What’s next immediate need? PF or Center

[BigErnMcCracken]

Was kind of hoping we were going for a bulletproof type team for next season because Hurley didn't think he had it this season.

Where is this coming from? Is your thinking that Hurley thought about the portal this season and said to himself, "I guess it would be nice to have a 'bulletproof team' this season but it might actually be cooler to have a less good team with a lower chance of winning the national championship"?

I don't think any of these programs are playing the long game any more. What are the specific decisions that lead you to say that Hurley has decided not to be "bulletproof"? I'm not being snarky, I'm genuinely curious and sort of mystified.

 

[superjohn]

Where is this coming from? Is your thinking that Hurley thought about the portal this season and said to himself, "I guess it would be nice to have a 'bulletproof team' this season but it might actually be cooler to have a less good team with a lower chance of winning the national championship"?

I don't think any of these programs are playing the long game any more. What are the specific decisions that lead you to say that Hurley has decided not to be "bulletproof"? I'm not being snarky, I'm genuinely curious and sort of mystified.

From talking to people who are close with the team at the final 4. Hurley wants to have answer for everything this upcoming season roster wise. He didn't think he had it this past season which makes it so remarkable they made the championship game and even more remarkable they did so with guys playing with serious injuries.

 

[RuffRuff]

Was kind of hoping we were going for a bulletproof type team for next season because Hurley didn't think he had it this season. At least that's what I heard at the final 4. Playing for seasons down the road is a difficult thing to do in this era.

I don't know if their NIL situation allows for it - 24 was truly a confluence of perfect variables. Also pre all these crazy $$'s. Not sure if he's going to be able to pull that kind of dominance off ever again.

I would have hoped it started with a kid like Diop or Thiam, a real rim protector. But maybe Hurley sees something in Hines. I can't doubt him as it comes to finding the right character and culture fit, which are huge. When you look at his C selections since Clingan, none have really been that - Reed, Reibe, Hines. None have really been the lob threat either. If I had one question for him, it would be why Hines over a Diop? I feel like we lose a very advantageous element of our offense/defense with a short 5. To me, we'd be looking at this team in a very different light had we picked that Diop kind of guy that plays above the rim, protects, can take lobs from Silas.

We're 5 in Roth's list - if Mara/Johnson are back, that'll suck.

 

[bendm]

From talking to people who are close with the team at the final 4. Hurley wants to have answer for everything this upcoming season roster wise. He didn't think he had it this past season which makes it so remarkable they made the championship game and even more remarkable they did so with guys playing with serious injuries.

So Why Didn’t he want to be bulletproof in 25 and 26? I think the answer is $$$. I’ve always been worried the Hurley discount wouldn’t keep cutting it once revenue sharing kicked in.

 

[EBonz30]

The opposite actually, we should have Najai Hines locked up as our starting center for the next 3 years. So in this case we're not looking for a backup to take over as a starter in a year, we're looking for a program player to give us a solid 15 minutes a game for a few years

Okay- so you think we will be stronger as a program in the upcoming years but weaker next year?

Don’t really want to go back & forth about this so let me give you my point.

My original point was that we would be weaker this year at center compared to the last three seasons if we were to have Hines & add the player we are discussing.

Also, with that said, I think in this era unfortunately although Hurley has shown a pretty strong retention rate- to me it’s still extremely difficult & almost impossible to predict what players are going to do in the upcoming years (to my point we literally wouldn’t be having this conversation right now if Reibe decided to stay at UConn & not transfer).

 

[superjohn]

I don't know if their NIL situation allows for it - 24 was truly a confluence of perfect variables. Also pre all these crazy $$'s. Not sure if he's going to be able to pull that kind of dominance off ever again.

I would have hoped it started with a kid like Diop or Thiam, a real rim protector. But maybe Hurley sees something in Hines. I can't doubt him as it comes to finding the right character and culture fit, which are huge. When you look at his C selections since Clingan, none have really been that - Reed, Reibe, Hines. None have really been the lob threat either. If I had one question for him, it would be why Hines over a Diop? I feel like we lose a very advantageous element of our offense/defense with a short 5. To me, we'd be looking at this team in a very different light had we picked that Diop kind of guy that plays above the rim, protects, can take lobs from Silas.

We're 5 in Roth's list - if Mara/Johnson are back, that'll suck.

I'm super high on Hines, I was all season. Hines and Diop were probably the main guys during the season I wanted Hurley to pursue. He's the least of my worries. I'm worried about replacing all our scoring but we have the guys to do it if most of them make the jumps. It's a gamble but I could see it happening. Entrusting backup point guard duties to a freshman who isn't an elite freshman is a concern and I'm shocked if our answer at center is this Giltay kid sharing the minutes with Hines. Part of the plan to make us more bulletproof was to get bigger and more athletic.

I trust Hurley and his track record. I'm just thrown off by this kid visiting, I'm still hoping it's for a lesser bench role and not as our other center getting 15 mpg.

 

[RuffRuff]

Why Didn’t he want to be bulletproof in 25 and 26? I think the answer is it’s Easier said than done.

We can outline BP based on the 24 team - what did they have:

1 - a dominant rim protector (no)
2 - a seasoned system PG with size that can create down shot clock (yes-ish)
3 - 2 elite shooters (maybe, if Khamenia is that)
4 - 2 elite ballhandlers/creators (no)
5 - 1 elite perimeter defender (no)

To me that is the recipe for BP. Unless Hines is a menace for his size, he's not going to be the RP profile. Silas could develop into TNewt. We definitely do not have the 2nd option ballhandler profile in there (Newt/Castle). I can't classify Ross as the great perimeter defender.

The rim protector is a cheat code. That said, Hines had a much better EM DPR than both Thiam and Diop, so who knows.

 

[GlastonTim]

I thought he was listed as a SF

He was

 

[superjohn]

So Why Didn’t he want to be bulletproof in 25 and 26? I think the answer is $$$. I’ve always been worried the Hurley discount wouldn’t keep cutting it once revenue sharing kicked in.

He tried and I think he thought he had it with this team. Things happened like Solo's injury and underperformance, our shooters not shooting like they're capable of, and Reibe underperfoming as the season went along. It was a great team but it was remarkable and unexpected how they made the title game.

The year before we were stacked but the staff had a bad evaluation at point guard. It didn't work out with roster construction.

 

[3rdbass]

We can outline BP based on the 24 team - what did they have:

1 - a dominant rim protector (no)
2 - a seasoned system PG with size that can create down shot clock (yes-ish)
3 - 2 elite shooters (maybe, if Khamenia is that)
4 - 2 elite ballhandlers/creators (no)
5 - 1 elite perimeter defender (no)

To me that is the recipe for BP. Unless Hines is a menace for his size, he's not going to be the RP profile. Silas could develop into TNewt. We definitely do not have the 2nd option ballhandler profile in there (Newt/Castle). I can't classify Ross as the great perimeter defender.

The rim protector is a cheat code. That said, Hines had a much better EM DPR than both Thiam and Diop, so who knows.

Technically that 2024 had 3 elite ball handlers and creators in(Castle, Newton, and Spencer).

 

[3rdbass]

So Why Didn’t he want to be bulletproof in 25 and 26? I think the answer is $$$. I’ve always been worried the Hurley discount wouldn’t keep cutting it once revenue sharing kicked in.

There might be a reason why Hurley was complaining about money for us stay a top tier team. We are obviously falling behind and can't pay top dollars for a lot of Portal Targets like Kentucky, St. John's, Michigan, Duke, BYU and Arizonia can. Maybe we need to rely on Freshmen more and then hope we can retain them even if we can't pay top dollars for it.

 

[bendm]

If we get Giltay and Marchot and a backup CG I’ll be feeling pretty good. Preseason Top 5.

 

[RuffRuff]

There might be a reason why Hurley was complaining about money for us stay a top tier team. We are obviously falling behind and can't pay top dollars for a lot of Portal Targets like Kentucky, St. John's, Michigan, Duke, BYU and Arizonia can. Maybe we need to rely on Freshmen more and then hope we can retain them even if we can't pay top dollars for it.

Hurley can't buy stock that's already peaked, he's going to have to buy on the way up. It's concerning longer term.

I don't think freshmen is the answer - I think it's what he's doing here, finding young transfers with upside that may be just not good enough to get drafted. Have always thought this was the right formula, glad he's doing it.

 

[kobebeanbryant]

We can outline BP based on the 24 team - what did they have:

1 - a dominant rim protector (no)
2 - a seasoned system PG with size that can create down shot clock (yes-ish)
3 - 2 elite shooters (maybe, if Khamenia is that)
4 - 2 elite ballhandlers/creators (no)
5 - 1 elite perimeter defender (no)

To me that is the recipe for BP. Unless Hines is a menace for his size, he's not going to be the RP profile. Silas could develop into TNewt. We definitely do not have the 2nd option ballhandler profile in there (Newt/Castle). I can't classify Ross as the great perimeter defender.

The rim protector is a cheat code. That said, Hines had a much better EM DPR than both Thiam and Diop, so who knows.

I think the mobile 7 footer is the real college basketball cheat code. If you have a Clingan/Mara, that’s a unicorn level player that gives a massive advantage over other teams.

Gives you great rim protection which can hide a lot of other defensive limitations on the roster, and a lob threat for easy high percentage buckets.

Obviously you need to surround that guy with a high end roster. but they provide the biggest “VORP” if you want to call it that.

Closest thing that can rival that is a dynamic point guard that can score at 3 levels and facilitate.

Get both and you are basically bulletproof.

 

[WhereistheDove?]

We can outline BP based on the 24 team - what did they have:

1 - a dominant rim protector (no)
2 - a seasoned system PG with size that can create down shot clock (yes-ish)
3 - 2 elite shooters (maybe, if Khamenia is that)
4 - 2 elite ballhandlers/creators (no)
5 - 1 elite perimeter defender (no)

To me that is the recipe for BP. Unless Hines is a menace for his size, he's not going to be the RP profile. Silas could develop into TNewt. We definitely do not have the 2nd option ballhandler profile in there (Newt/Castle). I can't classify Ross as the great perimeter defender.

The rim protector is a cheat code. That said, Hines had a much better EM DPR than both Thiam and Diop, so who knows.

Is your criteria for dominant rim protector that they have to be 7’2+? Hines should absolutely be an elite defensive big next year because he was this year.

 

[RuffRuff]

Is your criteria for dominant rim protector that they have to be 7’2+? Hines should absolutely be an elite defensive big next year because he was this year.

I'd say length has something to do with that, yes. You want that player to evoke fear in those around the rim, it's not just blocking shots.

 

[FightOnCT]

I'm super high on Hines, I was all season. Hines and Diop were probably the main guys during the season I wanted Hurley to pursue. He's the least of my worries. I'm worried about replacing all our scoring but we have the guys to do it if most of them make the jumps. It's a gamble but I could see it happening. Entrusting backup point guard duties to a freshman who isn't an elite freshman is a concern and I'm shocked if our answer at center is this Gilkay kid sharing the minutes with Hines. Part of the plan to make us more bulletproof was to get bigger and more athletic.

I trust Hurley and his track record. I'm just thrown off by this kid visiting, I'm still hoping it's for a lesser bench role and not as our other center getting 15 mpg.

Probably the easiest kid to get on campus. Nobody really knows who exactly Hurley prioritizes and which ones end up here. It was Freeman until Khamenia was on campus

 

[navery12]

I don't want to speak for him but I thought he was asking if we're most likely going to be weaker at the center position this upcoming season?

@EBonz30 it seemed pretty obvious to me what your question was. Did I get it right?

I understood that. I do think Hines will be worse than senior Tarris but that's made up for by improvements at the other spots, though this is lessened by losing Solo.

My point was more that I don't view the backup C as important as Hines since we're in a situation where we're committed to him as a starter for 3 years. It's not a case where we need to rely on our backup taking a huge leap and to start here next year like with Reed in the portal. I would not like Giltay as a future starting C, but when all we'll need is backup minutes with defense and rebounding I think he's very good there

 

[UCfor3]

I'm super high on Hines, I was all season. Hines and Diop were probably the main guys during the season I wanted Hurley to pursue. He's the least of my worries. I'm worried about replacing all our scoring but we have the guys to do it if most of them make the jumps. It's a gamble but I could see it happening. Entrusting backup point guard duties to a freshman who isn't an elite freshman is a concern and I'm shocked if our answer at center is this Gilkay kid sharing the minutes with Hines. Part of the plan to make us more bulletproof was to get bigger and more athletic.

I trust Hurley and his track record. I'm just thrown off by this kid visiting, I'm still hoping it's for a lesser bench role and not as our other center getting 15 mpg.

Yep. Agree completely. These decisions have to be largely financial based. If Silas or Hines gets injured for an extended period we would be in trouble.

 

[WhereistheDove?]

I'd say length has something to do with that, yes. You want that player to evoke fear in those around the rim, it's not just blocking shots.

Zuby evoked plenty of fear in those around the rim. He’s shorter than Hines. I think your criteria is a little ridiculous if that’s the case.

 

[RuffRuff]

Zuby evoked plenty of fear in those around the rim. He’s shorter than Hines. I think your criteria is a little ridiculous if that’s the case.

You think Zuby stopped players from coming in the lane? He was a madman on the boards, but not sure I'm calling Zuby a rim protector.

 

[UCfor3]

There's a big difference between the center rotation we're trying to build this year, and what we've had the last 4 years. In every case we had a starter who had 1 year left and a backup ready to take over the next year. In this case our starter is a sophomore, so it's a much harder sell to bring in another top C option

Maybe not a top C option but a pretty solid one. Hines is gonna be good but he averaged 6 points a game. Not like you are trying to sell playing time behind an all-american starter. Other programs of our ilk seem to have a lot less trouble stacking talent at positions. In another thread, someone mentioned Duke having 3 or 4 point guards. Other teams seem to be stacking multiple bigs. More to it than playing time.

 

[navery12]

I'd say length has something to do with that, yes. You want that player to evoke fear in those around the rim, it's not just blocking shots.

Seton Hall with Hines was #1 in Block%, #17 in 2P FG%, 280th in 3P/FGA, and 350th in % of points coming from 2P. So yes, teams feared Hines at the rim

 

[navery12]

Maybe not a top C option but a pretty solid one. Hines is gonna be good but he averaged 6 points a game. Not like you are trying to sell playing time behind an all-american starter. Other programs of our ilk seem to have a lot less trouble stacking talent at positions. In another thread, someone mentioned Duke having 3 or 4 point guards. Other teams seem to be stacking multiple bigs. More to it than playing time.

I agree, which Giltay is. I would have no problem with going 2 deep at every position with all star players like Duke. But you have to be able to offer playing time or money if you want a star

 

[superjohn]

I understood that. I do think Hines will be worse than senior Tarris but that's made up for by improvements at the other spots, though this is lessened by losing Solo.

My point was more that I don't view the backup C as important as Hines since we're in a situation where we're committed to him as a starter for 3 years. It's not a case where we need to rely on our backup taking a huge leap and to start here next year like with Reed in the portal. I would not like Giltay as a future starting C, but when all we'll need is backup minutes with defense and rebounding I think he's very good there

For next season you don't think it's a major downgrade at backup center from last season or the other years during our run at backup center?

 

[Scoe]

Enormous hands...

View attachment 119831

Holy crap now that looks like AI

 

[navery12]

For next season you don't think it's a major downgrade at backup center from last season or the other years during our run at backup center?

Of course it is. All I'm saying is I wasn't looking for a 20/20 split like we've had the last 2 years so I have no problem with the starter being significantly better than the backup

 

[UCfor3]

I agree, which Giltay is. I would have no problem with going 2 deep at every position with all star players like Duke. But you have to be able to offer playing time or money if you want a star

I know, that's why I said it's about more than just playing time after you were discussing Hines being a sophomore as it pertains to future playing time. I was alluding to the fact it's about the $. There is a reason Hurley said we needed to do more to compete if we want to continue to be the Basketball Capital of the World. This is the rubber meeting the road.

 

[BigErnMcCracken]

There is a reason Hurley said we needed to do more to compete if we want to continue to be the Basketball Capital of the World. This is the rubber meeting the road.

This is not what he said. This offhand comment about needing buy-in from the entire state has ben so bastardized by this point. And none of us have any idea about how much we do or don't have to spend so saying targeting a specific player is about the money is just sheer speculation. This notion that we're trying to do this stuff on a shoe-string relative to our peers is silly.

 

[WhereistheDove?]

You think Zuby stopped players from coming in the lane? He was a madman on the boards, but not sure I'm calling Zuby a rim protector.

What are we even talking about? The guy just won BE DPOY. Yes, he was a feared rim protector that stopped players from coming into the lane. If your bar is Donovan Clingan, you’re going to be waiting a while and vastly disappointed.