We're Doomed!

[JavaMan]

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But I can live with it.

​

 

[bags27]

I actually want Tenn to be a competitive team nationally (the more, the better for WCBB), but even with a couple of their marquee wins this year, I can't for the life of me understand how top talent can decide to go there. It's so hard to see why you'd entrust your personal basketball development to Holly.

 

[RockyMTblue2]

Or, frankly, Texas. Lots of talent squandered there too. Miss St, Oregon, Washington more promising for talent development IMO.

 

[CocoHusky]

I actually want Tenn to be a competitive team nationally (the more, the better for WCBB), but even with a couple of their marquee wins this year, I can't for the life of me understand how top talent can decide to go there. It's so hard to see why you'd entrust your personal basketball development to Holly.

Playing time.
+
Many high level college prospects view themselves as finished products i.e., NOT in need of development.

 

[Paesano]

Why are kids signing up for that train wreck?

 

[Carnac]

Playing time.
+
Many high level college prospects view themselves as finished products i.e., NOT in need of development.

A very interesting observation. You may have something there. I would think that most high schoolers realize that they are not even in the neighborhood of reaching their maximum potential at the high school level.
If you're a young impressionable athlete, and you hear something enough times, you may begin to believe it.

When the people in their circle are constantly telling them how good they are, they may begin to believe it. They (and their parents) may enter the recruiting process with the attitude of "I'm/we're good. What can/will you do for me/us?. I know what I/we can do for you".

It would be fun and interesting to read short blogs from all of the top 25 ranked potential recruits in each class (written anonymously of course, omitting the names of the schools to insure honesty & sincerity) why they chose the school they did, and what were the real reasons they did not choose the other schools on their final list. No doubt the basketball coaches and recruiters would also be interested in reading those blogs as well.

 

[JordyG]

Bags, Coco and I think so alike here. To my way of thinking the reason for their inconsistency and lack of success is that the top teams have passed them by with their offensive schemes. To steal a phrase from Jim Jabir, the better teams don't teach plays, they teach their guys how to play. Geno, although he uses a number of plays, generally teaches a motion offensive with situational options depending on your position on the floor, your teammates strengths and weaknesses, and the defense in front of you. From there you read your teammates. Most of the SEC teams play a static hi/low or a basic dump it in to the bigs inside. I loved Pat Summitt and her legacy is well deserved. But for all of her success she didn't teach offense, and she admitted so. The current UT regime has followed in her legacy. Offensively it's just dump it in or have the guards create. In actuality it places a lot of the responsibility on the guards, or more importantly, on 18 to 22 year old's. Naturally when pressed these offenses are going to devolve into street ball, with low scoring often ugly affairs.

As Coco has said, prospects see themselves as finished products. This is why I feel the Jeff Walz approach of merely amassing talent will always fail and the approach used by UConn, Stanford, Oregon State and others is the way to long term success.

 

[BroadwayVa]

View attachment 19489 ​

But I can live with it.

​

I told Geno this past summer, on the golf course, that Walker was a risk--he should be seeing what Tenn wanted
Then follow their lead--and then offer those recruits more. I'm sure Sue and DT and now Stewie would gladly drive them around ESPN or the Atlanta Airport. --The last time I looked back --he was just shaking his head---Flies I assumed!!

 

[BroadwayVa]

Playing time.
+
Many high level college prospects view themselves as finished products i.e., NOT in need of development.

When you were 16/17/18 you knew everything--and your family, friends, aau coaches and HS league--said YOU ARE THE best there ever was. What is not to believe?? Geno?? What does he know???

 

[CocoHusky]

A very interesting observation. You may have something there. I would think that most high schoolers realize that they are not even in the neighborhood of reaching their maximum potential at the high school level.
If you're a young impressionable athlete, and you hear something enough times, you may begin to believe it.

When the people in their circle are constantly telling them how good they are, they may begin to believe it. They (and their parents) may enter the recruiting process with the attitude of "I'm/we're good. What can/will you do for me/us?. I know what I/we can do for you".
It would be fun and interesting to read short blogs from all of the top 25 ranked potential recruits in each class (written anonymously of course, omitting the names of the schools to insure honesty & sincerity) why they chose the school they did, and what were the real reasons they did not choose the other schools on their final list. No doubt the basketball coaches and recruiters would also be interested in reading those blogs as well.

I worked in the Washington DC area a few years ago and was listening to John Thompson's radio show. John mentioned that through his coaches network he survey 100 mid-major college MCBB players , non-starters, upper classmen (juniors & seniors) and asked: What did you think were your chances of making the NBA? 83% thought their chances were good to excellent. The reality was <.1%. That is both the arrogance of youth and for many never having heard anything except how good you are.

 

[RockyMTblue2]

Many high level college prospects view themselves as finished products i.e., NOT in need of development.

Just how stupid can they be to think that! I know, it is hardly a surprise in our everyone gets a trophy world of "raising" kids, plus the muck that hangs around in AAU ball, but if these kids were students of the game they'd know that even among the so called elite college programs there are vast player development difference. Now, Tenn, whole different story. Disaster junkies running to an opportunity.

 

[BroadwayVa]

I actually want Tenn to be a competitive team nationally (the more, the better for WCBB), but even with a couple of their marquee wins this year, I can't for the life of me understand how top talent can decide to go there. It's so hard to see why you'd entrust your personal basketball development to Holly.

I agree --why Holly?? I agree--we need many competitive teams! I believe, for what that is worth, that kids go to Tenn because: 1. The program is still basking in Pats sun shine, albeit--it is getting very dim. 2. As has been stated--I'm great, I can play Div 1 now and win--and Geno (and other coaches) want them to work to get better--BETTER?? How can that be for perfection??? 3. Playing time right away--many Div one coaches offer that--not Geno--if you practice, are good, you may get some minimal Frosh PT.

 

[RockyMTblue2]

I told Geno this past summer, on the golf course, that Walker was a risk--he should be seeing what Tenn wanted
Then follow their lead--and then offer those recruits more. I'm sure Sue and DT and now Stewie would gladly drive them around ESPN or the Atlanta Airport. --The last time I looked back --he was just shaking his head---Flies I assumed!!

My LMAO post of the morning. I assume your picture is now in the gatekeeper's booth.

 

[BroadwayVa]

I worked in the Washington DC area a few years ago and was listening to John Thompson's radio show. John mentioned that through his coaches network he survey 100 mid-major college MCBB players , non-starters, upper classmen (juniors & seniors) and asked: What did you think were your chances of making the NBA? 83% thought their chances were good to excellent. The reality was <.1%. That is both the arrogance of youth and for many never having heard anything except how good you are.

I listened too to John Thompson (Sr)---he was good for his community, his team and his players---I thought he spoke the truth. Among the best coaches of his era. He too spent loads of time around the playgrounds and projecting his encouragement to ---get an education!!

 

[BroadwayVa]

My LMAO post of the morning. I assume your picture is now in the gatekeeper's booth.

It is in the parking garage with a circle with a line through it---I assume that means I am now a member of the inner circle--!!

 

[Carnac]

I've been monitoring the Lady Volunteer program from a distance, and will continue to do so. I find it interesting that despite all of the turmoil, fan/booster rebellion (wanting Warlick gone), and the team's recent failures to play to the level of the talent on its rosters, they continue to recruit fairly well. Someone in their camp has got one heck of a sales pitch. SMH.

 

[HGN]

I actually want Tenn to be a competitive team nationally (the more, the better for WCBB), but even with a couple of their marquee wins this year, I can't for the life of me understand how top talent can decide to go there. It's so hard to see why you'd entrust your personal basketball development to Holly.

Bags , I can appreciate your thoughts. But when you are a Top talent senior why not go to a place that perhaps cannot figure out who to play ? Maybe you get more playing time that way. Or perhaps the player is not concerned with winning NC's. Holly is proving to be a good recruiter . Everybody can't go to UConn. They are only allowed 15 schollies.

With the talent that Holly has coming in next year its obvious the team will be better. With or without Deshields.

And I wish them well..........................Except when they play the Huskies.

GO HUSKIES!!

 

[Siestakeyfan]

Playing time.
+
Many high level college prospects view themselves as finished products i.e., NOT in need of development.

There is "What we know". There is "What we don't know". PROBLEM - There is "What we don't know, that we don't know". Throw in opinions, beliefs, points-of-view, attitudes, positions, desire to be right, egos, greed, self serving, sophisticated Brainwashing/Marketing & related - then you have quite a formula for frustration.

Today's HS stars only know the HS level of Success !

 

[JordyG]

I told Geno this past summer, on the golf course, that Walker was a risk--he should be seeing what Tenn wanted
Then follow their lead--and then offer those recruits more. I'm sure Sue and DT and now Stewie would gladly drive them around ESPN or the Atlanta Airport. --The last time I looked back --he was just shaking his head---Flies I assumed!!

FOTFLOL.

 

[DefenseBB]

There is "What we know". There is "What we don't know". PROBLEM - There is "What we don't know, that we don't know". Throw in opinions, beliefs, points-of-view, attitudes, positions, desire to be right, egos, greed, self serving, sophisticated Brainwashing/Marketing & related - then you have quite a formula for frustration.

Today's HS stars only know the HS level of Success !

I am finding this thread highly presumptuous on what "we think" how "high school" players think. Having two sons now playing Div 1 sports and knowing the teams at 2 different schools and the other sports programs as well, I call complete "rubbish" on those making these assumptions. HS basketball for both Boys and Girls is usually bifurcated immediately into good programs and significantly ave to below ave. The AAU circuit as well as camps give a good indication to players and their families. While delusion in many D1 Men players may exist, I disagree with Thompson's numerical value being that high. Among girls, let's be frank that very few of the pros make any real money in this sport and would be better served with real degrees and professions that academia provides. Geno made the comment that he looks for girls who want to get better, WANT TO BE COACHED and are motivated. The middle part is key and is demonstrable by past or current habits, not just because they say "they will be". Yes, there are some key athletic types we hear are difficult and maybe their attitude holds them back and we tend to "group" too many players into that camp. Do I think the Tenn players practice hard under Holly- YES, do they practice SMART at skills they need to be better, evidently not. Claiming anyone has an attitude problem with being intimately involved is reckless and rumor mongering. We are better than that.

 

[BroadwayVa]

I am finding this thread highly presumptuous on what "we think" how "high school" players think. Having two sons now playing Div 1 sports and knowing the teams at 2 different schools and the other sports programs as well, I call complete "rubbish" on those making these assumptions. HS basketball for both Boys and Girls is usually bifurcated immediately into good programs and significantly ave to below ave. The AAU circuit as well as camps give a good indication to players and their families. While delusion in many D1 Men players may exist, I disagree with Thompson's numerical value being that high. Among girls, let's be frank that very few of the pros make any real money in this sport and would be better served with real degrees and professions that academia provides. Geno made the comment that he looks for girls who want to get better, WANT TO BE COACHED and are motivated. The middle part is key and is demonstrable by past or current habits, not just because they say "they will be". Yes, there are some key athletic types we hear are difficult and maybe their attitude holds them back and we tend to "group" too many players into that camp. Do I think the Tenn players practice hard under Holly- YES, do they practice SMART at skills they need to be better, evidently not. Claiming anyone has an attitude problem with being intimately involved is reckless and rumor mongering. We are better than that.

There are a many different versions of kids /players as there are adults. Some adults are motivated --some are not. Some are quick to pick things up--some are not. Some adults take guidance readily--some do not. As a kid my ego was not as supreme as some--and yet I had more belief in my abilities, intelligence, academic knowledge, basketball skills --as I learned in my 30's , a sad awakening. I'll repeat something--I was told at a young age--18 year olds are drafted because they believe they are invincible, and capable, have not lived enough to have the initial fear
Your opinion of Thompsons .1 percent of ALL male players (freshman to Senior) from every Div 1 College is more than likely accurate. Mr /Coach Thompson was deeply involved with kids, players, college players, pro players--his number may be suspect--but it may be by the order of magnitude i.e 1 percent rather than .ol. In all the time I listen to Coach Thompson on the radio--i cannot remember one "lie" or mis-truth-or just plain mixing up number--the later is probably more possible. \
All you have to do is look at Uconn to see which easily accept "coaching' , the transfers, the one's geno does not accept---he looks for talent that is coachable.

Your opinion--as mine--are all acceptable here. Does not mean either of us are 100 percent correct.

 

[BroadwayVa]

There are a many different versions of kids /players as there are adults. Some adults are motivated --some are not. Some are quick to pick things up--some are not. Some adults take guidance readily--some do not. As a kid my ego was not as supreme as some--and yet I had more belief in my abilities, intelligence, academic knowledge, basketball skills --as I learned in my 30's , a sad awakening. I'll repeat something--I was told at a young age--18 year olds are drafted because they believe they are invincible, and capable, have not lived enough to have the initial fear
Your opinion of Thompsons .1 percent of ALL male players (freshman to Senior) from every Div 1 College is more than likely accurate. Mr /Coach Thompson was deeply involved with kids, players, college players, pro players--his number may be suspect--but it may be by the order of magnitude i.e 1 percent rather than .ol. In all the time I listen to Coach Thompson on the radio--i cannot remember one "lie" or mis-truth-or just plain mixing up number--the later is probably more possible. \
All you have to do is look at Uconn to see which easily accept "coaching' , the transfers, the one's geno does not accept---he looks for talent that is coach able.
Nice sounding comment---we are better than that---but aren't we better than judging here??

Your opinion--as mine--are all acceptable here. Does not mean either of us are 100 percent correct.

 

[BroadwayVa]

Bags , I can appreciate your thoughts. But when you are a Top talent senior why not go to a place that perhaps cannot figure out who to play ? Maybe you get more playing time that way. Or perhaps the player is not concerned with winning NC's. Holly is proving to be a good recruiter . Everybody can't go to UConn. They are only allowed 15 schollies.

With the talent that Holly has coming in next year its obvious the team will be better. With or without Deshields.

And I wish them well......Except when they play the Huskies.

GO HUSKIES!!

I wish Uconn could get recruits that Holly gets that makes her team better as they walk in the door---or is it Tn is that bad?? look at Gabby--almost 3 years to be a difference maker.
KLS or Napheesa --unlike those coming into TN--took a whole year and are still learning. Chong 3 years plus--and still developing.
Danger has potential and saw it once, maybe twice--but --how does Geno miss all those good walk in the door ready ones??

 

[tonehill68]

Playing time.
+
Many high level college prospects view themselves as finished products i.e., NOT in need of development.

Agreed on the playing time. I also think from a recruits mind, that they think "we are going to be the class that ends all the losing and bring back the championships" or "why not us?" "We can start our own legacy".

Tennessee is going to get it share of top talent just because of the name. A lot of these ladies grew up as little girls watching Tennessee. They have playing time and possibly those thoughts above to choose that school. Just my two cents.

 

[tonehill68]

View attachment 19489 ​

But I can live with it.

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I also will take my chances on Megan