WNBA and social justice (Breanna Stewart quotes, too)

[maddoggy]

Politico.com has a (non-cesspool, I trust) take-out today (at How the WNBA Stood Up to Trump and Won Fans) on how the WNBA and its players have found that taking a stand on social justice issues can also be good marketing for its target audiences.

"Fans of the league tend to be older men—its TV audience on ESPN2 is 68 percent male, while women under the age of 35 account for only around 7 percent of WNBA viewership on ESPN2 and NBATV. 'Trump has given the league a way to connect with millennial women,' [Howard ] Megdal [of highposthoops.com] said. 'For a long time, the league’s been asking: ‘Are we a business or are we a cause?’ And in 2018, they’ve determined those things are one and the same."

One of the examples that the article cites is Breanna Stewart's decision to protest the president’s travel ban.

"Stewart told me that after her protest at LAX, she attended a high school basketball game, where a boy approached her and thanked her for being there. 'I don’t know if it’s creating more fans, but the fact the league is being talked about more is good for us,' she said."

and

... "Stewart has watched the internal divisions in the NFL, where players and owners have battled over players’ aspirations to speak out against racial equality and police brutality and protecting the league’s business interests. “As the WNBA, we need to have a unified front,” Stewart said. “Obviously there will be times where we don’t agree, but compared to the NFL—the disparity between players, front offices and management—it’s huge. We know change is only going to happen if we’re together.”

 

[Bronx23]

I'd love to comment but wonder how this is NOT a political thread!
Until the policy here changes (which maybe never) I will refrain, as difficult as that might be!
Bronx23

 

[maddoggy]

I'd love to comment but wonder how this is NOT a political thread!
Until the policy here changes (which maybe never) I will refrain, as difficult as that might be!
Bronx23

I look at the article as a factual discussion of (1) HOW the league and its players are handling the social and political issues that other athletes and leagues confront and (2)HOW it affects their marketing.

The how is the same whether one likes or dislikes the underlying actions. And I think one can discuss whether or not the strategy makes marketing sense without endorsing or condemning the politics of it. But I do very much take your point, which is why I tried to let the article speak for itself, without adding my opinion. And I'd be happy to take any discussion off-list if the mods prefer.

 

[HuskyNan]

I'd love to comment but wonder how this is NOT a political thread!
Until the policy here changes (which maybe never) I will refrain, as difficult as that might be!
Bronx23

As maddoggy explained in the follow up post, the OP was introducing how sports, and the WNBA in particular, aren't shying away from making statements on social and political issues. I think it can be discussed as a general concept without going into posters' individual political views. We had quite a long thread on the time the Pledge of Allegiance was recited before UConn games. It was a very good discussion, both pro and con, that managed to go on without arguing politics.

In the off-season, I prefer to watch threads to see if they go astray rather than just deleting them. During the season, there's way too much traffic for that so some potentially problematic threads aren't allowed.

 

[vtcwbuff]

How's that social activism stuff working out for the NFL's bottom line?

 

[triaddukefan]

How's that social activism stuff working out for the NFL's bottom line?

Record revenues distributed by the NFL for the 2017 season. Up 4.7%

AMP icon

My local team just sold for a record amount.... David Tepper bought the panthers for 2.2 billion dollars straight cash.

 

[JustinesGuy]

How's that social activism stuff working out for the NFL's bottom line?

I believe the NFL ratings fell 9.7 percent in 2017. I would say this is mostly attributed to the Kneeling during Anthem issue. One could argue the product on the field took a hit when Aaron rogers broke his collar bone, a historically poor NY Giants team and an underperforming Dallas Cowboys team could have been factors. Other factors I see for a decline are frustrationg with rules, like what is a catch???, or over saturation .. NFL sunday is fantastic, but watching another game on Sunday night, then usually a crappy game on Monday night, then an even crappier game on Thursday night can contribute.
The whole thing is a disaster, from RG to Trump, and the players. Its hard to believe this is still an on the field issue.

 

[MilfordHusky]

I believe the NFL ratings fell 9.7 percent in 2017. I would say this is mostly attributed to the Kneeling during Anthem issue. One could argue the product on the field took a hit when Aaron rogers broke his collar bone, a historically poor NY Giants team and an underperforming Dallas Cowboys team could have been factors. Other factors I see for a decline are frustrationg with rules, like what is a catch???, or over saturation .. NFL sunday is fantastic, but watching another game on Sunday night, then usually a crappy game on Monday night, then an even crappier game on Thursday night can contribute.
The whole thing is a disaster, from RG to Trump, and the players. Its hard to believe this is still an on the field issue.

My lack of interest is largely due to the concussions and the league's inadequate response to them. Salaries are very high, but the product would be nothing without the players.

 

[KnightBridgeAZ]

The biggest problem for any league or group of players adopting an activist position isn't, to my mind, peeving the folks that they know they are going to bother.

Rather, because everyone will perceive a position / behavior from their own point of view, there is a possibility of annoying lots of folks that you didn't think you would.

I will use the kneeling as an example. The players perceived they were making a particular point. But in the end, the point they were making was lost in the controversy over the action they were taking. And I worry that the WNBA or any other group might likewise "lose" the point they are making in the controversy over making the point in the first place.

 

[eebmg]

I do not believe issues such as social activism really affect the bottom line in any significant way and if they do, not in the long term. Only the product on the field matters . And with the new rules change regarding the use of the helmet leading to even more confusion, expect the NFL games to frustrate and alienate alot of fans to the point of giving up. The only thing worse than the actual calls will be the Monday morning analysts trying to break them down with a few hired ex referee's.

 

[HuskyNan]

you cannot apply the rules nilly -willy and keep your credibility. As a veteran I have earn the right to speak on the subject and I have plenty to say. However this board was advertised as a "sanctuary" where we talk about sport and not controversial subject like politic!

The topic being discussed in this thread isn't politics; it's the use of sports to make statements about other issues, such as social or political issues.

Incidentally, and not to start an argument, everyone has a right to speak on topics introduced to the board, not just veterans. I say that with recognition of your sacrifice for the right of all American to enjoy their Constitutionally given rights and I thank you, most sincerely, for your service.

 

[Bronx23]

As maddoggy explained in the follow up post, the OP was introducing how sports, and the WNBA in particular, aren't shying away from making statements on social and political issues. I think it can be discussed as a general concept without going into posters' individual political views. We had quite a long thread on the time the Pledge of Allegiance was recited before UConn games. It was a very good discussion, both pro and con, that managed to go on without arguing politics.

In the off-season, I prefer to watch threads to see if they go astray rather than just deleting them. During the season, there's way too much traffic for that so some potentially problematic threads aren't allowed.

Thanks Nan for the clarification / explanation!
I just personally find it very difficult in our current environment not to address these type of issues more fully, which then at least for me, becomes political.
The current Lebron situation easily becomes the next step.
So without becoming political I'm proud to see Brianna Stewart talk of her personal struggles and social awareness and commitment. As to its impact on marketing it can easily be a two edged sword.
Bronx23

 

[Bronx23]

I believe the NFL ratings fell 9.7 percent in 2017. I would say this is mostly attributed to the Kneeling during Anthem issue. One could argue the product on the field took a hit when Aaron rogers broke his collar bone, a historically poor NY Giants team and an underperforming Dallas Cowboys team could have been factors. Other factors I see for a decline are frustrationg with rules, like what is a catch???, or over saturation .. NFL sunday is fantastic, but watching another game on Sunday night, then usually a crappy game on Monday night, then an even crappier game on Thursday night can contribute.
The whole thing is a disaster, from RG to Trump, and the players. Its hard to believe this is still an on the field issue.

All good points! And what about the head injuries/ concussions?
That is part of why I've stopped watching the NFL and the Giants. And I grew up while the Gifford / Rote teams of the late 50's / early 60's played at Yankee Stadium and most resided at the Concourse Plaza during the season.
So of course political activism / social awareness effects marketing. Sometimes it's clearly in one direction sometime the other and occasionally both!
Bronx23

 

[PhillyCoach]

I watch all women's sports. Soccer, tennis, and college basketball are my favorites. I watch for the competition and the developing skills. I stop watching when the "social justice" comes into play. For all sports, IMHO, the more politics--the less spectators and more division. We are all brought together by the sports. That is the unity. Politics divide us. [ politics removed] ESPN has lost viewers since there is less sport and more divisive politics. I never watch the ESPN talk shows. Too much politics. [politics removed]

 

[CL82]

'For a long time, the league’s been asking: ‘Are we a business or are we a cause?’ And in 2018, they’ve determined those things are one and the same."

If the league took that position it would be a key marketing mistake. [politics removed] crowds don't consistently fill arenas to watch social justice or political causes. The WBNA would be better served focusing on its core mission, providing an exciting and entertaining pro sports events on a consistent basis. Confusing that core mission with social justice suggests either a lack of focus or attempt to diversify because of lack of demand. Don't get me wrong, big business can do a lot to promote social justice issues, but confusing that with the core mission of a for profit business is problematic.

[politics removed]

 

[JustinesGuy]

you cannot apply the rules nilly -willy and keep your credibility. As a veteran I have earn the right to speak on the subject and I have plenty to say. However this board was advertised as a "sanctuary" where we talk about sport and not controversial subject like politic!

Thank u for your service. Much respect towards you. I welcome your opinion whatever it is.

 

[JustinesGuy]

I watch all women's sports. Soccer, tennis, and college basketball are my favorites. I watch for the competition and the developing skills. I stop watching when the "social justice" comes into play. For all sports, IMHO, the more politics--the less spectators and more division. We are all brought together by the sports. That is the unity. Politics divide us. ESPN has lost viewers since there is less sport and more divisive politics. I never watch the ESPN talk shows. Too much politics.

[politics removed]. I loathe people who create hate no matter the politicals. [ ] it’s gone too far. [ politics removed]
It’s a crazy time. I hope we can have discussions again without so much hate.

 

[vtcwbuff]

I can only speak for myself but I find the social activism touted so loudly by the WNBA to be a real turnoff. I watch sports for the competition, that's what the WNBA should market. I have no interest in the endless of selling of "I am woman hear me roar" and the current cause of the week.

After a couple of years of supporting the Sun I had enough and now I stick to WCBB.

 

[tomcat]

Which raises an interesting point. I have little interest in the WNBA, but not because of the social activism of its players. If anything, that has made me more interested in the teams and players. I do have to say, for the record, that as a UConn WCBB fanatic, I could not be more proud of Breanna and the stands that she has taken on a variety of issues. As it happens, I agree with those stands, but I also admire her gutsy willingness to speak out on tough topics, regardless of her point of view.

 

[Bronx23]

Which raises an interesting point. I have little interest in the WNBA, but not because of the social activism of its players. If anything, that has made me more interested in the teams and players. I do have to say, for the record, that as a UConn WCBB fanatic, I could not be more proud of Breanna and the stands that she has taken on a variety of issues. As it happens, I agree with those stands, but I also admire her gutsy willingness to speak out on tough topics, regardless of her point of view.[/QUOTE
Perfectly said!
Sometimes things require stepping up and out even if it is not good marketing or money wise!
Bronx23

 

[maddoggy]

Great discussion so far. At the risk of screwing it up, here are some additional thoughts:

1) While I understand that some people don't want sports teams to address social issues, the status quo is just as political as changes to it.

2) Most advertisers are much more interested in reaching young people, whose lifelong habits are not yet set in stone, than old people, who may not be around much longer. (OK, there are exceptions, nut mostly for Depends, reverse mortgages, walk-in bathtubs and the like.) The WNBA may well believe that losing some older white males from its current audience may be a good trade-off for attracting millenials.

3) Many WNBA players have advanced degrees and could easily find other jobs. Much as tech companies have tried to attract and retain talented workers by changes to the workplace and by taking social stands, the WNBA may to encourage the best players to join and stick around, especially when they could be earning more elsewhere.

 

[vtcwbuff]

1. If the WNBA loses their old white guy fan base they will most certainly fold. Go to a game and look around at the fans. It's old white guys, their drag along wives and lesbians.

2. I would be absolutely astounded if more than a few WNBA players have "advanced" degrees. My guess is that though they may be better educated than their male counterparts, many have little beyond tutored basket weaving.

 

[Sifaka]

How's that social activism stuff working out for the NFL's bottom line?

How's that basic statistics concept, correlation does not equal causality, working out?

 

[triaddukefan]

2. I would be absolutely astounded if more than a few WNBA players have "advanced" degrees. My guess is that though they may be better educated than their male counterparts, many have little beyond tutored basket weaving.

How do you figure?

 

[temery]

From now on ZERO politics on the sports boards. A UConn link is not a loophole. Post it in the cesspool. That's where it belongs.

Sorry, but I just spent way too much time cleaning up politics on the sports boards, and it seems like I have to say this once a month.

This is not meant as a message for the thread starter, it's for everyone on all sports board.