Thanks for sharing your thoughts on this, 61cygni. I always find it interesting what others are thinking when it comes to faith. Most in the north east, particularly New England tend to be very secular and are reserved when it comes to talking about what they believe. Talking about such in other parts of the country aren't as taboo as it is here and I enjoy when we occasionally discuss this sort of thing.
I understand exactly where you and others are coming from, because I was there at one point in my life. It's funny that many who grew up in a family that centered around a deep personal relationship/connection with God often feel the same about those who don't believe and feel it doesn't make sense not to. I understand that believing in something that we can't see or touch, though is based on some body of data (Bible, life experiences, miracles experienced, witnessed or informed about), is not easily entered into. One has to weigh the message and their life experiences and decide if they're willing to explore and/or embrace the objects of faith.
I've seen many an atheist, agnostic or otherwise, explore the Bible to see what it has to say and eventually embrace Jesus as their Lord and Savior. I know that many have heard that combination and have a strong visceral response. Our nature is often self reliant or co-reliant on others we can touch and see. The idea of a savior implies there's something one needs to be rescued from. If one doesn't recognize the thing from which we need rescuing or believe there is such a condition, then the whole idea of a savior sounds flat out dumb to be honest. As for the lord part, we no longer live in a kingdom type society, but all this means is putting ourselves in the care and service to the one we wish to honor. It's no longer living for our own set of wants, goals and objectives but to place all of this under the lord's domain, which in the case we see described in the Bible, is designed to be favorable not only for this life but for eternity.
These images we often see on TV and the movies of punishment, sacrifice for the sake of sacrifice and misery is not what is described in the Bible. That's not to say that giving up something to honor God and others is not part of a persons individual journey. I think many have this idea that I have to give up fun, drinking alcohol, giving up who I am, etc. to embrace faith in God. Based on my personal experience and that of the many friends who have embraced this connection to God that I've referred to are enjoying life so much more than they ever did before. Some have given up things that they used to do, but did so, not because the felt they had to, but because they wanted to, like a son or daughter does to please their mom or dad who often know what's best for us before we even recognize it, and want to make them proud of us. That's not such a scary concept is it? But most see religion as dos and don'ts, and completely don't understand the "freedom" that one has when putting their faith in God.
Anyhow, the point I was driving at is how simple the Lord and Savior message is to understand, but hard to embrace. It takes believing and acknowledging that I am a flawed person who has fallen short of what our loving created intended me to be. I know I've chosen many a time to do the wrong even though I knew it was wrong. I didn't need the Bible or the thought that God existed to come up with that conclusion. Most likely feel the same unless you're a sociopath. I've yet to meet the perfect person, so I'll remove that out of the equation till I meet one. Once I came to grips that there must be some higher power to have created such complexity to life, I was faced with the challenge of trying to find out what the higher power might be. A sand castle doesn't suddenly materialize without a builder, but somehow many embrace the idea that this entire universe spontaneously materialized on its own and evolved into what it is today, even though there is absolutely no evidence of spontaneous creation and evolution taking place before our eyes or even pieced together over a centuries of time. I happen to find the complexity and order of nature, mathematics, physics etc, pointing to an intelligent designer which is a growing theory/belief by many modern scientists than the "poof" it all just happened so called scientific paradigm which really isn't scientific at all. A watch begs the question, who was the watchmaker and not, oh look, I just found a spontaneous surprisingly accurate time measurement device.
Then what caught my attention was as I began to see if the Bible was full of or some good or maybe even some truth, was that how this so called God took the initiative and revealed himself to us instead of us having to try to figure him out on our own. For example, no matter how long I sit and think about what nuclear physics is all about, I'm not going to figure it out. But if someone who understands what it is and explains it to me, I have a much better shot at understanding it. I found it interesting how most of the religions in this world were either all about us trying to figure out who God is or what we can do to reach some level of perfection and/or enlightenment, but how the Bible was all about God revealing himself to his creation. That very concept broke the ice for me, a Jew, to even consider Jesus as having any place in my belief system. But I finally was willing to find out what this Jesus character was all about, who he was, where he came from, what he did, and what he's all about now. Once I found out that the Bible explained that he was a manifestation of God in human form, kind a like how Ice is 100% water, just as water vapor or a cup of water is, I began to understand that I wasn't selling out my Jewishness if Jesus was the human manifestation of the God that's described in the old testament, Jewish canon or whatever you want to call it. Oh, by the way, I knew so little about the old testament at the time and began reading that and have studied the entire Bible learning a great deal about both the new and old testaments since then. Note that chapter 1 of the Gospel of John uses the concept the "Word became Flesh", and if interested you might want to read that first chapter of the Gospel of John and track what it says about the "word" to see it for yourself. You might not agree with it, but you'll at least see what I'm talking about. Once the concept that the best way for an invisible God to reveal himself to mankind would be to do so in the form of something we could all understand, it began to make sense to be. What better way to bridge us to himself than to live among us as a perfect man and to then do something to resolve my imperfection and the disregard I had for the one who created and loves me.
If in fact Jesus was a manifestation of God himself and that he came up with a solution to reconnect me back to him the way he intended it to be, it made sense for me to try to understand it and to make a choice if I believed it to be true. Here's the kicker! Embracing the solution part (i.e. Savior or maybe better put reconciler, if there was such a word) there was the lord part that I had to consider, which I've discovered over the years that many wrestle with just as much as they do the intellectual faith issue. Now if it wasn't hard enough to simply believe God became man with the whole idea of allowing himself to be tortured on a cross, completely separated somehow from the other two manifestations of God (The Father and the Spirit individuals that are described in the Bible) to be resurrected, or in non-religious terms, restored back to life and reunited with the mankind, the Father and the Spirit, it is even harder to decide if I was willing to take all my wants and plans, really everything about myself and agree to put them all under his lordship. In other words, "Okay, God. I'm all in! What's your plan for my life?" It is this little kicker that many who claim to be Christians never signed up for and many who explored this option decided at one point in time, "No way! It's my life and I'm going to live it however I feel. No one is going to tell me what to do!" Although it is a giving one's life over to God, it has to be done because we want to do it, not because we have to. That's the major misconception of the Lordship part of the story (known as the Gospel, yeah, another seemly archaic religious term that people don't want to hear) well except when it comes to some entertaining musical. As someone once explained it many years ago to me, this lordship concept is deciding to make that one big first "Yes" I want you to be my Lord, followed by a whole bunch of little yeses...which I've added since I heard that clever description with a bunch of little nos sprinkled throughout, that becomes less and less as we find out that the yeses simply turn out a lot better for us than the nos.
Boy, I can't seem to explain anything without going into some sort of DM's War and Peace description. I guess why would this topic be any different.
Anyhow, to sum this all up, I understand where you're coming from since held to the same belief system. What I think happened to me was once I was willing to explore it for myself, God began to work from the the inside out deep within my soul or whatever non-physical matter thingy exists in all of us,
which of course would also be up for debate.
Based on my experience and that of others who went through down a similar road and process, once a person is willing to examine who God is and what the Bible has to say about this, God begins to open our minds and eyes to things we simply couldn't see or embrace. In the end, it comes down to a choice what to do with what he reveals to us.
Maybe all this sounds like a bunch of BS, but I've experienced a transformation that sure seems real and have witnessed the same in the lives of others not to mention the occasional miracle that God sticks in there along the way. The latter is not what I hang my hat of faith on, but it sure helps. Knowing the heart of man, even if God hit us all over the head with something, most would respond by getting a harder hat than to look up and say, what just hit me. I recently read part of the book of Exodus where the Jewish people just witnessed the parting of the sea and all sorts of visible miraculous signs, not to mention the promised deliverance from their oppression from Egypt, and all it took was a few absent weeks from their leader Moses while we met with God on a mountain, to conclude, "Heck, we need a
fricken huge golden Bull to worship like we saw back in Egypt. This guy Moses who led us out here to die in the desert and his God doesn't seem to be around any more."
Sadly enough, I find myself not all that different at times as those sorry folks. After experiencing his goodness, sometimes in the realm of the amazing, though many here would consider them coincidences or simply the work of my own or others, I face some sort of adversity and complain just like theses folks out in the desert. Subconsciously I begin thinking "God, your either not around, don't care or not big enough for the situation at hand." For example I was doing pretty good after the storm even tough my yard and house were covered with huge limbs and branches. That next morning, a neighbor helped me cut some branches so that I could clear my driveway and get our cars out when needed. I was able to get a tree guy that afternoon who came a day or two later to clear everything off my house and yard for a very reasonable price. I was able to get a generator on that first Monday even though they were all spoken for, when a guy overheard me asking what I should do if more came in. He waved me over and told me his wife no longer wanted him to buy that little sucker sitting on the pallet in front of him and told me I could have it. Also a friend of mine who set up his generator offered to come over that very afternoon to help me set it up. I had no clue and would have likely killed myself, which I'm sure many who are reading this wish I did.
But even after all this, as well as some other good fortune that had happened, when I found out that I had a hole in my roof I felt helpless wondering how in the world am I going to find a roofer. Most of the business phones are down and I'm sure by now they're already spoken for. Who knows when it will ran next and I have this hole in my roof. Of course I wasn't thinking all that straight. I could have pulled the branch out of my roof which was only about a half-dollar size or slightly bigger. then shoved one of the extra shingles that I had temporarily. No that was just made way too much sense for me to think of at the time.
Well while taking to my next door neighbors about my predicament, one of them told me they knew a guy who did a lot of roof work for her and her parents. I looked him up, called the number and he picked it right up the first time I called. He came over the next day or maybe even that evening to assess the problem, returned a day or two later and fixed the hole at a reasonable price. Why I doubted God's provision in the first place, is beyond me. The fact is I handled most of the adversity a lot better than how I would have in the past, not really feeling all that anxious till the hole situation. Next time...hum, I hope there is no next time, but there always is...I will likely demonstrate a lot more faith due to this experience. It's taken some transformation that didn't need a knock on the head, but there's been more than my share of head knocking to change me into what I hope is a better man.
Well enough of my story and beliefs for now. Take it or leave it for what it's worth. I hope this thread encourages some to seek something deeper with God, but I don't think the less of any who don't want to or think I'm nuts for believing as I do. You all have your God given...I mean whatever given right to choose what you believe and live your life as you wish.
