost $375 million.

I don't see why you would put $140 million into the Xl Center. Either build a new one or shut it down.

 

[StllH8L8ner]

burn it down for the insurance money and play all games at Gampel. win win.

 

[How Sway?!]

Houston turned the Fertitta Center into an NBA style arena for less than $60 million a few years ago. Nothing ever gets done in state because of the costs and regulatory barriers have made these types of upgrades, even normal upkeep, too much of an hassle and too expensive.

I wouldn't use the Fertitta Center as an example to follow. Much smaller arena and much less work was needed as it had just been renovated in 2004.

 

[UCann]

I don't see why you would put $140 million into the Xl Center. Either build a new one or shut it down.

Exactly. Would be way way better off to use that as a downpayment on a new arena. I think the public would support it if UConn continues to do well. And maybe not a commitment from the NHL, but if there are enough compelling other events that could be guaranteed it could make a difference. Throw in a private partnership, naming rights, etc. and the cost can be manageable. How can the state not have a premier arena??

 

[FearThePups]

Play all games in Storrs. Ez pz.

Yes. It’s a no brainer. Update and expand seating in Gambel. Dump the Civic Center. Why is the university and the state always thinking small? Same problem with the Rent and the fact we have no on campus football stadium. The basketball and football venues need to be on campus, just like all the big boy leagues and programs.

 

[CL82]

Houston turned the Fertitta Center into an NBA style arena for less than $60 million a few years ago. Nothing ever gets done in state because of the costs and regulatory barriers have made these types of upgrades, even normal upkeep, too much of an hassle and too expensive.

There's a lot of space in Gamble being used for other things, like the golf simulator, offices etc. grab that concourse/concessions/bathrooms and then replace the fold out bleachers with dedicated stands, maybe work some club sections in there.

 

[LBird33]

It does drive up construction costs. You got people say burn it down or blow it up. What with this

 

[ctkaiser]

Have we ever seen the projections for a brand new arena? They keep trying to put lipstick on this pig, I just have 0 clue what a new arena would actually cost.

How many almost 50 year old arenas is anybody trying to fix, renovate or keep operational. Seems like an impossible task.